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Debate Score:270
Arguments:257
Total Votes:338
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 If America turned back to Jesus, would things get better? (221)

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JesusFreak7(48) pic



If America turned back to Jesus, would things get better?

With all the natural disasters and terrorism going on here in the USA, I was wondering if we humbled ourselves before Jesus Christ and stopped turning our back on Him, if things would actually get better for us here in the USA..... Im curious to see what people say..... GBU all.
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3 points

Natural disasters are not a reason to go to Jesus. Those are the ones that should convince us to leave Jesus.

Saintnow(3684) Disputed
1 point

You never came to Him. You turned away from Him and went against Him a long time ago, and I doubt you will be returning to Him ever except when He calls you up out of Hell to appear before Him in the final judgement before you are forever castaway into the lake of fire which is the second death. Laugh loud while you can if you want to keep on going your own way into death.

Cartman(18192) Disputed
1 point

I turned away from a long time ago, like the time He destroyed the Earth. He turned away from us.

Izzy55101(25) Disputed
1 point

How can you leave Jesus if you've already left? Natural disasters are a reason to turn back to Jesus because God will always strengthen you in hard times. If he bring you to it, then he will bring you through it.

I've always thought America was f*cked up, I don't even know why. I mean the KKK, ISIS, slavery... Forgive me if I'm wrong. But if I wasn't mistaken, I would've thought that the USA stands for Under Satans Authority...

Cartman(18192) Disputed
1 point

How can you leave Jesus if you've already left?

I am talking about the people who were with God, then got struck by a natural disaster.

Natural disasters are a reason to turn back to Jesus because God will always strengthen you in hard times.

Why didn't God not destroy the person's house? God can do way more to strengthen a person by making sure they don't get hurt by a natural disaster. God is supposed to be the master over nature.

If he bring you to it, then he will bring you through it.

If He brings you to it, He wasn't a great being. That's like saying you can get through an abusive father by staying with him.

I've always thought America was fcked up, I don't even know why. I mean the KKK, ISIS, Martin Luther King... Forgive me if I'm wrong. But if I wasn't mistaken, I would've thought that the USA stands for Under Satans Authority...*

This is too dumb to even refute. It is just completely ridiculous.

AlofRI(2815) Disputed
1 point

No. You are confused. Those letters mean: Under Savior Authoritarianism. Also, it's not America that's Fked up, it's Americans, ...... conservatively speaking

ignorantass(2) Disputed
1 point

Natural disasters aren't a reason to look at religion at all. You should go to plate tectonics and wind behavior. These are the known and proven causes for earthquakes, tsunamis, hurricanes/typhoons, volcanic eruptions, etc. There is no need to go all supernatural over this.

Additionally, if this "god" created the universe where multitudes of galaxies exist and trillions of stars dot the cosmos and where at least ten other planets are found to exist in the Golden Zone in the current small, known universe; why would some omnipresent being stay on Earth to screw around with the human race?

Cartman(18192) Disputed
1 point

Natural disasters aren't a reason to look at religion at all.

The debate description made it clear that natural disasters is a reason to go to religion. It isn't a concept I introduced.

why would some omnipresent being stay on Earth to screw around with the human race?

Because if He doesn't stick around He isn't omnipresent. Remember, since He is omnipresent there is no effort to be around us and to be everywhere else in the universe at the same time.

ignorantass(2) Disputed
1 point

Natural disasters aren't a reason to look at religion at all. You should go to plate tectonics and wind behavior. These are the known and proven causes for earthquakes, tsunamis, hurricanes/typhoons, volcanic eruptions, etc. There is no need to go all supernatural over this.

Additionally, if this "god" created the universe where multitudes of galaxies exist and trillions of stars dot the cosmos and where at least ten other planets are found to exist in the Golden Zone in the current small, known universe; why would some omnipresent being stay on Earth to screw around with the human race?

JesusFreak7(48) Disputed
-1 points

Cartman...... Jesus is our refuge in times of trouble..... He even says in His Word..... Matthew 11:28-30 New International Version (NIV)

28 “Come to me, all you who are weary and burdened, and I will give you rest. 29 Take my yoke upon you and learn from me, for I am gentle and humble in heart, and you will find rest for your souls. 30 For my yoke is easy and my burden is light.”

Jesus lifts our burdens and is with us all the time, and if you havent noticed, people are more willing to hear about Jesus after a disaster. People are so prideful when things are going well in life, but as soon as things go downhill they are crying out to God to save them, but that is the only time they turn to Him. But we should be praying to Him and growing in Him everyday, not just in times of trouble.

Cartman(18192) Disputed
3 points

Jesus lifts our burdens and is with us all the time, and if you havent noticed, people are more willing to hear about Jesus after a disaster.

So what? Why should I follow a sick God who would destroy cities in order to get people to turn to Him?

But we should be praying to Him and growing in Him everyday, not just in times of trouble.

Praying to Him doesn't prevent times of trouble. So, things wouldn't get better.

AlofRI(2815) Clarified
1 point

How can there be "other versions" of "Gods Word?" Naturally, it's because another MAN published it. I'm waiting for HIM to call a Press Conference, then maybe I'll listen!

How many "versions" are there?? What we need is a book signing, BY THE AUTHOR. Then we'll know it's legit.

auyeungyat(72) Disputed
1 point

I although agree with your reference of Biblical word is the truth,but I think...... this is not convincing enough to some people.

auyeungyat(72) Clarified
1 point

We can't tell if Jesus caused the above you're saying, but I am well aware of something:

For some non-religious reason:

America motto is "In god we trust"

The first men in colonies of America were dissenting Christian Groups

Excerpts from Declaration of Independence:

"We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness."

