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Debate Info

52
30
Of Course No
Debate Score:82
Arguments:63
Total Votes:92
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 Of Course (38)
 
 No (21)

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LordSkeptic(92) pic



Is Antifa Fascist?

Of Course

Side Score: 52
VS.

No

Side Score: 30

I don't care if they label them fascist or not. Whatever you want to call them, they are evil and use force and violence to shut down anyone who opposes their godless religion. What we do know is that they use the Communist symbol to represent themselves, and Communism is even worse than Nazism. Nazism targets a group that it sees as a minority. Communism targets all of its own people.

https://libertarianheathendotcom.files.wordpress.com/2016/05/antifa-red.jpg?w=300&h;=225

Side: Of Course
Rattbag(25) Disputed
1 point

Antifa isn't a communist group. It's a collection of people who happen to be against fascism.

Side: No
2 points

When a group violently attacks people simply for holding a different point of view, they have become the fascists.

Side: Of Course
1 point

I agree. Being intolerant enough to want to deport or (at the extreme end) kill your 'opponents' is pretty fascist. What a good thing we have people willing to stand up for our side against these tyrants, huh?

Supporting Evidence: comic (i.redd.it)
Side: Of Course
WinstonC(1116) Disputed
1 point

I like how you talk about a dislike for fascism while posting arguments and comics calling for or condoning violence against peaceful democratic opposition. Forcible suppression of democratic opposition is one of the defining features of fascism.

Side: Of Course

The anti-fascist fascist are, indeed fascist. They use brown shirt tactics to silence and censor those who disagree with them; they disrupt peaceful gatherings; try to deprive people of their rights of freedom of speech/expression; assault and battery those who disagree with them; engage in vandalism and arson. Yup, they are fascists.

Side: Of Course
excon(6262) Disputed
2 points

Hello High:

Yes... Some people disagree with ANTIFA.. But, when those people are Nazis, they DESERVE attacking..

excon

Side: No
2 points

So if the KKK starts attacking Nazis, you're ready with your white sheet to join the cause.

Side: Of Course
1 point

I think ALL are reprehensible, including BLM, a black, racist hate group.

Side: Of Course

Ironically. Yes.

Side: Of Course

The anti-fascists fascists are fascists. Their name is classic Orwellian double-speak. They use brown shirt tactics to silence those whose opinions they disagree with.

Side: Of Course
TheSnake(6) Disputed
1 point

The anti-fascists fascists are fascists

The fascists are, and always will be, the fascists.

Far-right smear campaign against Antifa exposed by Bellingcat

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/blogs-trending-41036631

Their name is classic Orwellian double-speak.

Just what is it with the right wing? You invoke the name of an anti-fascist socialist to support your idea that anti-fascists are secretly fascists? And then you accuse the LEFT OF DOUBLE SPEAK? That is simply UNBELIEVABLE.

They use brown shirt tactics

Listen to me carefully, young man. Fascism is not a set of "tactics". Fascism is a political ideology.

I need to repeat again what I said earlier. You are UNBELIEVABLE. Apparently we are to believe that you are actually stupid enough to listen to and believe fascists when they accuse their opposition of being the fascists. That is so far beyond retarded that the only analogy I have is turning up at Hitler's bunker, and being persuaded by Hitler that your own army are the Nazis.

Side: No
1 point

First of all, I have no idea who Bellingcat is; my observations are my own. Secondly, there's reality, then there's what you think.

Side: Of Course
1 point

The argument the opposition gives is that "Their name is Anti-fascist, so that means they're against fascism" to that I say, guess what Nazism is called? National Socialism, going by the name, Nazism is also Socialism... right?

Or if that doesn't work how about DPRK democratic people's republic of Korea (North Korea) has "democratic" in it's name. If you're against Kim Jong Un, you're against Democracy. Names don't mean anything. As for Fascism? It's more of a tactic than an actual Ideology. Fascism is the forceful subjugation of your people, the violent eradication of any form of opposition and pure authoritarian and totalitarian control over your nation. there were left-wing fascists such as Stalin and Mao, and there were right wing fascists such as Hitler and Mussolini... Antifa perfectly fits the first two part of the definition.

Attacking their opposition, physically harming them, forcing them into their own beliefs. The only thing missing is institutional influence and pure authoritarian power, otherwise Antifa is quite close to being Fascist.

Side: Of Course

From the Merriam-Webster dictionary:

Fascism: "Forcible suppression of opposition."

Actual quote from an Antifa member (spoken at one of their college "Demonstrations:"): "You're a fucking fascist, and if you don't shut your fucking mouth, we will find your house and fucking burn it to the ground, you piece of shit."

In my experience with Antifa members, if you say ANYTHING that conflicts with their beliefs, you immediately get labelled as one of these many fun terms: Racist, Homophone, Xenophobe, Sexist, Bigot, Transphobe, or a White Supremacist.

OR, they straight up punch you in the face and threaten to set fire to your home.

In a social debate and expression of ideas, using those terms isn't a way to combat another person's argument. It is a way to shut them down so that they can't continue to retort to you. It is an attempt to remove their credibility and make it so that you look like the hero of society, and they just get reduced to a racist, sexist, bigoted, homophobe who hates the poor.

Antifa doesn't want to listen to ideas. They don't want to be adults. They used to want to just hold their hands over their ears so they didn't have to hear what you were saying. Now, they hold those hands over your mouth, so that you simply can't get those ideas out.

