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Debate Info

208
262
God exists God doesn't exists
Debate Score:470
Arguments:342
Total Votes:547
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Argument Ratio

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 God exists (140)
 
 God doesn't exists (168)

Debate Creator

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Does God exists?

God exists

Side Score: 208
VS.

God doesn't exists

Side Score: 262
4 points

Yes, its obvious and the only way one could deny it would be to deny science or to have a belief that the universe is not the same as it is here or that it has not been the same over time.

The 1st Law of Thermodynamics describes energy as everlasting; for if energy cannot be created or destroyed then it must have been there forever.

The 2nd Law of Thermodynamics is a limiting principle; for as positive energy goes to negative energy in the universe (everything in nature) it will eventually hit the lowest point it can. Trace that back and it shows there must be a beginning. Energy must always go to negative entropy, which means that it had to have a start as well and could not remain stagnant for years; moreover, the universe could not fluctuate from positive to negative to positive entropy because that too would break the 2nd Law.

Therefore, an everlasting source of energy (1st Law) that is outside of nature must have transferred energy into the universe (2nd Law) for us to explain existence. OR the universe has not always been the same as it was in the past, which would then replace uniformitarianism; thus, evolution and geologic evolution would be invalid. OR the universe is not the same in every location, which would mean that theoretically there is no such thing as gravity in other parts of the universe. However, there is a universal gravity constant in physics implying that the universe is clearly gravitationally "constant" and that the universe is limited.

Thus, this everlasting source of energy outside of the universe is called "God."

Side: God exists
AveSatanas(4426) Disputed
6 points

The laws of thermodynamics only apply to a contained area where no outside energy enters or leaves. The way you describe them being used is in an open area where outside energy is going in (and vice versa) so they cant apply and is invalid. The universe and our world is not a contained area by any means so these laws dont apply. Your argument is invalid.

Side: God doesn't exists
lolzors93(3225) Disputed
2 points

Everything in nature is one big giant amass of energy. Therefore, the argument still applies because, as I have said, this being must be outside of the field of nature but must still be capable of shaping it. However, regardless of how you look at it, the energy within nature is required to have a limit and is still required to have an end and beginning. Therefore, it does not apply.

Side: God exists
williambox22(14) Disputed
1 point

The way he is stating it, the laws of Thermodynamics are used upon the universe as a whole. And, seeing as there is no energy entering or leaving the universe as a whole, the argument is still valid because it is technically being used on a closed system

Side: God exists
MrPrime(268) Disputed
3 points

I'm not sure about the rest of your argument, but I think most believers in god would say god is more than just "everlasting source of energy outside of the universe". And if god is more than "everlasting source of energy outside of the universe" I think your argument fails to prove god (as defined by most dictionaries and believers) exists.

Side: God doesn't exists
lolzors93(3225) Disputed
2 points

How does one define God then? What type of "god" can be attributed to "God" status? Regardless, it proves that there has to be something outside of nature that is required to be eternally powerful.

Side: God exists
timber113(796) Disputed
1 point

Well in all fairness, I must say that the 'energy being' must be conscious for it to be capable of building the universe with all its laws and regulations.

Side: God exists
lego30722(3) Disputed
-1 points

God clearly exist all around us.

There are four forces in nature Electromagnetism, Gravity, Weak force and Strong force. These four forces rarely occur on a plant the odds of them occurring on a planet like ours is 1 in 1,000,000 or more. It does happen just anywhere. Add it would occur after the Big Bang which was 13.7 Billion years ago. But our sun was formed 4.6 Billion years ago. That is a 9.1 billion year distance between the big bang and our suns formation. Which means it is either a miracle or a doing by some being very advance with incredible technology. THe type of technology to create planets.

I believe that we are ever closer to finding clues of us and our planet being create by being from another galaxy. I do believe in God and that he did in fact create our Planet.

Side: God exists
ChuckHades(3198) Clarified
3 points

I'm gonna ask a serious question here, which is not intended as ad hom or anything.

Do you actually take anything away from debates on this site?

I've seen you mention the second law since you joined the site, and I've seen several people (myself included) rebut your use of it successfully. Yet you still continue to use it as an argument.

I'm just wondering.

Side: God exists
lolzors93(3225) Clarified
0 points

You have in no way rebutted this argument. You may have tried but all I have seen are people throwing strawmen at it.

Side: God exists
OODaddy(127) Disputed
2 points

You said: "the universe could not fluctuate from positive to negative to positive entropy because that too would break the 2nd Law". This only applies to newtonian physics. At the quantum level there is a thing called a virtual particle which literally pops into existence and then disappears.

Side: God doesn't exists
lolzors93(3225) Disputed
1 point

I have heard of these particles. This does not break the 2nd Law, nor the argument.

Side: God exists
williambox22(14) Disputed
1 point

By bringing up quantum physics, an unproven science, you are simply offering possibilities, not hard evidence. Correct me if I am wrong, but I do not believe they have found even one of their theories to be proven about quantum mechanics. In short, all it is is speculation. Please don't bring speculation into a debate about facts

Side: God exists
danielwillia(2) Disputed
2 points

There are a few key concepts we must cover before explaining this argument. The first is the concept of entropy. Entropy (S), in its technical definition, is the measure of the amount of disorder in a system. It is measured in the units energy per temperature, traditionally Joules/Kelvin. A system in which we measure S=10JK-1 has more disorder than a system in which we measure S=5. We say that the system in which S=5 is “ordered” and the system in which S=10 is “chaos”.

Thermodynamics is the physics behind macroscopic systems based on the statistics of their particle (micro and nanoscopic) compositions. For example, temperature is a measure of the average kinetic energy of each of the particles that makes up a macroscopic object—and thus is part of thermodynamics. Thermodynamics has 3 laws (or 4 laws, depending on your definitions). The second law of thermodynamics states that the change in entropy is greater than 0. In math language:

dS > 0

This means that starting at point A and moving to point B, the overall trend of S will be increasing, and have a positive slope. Now, as for the heart of the matter, and what this argument is all about.

