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Atheists, is it possible...
Is it possible that all of reality is proof of the existence of God, but something in you makes you unable to perceive, comprehend, understand and accept that truth? Provide a rational justification for your answer. Trolls will be banned. Of course, I do not really expect a serious answer to this Q as atheists are too narcissistic and deluded to even entertain the idea that they are the problem.
Are you serious? Are you trying to make stupid questions? Science is observation of nature, it is not a thing which exists in nature; it's something people do. Science itself is immaterial. Why do you believe in an immaterial thing? Or is it your own mind which you believe in? Did your mind, which is the tool by which you can practice science, bring you into existence? Is that why you think people believe in science; because they believe they brought themselves into existence are are their own god which denies God created all things and gave us minds to observe them scientifically?
Are all atheists mentally challenged so that they cannot deal realistically with simple concepts?
If your dull enough to take the apparent design of things and attribute it to a magical guy that you believe in, then no one can help you. The fact is that planets without life don’t have conscious beings sitting around wondering why they don’t exist.
When simple cellular life is discovered on mars or Jupiter’s moons, will you attribute THAT to some magical life maker guy as well? What is the reason that you’ll have to why god created such simple life with no apparent purpose?
It's possible in the same way that it's possible for a flying-spaghetti-monster to be hiding behind the rings of Saturn weaving invisible spaghetti blankets when nobody is looking.
You are confusing what is physically possible with what is capable of being dreamt up in the human mind. It's physically impossible that there is a spaghetti monster behind Saturn. But the idea is entirely able to be concocted.
That's the difference between reality and fiction.
The human mind is capable of resolving logical tensions in illogical ways. For instance, there is a logical tension in the Christian mind about their belief in God, and the lack of evidence for his existence. Thus, they resolve, "you must simply have FAITH".
I don't think "wrong" comes into it. Or "right" for that matter. I think not only do you confuse what is physically possible with what is able to be dreamt up, you also confuse the idea of factual correctness with moral uprightness.
It is factually correct that no evidence for God exists; it is factually correct that there is no spaghetti monster flying around Saturn. Morality is irrelevant therein.
You assert God exists because you choose to believe that. In order to subsist that assertion you will cite faith as necessary substitute for evidence. Since I don't choose to believe that God exists, I have no need for faith in that idea.
Evidence informs my beliefs. This is sufficient for me.
I rationally know fact from fiction through the application of rationale. Inductive and deductive reasoning allow me to derive logical summations from the world around me.
I think what's really happening here is that you don't have a large vocabulary or a firm grasp on logical processes, and because that makes you uncomfortable you are applying superficial logic to unsound premises in order to reinforce your preconceptions.
He rationally know via reason? ROFL. Putting aside the glaring irrationality of this statement, I am forced to ask how does reason tell you what is true and how do you know you reason is valid?
Hahahahaha.........you think wrong or right is irrelevant, and yet you argue as if you think you are right. What a goof ball atheists makes out of you.
Moral rightness or wrongness, isn't the same as factual rightness or wrongness. You religious types have trouble distinguishing between the two concepts.
So you have no moral basis for anything you say, so you don't care if the things you say are true and nobody should care what you say....why should I care what you say? Why should anybody care?
You don't care if you end up in Hell with all the sodomites, why should anybody else?
That's quite a jump in reasoning there. You think because I don't believe in hell, that I have no moral basis for anything? Since when did religion own morality?
It's quite clear that morals predate the hellfire-Christian religious philosophy.
so you don't care if the things you say are true
Again, quite a jump in logic. My view of the world is informed by evidence that precludes proof. By definition, proof is a factual representation of the truth. By contrast, your worldview is informed by unfalsfiable claims.
It is you who doesn't care if the things you say are true. And the lengths you've taken to misrepresent and distort and jump to conclusions in your response here is plain evidence of that.
and nobody should care what you say
I don't care if you don't care what I say. Proof and evidence stand on their own merits. They don't require affirmation from you.