"When in the Course of human events, it becomes necessary for one people to dissolve the political bands which have connected them with another, and to assume among the powers of the earth, the separate and equal station to which the Laws of Nature and of Nature's God entitle them, a decent respect to the opinions of mankind requires that they should declare the causes which impel them to the separation."

For religious reason:

These disaster were created as a instrument for God to punish and alert the people.But God is loving.

Saintnow(3684) Clarified
0 points

Adolfi had a good point...how can there be other versions of His word? All the versions must have errors and therefore not be the word of God or one version must be God's word.

2 points

Hell no! He's the one who created this dangerous ass rock and put us on it.

2 points

In this day and age we need a revival in america god wants us to turn back our hearts to him things will only get better

1 point

It's true, but I don't think it is going to happen when people who know Him don't even care enough to spell His name correctly as "God". Most people who know Him today are too busy watching movies and listening to ungodly music, filling their minds with mush so the power of the gospel seems like a fairy tale.

Kingly342(29) Disputed
-1 points

We can't turn back to something that doesn't exist. 'God' or 'Yahweh' as some called it either doesn't exist, or is a huge cockhead for not altering all the back things.

Saintnow(3684) Disputed
1 point

You can't turn back to God because you never came to Him to start with. You turned away from Him a long time ago and are going away from Him as fast as you can.

2 points

The Christian creed of 'turn the other cheek' is one very significant reason why Muslims are able to slaughter Christians world wide with impunity. What was described as an act of God is now more often referred to as a natural disaster. When Apollo 13 experienced serious electronic and mechanical failure it was American know how, and not Jesus Christ Super Star, that saved the crew from a lingering death in space. N.A.S.A.'s attitude of ''failure is not an option'' summed up the confidence they had in themselves as scientists. Maybe you would have suggested that the scientists prayed to the big shy man in the sky instead of employing the wizardry of their expertise.

Saintnow(3684) Disputed
2 points

Only God can save from death. You are dying eternally or living eternally. Only God can give life. A temporary extension of life is not being saved from death. If you are not permanently saved, you are not saved at all. If the astronauts were not saved by God, they were still dying even though they managed to come home when their ship had problems in space.

Saintnow(3684) Disputed
1 point

Ignoring your insult against the Savior, the life of the Apollo astronauts was in God's hands as is your life now. When God says it's over, it's over. God gave you the brains to feed your mouth so that your time can be prolonged as He does not want you to burn in Hell. God gave the Apollo astronauts the ability to solve their problem to prolong their time because He does not want them to burn in Hell.

Sooner or later all of your efforts to survive will fail. You can't keep flying around space, dodging the bullet of death forever. You are not "The Force".

First of all, you only said America, but not every other state. But if you meant the whole world, then this is wrong. You can't blame Jesus for every little or big thing that happens. Like terrorist attacks; he didn't set those up, his creation of people did.

-----I added a space here so you can see that if you are going to dispute or support, don't use the Bible as evidence in here as if I am talking about common sense.-----

But there would only be one thing we would stop fighting about: which religion is correct telling the story. This is a common issue for what really happens in Jesus's time and what is said in the story is not correct. Sometimes some people would change parts of it to prove themselves about "what really happened."

AlofRI(2815) Clarified
1 point

A good example of that is the "Birth of Jesus". The whole nativity thingy was "invented" by St. Francis of Assisi, as a way to "explain" the "virgin birth" of Jesus! C'mon .... can't we stick to FACTS? At least scientific theory is based on what "appears to be fact"! Religion "appears to be " based on MYTHS, created by it believers! Most of which seems to have come from Constantine, the guy who put all the myths together (as HE saw them), and wrote/published "Gods Word" for the first time. Gods word has been "revised" many times since!

Saintnow(3684) Disputed
1 point

Jesus carefully chose twelve men to record His sayings and the events of His life, knowing one of those men was a devil who would be used of God in the chain of events by which Jesus gave Himself on the cross to pay for the sins of the world.

The men He chose, including Paul who He chose to replace Judas Iscariot, obeyed Him in recording and preaching His message as directed by Him. Of course there were many who resented His assertion of being the only way to know God, the only way to enter the Kingdom of Heaven, the only truth, the only way to life, the only life....as all life comes from God, Jesus claimed to be the originator of life as well as the one who gives life to the dying so they can live forever in heaven.

Many who resented Him twisted His words, invented lies to frame Him as a lunatic, and twisted, neglected, or ignored Him in accounts of history. We have His word, God keeps His word, and it never fails. The blood of martyrs used by God to keep His word after He commanded it to be put in writing was given willfully, and all the forces of evil are unable to change or get rid of God's word.

God made sure to give His word in English before it became the only language anything near universal today, before evil forces of fascism mounted in Word War II in their effort to deny God's promises for the world by wiping out the people of God, Israel. God used America which rose from the Great Awakening spurned by His word being translated into English to stop the forces of evil from wiping out the Jews.

The story of history is God's story, and the point of history is that He became a man to redeem His creation form the corruption of sin. You don't have to believe God's word if you don't want to. You can't stop God from doing exactly as He said He would do in His word.