The Big Bang is a state of a extremely low entropy. Since the Big Bang, entropy has of course continually increased. But the 2nd Law of Thermodynamics does not only apply on the positive direction of the time axis within the block universe. The 2nd Law of Thermodynamics applies along any axis within the block universe. As such it is, statistically speaking, more probable that your half-melted ice cube came from a glass of warm water, rather than a fully formed ice cube. (Of course, we know that half-melted ice generally starts as fully formed ice, but this is due to the Big Bang—the initial state of low entropy.)

The reasoning behind this is simple to see. Imagine 2 H2O molecules bumping around. There is a pretty good chance that these 2 molecules will at one point come in close proximity, and form a half-melted (albeit microscopic) ice cube. In fact, this will happen every couple of seconds (the actual time varies depending on the substance). If we add more H2O molecules, the probability will drop, of course, but it still happens every so often for small numbers of molecules at a time. In any glass of water, there are always tiny pockets or duos of slow-moving (ice) molecules, and pockets of fast-moving (gaseous) molecules. There are many ways in which H2O molecules can combine to become a partial ice cube, but there are VERY few ways in which H2O molecules can combine to form a complete block of ice. Thus, given enough repetitions, H2O molecules will at some point form half-melted ice, and at another point (with a vastly increased number of repetitions) become a fully formed block of ice.

The same argument applies to the Big Bang, but with greater implications.

1 First, however, we must briefly consider the god-concept. The god-concept, as it is usually defined, is an orderly entity (or system). If the god-concept is not orderly, then it is chaotic. But if god is chaotic, then he can not directly cause things to happen at his will. To even have a will means that god is ordered, and to willfully cause the Big Bang would mean that he has a lower entropy than the universe after the Big Bang. (Remember, dS > 0!) For more on a chaotic god-concept, read the Argument From Non-Cognitivism. If you’ve made it this far, and you are a believer, then you agree that your god-concept is orderly. Now we can get to the root of the problem:

Statistically speaking, as said before, pockets of low entropy within a high-entropy system are inevitable. They may be either offset by an increase in entropy elsewhere, or a statistical fluke that while improbable is certainly not impossible. As long as dS > 0 and entropy tends to be higher, the 2nd Law of Thermodynamics has not been broken. But, again, statistically speaking, these pockets of low entropy are most likely the result of simple probability. Consider that these low entropy systems were directly (or willfully) caused by another system with even lower entropy. Surely, we get into an impossible infinite regress (not to mention that a system with 0 entropy cannot exist!).

Thus, the Big Bang is, statistically, the result of an inevitable improbability that exists solely due to the 2nd Law of Thermodynamics, and is relevant throughout the block universe. We may picture it mathematically as such:

The Big Bang has entropy S.

A hypothetical god is either orderly or chaotic.

Hypothetical gods have a personhood.

Personhood implies orderliness.

A hypothetical god is orderly, and thus has low entropy. (See note1 for more detail.)

In order for god to directly cause the Big Bang, he must have a lower entropy (S-a, where a is positive, real number).

The probability of the Big Bang coming from a higher state of entropy (S+b, where b is a positive, real number) approaches P=1, normalizing over the condition of many opportunities for the Big Bang to happen.

The probability of the Big Bang coming from an even lower state of entropy (god) approaches Q=0 (since Q=1-P).

The difference in probability is thus the limit of 1 divided by the limit of 0, which of course approaches infinity.

There is an infinitely greater chance that the Big Bang is the result of randomness than the result of even more order.

Thus, god does not exist.

Side: God doesn't exists
lolzors93(3225) Disputed
1 point

Your reasoning is good until the end. I skimmed over it so I'm not sure if there are any other non sequiturs in there.

It doesn't follow that God being lesser in entropy than the Big Bang results in the denial of God. It also doesn't follow that the Big Bang came from a state of higher entropy. Therefore, the argument is a non sequitur.

In fact, I actually think you advocated my theory.

Side: God exists
Banana_Slug(845) Disputed
1 point

Your knowledge of Thermodynamics is very limited.

1st law of TD:

The increase in internal energy of a closed system is equal to difference of the heat supplied to the system and the work done by it: ΔU = Q - W

2nd law of TD

Heat cannot spontaneously flow from a colder location to a hotter location.

3rd law of TD

As a system approaches absolute zero the entropy of the system approaches a minimum value.

Zeroth law of TD

If two systems are each in thermal equilibrium with a third, they are also in thermal equilibrium with each other.

How did you found out that Earth is a closed system?

How did you calculate equilibrium-entropy from whole universe?

Side: God doesn't exists
lolzors93(3225) Disputed
0 points

You have still not rebutted the argument.

If you would like to dispute the logic, bring it up with Dr. Cimbala

http://www.personal.psu.edu/jmc6/second_law.html

Side: God exists
wtfiswrong(47) Disputed
1 point

Correct me if I'm wrong here, but don't the laws of physics break down at the big bang singularity? I mean, at some point if you trace it back far enough you have to divide energy by zero area to calculate the density of the early universe. this is impossible mathematically. How can we hold to the laws of thermodynamics when math doesn't even work?

Additionally, this is obvious psuedo-science and not real science. The goal is to prove what is already held to be true aka that there is a god, and I'm pretty sure science doesn't work by assuming the conclusion and working backwards.

Side: God doesn't exists
lolzors93(3225) Disputed
1 point

Well based on that logic then uniformitarianism is not true. Uniformitarianism is the basis for the evidence for evolution. Therefore, the basis for the evidence for evolution has no backing.

