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1. Gun laws will only affect guns that would be obtained legally and yet criminals get their Guns illegally. No it will not affect criminals, which are the ones who need to have the guns taken from them.
2. Those who obtain a legal firearm and commit crimes are very small number.
Those who need guns to protect themselves are a very small number, but with the implementation of gun laws that reduce the number of guns that are obtained legally , will cause that number of people to skyrocket, due to the fact that it takes away defense against the large number of criminals who obtain their guns illegally.
So gun laws would potentially increase the number of innocent people in danger of gun violence and actually help the criminals.
Yeah. Because it's much harder to kill 30 people quickly with a knife than with a gun. And if it's harder to get guns, while there are always people who will get guns, then fewer people will have guns.
As we have seen in cases such as Australia, gun control is effective in reducing gun violence.
The point in Australia is that the conditions under which guns are available, i.e. getting a weapons license and gun storage are strictly regulated.
Guns aren't the problem it is the user that is the problem, so, gun control means the less unregistered guns in the public domain, and guns available and limited to those who are authorized to have them. That takes about six months for a license and permit to acquire. .
OK yes I know there are illegal guns around and the police and customs need to be vigilant on that issue, but the more guns are controlled in society the less gun violence.
It will never solve gun violence but it's a big help living in a society where guns are not readily accessible.
Eliminating gun violence is a worthless goal if you are in more danger from other violence. Allowing more people to become the victims of crime to reduce another crime is not success, that is failure.
Gun violence may occur in Australia but there are significantly less deaths as a result of our gun laws. The argument where Americans say that they feel safer when they have possession of a gun is simply fighting fire with fire.
The goal is not to stop all gun violence, for many reasons, particularly that is completely implausible. However, gun control will absolutely reduce gun violence.
So you approve of gun confiscation in this country but you can't prove it will ever stop or reduce gun violence. So what is the point of gun confiscation ?
That's like saying that you don't have enough money to cover your entire home mortgage, so you won't make monthly payments. Will you monthly mortgage payment reduce how much you owe or will it stop you from owing any more money? Reduce, so don't pay the mortgage.
Do you not pay your credit card bills until you have enough money to cover the whole balance?
What is your point here ? Gun crime will never stop due to gun confiscation nor will gun confiscation keep guns out of the hands of criminals. So do tell me the point of gun confiscation and what it is about !
I don't want gun confiscation. I know it won't work in America. You don't know why it won't work in America, and you are helping the side of the gun control movement since in Australia the guns are out of the hands of the criminals.
Why do you leftist dicks always think that all of the policies of other countries will definitely work in America. America is not Australia. Why do you think America is Australia?
"Why do you leftist dicks always think that all of the policies of other countries will definitely work in America. America is not Australia. Why do you think America is Australia?" LMAO
Does Gun Confiscation stop gun crime or just reduce it ?
Yes, I know you are a right to bear arm supporter from previous debates. But in Australia when guns were banned, knife and other murder type increased.
That may be, but overall homicide rates have decreased substantially with increased gun control in Australia. I think it's safe to say that society as a whole shouldn't mind an increase in stabbings as long as it coincides with an overall decrease in murder.
Well I personally would rather be shot then stabbed... Quicker death with a gun then a knife... I know that because in my area someone was just murdered with a knife and it took quite a lot of stabs
The human body can sustain a remarkable number of stab wounds without dying. Gun shots, on the other hand, tend to be far more lethal. So if you had to choose between a statistically less likely stabbing that is also less likely of killing you, or a statistically more likely shooting that is also more likely to kill you, would you really choose the latter?
I have not done the research but in England they took away the guns and it reduced gun violence but not the violence or murder rates people just found other ways to hurt and kill people. This could be the case in Australia also.
Yes, but by that logic, we should legalize nuclear bombs and other weapons that can kill masses of people in an instant. It's much harder to kill someone with a knife than it is with a gun.
