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Debate Score:48
Arguments:43
Total Votes:62
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 Can a socialist be right wing? (31)

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ArchonElite(337) pic



Can a socialist be right wing?

Bronto has the IQ of a box of hedge clippings.
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1 point

Can they be ultra nationalists ?

ArchonElite(337) Disputed
1 point

Can they be ultra nationalists ?

No, actually. The natural inclination of a collectivist is globalism rather than nationalism.

Amarel(4790) Disputed
2 points

The natural inclination of a collectivist is globalism rather than nationalism.

That’s incorrect. Collectivists are naturally inclined to view individuals according to category, nothing more. In fact, the form that collectivism most commonly takes is racism, and other localized group discrimination.

If a nation has a socialist agenda as well as nationalistic protectionist measures, they are not less socialist. Even if they kicked out all foreigners and declared a socialist utopia for whites only, they would not be less socialist. Simply more selective. Even if it were the case that collectivists tended toward globalism, socialism and nationalism would not be mutually exclusive.

Now that we know a socialist nation can also be ultra nationalist, the question is whether they are right wing for their nationalism or left wing for their socialism.

1 point

Nom caught proving he is a Hitlerian fascist

Nom quote:

"Corbyn and his socialist army are coming for you. There is no escape. There is only assimilation or death."

http://www.createdebate.com/debate/show/TheresaMayshouldretire

Nom Quote proving he's an antisemitic Nazi:

"Shut up you extremist Jew prick."

http://www.createdebate.com/debate/show/ Jews oftheworldItscomingAGAINHATEisintheairYoucanFEELitcantyou

1 point

A 'socialist' could be a lot of things. He could be a wall street banker. See TARP, S&L bailout and FDIC single-payer, govt-run 'health' insurance.

Farmers getting subsidies and price supports. (dairy) Those free market/capitalists [sic] need those govt. handouts and price supports. (FCIC)

Then there is pensions...PBGC

And overseas private [sic] investors...OPIC.

Socialism for the rich is my kind of capitalism.

If you're liberal enough about it, why not?............................

1 point

Can a socialist be right wing?

One could be quasi-libertarian/quasi-anti federalist that support weak federal government, and strong state & local rights/power. Then, each state and/or local community could have much pull on their area. As such, it is possible they could support some form of Socialism on a small level. It is conceivable that an entire town could be run on Worker's Co-operatives, and agree to pull money/resources together in some fashion to be distributed throughout the community in a pre-planned manner. Then, such a person could decide to live under this setting, while supporting limited or no taxes, classical capitalistic corporate structure, etc. etc. elsewhere.

ArchonElite(337) Clarified
2 points

One could be quasi-libertarian/quasi-anti federalist

I myself am a libertarian socialist, and an anti-federalist. These things are not inherently right wing.

that support weak federal government, and strong state & local rights/power.

That's similar to what socialism is meant to do in the first place. The decentralization of power is fundamental to socialist philosophy.

it is possible they could support some form of Socialism on a small level

I could imagine an almost fully socialist state falling under this description. Of course, socialism is a spectrum rather than an absolute. Even some right wing systems have a small degree of socialism but there is a point on the political spectrum somewhere right after "social democracy" where you cross over into actually being fundamentally "Socialist" by definition. And by definition, the more left wing you are, the more socialist you are. Socialism literally is the far left itself.

xMathFanx(1748) Clarified
2 points

@ArchonElite

I myself am a libertarian socialist, and an anti-federalist.

That would hold if you consider the system confined to a local area or state, though not others. That is, in the absence of nation-wide, and/or global mandate.

That's similar to what socialism is meant to do in the first place.

The term "socialism" is a player in a language game, as with "communism". The idea of small-scale communes operated by several dozen or so people at a time few people take issue with, when voluntarily created & maintained--same with worker co-operatives. Now, communes have decentralized power, and organization, however when people practically discuss the terms "socialism" or "communism" in modern political discourse, they refer to willfully & happily conceding tremendous amounts of power to a state authority who would, in principle, act as an authoritative mediator/arbiter/referee/middle-man. Of course, this is the antithesis to the guiding principle of a small-scale commune.

Right Wing

The further right-wing one gets, it strips away government power entirely and becomes individualist in nature. That is, one is in charge of & responsible for themselves, their possessions (i.e. private property) & their family unit, as well as an inner circle, if applicable (e.g. very close friends, etc.). Then, these people/units voluntarily decide whether or not they desire to collaborate with others, or disengage/disassociate. It can potentially look quite a bit like communes, in some instances, with the main difference that people barter and/or trade for goods, if desired, rather than a mandated collaborative pool of community resources.

0 points

Bronto has the IQ of a box of hedge clippings.

He literally just sits there all day trying to brainwash other idiots with the same far right nonsense he's been brainwashed with.

"Need a reference to back up the lies I'm telling you? Sure. Here's a quote from Hitler."

He's dumber than a wet fence post.

JugsNThugs(159) Disputed Banned
1 point

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JugsNThugs(159) Disputed Banned
1 point

Nom caught proving he is a Hitlerian fascist

Nom quote:

"Corbyn and his socialist army are coming for you. There is no escape. There is only assimilation or death."

http://www.createdebate.com/debate/show/TheresaMayshouldretire

Nom Quote proving he's an antisemitic Nazi:

"Shut up you extremist Jew prick."

http://www.createdebate.com/debate/show/ Jews oftheworldItscomingAGAINHATEisintheairYoucanFEELitcantyou

0 points

Of COURSE. Many of them HAVE been, but they weren't the GOOD socialists. They weren't "democratic" socialists ….. the GOOD guys! :-)

1 point

To say it is socialism for the investor class, is to say they own the benefits...the profits, while taxpayers 'own' the risk. For far too many it is heads they win...tails you lose.