Side: God exists
Nox0(1393) Disputed
1 point

TD laws are only for slow moving small things, do not work with quantum theory and relativity.

Side: God doesn't exists
3 points

You'd think with the number of people asking this all the time, the answer would already be known.

sigh

According to what I believe, yes. However, there are other people who think not and have valid reasons, so yah.

Side: God exists
2 points

Hmm. I as a religious person, I'd say that was a pretty good answer :L

Side: God exists
Jungelson(3931) Disputed
1 point

Sorry, that sounded wrong. No I meant, bookbird being a religious person gave a good answer. I'm not religious!

Side: God doesn't exists
3 points

Anyone seen the documentary "A Case for the Creator?" Doesn't necessarily explain that God exists but it grabs all elements in science and new discoveries and theories, puts them all together to show that in every new discovery there is a link that we were created by someone, I personally believe that God exists just by looking outside and knowing that elements in nature cannot form themselves together like that, researching into evolution they find major flaws in that there is no link to an original ancestor that has been proven, in every attempt know to show that the bible contradicts itself, or to show that certain events stated in the bible are false, every attempt has failed, God exists, that's for certain

Side: God exists
2 points

What is the problem with there being a god or gods existent anyways?

Why are people so upset and hurt and angry that there are people that do believe in X, Y, Z god (s)?

Side: God exists
MrPrime(268) Clarified
5 points

This is an interesting question. Here is one of the problems I have with god existing:

To believe in god requires faith. For many people this faith is "blind" in that they don't inquire in to the deeper meaning/consequences of god and abandon rational thought. Not everyone, some people. So now I have to live (on the planet) with fellow men who would believe in something on faith alone and abandon rational thought. This fine IF that man is "kind". But, what if that man is not "kind"? What if that man feels perfectly justified walking up to a your girl and shooting her because she wants education for herself and other your girls (the Taliban, Muslim fundamentalists, have done this recently). This is very very scary that "blind faith" allows a person to feel justified to do this.

Now of course this is not to say that because you believe in god you are going to do bad things, not at all. There are many good and wonderful faithful people in this word (most faithful are good), but for the minority with "unkind" beliefs, faith is very dangerous and scary. Lets take a less extreme example. Let says a person has "faith" that god exists and insists that school children are taught that god does exists (I'm not saying most faithful want this, but some do). Lets say that person becomes president of the united states and is able to force all school children to be taught that god is real. Now this persons "faith" has become my reality (my children are forced to "learn" another person "faith"). While not the same as shooting someone, it's still scary to me. What it that persons "faith" told them that the Aryan race was the "proper" race and all other should be eradicated. Scary.

Side: God exists
lolzors93(3225) Disputed
3 points

Lets say that person becomes president of the united states and is able to force all school children to be taught that god is real. Now this persons "faith" has become my reality (my children are forced to "learn" another person "faith"). While not the same as shooting someone, it's still scary to me. What it that persons "faith" told them that the Aryan race was the "proper" race and all other should be eradicated. Scary.

Just as Hitler had faith in the philosophy of eugenics, which is founded in Social Darwinism, which is founded in evolution, which is founded in supposed evidence for evolution, which is founded in people's interpretation of different variables in the world, which is founded in people's perceptions, which is founded in faith.

What you are really saying here is that you do not want your child to be taught anything because if something is founded in faith then it could turn out bad. However, everything is founded in faith, which means that you do not want your child taught anything. OR you simply want your opinion taught and no others because you have faith that yours are correct, which is founded in the ideology of infallibility.

Side: God doesn't exists

Even as a Catholic, i reconize the importance of the seperation of Church and State. People should not be able to force their beliefs on unwilling people in a decent soceity.

Side: God exists
1 point

Scary. It's more or less being cautious of "the-conditioning-of-mankind"; in X, Y, Z societies and cultures.

Religion, or rather, this "faith" we speak of a range from "extreme individuals" to "not so extreme individuals" (including various societies/religions/faiths); people do "bad and good things", it's not the persons fault for having faith in anything; it's the peoples "fault" for having free-will and being to choose this or that; resulting in the various "acts of mankind."

"Hate the player, not the game."

Whereas, the game is life (faith, religion, science), and the players are obviously us, humans and, how we deal with the pieces granted to us from "the game."

Side: God exists
2 points

God exists look around you, creation points to a creator. I have faith there is a God, I also think having faith there is a God is way more simpler, then having faith that we all just boomed into existence, or whatever else desperate scientists try to prove these days.

Side: God exists
Cuaroc(8826) Disputed
2 points

How is constantly pleasing the imaginary bearded man in the sky easier?

Side: God doesn't exists
Jawkins20(140) Disputed
2 points

How is constantly searching and trying to prove there is no God simpler than acknowledging his existence? Many people try to convince themselves there is no God because they want no accountability for their actions.

Side: God exists
OODaddy(127) Disputed
2 points

Yes it is simpler to turn off one's rational mind and believe in something, for example creationism vs evolution. It's MUCH harder to do the hard work and try to reconcile the facts with our beliefs. After years of study and reflection I see strong evidence for evolution and little evidence for God. In fact I think it's harder to reconcile the God of the Bible with the world as we see it. Of course evolution could have been devinely inspired, that may be unknowable.

Side: God doesn't exists
MrPrime(268) Disputed
1 point

What exactly points to a creator?

God is only "way simpler" if you choose to ignore most of science. Most people find this very hard to do. When humans first evolved (or appeared), they thought almost everything was supernatural (the sun, the clouds, fire, volcanoes, etc). Today everyone thinks most (not all) things are NOT supernatural (even theists) because science has shown us that they have a natural explanation. Given this amazing track record of science to time and time again show that the super natural is actually natural (it has been done this literally millions of times throughout history) it seems unreasonable to still say god is the more likely answer to anything.