You miss a very important point when it comes to the discussion of guns. Many people like myself own guns. We don't own them to kill lots of people. I hunt with them, our family target shoots as a family activity, if I had to defend my family with my guns I would do so and I should have the right to do these things because I have never harmed anyone with my many guns. What possible reason other than mass human destruction would someone have to own a nuclear bomb????? Do you see the vast difference in owning guns and bombs??
You could easily make a similar argument for bombs. What if you used bombs to hunt? Or for other non-violent uses? I nuclear bomb is obviously an extreme, but you think that just because something doesn't have to be used for mass destruction means that we should all be allowed to have them?
Of course you can't use bombs to hunt because that would be stupid. Yet smaller ones are legal in many areas because they are fun to play with. They just don't make them as powerful now as they did when I was a kid. An M80 or a Cherry Bomb use to be really loud and destructive now not so much. You don't make much of a case. Give me any good reason why I should not be able to possess any gun that I want to.
So it's fine for anyone to have guns that can shoot 580 rounds a minute, snipe rifles, machine guns, and other weapons that can end a plethora of human life in an instant.
You can also have this if you're mentally ill, disabled, don't understand how to operate them, suicidal, etc..
If you are convicted of a violent felony you are currently restricted from gun ownership. And that is part of how to keep law abiding citizens safe. Strict punishment for violent criminals especially those who use guns in the commission of a crime. Yet if a person has not committed a violent crime that person should be able to possess any gun they want. If you are under the impression that you can prevent murder by having strict gun laws then you must believe that there are no illegal drug users in the USA. Since there are laws preventing the manufacture, sale and possession of them the problem should be solved. Or at least kept to a very small number. If you are honest with yourself you know that you can get illegal drugs anywhere in the USA. Laws against things don't prevent people from having them. All strict gun laws would do is make many law abiding citizens criminals for having their guns or make them unsafe by giving them up.
If you are convicted of a violent felony you are currently restricted from gun ownership.
Unless you get a gun at a gun show or online.
Yet if a person has not committed a violent crime that person should be able to possess any gun they want.
So if a person has not committed a violent crime, they should have access to everything possible that could let them cause mass destruction and death?
If you are under the impression that you can prevent murder by having strict gun laws then you must believe that there are no illegal drug users in the USA.
Nope. And one of the reasons I support legalization of several illegal drugs such as marijuana is because that way, we can regulate their uses. That's what I want with guns... the ability to regulate it.
Laws against things don't prevent people from having them.
I don't want to ban guns. I want to regulate them.
Why must these Liberal control fanatics always be such mindless hypocrites? Why do they pretend to never get it?
If we took away all guns, yes there would be fewer deaths from guns. If we took away all cars and all alcohol, there would be far fewer deaths from those things.
YOUR POINT?
We live in a nation of freedoms where our Constitution gives us the right to bear arms and even if it did not, people understand that the freedom to protect ourselves from criminals who will get guns anyways, supercedes losing lives from guns just as we understand that the freedom to have alcohol in bars and nightclubs will lead to more deaths from drunk driving. The freedom to drive cars short distances versus riding bicyces is worth the additional deaths from cars.
Can you mind knumbingly stupid control fanatics get it? Nah, only the guns should be banned, never your alcolhol or your cars to save lives. You are total hypocrites wantng to ban other's enjoyment's in life while keeping your own.
I do not support banning of guns. I support gun control. Control. Which we have measures in place to control cars. We have measures in place to control alcohol. I simply support strengthen the measures in place to control guns. And if you suggested some ideas that would better control deaths from cars and alcohol, I would likely support them.
Are you kidding me? I just gave a very simple way to save thousands of lives..... ban bars and nightclubs where people will no longer be forced to drink and drive.
Force people to use bicycles when going short distances. It would save thousand of lives.
Oh wait a minute, you don't really care about saving lives, you care about taking our guns ONE STEP AT A TIME AS THEY DID IN ENGLAND.
