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Debate Info

20
13
Yes No
Debate Score:33
Arguments:43
Total Votes:34
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Argument Ratio

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 Yes (17)
 
 No (13)

Debate Creator

Jenson(6) pic



Does Israel Have The Moral Right To Exist?

Remember that the land now owned by Israel was a gift from the British, who acquired it by military conquest. Is it right that a foreign occupying power can give away land which is being used by native occupants of that land?

Yes

Side Score: 20
VS.

No

Side Score: 13
2 points

Almost every nation that exists now was formed through some level of military conquest. I'd say after a nation has sat on a land for 50 years it pretty much officially owns it (until someone takes it from them and achieves the same).

Side: Yes
Amarel(2388) Clarified
1 point

So you don’t think it should be returned to its rightful owners; the Ottomans?

Side: Yes
Grenache(5564) Clarified
1 point

The Ottomans lost their right to claim anything after they became footstools.

Side: Yes
2 points

It does now; it has been established for 70 years and people have been born, lived full lives and died as Israeli citizens. This is not to say that it should have been carved out of British Palestine in 1947, because that was a massive blunder which immediately resulted in war. It also doesn't legitimize Israeli territorial expansions.

Side: Yes

It does now; it has been established for 70 years and people have been born, lived full lives and died as Israeli citizens. This is not to say that it should have been carved out of British Palestine in 1947, because that was a massive blunder which immediately resulted in war. It also doesn't legitimize Israeli territorial expansions.

A sensible post for a change. Good work.

Side: Yes
1 point

They have nukes. Why do they need a "moral right?" ;)

Side: Yes
1 point

They;have nukes. Why do they need a "moral right?" ;)

You have a mouth to breathe out of. So why do you need a nose?

Side: No
1 point

Makes it more convenient ;)

Side: No
Antrim(999) Clarified
1 point

@ Nom;- Clever mother nature positioned the nose and eyes close to the mouth so we could see and smell the food before we eat it.

Also, mother nature included special hairs called cilia that are coated with sticky mucus in the nose and respiratory system to trap germs.

One should avoid breathing through the mouth.

Of course dumb ass filth like you wouldn't have known this, thus the reason for your ridiculously pig-ignorant remark.

Just as every village has it's idiot, you are this site's prize shithead.

Side: Yes
daver(1772) Clarified
1 point

What then say you of North Korea?

Side: Yes
1 point

What then say you of North Korea?

I'll take a political regime over a religious one, any day of the week.

Side: No
1 point

They are morally corrupt and yet..., they exist. A moral right does not allow you to exist. Nukes do ;)

Side: Yes
1 point

Yes it does, but not by the obliteration of another nation. Palestine

Having been themselves without a country, I'm perplexed that Israel steadfastly forces that condition on others.

Side: Yes

Having been themselves without a country, I'm perplexed that Israel steadfastly forces that condition on others.

You have a very good point.

Side: Yes
1 point

My view is that the Jews have a historical claim to Jerusalem that goes back before Islam even existed. Many pro Palistine arguments only go as far back as the Crusades for their claim. Or that a mosqe has domintated the skyline longer so there for it is our city. All one has to do is read the Roman historian accounts of the Roman sack of Jerusalem in 70 AD and read that the Romans burned a Jewish holysite not a Islamic one. Islam was not even in existenct at the time. But that is beside the point. Is it moral to say I have a right to exist and you do not? I don't think any nation needs a moral right to exist as morals change based on the situation for some. I don't think Isreal sees thier existence as a moral one rather more historical. I agree that Isreal has a moral right to exist as they are fellow human beings. But they have a stronge historical claim to the area as well.

Side: Yes

I think the British have a lot to answer for in Palestine, of which the creation of the Israeli state is only part. However, I think theocratic regimes should be outlawed generally, whether they be Jewish, Muslim or Christian.

Side: No
Amarel(2388) Clarified
1 point

Whose going to outlaw the existence of certain types of nations; the UN? Hahaha

Side: Yes
1 point

Whose going to outlaw the existence of certain types of nations; the UN? Hahaha

Are you aware this debate is about morality and not practicality?

Because I'm not sure you are.

Side: Yes
brontoraptor(12166) Disputed Banned
1 point

Adolf Hitler, Mein Kamf:

"However, I think theocratic regimes should be outlawed generally, especially Jewish ones."

Side: Yes
1 point

Adolf Hitler, Mein Kamf:

"However, I think theocratic regimes should be outlawed generally, especially Jewish ones."

There were no Jewish states when Hitler wrote Mein Kampf, so you are an absolute goddamned liar.

It's a pity, because if your quote were genuine, I would have liked to explore why you are so familiar with Mein Kampf that you can quote relevant parts of it during a discussion.

Side: No
Jenson(6) Disputed
1 point

Adolf Hitler, Mein Kamf:

"However, I think theocratic regimes should be outlawed generally, especially Jewish ones."

Google has no record of this quote. You are being banned for fake quotations.

Side: No
1 point

Frankly, I'm a little confused, here. What gives a country a 'moral' right to exist? Acting with a reasonably accepted morality? If so, then no - but many countries have been astoundingly immoral, including the USA.

If how a country gets established has anything to do with it, I'm not sure what that really means, because most begin with mass murder as a common act - definitely not 'moral'.

Side: No
Amarel(2388) Clarified
1 point

Perhaps the real question is “Should Israel become Palestine?”. If it is a matter of Israel remaining or Israel going away, I would have to side with Israel remaining.

It was taken from the genocidal Ottomans. Carving up the borders was always going to be along whatever lines the Brits chose. Israel is no more immoral than any other created country in the region. The fighting started simply out of hatred for Jews in what the Muslims considered Muslim land.

Side: Yes
Nomenclature(1182) Clarified
1 point

Perhaps the real question is “Should Israel become Palestine?”. If it is a matter of Israel remaining or Israel going away, I would have to side with Israel remaining.

It was taken from the genocidal Ottomans. Carving up the borders was always going to be along whatever lines the Brits chose.

These are fair comments.

The fighting started simply out of hatred for Jews

This line is stupid and obviously false. The fighting started because the Brits gave away land being used by other people. If indeed there was hatred for Jews in this region, as you claim, then the British should have known better than to give the land away to Jews in the first place and risk a war.

Zionists strive to portray Israel as the poor, innocent victim, and they blame all the violence on Arabs and their "hatred for Jews". But the reality of the matter is that the Israelis are the invaders, and I personally am not aware of any other historical circumstances where the invaders are considered to be the victims.

Side: Yes

Israel has the same right to exist that the USA has - very similar land grab. 😉. It’s survival of the fittest - not fair at all. But what makes it worse is the Palestinians can’t vote. At least in USA most people who inhabit the land can vote and participate in the national affairs. The other thing is the fact that Jews continue to muscle outside the borders they were so graciously granted. But that is all a mute because the Jews control the whole money and banking system of the West! >>Why does no one care??!!<<

Ask yourself this simple question:

Hitler tried to simply “export” the Jews

And... no one wanted them?

So - don’t that make the West semi-responsible for any harm?

Side: No
0 points

Israel does not have a right to exist, there is nothing "moral" about how Israel conducts itself. Israel's land is not anyones land by right, for thousands of years different cultures have been fighting over it, conquering and reconquering it, there is no justification for stealing that land and committing genocide so that wealthy fascist jews can set up their own government and be armed with nukes.

Side: No