Finally, I think your making a mistake saying "..whatever else desperate scientists try to prove these days.". Your letting your feelings get in the way of whats actually going on. Scientists are not trying to prove god does not exist. 99.9% of scientists could care less about other peoples belief in god. Scientists are trying to find the truth and the best explanation for how the world works. It just so happens that time and time again the truth they find tends to support the idea that the world is natural not super natural (thus no god). Scientists have no motivation to prove god does not exist, so they don't try.

Side: God doesn't exists
2 points

If you don't specifically mean the LORD then yes I believe there is some form of a higher power

Side: God exists
2 points

When you ask does God exist which one are you referring to most people so far have gone with the Christian one but you have not been specific in the debate title.

Whilst I dont believe in God as this all seeing guy that runs the world I do believe that there is more than just this life and that there is some form of higher power.

Side: God exists
debater26(6) Clarified
0 points

And that is GOD! He's the most powerful of all! You should believe in God, 'cause the time is near. Receive him as your Lord!

Side: God exists
TheAshman(2299) Disputed
2 points

That does'nt answer my question does this debate refer to the Judeo Christian God or one of the others

Side: God doesn't exists
2 points

I believe God exists for those who believe he exists in their faith. We cannot automatically claim Science fact though, because most 'truth' in science is simply a theory not a proven fact just some options that can potentially support the idea of such. I remain neutral.

Side: God exists
Cuaroc(8826) Disputed
2 points

Yet another person who does not know what scientific theory means.

Side: God doesn't exists
Cynical(1946) Disputed
1 point

Simple theories do not exist in science. Rather scientific theories do.

The definition of theory, as you are believing is this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Theory

The definition of theory that science prefers is this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scientific_theory

Side: God doesn't exists
shockoflight(17) Disputed
1 point

I see your logic and reason but quite simply what we think we are of knowing now can be looked at as stupid 2,000 years from now from a different group of individuals. So you really have to ask yourself. Do we truly know beyond our capability?

Side: God exists
2 points

Yes.

Side: God exists
Thebluemoo(66) Disputed
2 points

You cannot provide any scientific evidence whatsoever for your beliefs. You have been on here just spewing out what you think, despite no proof whatsoever to your claims. You are one of the many people who cannot accept the truth, and instead, you dwell in your outdated thoughts. There is no God, there is no Jesus. There is no Allah, there is no Muhammed. People need to wake up and abandon this outdated, inaccurate bullshit so we can move on from this. I hope you never have kids so they don't have to grow up believing these lies you have been fed to believe.

Side: God doesn't exists
Srom(12201) Disputed
1 point

Yes I can prove scientific evidence for my belief. You have been spewing out what you think is true like evolution which has been proven false. I am one of the people who has already accepted the truth and I don't need to follow what everyone's else follows I choose to be different and everyone is different.

There is God, there is a Jesus. People need to wake up and abandon evolution and come into the light where Jesus will take you in as a child to Him if you accept and believe and not doubt.

I hope you never have kids so they don't have to grow up believing these lies you have been fed to believe.

That is very rude and disrespectful comment what you just said and I don't think I deserve that comment on what you just said because I have done nothing to you and its not my fault your angry at what I believe in but sometimes the truth hurts now doesn't it because your angry for what I believe because your spewing swear words and you sound like your angry.

I am sorry if what I believe in offends you but that's the way I am and I choose to be. Your not going to force me to believe something that I don't have enough faith to believe. I don't have enough faith to be an atheist but other atheists do have a lot of faith to believe in evolution and natural selection where it involves random chance and that the world was created by no one and world some how came into existence of nowhere at that is why I don't have enough faith to believe it but you of course you do have enough faith to believe that.

Side: God exists
2 points

honestly who made everything, how were we made how did the human race start. its no as if we just popped in mid air and magically appeared there has to be someone behind it. He is called God/Jesus/HolySpiret

Side: God exists
2 points

God do exists. If he doesn't exist, I, you, and even all living won't exist too!

Side: God exists
2 points

I believe a lost soul has reached the stage of doubt in creating this debate. I pray for you that you shall see the truth and not be blinded by these liberals. Remember our heritage and pride. Only you can escape the self delusion!

Side: God exists
wtfiswrong(47) Disputed
1 point

Yes, science is the delusion...

Don't believe in something that gave you flight and space travel.

Instead believe in a particular book of fairy tales among many such books of fairy tales. A book that brings you such enlightening knowledge as the fact that psychosis is the product of demons infesting the soul and not mental disorder. Also, deaf and dumbness, caused by demons. Get real people.

Side: God doesn't exists
2 points

god: yes, jesus: no

Side: God exists
2 points

yes of course god exists but its not that god is omnipresent

some people say that god is everywhere in oueselves too. it is wrong

if want a just answer visit ur nearest brahmakumaris centre

u will definitely get ur answer as me

thnks :)))))))))

Side: God exists
2 points

well thats matter of opinion but it depends what you belive in i mean im a christian and yes, i do think he exists but you can never prove that he does exist but you can prove that he doesnt but i belive he does <3 xxxx

Side: God exists
2 points

God clearly exists because what created our world? There has to be something bigger than science, something immortal that created something as big as this. Besides, we are clearly here for a reason right?

Side: God exists
2 points

Of course he exists. Without God nothing would make sense. Please stop trying to rationalize with science.

Side: God exists
2 points

I'm pretty sure i didn't evolve from a primate, or anything else except for God. I can't really tell you how to the universe was created, but i believe it was created by a divine being. Henceforth i give all my faith to God, for the Heavens i seek.