2 points

After everything that America has went through why not go back to Jesus. This great country was founded on the belief systems of Christianity. I believe that with all of the sin going on in this country that god is very disappointed but hasn't turned his back on us. He died to save you, all of you out there he shed his precious blood for you and i hope that one day you grasp what I'm saying. There's a hell to pay or a heaven to gain.

AlofRI(2815) Disputed
1 point

Cmoo:

One of our most famous and influential "founding fathers" said: "The government of the United States is NOT, in ANY sense, founded on the Christian religion." "In ANY sense" kind of includes "the belief systems of Christianity."

No, the country was founded on a system of common sense, not religious sense. There is too much conflict in the "belief systems" of the religious. Christians will never follow Allah, Muslims will never follow the Christian God, You can't have anything but conflict in a nation "guided by" a single religion, you can never have anything but conflict while you have any nation guided by other religions, take Iran and Iraq, for instance. Whatever religion is the "system", it will clash with the other "system". THAT is what the founding fathers were trying to circumvent.

As another founding father commented: "The PURPOSE of the separation of church and state is to keep, forever from these shores, the constant strife that has soaked the sands of Europe in blood for centuries." Religious systems have , and still are, keeping that idea from working. Do you "grasp what I am saying."

Saintnow(3684) Disputed
-1 points

Of course things would get better but it's not going to happen if Christians do not humble themselves and pray and turn from their wicked ways and seek God's face. God will humble His people if they won't humble themselves.

2 points

America is still so overwhelmingly Christian that only an alarmist Christian could seriously suggest the nation has turned away from Jesus. At any rate, there is absolutely nothing to suggest that more faith in Jesus would alter completely independent, scientifically understood, natural phenomenon. Or anything else, really.

Saintnow(3684) Disputed
1 point

A lot of people call themselves Christian only because they think Christianity has the best moral teachings and concepts. If America were "overwhelmingly Christian" we would have little if any problem with alcohol or drugs, no abortion, no laws allowing or condoning homosexual behavior. America has become heathen and pagan and is more and more like the evil nations in the Bible which were destroyed for things like killing their own children and allowing and supporting sodomites.

Jace(4706) Disputed
1 point

It is an empirical fact that most people in the United States are Christians. Incidentally, not all of them are the same denomination as you which is why they have different political and social attitudes than you. But they are still Christian, and the nation is decidedly not majority Pagan. Sorry reality is so difficult for you to understand.

Saintnow(3684) Disputed
0 points

Faith in Jesus Christ will completely altar your life, and that's why you don't want it. You love your sin more than life, and you think it's good to die in your sins...you think the pleasure of sin is worth more than life, so enjoy it while you can.

Jace(4706) Disputed
1 point

Altar my life? I doubt it. XD

Jace(4706) Disputed
1 point

I cannot love that which I do not perceive as existing, and so I do not love sin.

I also do not think anything is worth more than my life.

I would say try again, but you will probably just continue to get it wrong.

It would for Christian related organizations, but it wouldn't change a darn thing.

Saintnow(3684) Disputed
1 point

The "damned" thing is you, under the curse of death as a sinner. Everything you know would become new if you turned back to the Savior.

I was a high falutin sinner like you, doing all kinds of evil for the momentary pleasure it gave me. Jesus Christ gave me a new life, made me a new person, and all things are new now because I know I am under His mercy.

If our nation turned back to God, homosexuality would again be outlawed, fornication and adultery would be outlawed, abortion would be outlawed, the crime rate would fall to near zero, drug and alcohol usage would virtually disappear from society, rock and roll would fizzle and die out in America as would rap, jazz, country, and all other ungodly sin-promoting entertainments......

and God would put so much fear in all of our enemies that they would not dare attack us and would rather do business peacefully with us and the whole world would prosper from it.

Of course there will be some people like you who would never be changed no matter what, always being bitter against God and refusing to repent of their sins...but if the nation in general returned to the Lord, in obeying Him they would be blessed by Him and the nation would remain indivisible under God with liberty and justice for all.

1 point

I have no idea why you are spewing forth this pablum and frothing at the mouth, do you? You should have it checked, though; you may have rabies, or something similar. I wish you a speedy recovery.

1 point

Well, let's see. Has Jesus "smitten" the cruel ISIS?? Did He save those 20 kids in CT? The good people of California? Has He revisited us and thoroughly explained to the terrorist Muslims that they were following the "wrong god"? That even the NON-terrorist Muslims, the Buddhists, the Atheists, etc. that THEY were wrong?

I have little doubt that a MAN named Jesus once existed, that he was a charismatic leader to many, but, I've been here a LONG time. I haven't seen ANY action from HIM that helped anything. A strong belief in him HAS helped some, and that's good. However, If he would simply drop in and straighten out the mess he's left us in, straighten out the religious confusion that has permeated this "creation" (if you must), ( I ) would be happy to follow him. Maybe not his "father", who seemed to be cruel and unusual, but yeah, I'd LOVE to have something REAL to follow, something I could depend on to protect me if I was good. Someone who would really show me "love", I'd likely become a real Christian. As someone said recently, "Prayers are not going to help those who are dead....."

People have "turned to Jesus" for centuries, he hasn't "made things better".

Only WE can make things better.

Saintnow(3684) Disputed
2 points

Jesus would make your life better if you believe on Him, He made my life better, satisfying, full of love, joy, peace, hope in God's promises which cannot be denied.