Quit crying, you made it clear that you have no basis for distinguishing right from wrong, so just keep on pretending like you don't know right from wrong and I'll keep pointing out how silly you sound.
I didn't say there was no such thing as right or wrong. I said factual correctness and moral rightness are often different things.
What is considered perverse is intrinsically defined by the boundaries on what is considered normative. In other words, "perversity" is a subjective construct. Homosexuality might be perverse to you. It isn't perverse to me and to vast swathes of other people in the developed world.
In fact, if we take the majority of opinions in the region of the world I inhabit -- Western Europe -- homosexuality is considered by the majority as not-perverse. Contrastingly, hellfire Christianity and bigotry are considered by that majority as rather perverse.
In your culture, perhaps your point might be valid. In mine, however, it is largely not.
You admitted you reject all concepts of right and wrong, so I'll make a fool out of you and you have no basis for complaining about me doing it since you can't say what is right or wrong.
If your sodomite buddy breaks your nose, it's okay because you can't say anything is morally wrong. Even if the fellow dirtball goes to jail, you still can't say what he did was wrong because you recognize no morality.
It's so easy to show how fools are foolish, and they are so funny in their fool ways.......it's a tragic comedy to watch the parade of fools on their way to hell like a bunch of death defying clowns.
You admitted you reject all concepts of right and wrong
No, I didn't. I said moral reasoning and factual reasoning are often different things, and that there are contexts within which the application of one is preferable to the application of the other.
The rest of this is just a rambling, stupid, argument made of straw.
I know the difference between right and wrong, you go on and on and on trying to explain why you don't know the difference between right and wrong. Apparently, you have a learning disability so you can't tell right from wrong.
Maybe it's possible. But where might this thing inside me have come from? Did God put it there? If so, it seems kind of mean to make it so that I can't believe him, and silly if he wants a relationship with me as I often hear. And if I really can't see the truth, nobody can blame me.
You could apply that argument to any claim, for example; Bigfoot. How do you know you are not just incapable of understanding the evidence for Bigfoot and discovering the truth that he existse? Stop asking for proof until you know you aren't the problem. See?
I answered the question, you told me to stop asking for proof, and I told you why it didn't make sense to tell me that. If anything you were the one who strayed from the question first by telling me to stop asking for proof. I think I am allowed to counter points that you make, otherwise it isn't much of a debate.
You did not answer the question. Comparing the Creator of all things, to a created thing like Bigfoot is dodging the question. You're throwing out red herrings.
Mack, I say with all sincerity that you are one of the very few intelligent people who use this website.
I'm not saying that in relation to this specific comment, but rather generally. Above everything you are here to debate truth, which is more than I can say for nine out of every other ten trolls who come here only to find creative outlets for their various personality disorders.
Thank you for that. I am glad that it comes across that I am more concerned about truth than making myself seem better than others. You saying this does mean something to me. It is encouraging, and I wish more people here would compliment each other like that.
I think I can guess who gave the five down-votes to this argument.
If you were concerned about truth, you would admit that you are unrighteous and worthy of the fire of Hell. The last thing atheists want is the truth...because when they get it, they will either be saved from Hell by God the Savior Jesus Christ, or they will wake up in the fire with no way out. Both possibilities are unacceptable to atheists so they will get what they deserve if they accept it or not.
Atheists are fools, no matter how much "education" they have.
You have a relationship with God, and that relationship is your personal experience.
Your inability to see the truth is called "sin", and there is no man alive without sin.
"For now we see through a glass, darkly; but then face to face: now I know in part; but then shall I know even as also I am known. "
Believing in God is easy, you can be absolutely certain of God. Believing things about God is harder. What is God? The Supreme and Ultimate Reality. Recognize that, and allow the spirit of truth to show you the way and grant you a peace that surpasses all understanding.
I have not read such a sanctimonious, dull witted response to anything. I have a relationship with a force that cannot be understood but it just so happens some idiot on the internet understands it and knows that I need to placate this force and it’ll give me all the info. on everything.