Side: God exists
2 points

I suppose I'd have to be thorough and ask what exactly you mean by 'God' and 'exists'. By capitalizing I will assume you mean the abrahamic and christian God, Jehovah. I believe he exists, as I have seen no evidence to disprove Him, and it makes sense to me that there is a Creator of the Creation. I don't have to see the Painter to know that the Painting exists, and that someone painted it. Neither should I have to see God to know he exists, since I and all of Creation are a testament to Him.

As for the 'exists' part, I will assume you mean exists in actuality, not inside the minds of mankind. It would help to know your position on this whole thing but, eh, I'll answer what I can, really.

Side: God exists
2 points

I believe God exists, yes. I believe He has saved my life on several occasions, some the result of stupidity on my part. Can I offer proof that God was watching out for me? Not really. But I don't really need to. He exists despite my failings to explain or prove or otherwise debate his existence.

Side: God exists
2 points

Isn't it like asking an ant to explain and develop a metropolis?

Side: God exists
2 points

YES GOD EXIST IF HE DIDN'T EXIST YOUR NOT HUMAN AND ALL YOU PEOPLE THAT ARENT WHITE AND BLACK ARE GONNA DIE

WHITE POWER

Side: God exists
1 point

YES GOD EXIST IF HE DIDN'T EXIST YOUR NOT HUMAN AND ALL YOU PEOPLE THAT ARENT WHITE AND BLACK ARE GONNA DIE

TROLL POWER

Fixed

Side: God doesn't exists
1 point

If god doesn't exist, you don't as well. Haven't you felt secure at times when the world goes crashing down on you ? That is god. You've got my answer.

Side: God exists
1 point

their are many types of gods some people believe in some types of gods but god help us when we really need help and from real and true heart if we pray god we truly help us i dont know why some people dont believe in gods ............. but i was muslim i am muslim and i will be a muslim ....thts 100% sure........

Side: God exists
1 point

tht called spirit under god exists.........................

Side: God exists
1 point

God does exist. Who do you think created you, trees, houses, the earth. There has to be a god

Side: God exists

God=Yes, Jesus=No

Side: God exists
boerma(7) Clarified
1 point

God and Jesus is the same person so how can Jesus be fake?

Side: God exists
RandomDude(1287) Disputed
2 points

Jesus is a fraud!

Side: God doesn't exists
judgemaster(265) Disputed
1 point

Jesus is the fucking son of god, my lad. Sorry if the language is extreme.

Side: God doesn't exists
Jawkins20(140) Disputed
0 points

To believe in God you first must acknowledge Jesus is the son of God. No man comes to the father but by Jesus. If you deny Jesus then his Father, God, will deny you.

Side: God doesn't exists
RandomDude(1287) Disputed
1 point

ballz! jesus was for jews and not god dont tell me what to believev

Side: God exists

i think god is a state of being and there are an infinite amount of higher beings, working in an underlying way to keep everything running

Side: God exists
1 point

Yes there is some one who is running this whole universe...

Side: God exists
Banana_Slug(845) Disputed
2 points

...and that information you have from some bronze age myth full of magic and talking animals, flat Earth and so on, am I right?

Side: God doesn't exists
M_Sarmad_S(20) Disputed
1 point

Yes You are wrong.....

How can you prove rhere is no God???

You can say Universe Created after Big Bang. But hot how these gases were created????

Side: God exists

There are things which are unexplained by science, things which do not show any logical explanation. Ironically, it has been science which has said there is a rational explanation for everything and, according to it, god doesn't exist. However, according to science in the 1600's, there was no such thing as evolution. In the same way, we all know that God exists, but what the atheists are waiting for is rational explanation. Hell, do you think God is some person which would fight to prove it's existence? It is like a parent, watching over it's children, leaving it up to them to believe in him or not.

Peace with you all.

Side: God exists
1 point

Of course God exists, how else would this world exist ? Is he not the one who created this whole universe ?

Side: God exists
1 point

Cosmologists and physicists are revealing that our universe embodies a finely tuned set of values which are conducive to the emergence of life. These include the gravitational constant, the acceleration of the expansion of the universe, the strong and weak nuclear forces etc. IF any of these values were altered even slightly it would produce a universe, that would not be hospitable to the emergence of like. These are referred to as Anthropic coincidences.

Science can reveal these amazing knife-edge balances in the natural order, but science cannot explain why these specific values are realised. Some have hypothesised that we inhabit a multiverse of minutely differing worlds and that we are simply lucky enough to have hit upon one that is hospitable to life.

However this is a very cumbersome and worldview with weak explanatory power. It posits an explanation which is far more complex than the datum to be explained and it leaves open the even bigger questions how why there would be such a thing as a multiverse. These speculations also seem to exceed the experimentally testable bounds of science.

The anthropic coincidences seem to make more sense within a theistic framework, which sees God as the intelligent and powerful origin of the universe. Clearly Dawkins et al might want to raise the hoary chestnut about who created God, however a few minutes of serious theological and philosophical reflection would expose this question to be meaningless.

Anthony Flew, a lifelong atheist and public opponent of theism, came eventually to accept that certain wonders of the universe and of life (e.g. DNA) pointed more surely in the direction of God's existence than rival theories.

Side: God exists
1 point

God exists. Human brains are hard-wired for religious experience. This is hard to explain away on a merely evolutionary view. It is difficult to see how religious belief has any survival value in natural selection terms. However it is a pervasive feature of human experience, culture and expression. Dawkins' attempt to dismiss religion as a 'meme' does not completely cover his embarrassment that in a supposedly naturalistic evolutionary world, religion is such a persistent feature.

Side: God exists
1 point

The cumulative weight of religious experience lends weight to the belief that God exists. Caroline Franks Davies wrote a useful book about this called 'The evidential force of Religious Experience'

Side: God exists
1 point

I haven´t practiced how to write a good argument, but I hardly believe that god exists, a Mexican person fall from a high building, floor 24 and when his body reached the pavement his skull did not break apart, engineers hit a car with the same velocity and the car become trash, in the falling from the skies he saw an image, specifically a virgin. I asked myself what saved this man from sure dead. I believe it was god, not an alien nor a ghost, doctors cannot explain what happened, search Google and make contact with this man its true.