You and others may think I'm being mean or hateful when I'm only telling the truth about sin because I care about sinners the same as God cares and cared for me when I was acting like His enemy, doing my own thing for my own pleasure regardless of right or wrong. When you know God through Jesus Christ, He always makes things better. Our own feelings and unbelief may hinder Him, but He will fix it all and all things turn out for good to those who love God.

God is showing you love, and you can believe His love through Jesus who died for you. He died in your place, paid your price, so you can be forgiven and saved from eternal dying in Hell. We still have to suffer the consequences of sin in our bodies, but we can know God loves us and we are forgiven and will be like Jesus in His resurrection. God loves you. All you have to do is believe it. When we believe God, then He can show us more of His love. When we don't believe God, we can't see it because of our unbelief.

What's real is that Jesus conquered death for us, and we can have secure hope of being in Heaven with Him forever to enjoy all of the blessings God gives His children as joint heirs of heaven with Jesus Christ.

Admit you have sinned against God and believe it's your sins against Him which caused the barrier between you and Him

Believe God Himself came down from Heaven as the Son sent by the Father to break down that barrier by breaking His own body in death to pay for your sins, giving His own life's blood as the payment to cover the debt you owe God for sinning against Him. Believe your sins can be forgiven because after He died in your place, He rose from the dead willing to forgive you and be your life, giving you eternal life when you receive Him as your Savior.

Call on God to save you from your sins....something like this, in your own words is easy if you really mean it wholeheartedly...

"dear God, I know I'm a sinner and am dying separated from you by my sins and need to be reconciled with you so I can have eternal life with you in Heaven. I believe Jesus died for my sins and is risen from the dead to justify me when I hope in your mercy. Thank you for hearing me, and thank you for giving me Jesus as my Savior. I have received Him now by faith, and thank you for your mercy and forgiveness. Thank you for giving me hope of eternal life, thank you that I can trust in your word."

Something like that. If you really mean it, God will hear you and Jesus who is now knocking on your door will enter in to you and you will sup (dine, enjoy company with) Him, and He with you. He is the bread of life...by Him we can live forever. I hope you will believe.

Cartman(18192) Disputed
2 points

Jesus would make your life better if you believe on Him, He made my life better, satisfying, full of love, joy, peace, hope in God's promises which cannot be denied.

I already have a satisfying life that is full of love and joy. What can Jesus provide me?

You and others may think I'm being mean or hateful when I'm only telling the truth about sin because I care about sinners the same as God cares

I thought God hates sin. How would you not be hateful if you are just like God? It is also probably not a great way to show you aren't hateful by comparing yourself to someone who drowned the entire Earth.

doing my own thing for my own pleasure regardless of right or wrong.

I have seen too many Christians who could be described as exactly that.

God is showing you love

Actually, He isn't. That's your main problem.

When we don't believe God, we can't see it because of our unbelief.

This is a direct contradiction to your claim that God is showing His love.

If you really mean it

I always love that little qualifying remark that must be used for the person who doesn't see God's love even if they believe. Can't have anything concrete.

AlofRI(2815) Disputed
1 point

Santa Claus always made my life better when I believed in him, satisfying, full of love, joy, peace, hope and Santa's promises.

I simply want to know why, the children of Stony Brook, who cannot be called "sinners", weren't receiving, or were cared for, with "gods love". Just ONE example of many, but, where was it? Not all of their parents were sinners worthy of such punishment. I'm sure at least SOME of them were followers of Jesus. They could have "called on God" to save their kids .... think "HE" would have listened? I don't see many signs, with that and other tragedies, where "HE" does! HE wouldn't hear those kids beg, "as if they really meant it", to stay with their parents because they didn't even know HOW! "By HIM we can live forever". Somehow, I don't see THEM "living forever", except in the dreams of devout Christians. I'm sure their parents miss being a part of those "lives". I don't mean to denigrate your religion, believe as you want. Just saying why I DON'T.

Cmoo169(3) Disputed
0 points

All of the things you are mentioning are happening because of one little decision in the early days. I'm sure you know the story Adam and eve. because eve ate the fruit sin entered the world, but don't try to find things on Jesus. I used to think just like you until;l i realized this is how the devil tricks us. Don't let him

mykebee34(119) Disputed
1 point

Original sin has been cancelled out. accordind to the books of Deut. and Ez.

AlofRI(2815) Clarified
1 point

Cmoo169:

I wont. Neither will I let the Emperor Constantine trick me, or King James, or Mohammad, etc. Since I don't believe in Satan, and I DO believe in the "alleged teachings" of Jesus .... even though ancient religions long before HIM taught similar things and told similar stories (myths).

St. Francis of Assisi "made up" the story of the nativity as a "way to explain the birth of Jesus". Others have "made up" the story of Satan. I'm sorry, I simply don't believe "stories" that are not followed by at least a reasonable amount of what can be construed as "fact". Some evidence! People being slaughtered in "Houses of God", show little evidence that "God will protect us. Children drowning, trying to escape terror, or slaughtered by a deranged gunman, well, if I saw a "god" step in and save them I might see a reason to "believe". I'm still waiting. All I see is that myths don't save anyone, and you can put any name you wish on evil. Satan? Andrew? Donald? Or any other mythological figure. I prefer "scumbag", or the like. Scumbag isn't going to run my life.

AlofRI(2815) Disputed
1 point

The devil and I don't get along at all. I simply ignore it. That pisses it off. I keep telling it to go to heaven, which pisses it off even more!