Before people attack me for wanting to shut down bars, I was only making a point to these hypocrites. I do not want Goernment playing the nanny state to keep us safe. Government is total corruption.
ban bars and nightclubs where people will no longer be forced to drink and drive.
How do you plan to enforce this? Who's to say that we won't end up in a situation similar to prohibition?
(Not dismissing this idea, just trying to explore it. Almost as if we could discuss an idea. Like people.)
Force people to use bicycles when going short distances. It would save thousand of lives.
This seems almost impossible to regulate. Are you going to require everyone who owns a car to also own a bike? How do you define 'short distance.' How will you get enough sidewalk space for this?
Oh wait a minute, you don't really care about saving lives, you care about taking our guns ONE STEP AT A TIME AS THEY DID IN ENGLAND.
I really don't care about taking your guns. I care about making sure people who shouldn't have guns don't have guns. And also, to be honest, i still really don't get why you need a gun.
I do not want Goernment playing the nanny state to keep us safe. Government is total corruption.
So anarchy is better?
Without government, how would you stop gay marriages? How would you ban abortions? How would you protect the country from terrorists and illegal immigrants? xD
Anarchy is better? LOL, why is it we had no anarchy 50 years ago when we had very few gun control laws? What has changed to now blame the gun for mass shootings that we did not have 50 yeras ago.
There are places that do ban alcohol and they say it saves lives! You just sluffed off prohibition as not working yet you sink prohibition wth guns will work? The black market would love it and only criminals wold have guns.
When you said .... "And also, to be honest, i still really don't get why you need a gun"
That has to be the most outrageous typical Liberal control fanatical statement I have every heard.
To all the people who target shoot, who enjoy hunting, who want to have a gun in the home to protect their families from all the criminals who will have guns, or knives, or whatever weapon of choice to kill our family, pirateelfdog wants to know why you need a gun? We are suppose to wait till after the killing is done when the cops finally show up.
He never asks people who drink why they need alcohol. nah, it is only the gun that these control freaks fear.
That deserves a ban but i must wait till my next argument.
Do you actually want to discuss the ideas you presented? Or do you just want to leave those ideas behind so you can insult me further?
There are places that do ban alcohol and they say it saves lives!
Ok, provide a source, and a specific example. That's fantastic! Lets look into that and see how it could be implemented further.
You just sluffed off prohibition as not working yet you sink prohibition wth guns will work?
I DON'T WANT TO BAN GUNS. I don't want to ban guns. I don't want to ban guns.I don't want to ban guns. Hey. Hey FromWithin. Guess what? I don't want to ban guns.
I favor a form of gun control, something we have in place for cars and alcohol, which you keep trying to present as counter examples. And yes, I would certainly be in favor of increasing these levels of control if I believed that it could help save lives.
When you said .... "And also, to be honest, i still really don't get why you need a gun"
That was no joke and if it was, try a smiley face.
You can spew how you don't want to ban guns until you are blue in the face but guess what? You vote for people who DO WANT TO BAN GUNS!
What do you actually think, that these gun control fanatics would actually come out and say they want to ban our guns? OF COURSE NOT!
They will do want all good Liberals do, and slowly indoctrinate the masses one step at a time as they did with many other issues..... abortion, tax payer funded abortions, Gay marriage, etc. etc. Do you honestly think they started out saying all tax payers would be forced to pay to end a Baby's life? Did you thnk they actually started out telling us all how they planned on legalizing any abortion for any reason right up to birth? Did you honestly think 40 years ago they would come right out and say they wanted to force all states to allow Gay marriage? NO, they never would and they never will when it comes to guns.
It took one hundred years for Englnd to pass law after law after law until the people were finlly conditioned to accept the confisction of their guns.
When you vote for these liars and deceivers who do want to take our guns, you are just as bad as they.
You can spew how you don't want to ban guns until you are blue in the face but guess what? You vote for people who DO WANT TO BAN GUNS!