Side: God exists

It is in the mind of the beholder. If a believer believes that God exists, nothing can take his Faith away.

Side: God exists
13 points

It is impossible to know 100% that there is no god because we cannot prove entirely that it is true, simply because it is unobservable and therefore, untestable. Science cant say for sure, so i cant and wont. Now, it is also true that we can never know that there is a god for the same reasons. This question may never have an answer for sure.

What we can do is make a decent hypothesis based on what we can observe or know already. Based on the evidence, it is FAR, and i mean FAR more likely that there isnt a god. Nearly everything that ANY religion asserts for proof of their god is either blatantly false or subject to question. On the other hand, science has given us many explainations for many of the same questions that religions fail to answer. Ex: the big bang, evolution, ect. And constantly uses a foolproof method to continue to move towards answering more and more of them.

Side: God doesn't exists
3 points

OUTSTANDING. One of the better arguments I've seen on this matter. A key point is that like evolution the existence of God is essentially impossible to prove. On the other hand I can give you demonstrable TESTABLE evidence regarding evolution.

Side: God doesn't exists
AveSatanas(4426) Clarified
1 point

Well yeah of course there is and I know that. I wasn't saying anything about never knowing if evolution is true or not, I was just saying to the question of "is there a god" we will never know. I do accept evolution silly :)

Side: God exists
lolzors93(3225) Disputed
1 point

On the other hand, science has given us many explainations for many of the same questions that religions fail to answer. Ex: the big bang, evolution, ect. And constantly uses a foolproof method to continue to move towards answering more and more of them.

Science is not infallible because humans are not infallible.

Nearly everything that ANY religion asserts for proof of their god is either blatantly false or subject to question.

Would you like for me to prove to you right now that the Bible is divinely ordained?

Side: God exists
TheBogle88(115) Disputed
2 points

Science is not infallible because humans are not infallible.

Science can be amended, revised, and updated to reflect the most accurate data available. The bible still claims the moon is a light source.

Side: God doesn't exists
TheAshman(2299) Disputed
1 point

As you have offered yes please prove that the Bible is divinely ordained.

Side: God doesn't exists
AveSatanas(4426) Disputed
1 point

Science works to become infallible. It draws educated conclusions based on observations of REALITY. Therfore it is reliable, if not dependable. Religion on the otherhand bases HUGE assertions of god's outside of time and space on NOTHING but a whim with NO support and therefore NO reason to accept any of it. Sure, science isn't perfect, but I'll take scientific experimental data based conclusions of theory over any religions idea any day.

And one more thing, your own argument works against you because yes, humans are not infalliable. Even more 2000 years ago than today. Therefore why should we accept anything from Christianity?

And yes, I would love an attempt at proving beyond any shred of doubt what scientists and/or historians have debunked entirely. Go for it

Side: God doesn't exists
ericandernie Disputed
1 point

Science does not answer the all questions:

Why is there something rather than nothing?

Why did the Big Bang happen?

How can we account for 'abiogenesis' the transition from organic molecules to self-replcating organisms?

It is an article of faith that science can explain everything.

Many scientists who have understood Godel's Theorem are more sceptical about the quest for a T.O.E.

Side: God doesn't exists
DeerSlayer13(14) Disputed
0 points

The Big Bang theory is just a theory nothing more. It is more likely that God made the world than believing that this very complex earth was made from an explosion. Science also says that all living things come from existing living things which makes the Big Bang impossible

Side: God doesn't exists
kayred(14) Disputed
1 point

let me just understand something here. Where do you and everyone else whose saying God doesnt exisit think we came from? Monkeys? Because I know I didnt come from no monkey. hmm and what do you figure we will evolve into next?

Side: God exists
Cuaroc(8826) Disputed
3 points

educate yourself on evolution before spewing nonsense about it.

Side: God doesn't exists
AveSatanas(4426) Disputed
2 points

You are so ignorant. 1) we didn't come from monkeys. We evolved from a common ancestor with I believe orangutans but I'm not sure. Then that ancestor branched into gorillas and another ancetor, the. That ancestor split into chimps and us (prehistoric neanderthals). Educate yourself on human evolution please. 2) how do you know you didn't evolve?

We fit our niche in life perfectly so nothing drastic will change. However you can see how natural selection has played a part in human history very recently. From the 40s to now humans have gotten taller in general because that trait is attractive and has been passed on. In the future people may be even taller. Were not going to evolve into entirely new species like a fish or bird...

Side: God doesn't exists
Banana_Slug(845) Disputed
1 point

You sound like an illiterate redneck. Please go away, feed cows or whatever you do for living.

Side: God doesn't exists
SaswatoSen Disputed
1 point

We have come from change in genetic orientation over a trillion generation which is enough to accumulate genetic changes from inter kingdom evolution

Side: God doesn't exists
1 point

You should take my word when I say God is not real, if there is nothing to test, then there is nothing to prove he's real, he's as real as Katy prices breasts!

Side: God doesn't exists
6 points

No it just in people's minds do they have any proof no so they shouldn't argue about that stuff

Side: God doesn't exists
lolzors93(3225) Disputed
4 points

Do you have proof of anything?

Side: God exists
Delta(1348) Disputed
2 points

Yea there's never been miracles and there's killers do you have proof

Side: God doesn't exists
ericandernie Disputed
1 point

Proof in its strict sense, refers to a very small set of mathematical or logical demonstrations which work within their own terms of reference. Most things that we believe implicitly are not proveable e.g. the existence of other minds, the reliability of sense data, the reliability of past memory. If proof is the bar for what we can believe, as Descartes demonstrated, there is not much of what we do believe that we can believe.