Saintnow(3684) Disputed
0 points

This stuff is sooooo stupid. God is going to end all wars one day, and all evildoers will be forever separated from the living. You are one of the evildoers, sitting there enjoying God's goodness and using his temporary tolerance of oppressors as your excuse for speaking evil against Him, trying to murder God because you think He should take care of business faster to meet your demands.

God is giving you time you do not deserve any more than those extremely evil oppressors and murderers deserve. If God were to stop all evil now, your time would be over and you would be burning in Hell now. God does not want that, but eventually He will run out of patience and put an end to all evildoers including you.

Syvarisin(4) Disputed
1 point

What is "God" waiting for? If god created this Earth, he must be an all-powerful being. If he is an all-powerful being, why wouldn't he be able to end all wars now? You say that anyone that doesn't agree with you is an "evildoer" or a "sinner," but there are quite a few active religions whose members would consider you the same. You say "This stuff is sooooo stupid" then proceed to state ignorance that was created inside a human mind? Jesus has never, nor will ever end suffering on Earth, and turning to him would only make things worse.

1 point

If you look through history factually there is no evidence that any God or demigod has improved the living conditions of any of their followers. There is no way that would improve anything

Saintnow(3684) Disputed
0 points

It is a historical and evidential fact that God has improved my living conditions. Everybody who knows me knows it's true, though some say that it was only me making better choices rather than God compelling me to obey Him and blessing me in obeying Him. The same is true for hundreds of people I know personally, and true for millions throughout all of history. Most people will never be changed, most will die in their sins with their own blood on their own heads and pay for it in Hell.

You want to deny God, and all you are doing is denying yourself of life. That's the only way you can deny God, by keeping Him from giving you life so that you end up in eternal dying in the lake of fire, the only way the devil can strike back at God by depriving God the pleasure of having you know His mercy and goodness. He's being good to you and you are trying to say He is evil. One day, if you do not repent, you will have what you want, complete confirmation that God is not good to you when all you know is evil in the fire of Hell where you will fry like an eternal sausage writhing in pain if before it's too late you will not repent and believe on the Lord Jesus Christ.

smilinbobs(600) Clarified
2 points

Hi Saintnow, hope all is well with you, Have a Merry Christmas.

You are right, many people have used God to improve their lives. If it works for you then it is a good. For some of us it is just like Santa, it's great if you are able to believe, but if you find out the truth it's just impossible to go back. You may think that it is somehow about something else but for me it's not. I am not worried about dying or eternity as I know that it will be no different than it was before I was born. The thought that I will no longer exist at some point is not a happy thought but it is one I can live with. If by believing in God you can eliminate that unhappy thought, that's great.

AlofRI(2815) Clarified
1 point

Saintnow:

Well, y'know, I can't complain about my living conditions. The "BIG GUY" seems to take pretty good care of me. You scare me though. You keep telling me he's going to send me to HELL. Kind of like a Republican, you keep repeating something often enough it seems to become true!

Let me correct you this time. I have NEVER said HE is evil. I've said IF HE EXISTED, the world knows that HE hasn't helped an AWFUL lot of ....um...."creations". HE doesn't seem to be able to shut down those "false religions" that have "sprung up" over the last 20 centuries. Maybe Hell is getting so full of the "unbelievers" around the world, there's no room for ME...ya think? Anyway, if HE does have anything to do with it, I can't complain. I just hope HE continues to treat me nice, and if I get to see him, I'll put in a good word for you, I mean, telling people to "go to hell" and "fry" isn't very Christian-like, to MY mind, but then, I stayed away from Christianity....too violent for ME! Please, have a peaceful life. You seem to take things SOOO personally! If HE is going to punish ME, HE doesn't need YOUR help....then again....HE doesn't seem to handle a crisis well. Maybe I can calm HIM when I see HIM, and maybe make some suggestions? I'd LOVE to talk him out of some of the VIOLENCE! Maybe buy him a beer?

1 point

Psalm 91New International Version (NIV)

Psalm 91

1 Whoever dwells in the shelter of the Most High

will rest in the shadow of the Almighty.[a]

2 I will say of the Lord, “He is my refuge and my fortress,

my God, in whom I trust.”

3 Surely he will save you

from the fowler’s snare

and from the deadly pestilence.

4 He will cover you with his feathers,

and under his wings you will find refuge;

his faithfulness will be your shield and rampart.

5 You will not fear the terror of night,

nor the arrow that flies by day,

6 nor the pestilence that stalks in the darkness,

nor the plague that destroys at midday.

7 A thousand may fall at your side,

ten thousand at your right hand,

but it will not come near you.

8 You will only observe with your eyes

and see the punishment of the wicked.

9 If you say, “The Lord is my refuge,”

and you make the Most High your dwelling,

10 no harm will overtake you,

no disaster will come near your tent.

11 For he will command his angels concerning you

to guard you in all your ways;

12 they will lift you up in their hands,

so that you will not strike your foot against a stone.

13 You will tread on the lion and the cobra;

you will trample the great lion and the serpent.

14 “Because he[b] loves me,” says the Lord, “I will rescue him;

I will protect him, for he acknowledges my name.

15 He will call on me, and I will answer him;

I will be with him in trouble,

I will deliver him and honor him.

16 With long life I will satisfy him

and show him my salvation.

We are all seeing the result of the lie of "separation of Church and state".

Without faith in God, that America is turning away from, we are already seeing the results.....

Millions of abortions each year while the liars say our preganacy rates are going down without faith in God. They say man's so called morals work... LOL yeh pregnancy rates are going down because we are killing the Babies before anyone knows of a pregnancy.