You have no idea who I've voted for in the past, nor if I've even voted in the past. Right now, the candidate I am supporting the most is Bernie Sanders, who has made it clear he has no interest in banning guns.
What do you actually think, that these gun control fanatics would actually come out and say they want to ban our guns? OF COURSE NOT!
...because they don't want to ban your guns. And if no one has said they want to ban your guns, why would you think that they do? And if they have done things to suggest that they do want to ban your guns, then the premise of this question is flawed.
.
Also: Just want to make a note that you started down a road of ideas to reduce other deaths, i.e. bicycles and drunk driving, and we found something we can agree on, and you have repeatedly chosen to stop talking about it. I think you are much less inclined to agree with anyone than you claim we are to agree with you.
No. Common sense gun laws will NOT effect criminals. The point is to allow the police (and we, the people), to only have to worry about the criminals and NOT some idiot with an arsenal who doesn't have the "common sense" to control his/her hubris or to blame the world for his/her shortcomings! I haven't seen many "criminals" attacking students and teachers lately .... have YOU?? Not many "criminals" set up sniper perches and take out people, there's no profit in that! Criminals want MONEY! Not mass murder .... unless it's other competing criminals!
I've lived in this country for 78 years. All we used to worry about were criminals! Today, we have to worry about neighbors, schoolmates, even armed church goers! Yes, we need some "common sense"!
That's why countries similar to USA with gun control have lower crime rate in this cases. That's why the countries that have restricted the gun allowance have lowered their crime rates.
The word criminal should be the indication that laws do not affect those who break them hence the reason they are criminals. We can see how effective the war on drugs which are illegal has eliminated or reduced the quantity of drugs available in our society. Laws only make it difficult for law abiding citizens to own guns. There is really no benefit to this. If the government wanted to decrease gun violence they must actually punish the people who perpetrate the violence.
As long as there are people to populate the earth, there will be criminals. Simple as that. There is no possible way to destroy crime entirely. Whether it be drugs, money, people, or possessions crime will always be around as long as there are people and things people want. And where there is crime, there will be guns. Taking away guns wont stop anything. There will always be murder, stealing, and rape. Taking away guns will just make the criminals find different ways of getting what they want.
Why must these Liberal control fanatics and Democrats always be such mindless hypocrites? Why do they pretend to never get it?
If we took away all guns, yes there would be fewer deaths from guns. If we took away all cars and all alcohol, there would be far fewer deaths from those things.
YOUR POINT?
We live in a nation of freedoms where our Constitution gives us the right to bear arms and even if it did not, people understand that the freedom to protect ourselves from criminals who will get guns anyways, supercedes losing more lives from guns, just as we understand that the freedom to have alcohol in bars and nightclubs will lead to more deaths from drunk driving. The freedom to drive cars short distances versus riding bicyces is worth the additional deaths from cars.
Can you mind knumbingly stupid control fanatics get it? Nah, only in your hypocritical world should the guns be banned. Never your alcolhol or your cars to save lives. You are total hypocrites wantng to ban other's enjoyment's in life while keeping your own.
That was no joke and if it was, try a smiley face.
You can spew how you don't want to ban guns until you are blue in the face but guess what? You vote for people who DO WANT TO BAN GUNS!
What do you actually think, that these gun control fanatics would actually come out and say they want to ban our guns? OF COURSE NOT!
They will do want all good Liberals do, and slowly indoctrinate the masses one step at a time as they did with many other issues..... abortion, tax payer funded abortions, Gay marriage, etc. etc. Do you honestly think they started out saying all tax payers would be forced to pay to end a Baby's life? Did you thnk they actually started out telling us all how they planned on legalizing any abortion for any reason right up to birth? Did you honestly think 40 years ago they would come right out and say they wanted to force all states to allow Gay marriage? NO, they never would and they never will when it comes to guns.
It took one hundred years for Englnd to pass law after law after law until the people were finlly conditioned to accept the confisction of their guns.
When you vote for these liars and deceivers who do want to take our guns, you are just as bad as they.