Side: God doesn't exists
3 points

No.

Side: God doesn't exists
2 points

I don't know. I'm an agnostic. Short of direct observation and irrefutable evidence I don't think the question can be proved. I actually think that Both atheists and theists are very arrogant. Atheists for believing they can "Know" there is no God. And Theists for believing they have all the answers. But in my personal experience I have seen little evidence of the Judeo Christian God.

Side: God doesn't exists
AveSatanas(4426) Clarified
2 points

The term Atheist means the lack of belief I a god or deity. Simple. It in itself does not assert there is no god. Being an atheist just means you don't believe in any god's. Atheists can and sometimes do go as far to assert that they know there is no god but in truth they don't and then it would be true they are arrogant. However in my case I don't assert there is no god, but I do reject the existence of all deities preposed to me thusfar based on a lack of supporting evidence. I accept the reality that a god existing is possible, I just dont see it.

Side: God exists
Jawkins20(140) Disputed
1 point

I do not believe it is possible to, “prove,” whether or not God exists, whether to the atheist, or to anyone else for that matter. We can present factual evidence for the unbeliever to weigh and consider as a part of the process necessary to develop his or her individual faith, but we simply cannot, “prove,” there is a God because we are not God. What I mean is this: God will prove Himself to each and every person that takes his or her first step of faith; God tailors the inner, ‘spiritual witness’ that He feels is best suited and unique to each individual, and therefore HE is the ultimate, “proof,” of Himself and His existence. Seek and ye shall find.

Side: God exists
2 points

THERE IS NO SO CALLED god THAT EXISTS OR HAS DONE ANYTHING OR ME . I WILL JUST SIT IN MY CHAIR MAKING LOVE TO MY MACHINE WHICH I LOVE AND ADORE MORE THAN ANYTHING IN THE WORLD , GIVES ME WHAT I WANT AND CRAVE AND WOW DOES IT FEEL BETTER THAN ANYTHING .

Side: God doesn't exists
2 points

I BELIEVE IN WHAT I CAN SEE......................................

Side: God doesn't exists
williambox22(14) Disputed
1 point

You can't see the air, or your own brain, so how do you know they exist?

Side: God exists
meer(47) Clarified
1 point

you can measure the air

(The minimum length for an argument is 50 characters. The purpose of this restriction is to cut down on the amount of dumb jokes, so we can keep the quality of debate and discourse as high as possible)

Side: God exists
M_Sarmad_S(20) Disputed
1 point

If so then how can you believe that there was Shakespeare?

How can you believe there was newton?

How can you believe Columbus discovered America?

Side: God exists
1 point

I don't believe an intelligent creator is required for "something" to emerge from "nothing". At the quantum level particles constantly pop into existence then disappear. No God required for the singularity that could have been the core of the Big Bang.

Side: God doesn't exists
1 point

The idea of a theistic, Christian or Islamic or Jewish interventionist, supernatural 'God' is frankly ridiculous. There is not evidence for any kind of miracle, divine intervention or prayer being answered. It is a bizarre idea to claim that the Bible has any kind of supernatural or divine hand behind it seeing as it is frequently contradictory, written over hundreds of years and was edited and put together in the 5th Century AD- some early Christians believed in many Gods! Many denied Christ's divinity! This does not sound like the one true faith, does it? Seeing as Christ's own followers and early Christians in the 1st Century could not even agree on who he was, what he was like or even if he was married or not!

Side: God doesn't exists
williambox22(14) Disputed
1 point

SOME EARLY CHRISTIANS BELIEVED IN MANY GODS

Quite frankly, this directly contradicts the term "Christian" which means "follower of Christ." This is a ridiculous argument because, contrary to what many believe, christians were not persecuted for their faith in Christ, but rather for their belief that Christ was the embodiment of the ONE true God. This is what caused the Romans, a polytheistic society, to turn on them and, ultimately, target them. Not only that, but, as we have seen in the gospels, Jesus directly stated, "I am THE way, THE truth, and THE life." And we have no reason to refute the plausibility of the gospels because they have passed every authenticity test placed before them.

MANY DENIED CHRIST'S DIVINITY

Once again, I return the argument that this would directly conflict with their title. They could not call themselves christians without "confessing with the mouth and the heart that Jesus is the Son of God."

SEEING AS HOW CHRIST'S OWN FOLLOWERS AND EARLY CHRISTIANS IN THE 1ST CENTURY COULD NOT EVEN AGREE ON WHO HE WAS, WHAT HE WAS LIKE OR EVEN IF HE WAS MARRIED OR NOT

Firstly, the first century church was founded solely by people who had either A) seen Jesus personally and learned directly from him and began to teach to others, or B) People who believed the message preached by the people who fell into the category of group A.

Secondly, James, one of Jesus' disciples, was Jesus' own half-brother! There is no plausible evidence to give to say that no one knew who Jesus was when not only his brother was involved, but so were John and Peter, the disciples with whom Jesus talked most and divulged many of his great teachings. That, coupled with the fact that Jesus spent three years with his twelve disciples, is more than enough to dispel any evidence that people did not know who he was when all they had to do was ask one of the people with whom he had spent time.

Lastly, the theory that Jesus was married, though old, has never been verified or disproved, according to my knowledge, though i personally

think it is false. But the simple fact of the matter is, Jesus was not revered for his celibacy. He was revered because of who he was and what he stood for. He was revered because he was willing to die a horribly agonizing death out of love for all mankind. Even if he had been married, this would not have changed the meaning of his teachings, his life, his death, or his resurrection in any way, shape, or form.