This is exactly the way moronic churches started out in the first place. Some idiot was like, duh, I dunno, and some douche said oh I got all the solutions, just read this book, and the other idiot was like wow, I didn’t know, I gotta tell everyone. Pretty soon your killing in the name of an idiot with a fundamental misunderstanding of life and the universe.
You are clearly not talking to me, you are clearly talking to some homogenized prejudice.
Sorry buddy, you making me into your straw man because you have a hate boner doesn't make what I say idiotic.
The Supreme and Ultimate Reality is God. What you experience is a reality. This reality is your personal relationship with The Supreme and Ultimate Reality. Your experience is not God.
I do not kill people. I do not call for anyone to be killed. I believe in charity. You clearly do not believe in charity, because you have already taken yourself as judge by condemning "moronic churches". See, that is the difference between what my position is and your position. My position is not to lean on my own understanding, but instead say, "I don't know", and let The Supreme and Ultimate Reality be the judge, surely the righteous judge. I am a fallible human being. You on the other hand are puffing yourself up to be something.
Well, no matter how intelligent you are, no matter how capable, no matter how influential... You will die in your sins, and God will continue to be as God always has and always will.
You don't understand the faith because you already think you know. I'm telling you that you don't. The faith is in God, The Supreme and Ultimate Reality, and the discipline is loving God. Loving God means loving THE TRUTH. If you love THE TRUTH, it will eventually give you some humility, and make you an overall more honest person.
Maybe you should get a dictionary and figure out what "Supreme and Ultimate Reality" means before you start speaking about things you don't understand as if you had understanding.
God can blame you for not seeing the truth....and He does. You are denying the truth willfully. That is your choice. Trying to blame God for your insistence that He does not have the right to rule over you will not keep you out of Hell.
The truth is that you have sinned against God and deserve to die and burn in Hell. Only His mercy is keeping you out of Hell now. If you keep on insisting you cannot believe He is merciful, be sure that you will never find Him merciful and you will find yourself in the fire of Hell with no way out.
For a while I thought you were smarter than the average atheist here....lately it seems you are hell-bent on proving me wrong.
If it's not science, it's just a belief. If it's just a belief, it's not scientifically provable, as has been proven. Not all science is proven "beyond a reasonable doubt", but NO "god" has reached that level.
You can't even tell me if you are real, or if you are only a hologram type apparition caused by chemical fizzes in your brain so that you really are nothing because what appears to be you inside that big mouth of yours is materially nothing.
Atheists are mentally challenged and they just get mad when you point out how foolish they are.
My brain and mouth have kept me out of hell for (I suspect), longer than yours. Your brain (and arrogant big mouth) keeps YOU in a constant hell of hatred all day, every day. I have little hate in my brain and I enjoy it HERE. In heaven on Earth. Enjoy YOUR hell, you young fool! You have my "thoughts and prayers". :-)
Once again, the atheists shows it's wonderful worldview (religion) desiring that I burn in Hell forever after stating he does not care if He fries like an eternal sausage forever as long as he feels we all burn in Hell the same as him.
I want nobody to burn in Hell, the atheist wants me and all to burn in Hell with Him. Anybody reading this is free to hold the hand of the atheist as long as they can, I want no part.
If I believed in mythology I'd be terribly afraid (like you are) and I'd probably try "bravely" to become a saint. I'd be shaking in my boots in fear of this "loving god" who's favorite pastime seems to be genocide by "created" flood, fire, earthquake, hurricane or allowed bloody dictator or criminal. No sign of his "love" or appreciation of "thoughts and prayers". No, when you die, when I die, it's "lights out". Somebody else replaces you on the Earth. I want no part of a "god", supposedly all powerful and totally in control, who gets credit for random "miracles" and seems to ignore the suffering and brutality of many of "his creations". I'm not afraid of imaginary places like hell, which apparently is large enough to hold trillions of peoples simmering bodies, but has never been found.
Not interested. You want all to burn in Hell with you, I want none to burn in Hell....not even you. You are on your way to Hell. Why you want everybody else to be there with you is your problem.