Our family units are in shambles and the only answer from the Left is to grow welfare and social programs. Democrats want Government to be the fathers of our children so they can keep their votes. No wonder our kids are so screwed up.

We've got terrorism growing decade after decade, as well as a growing Muslim influence in this nation. When you separate God from our pubic, the void WILL be filled with things much worse than insecure bigots could ever imagine. The Bible teaches Christians to love their enemy and forgive one another. The Quran teaches to kill those who do not believe as you. If the Quran teaches us to love our enemy and those who do not believe the same way, I would love for people to show me the verses.

This nation's values are truly dieing and without a true transformed America, transformed back to the moral values once lifted up, we are going to collapse from within.

2 points

Without faith in God, that America is turning away from, we are already seeing the results.....

You're right! Things are getting better.

Millions of abortions each year while the liars say our preganacy rates are going down without faith in God. They say man's so called morals work... LOL yeh pregnancy rates are going down because we are killing the Babies before anyone knows of a pregnancy.

The abortion rate is actually decreasing. Because the pregnancy rate is also decreasing. There has been a steady downward trend of the number of abortions since the 1990s.

Study: https://www.bostonglobe.com/news/nation/ 2015/06/07/exclusive-abortions-declining-nearly-all-states/DNRxPWSUBMVEq9J7rj6zbI/story.html

http://fivethirtyeight.com/features/the-abortion-rate-is-falling-because-fewer-women-are-getting-pregnant/

"Although it’s impossible to attribute the decline to a single factor, the data shows that better contraception — combined with a bad economy and a falling teen pregnancy rate — is largely responsible"

And abortion rates are dropping even in states where no anti-abortion laws or restrictions have been passed.

"In fact, some of the states with the biggest declines — Hawaii, Nevada and New Mexico — have enacted no new abortion laws in recent years, suggesting that something other than reduced access is spurring the trend."

The teenage pregnancy rate has also been falling steadily since the 1990s.

And here's the key point: "Over the past decade, more and more women have opted for abortions early in their pregnancies, but as states place more barriers in their way, that trend could shift. If women have to jump through more hoops — travel to faraway clinics or encounter waiting periods that require overnight stays — they might delay the procedure until they can raise enough money or take time off work. “We know that restrictive policies don’t deter most women from getting abortions, but it can delay them,” "

So there's a reason why someone would get a late term abortion.

This article is from Nate Silver by the way, the man who successfully called the outcomes in 49 of the 50 states in the 2008 U.S. Presidential election, and all 50 in the 2012 election. He knows what he's talking about in regards to statistics.

FromWithin(7680) Disputed
1 point

What a bunch of garbage. Try usng data of abortions and teen pregnancy before the 70's!

You are doing what all deceivers do, you cheery pick data to make your argument seem feasible. Abortions and teen pregnancies were at their peak during the time you want to use to say they are dropping.

1 point

May I also point out that the many people now admitting they are gay, instead of living a lie, is also lowering the pregnancy rate AND the abortion rate. This also increases the adoption rate. Now, if we could get the Muslims and communists to accept the condition, the rates would reduce worldwide. (Oh, and the Catholics, the Evangelicals, etc.)

mykebee34(119) Disputed
1 point

This might come off harsh but id rather see a stem cell research facility full of aborted fetuses than an orphanage full of sad and embittered children. Fact; people are going to have unprotected sex.

FromWithin(7680) Disputed
1 point

It not only comes off as harsh, it comes off as inhuman. To excuse killing innocent life because that life might end up in a foster home, is the sort of mindless excuses Nazi's made for killing Jews, or terrorists killing women and children. Every selfish person since time began has come up with ridiculous excuses to justify their inhumanity.

Your's is every bit as diabolical.

mykebee34(119) Disputed
1 point

First of all, at least in my opinion both political parties favor a welfare system.

1 Quality employment sucks

2 Middle class is deteriorating

3 Unfair wages and taxing

Since corporations outsource to avoid paying higher taxes they remove any chance for quality american jobs.

With the majority of consumers being poor, hows else do you expect companies to make a profit?

This is how, legal money laundering.

1 Country is `in debt.

2 The 1% has more money than the 98% combined, yet we dont have the physical gold to back this. Meaning if every Billionaire in America were to attempt to exchange their wealth for gold they wouldn't be able to.

3 We print money with no value. Therefore everything is credit or invested.

4 Dollars that fund welfare are returned to the same pockets of those funding through merchandise bought by the poor. Take away the buying power of the poor and you lose customers as well as profits.

1 point

It is easier to believe a lie than to search for the truth. Jesus is a character in a book. A widely publicized book, that people could trust and confide is. Leaders used religion to gain power, and since then many people have moved on to actually helping people. Some people haven't quite caught up yet. Worshiping a character in a book wouldn't solve anything, it would blind us from our real goals.

1 point

NO, since all that is written about Jesus, or written that is quoted as what he said is by word of mouth that was passed down sixty years or more years and penned some fifteen or sixteen hundred years. Word of mouth, hearsay, is fundamentally unreliable and flawed, usually contrived and embellished over time.

The most important scientific fact that is also overlooked is that when the human brain remembers a past event, it is actually remembering the last time that it remembered it, not the actual event itself. Therefore, when someone says "as far as I can remember, they are making an actual true statement, for one can only remember about anything that they can recall that they remembered. And time takes its toll, so we add, subtract, invent, fill in the blanks as the remembered story or event passes from one generation to another.