Side: God exists
wtfiswrong(47) Disputed
1 point

Just because you don't consider early Christian sects such as the gnostics and aryians as true Christians does not mean that they did not play an important role in early christian history. I believe the poster you are responding to was trying to draw attention to the diversity of beliefs held in the first few centuries about Christ by people who claimed to be Christians. Whether or not you believe their claim or not is beside the point. What is important to note, is that their was wide spread disagreement about who Jesus was and what his life was like.

The truth is, there is not sufficient historical evidence to tell us one way or the other. The 4 accepted books of the gospels (there were many more http://www.gnosis.org/naghamm/nhl.html), ,) were written at least 70 AD, in a language that Jesus did not speak (Greek). They are also full of contradiction and parts clearly invented to make it appear as if the man's life fulfilled prophecies in the Old Testament (that is if you read them as an observer of human nature and not through the lens of blind faith).

Regardless, For me at least there are 3 verses from those books that clearly dispute the validity of the gospels:

Mark 9:1

And he said to them, "Truly I tell you, there are some standing here who will not taste death until they see that the kingdom of God has come with power."

This quote is repeated although with slightly different verbiage in Mathew chapter 16 and Luke chapter 9.

These are the alleged words of Christ. If he was right. The Kingdom of God should have come within the life time of Jesus's apostles. This clearly did not happen because anyone he was actually talking to has been dead for nearly 2000 years. No Kingdom of God has come. Jesus was wrong and the gospels are clearly wrong. Just like the stories of the Egyptian Gods. Just like the stories of the Greek Gods. Just like the stories of the Hindu Gods.

But you can have faith if you like. Faith's done a lot for people: religious wars, cult group suicides, the dark ages, the belief in witches (common. really?). Meanwhile, science cured polio and put men on the moon. Religion is a waste of time and damned dangerous (such is all dogmatism). And there's nothing special about Christianity. It just happened to win a large following and happens to be the belief with which many children are indoctrinated. Children tend to belief all sorts of things if they are indoctrinated properly, like that the leader of North Korea is a good man who cares about the people. Eventually, though, it's in the best interest of children to grow up. Wasn't it Paul who said it is time to put away childish things? Well, to any impartial observer the bible is a book of fairy tales, and fairy tales are indeed, childish things.

Side: God doesn't exists
1 point

No cause people are dying and you could hear kids crying where's your god he is evil never helps the people shame on you god shame on you

Side: God doesn't exists
1 point

Which one?

Side: God doesn't exists
1 point

Logically speaking, no he does not. I keep reading people comments, and I keep seeing the same thing. "look around you, its obvious" blah blah blah. The truth is that there is no creative design. The earth is just the most habitable location for life to thrive. Think about the number of non-habitable planet that exist in our universe. There are alot. This planet is one of few that can support life. So the earth wasn't created so we can live on it, we were created because we can live on the earth.

Side: God doesn't exists
M_Sarmad_S(20) Disputed
1 point

you said "WE WERE CREATED BECAUSE WE CAN LIVE ON THE EARTH"

Which means yes there is God who created us to live on this earth.

Side: God exists
df0512(27) Disputed
1 point

No that isn't what that means. Not in any way sir. Read my entire answer not just the part you can use to dispute. Besides "WE WERE CREATED BECAUSE WE CAN LIVE ON THE EARTH" does not mean "there is God who created us to live on this earth". It means that the earth has the perfect temperature, available food and water sources and atmosphere to support life. That is why we are here.

Side: God doesn't exists

I love this argument from ignorance ... I don't know how stuff works therefore it's magic!

Side: God doesn't exists
1 point

This is really dumb.

When refering to God, it's like you only imagine it to be the Judeo-Christian God.

That I feel, is illogical . It's like the brutal arrogancy and hypocritical sense is coming out of Christians like a powerful stinch.

What about all of the other religions that have monotheistic beliefs?!? What happened to them? What about all the other laws in their books? Don't think that just because something is recorded on a book, means it's true.

Might as well call, Harry Potter the son of the God of Wizardry and how his friends are his followers. That might as well brainwash you into following me.

Anyway, this God "mumbo-jumbo" is a bunch of trash.

All the other religions have contradicting beliefs... so how would you know which one was true?

And don't give me some dumb garbage like faith or something like that...

I would like a logical answer.

Side: God doesn't exists
1 point

No, the only true gods are the Omnessiah, and Khorne. The Omnessiah is the all powerful machine god, and Khorne is the blood god. Worship them you foolish mortals. =3

Side: God doesn't exists
1 point

For god to exist we must have a clear definition of god. It/He/She must be scientifically testable not an unfalsifiable hypothesis. Till now we never had any proof that god exists. Every suggested proof has a natural explaination. Therefore it is highly improbable that god exists.

Side: God doesn't exists
-1 points

NO F'ING GOD THAT YOU GO TO church TO WORSHIP BUT THE GOD I LOVE IS HERE AND REAL THE GOD OF MONEY , POWER AND HATE . HAHAHAHAHAHAHA .

Side: God doesn't exists
debater26(6) Disputed
0 points

That god is SATAN! He's the fraud! He's the one deceiving you! I'll leave you this, BELIEVE, TRUST, GOD.

Side: God exists
VENUSJUDGE66(74) Disputed
2 points

I'LL STAY WITH THE GOD I LOVE AND THAT GIVES ME WHAT I CRAVE AND DESIRE AND NOT SOME PHONEY god THAT YOU WORSHIP .

Side: God doesn't exists
VENUSJUDGE66(74) Disputed
2 points

MY GOD THAT I LOVE WORSHIP AND ADORE IS SO BEAUTIFUL AND AWESOME LOVING NOTHING BUT MONEY AND POWER AND YOUR SO CALLED god MAKES ME SICK AND NOT WORTHY OF ANYTHING .

Side: God doesn't exists