Take it easy, there, atheist. Keep on telling yourself that it's okay for you to end up burning in Hell forever as long as you feel you can have everybody else suffer the same as you.
What a bitter old fool you are. Your own words testify against you.
You asked him a question about his beliefs. The latest atheistic thing is to claim they only have "non-belief". Of course, belief in non-living nature to produce life, and mindless matter to produce minds, is acceptable belief to them as they claim the god they call science will prove itself to them by showing them how it all happened kabillions of years ago. Atheistic beliefs are so tangled up in nonsense, superstition, conjecture, and pseudo-science that it's just a sad tragic comedy, a parade of fools on their way to Hell.
There is no wisdom, nor understanding, nor counsel against the LORD. Atheists cannot answer questions about God, they can only try to change the subject.
This is what we know, we know we are here, we know a lot of stuff exists around us, we know the stuff around us is consistent and follows certain laws. This stuff is the universe, and the universe is unfathomable large and we are a part of the universe. We know we've been here for a long time, and that we evolved from other things that evolved from other things. We know that the "big bang" happened a really long time ago and that it brought all matter into existence. What causes the big bang? I don't know. Are there other big bangs in existence? I don't know. Is it possible "God" created the "big bang"? I don't know. Maybe? But, just because we don't know what caused something, doesn't mean God is behind it. I'm open to any thoughts and opinions, thank you.
How do you know we are here? What are you? If you are here, where do you go when your time is over? If you do not exist when your time is over, how do you know you exist now?
What are you? (other than a pervert, we all know you are a pervert already)
I guess I could get extremely philosophical and say you can't really prove anything. I could be a brain in a tub of juice on a space ship in a simulation which is in another simulation. You can't disprove that, but the thought probably isn't going to keep you up at night. My point is, I could be entirely wrong of everything, but I try to see everything as I see most likely to be true. Could the Earth be flat? You and I both know it's round, but than again neither of us has seen it from space. We've seen pictures of Earth from space, but how can we prove they aren't faked by lizard people for some reason? We can't, we just know the Earth being round seems to make a lot more sense than the Earth being flat. Though, that might not be the best example since you can probably prove the Earth is round using certain tools in your backyard. Honestly, I think when you die, your consciousness comes to an end. This is just how I see things, I'm sure you have an entirely different view. I hope this was helpful.
If "your consciousness comes to an end", then you are not real and nothing you do or say matters.....which of course is the atheistic hope, to be exonerated in death and free from responsibility for what you said, did, and imagined.
No, it matters to me. And no, if I do something bad, I will feel bad about it. Don't tell me what I believe. You don't know me, and I don't know you, so there is no sense in making assumptions. The reason I don't believe in God, is because I don't see evidence for him. I know that may sound ridiculous to you, and I understand that, and I can see why you would be frustrated, since you view existence as proof of God. I respect you and your beliefs, why can't you do the same for me?
Did this fool just claim he cannot prove anything, which means he has no proof that he cannot prove anything? But I do agree with him, that atheists are mentally dead and have no proof of anything they claim to be true.
I saw a couple try to blame God, saying He is the problem keeping them from knowing Him. At the same time, they say He is not there.
Stupid atheists.......If they will not believe I am me, nothing I do will convince them that I am me. If they will not believe God is God who has the right to rule over them, even the fire of Hell forever will not convince them that God has the right to rule over them.
But an educated person provides links and sources to support his science.
In fairness, educated people do not automatically assume they are reading the unbridled truth simply because a magazine has a daunting name, like "Popular Mechanics".
Popular Mechanics is a good publication not just for its name but for its impeccable writers. Like the ones whom I linked and who busted up your silly truther conspiracy.
You start your post with stupidity and expect me to read it? You're fighting a losing battle against God and getting what you deserve and you can't blame Him, after He repeatedly has offered you forgiveness through the blood of His cross, if He ends your countdown in time today and leaves you in uncountable unending suffering in Hell.
Arguing with me is not helping you, you are only arguing against your own life and God's patience will not endure forever with you if you will not repent of your sins and believe on His Son.