1 point

america would be great if we turn to god... through jesus cause he is our shepard... and for the non believers.. mercy on your souls i pray... just as i pray for mercy on my souls cause the wages of sin is death...

1 point

Jesus hates America. Both God and Jesus are going to destroy America because it's filled with nothing but sin.

2 points

All praises to The Most High N Christ Sir!

1 point

We gota destroy this Christian doctrine of lies

1 point

No, religion is inpeeding social, technological, and economic progress.

If we went back to Jesus then a lot of people would be unhappy .

NathanAllen(2227) Clarified
1 point

It depends on how Jesus would be incorporated into the Country. If Jesus was incorporated back into america through morals and laws than no there would not be a problem. It is when the Church and State have all the power, that is when things get hateful and judgemental.

The church has always judged people based on many factors. But Christian morals would make America great again.

LadyLinkstar(415) Clarified
1 point

couldn't summon it up any better .

1 point

1) America never turned away from Jesus. On balance the USA has citizens more aligned with understanding the Golden Rule than any other nation on earth. The only people with the pessimistic we're doomed by sinners view are those with such narrow views on religion they already expect the whole dang world to fail anyway.

2) if you believe natural disasters are punishment from God then realize God is a petty spiteful destroyer who hurts believers along with non believers and may on any whim send you to hell whether or not you deserve it.

3) Why aren't the cities and places most important to religion and full of the most believers then the safest and most disaster free places on earth?

Back to Jesus?! Like the old school Christian church that stole America from the natives and enslaved Africans?! 😇😇😯

Or maybe the church that burned witches at the stake.

Or their friends the Jews that invented capitalism and faux currency and usury.

Yea maybe we should go back to the dark ages again

-1 points

Well, yeah, sure...I suppose it would probably help our country on some levels if we all truly took the teachings of Jesus of Nazareth to heart. And practiced what he preached.

Now then: I am a staunch Atheist, as most of you know full well by now (LOL)---But please Don't ever get me wrong regarding my opinion of ol' JC.

Jesus had some fine teachings. In fact I consider him to be one of the finest moral philosophers who ever lived. Among that pantheon of great teachers like Siddartha Gautama; Mohatma Ghandi; and Martin Luther King, Jr.

And yeah, socially we all would probably get along much better if we follow Jesus' teachings. There might be less violence and more philanthropy. Of course there would always be the criminal element who are never going to follow his teachings. And that includes the white collar criminals: the wealthy who exploit the poor.

But the government won't change. And this is where a great deal of our problems come from. Economically-speaking as well. See, JC would almost certainly want to institute a socialist form of governing...maybe even communism. And we have seen form history that this sort of government simply does not work. Not on a macro level, as it would need to be for an entire Nation. The largest type of communist that true Marxian Communism could ever work would perhaps be on town, or small city level. I highly doubt it could work all the way up to, say, a state level.

Now as I close I have to make sure and clarify that my endorsement of Jesus as a great teacher and my opinion that following his teachings might improve the social conditions in my country in NO WAY is an endorsement to return to Religion!! Or make Religion more powerful. (It already was WAY too much say!)

Nor do I think the the Constitutionally-mandated separation of Church and State should EVER be repealed.

Because the vast vast majority of Religious folks don't adhere to JC's teachings much ore than us Agnostics or Atheists. So-called Christians are some of the nastiest and rudest and misanthropic folks I know. We have a couple of good examples right here on CD

! For the most part, organized Christian Churches--both Protestant and Catholic--have sorely bastardized the teachings of Jesus, as they chose instead to incorporate their own power-mongering and control-happy agendas.

Indeed, organized religion in my country has a lot of similarities with Congress. IN that they both began as good ideas but have been corrupted by power. And have also forgotten why they were invented in the first place.

Isn't it ironic how Jesus was a socialist and Christians love the pursuit of wealth so much?

0 points

I agree with much of what you said. If we "practiced what HE preached" (allegedly), we would all be better off. However, I think Muslims and even Jews would find it hard to "go along". Therein lies the problem. We would have to practice this without religion, or the fighting would never end .... as has been proven for centuries.

I agree with Jesus starting a "socialist type" of government, it's what he DID! Linking communism to socialism, though, is where we differ. The communists USED socialism as a tool to make their subjects BELIEVE that everything was "the peoples". The peoples Army, the peoples library, the peoples government ... nothing farther from the truth! Democratic socialism would be a different thing altogether, as has been shown by several European countries.

If Americans (some) would finally realize, as John Adams said: " The government of the United States is NOT, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion." As well as, in the words of the "Father of the Constitution", James Madison: " The purpose of the separation of church and state is to keep, forever from these shores, the ceaseless strife that has soaked the sands of Europe in blood for centuries." ALL PLAIN language by the founding fathers. We would have far less trouble in government! I don't blame the government THEY set up for us, I blame those who are IN government constantly trying to re-interpret the Constitution to fit their agenda. Or, if you will, praising Jesus while they act any way BUT "HIS way"!

To me, the problem isn't the government, it's the greed that "lobbying" has generated. The lobbying for MONEY, as well as the lobbying for their sorry souls! No other form of government, on paper, works as well. When it goes bad is when Of the people, BY the people and FOR the people is changed to "CERTAIN" people .... with the money to control it! Yep. A good idea, corrupted. Lobbying and Gerrymandering MUST be stopped.

1 point

I think I agree that the two biggest problems--biggest hindrances--to our current government working effectively are the over-influence of Lobbyists (K Street) and also Gerrymandering.

We have to get the $$ influence from outsiders away from the Capitol. We cannot tolerate the fact that it is not uncommon for congressmen and Senators to leave office far richer than they were when they entered.

Gerrymandering is especially pernicious. As it denigrates the efficacy of the very soul of the Democratic system: Voting! The GOP especially has been very ruthless--and effective!--in re-drawing some of our nation's district lines in a way to oft-times render votes against them to be meaningless. As well as increasing the importance of pro votes.

And what the hell is up with the "super PAC/s?" I cannot for the life of me understand how those can be allowed. And how anybody would say the framers of the Constitution would have not been totally against them. No way would they have allowed such a bastardization of the voting system!

Saintnow(3684) Disputed
1 point

Jesus did not start a socialist type of government. His government is a Kingdom, and He is the King. His word is the law. The nations of the world will be subdued under Him. In His Kingdom, Islam is not allowed. Islam seeks to steal His Kingdom. He will rule the world from Mt. Zion, and all Jews at that time will know He is their Messiah who their religious rulers murdered over 2000 years ago.

He will execute vengeance against His enemies. His Kingdom is an everlasting Kingdom.

You are twisted. You are not even king of yourself. Sin rules over you, and you are paying for it. You can be relieved of the debt you owe God, but you probably will not repent and believe on the Lord Jesus Christ. You probably are going to pay forever in Hell for being a sinner. There is no way out without the Savior you are rejecting.

-1 points

Yeah no. Nothing has ever pointed to prayer working to fix anything. I fail to see the logical standpoint behind this debate.

2 points

There is no logic, since prayer is usually asking some deity for something, or to alleviate something, that was responsible for the condition in the first place. Why would a compassionate deity impose such conditions and then require homage to it to obtain relief from what it caused to occur in the first place. No logic and not one thread of divine intervention exist to prove that some prayer "fixed" anything.

Saintnow(3684) Disputed
1 point

Jesus fixed my life. I know God answers prayer. Prayer does not fix things, God does when he deems it best. Sometimes we need to learn lessons so He lets us have troubles. His desire is always peace toward you, but your desire may be freedom away from His presence and He will hold Himself back from you to honor your wishes. He is still being good to you giving you things and abilities to enjoy. God loves you.

SlapShot(2607) Disputed
1 point

And what do children suffering from disease and illness need to learn from your impotent god?

But, yeah, sure....it is so very kind of him to let them have their troubles. I'm sure the kids are thankful to your god.

And one more question, while I am at it. Let me ask you: you say Jesus fixed you life? Why you and not the dying children? Also, please tell me how we can tell that it was Jesus who "fixed" you, and not just your own mind learning to amend it formerly deleterious habits and thought. The act of doing this on our own is called Cognitive Behavior Therapy. Millions of people do use this to better themselves.

So how again do you know you did not just "wise up?" Or mature? On your own. What exactly about your getting "fixed" demands that it was done by divine intervention?

I will eagerly await your answer. ANYTHING that tells how how all of it cannot simply be in your head.

Thanks.

Saintnow(3684) Disputed
-1 points

You don't know what you are talking about. This kind of arrogance is beyond ignorant, it's hateful.

-1 points

...........................................................................

-2 points
-2 points
2 points

Indeed.

Satan seems to be running the show here on the 3rd Rock.

So why the Hell not get in on the Winning Side?

LOL

After all, it is every possible that the murderous yahweh never really tossed SATAN out of Heaven, but that SATAN left on his own volition, to come down here and run things and help us indulge our desires and sin as much as possible--rebel as much as possible--against the oppressive and petty yahweh.

SATAN seems to be winning the battle. As we can find evidence of his works daily here on Earth, we can PROVE he exists and wields power, yet the christians can NOT do the same insofar as proving their god exists. Much less that he can do ANYTHING here on Earth?

Where was he during the Holocaust? Where is he in Africa every day? When 3000 kids die? Why are the most religious countries also the poorest? And have the highest infant mortality?

All questions the christians cannot answer, but rather are questions where the obvious answer alludes to SATAN as being the Man in Charge!!

Hail!

LOL

JesusFreak7(48) Disputed
1 point

Satan doesnt have all the power..... Jesus Christ has all the power.... and Satan is just having a tantrum cuz he lost.... thats all it is... and it shows how much of a coward he really is.

1 point

"Religion is regarded by the common people as true, by the wise as false and by the rulers as useful." Lucius Annaeus Senaca (Around the time of Jesus).

"God is a comedian playing to an audience to afraid to laugh." George Carlin? Nope, Voltaire (1778 - 1894)

"Question with boldness even the existence of God; because, if there IS one, He must approve of the homage of reason, than that of blindfolded fear." Thomas Jefferson

"During 15 centuries has the legal establishment of Christianity been on trial. What has been the fruits? More or less, in ALL places, pride and indulgence in the clergy, ignorance and servility in the laity. In both, superstition, bigotry and persecution." James Madison

The more things change, the more they stay the same.

These educated and respected people are , apparently, to some of our detractors on this debate, residing in hell.

Oh, well, "Heaven for the weather, hell for the company." I'd hate to have to listen to Pat Robertson for eternity!

Saintnow(3684) Disputed
0 points

3000 kids die? So you die the same as they do...and why do you laugh as you speak of your suffering? Are you not evil? God is being good to you, and you are being evil to God.