Show statistics? Why? You never show any statistics, you just ask other people to show it, and use their lack of evidence, to justify your claims, which you give no evidence for.
Mental midget, I did not ask you what I do or do not do, I asked you prove your claim. If you cannot, we know you are a deluded liar and kindly ask you to shut up.
I don't think this is possible. I base this on the existence of converts between atheism and religions and vice versa. If a person can go from being an atheist to believing in god, then there can't have been any impermeable barrier from doing so, such as somehow being incapable of acknowledging god. If a person can believe in a god and then lose their faith, then they are an atheist which has previously accepted god and the evidence for god in the past, and therefore are not incapable of realising god.
If god is not above interfering with the minds of people, then why does he keep barriers in certain people and not others? The logical conclusion of which is that going to hell for not believing in god is a punishment for a crime atheists are forced to commit.
Why have the barrier there only to remove it?
Why does god place barriers on converts going from christianity to atheism?
You may have been banned, but you can see this and I'd be happy to continue this via DM
If life can just pop into existence and evolve into intelligent life, there should be intelligent or quasi intelligent life teaming in our solar system, galaxy, and other galaxies as per the Drake Equation. But we see zero evidence of this.
If life can just pop into existence and evolve into intelligent life
If an intelligent God can just pop into existence than a molecule can reproduce itself and evolve into intelligent life.
there should be intelligent or quasi intelligent life teaming in our solar system, galaxy, and other galaxies as per the Drake Equation. But we see zero evidence of this.
Actually you have no idea what you're talking about. INTELLIGENT life should be very rare, most life in the universe is probabilistically bound to be simple microbes. Even if there was a civilization of a similar level to ours nearby in the galaxy we wouldn't have any way of detecting them unless they where right next door to us. Even if there was an intersteller civilization in this very galaxy the odds of them being anywhere near us are miniscule. Believe it or not it's actually a pretty long way between star systems, it might take them millions of years to get anywhere near us.
What I am trying to say is that there is no paradox, the fact that we aren't seeing aliens is to be expected.
If an intelligent God can just pop into existence than a molecule can reproduce itself and evolve into intelligent life
Not actually. Atheism needs a naturalistic answer, and your claim invokes magic.
My claim comes from beyond our reality and invokes the unexplained from a reality beyond ours. It invokes the supernatural. I need no magic. I need an outside variable. You need magic.
Ayo bronto man, I'm Marshall Mathers the rapper. I'm smarter than you because I have millions of dollars. All atheism is is the not believing in God or any diety, which doesnt requires anything but not believing in any diety. Saying that your God comes from "beyond this reality" does not help you verify whether or not your beliefs are rational or if God is real or explain how it works or if it does work at all. Your strawman about invoking the supernatural and magic is just your own projection based on what you think atheism means. In reality you just assume there is a God and atheists assume nothing and only believe what can be verified in objective reality.
Is it possible that your god is simply a delusion and an emotional placebo?
An adult version of that imaginary childhood friend that most rational and sane blokes outgrow.
To quote one of your holy book's heroes, Saul of tarsus, who, BTW, was a homosexual.... When I became an adult I out away childish things.
LOL
Godists see through the glass of truth darkly.
Ouch..I reckon I'm your worst nightmare, eh? An atheist who is not only more educated than you but also knows your bible as well as if not better than you.
Know thine enemy, right mate?
There is no god.
Its all in your head.
Like Thor and Zeus and Odin and Yahweh.
Get a grip, son.
His...hurry up and ban me. I consider it a compliment and a testament to my superior intellect to get banned from threads like this one.
Ouch..I reckon I'm your worst nightmare, eh? An atheist who is not only more educated than you but also knows your bible as well as if not better than you.
Know thine enemy, right mate?
Nom, in debates against me, you never knew what you were talking about and took hours to respond to points, rather than the normal minutes. You've even claimed things weren't in the Bible that are, and that things were in the Bible that are not. You're a Bible expert as much as I'm a urinary tract infection expert.