They are a group of fascists. A mere group of children who subscribe to a socialist ideology and are pissed off that the government won't take money away from every middle-class white person and give it to them so that they can pursue their dreams of become a Gender Studies or History of Racial Inequality professor.

They don't know anything about how the world works, nor do they understand what a civilized society looks like, NOR do they understand what it means to contribute to society, and then get back what you put into it.

Side: Of Course
3 points

It is horrible what we are doing to words. We throw them out there and not even know what they mean.

Fascism is an idea. If you are antifascist you don't believe in fascism. Now is your question: do antifascist deep down actually agree with fascists?

Communists are communist. Fascists are fascist.

It's like saying are democrats republican. It's nonsense.

Side: No
Gypsee(260) Disputed
1 point

Hahaha...Listen dear, you can give me references and links to articles and I STILL won't understand what logical path you took to conclude that ANTIFA are Communists.

I am going to read your articles and I will use critical thinking. And, I will very surely come to a different conclusion. I will take the time to explain to you my logic in hope that you will give me your's but instead I will get a one line statement. In the end, I will still NOT understand your position because you would have just refused to explain it to me, or you will use the "she is a liberal" card to excuse yourself from taking the time to extensively explain your ideas.

SO, if you are going to throw statements like beads out of a window during Mardi fucking Gras, I ask to stop my wasting my fucking time.

Thank you.

Side: No
marcusmoon(487) Clarified
1 point

I appreciate your point.

That is why I used the term fascistic to describe the behavior and tactics as resembling those of the Fascisti.

I think that some of this resulted from ANTIFA folks calling neo-Nazis and Republicans "Fascists" as if those groups were actually Fascist. (What is really funny is that while neo-Nazis are not actually fascists, most are not even National Socialists. There are actually neo-Nazis who rail against the welfare state!) The liberal arts "education" many of these millennial libtards received did not include basic logic, critical thinking, or an exposure to any history that was not presented to support some theory or other.

Once Fascist became an epithet for anyone ANTIFA folks thought conservative (hence evil and racist), it became popular to call ANTIFA "Fascists", largely to mock them with a sense .

I think the carelessness with which modern Americans use words is problematic when discussing everything, but especially politics. I blame the social science professors and theorists. They just make up words or give old ones new meanings, and then define them in the first two chapters of their books.

That is how we ended up with the Post-modernists, who are distinct from the Futurists, despite the fact that the future is what is after modern times.

Side: Of Course
Gypsee(260) Clarified
1 point

I do agree that the issue is lack of basic logic, critical thinking and history. Masses of people are easily manipulated by media that throws words here and there like they have no meaning. Media today has decided to be part of politics so, it makes sense that they push their ideas. Now it is the reader's job to question everything people tell them. This sort of questioning is taught.

Calling people liberals, or Fascist or Communist, or Nazis, conservatives without even knowing what these terms mean is the lowest form of judgment. We do that today to abstain from argument and from trying to understand each other. So yes, it is problematic when discussing because people have become idiots. And I have chosen my words carefully: Complete idiots. We give labels to each other without the slightest idea of what the person really thinks or even what the label means.

So, are ANTIFAs fascistic? Maybe. I say maybe because I don't know exactly how ANTIFAs fight against Fascism.

I don't know what fascistic means because honestly I looked it up and I have definitions that disagree with your's.

Even if your definition was correct, what exactly are fascist tactics and behavior?

My point being, whenever we are going to label people, we should make sure they label themselves that way or we understand very well their ideas and the label before giving it to them. The latter of course requires us to sit down listen to the other person, read about their theory, make our opinion, question our opinions... Instead we kill each other, insult each other, hate each other...

I'm ranting. I apologize. You made great points. +1

Side: Of Course
1 point

Their name stands for "anti-fascism", so take a wild fucking guess. America is just a composite haven of stupidity, where you can stand up and claim 97 percent of climate scientists are lying, the anti-fascists are fascists, and Barack Obama is a Kenyan dictator, all with a completely straight face and while being taken seriously by other complete fucking morons.

Side: No
WinstonC(1116) Disputed
3 points

"Their name stands for "anti-fascism", so take a wild fucking guess."

So I can make a hate group called "Anti-racist", then proceed to kill all blacks and it won't be racist?

Side: Of Course
BoneMaster Disputed
3 points

So I can make a hate group called "Anti-racist", then proceed to kill all blacks and it won't be racist?

So if something is theoretically possible that therefore makes it true (or even probable), does it? Welcome to the mind of the fascist, where such radical abuses of logic are commonplace.

If you make a group called "Anti-racist" then the people you attract are not likely to want to kill blacks, you sophist buffoon. Similarly, if I start a group to specifically fight fascism, the people I attract are not likely to be fascists. You might as well argue that NASA is staffed with religious mediums, you daft fucking clown.

Side: No
2 points

America is just a composite haven of stupidity

Then you would support immigrants not coming here to protect them from the stupidity.

Side: Of Course
1 point

So if someone starts a white supremacist group called "black liberaters" then that's what they are....

Side: Of Course
1 point

Antifa is a totally decentralised entity. It's nothing more than a flag that people rally under. It's members range from communists, to anarchists, to mainstream liberals. There is no central group, publication, or leader that can claim to represent the true antifa.

The only feature binding antifa members is being under an anti-fascist flag. Antifa is absolutely not fascist, because that is 100% impossible.

Side: No
Amarel(3118) Disputed
1 point

Fascism is characterized by dictatorial power, forcible suppression of opposition, and control of industry and commerce. While it's hard for a small group of criminals to wield dictatorial power or control over industry, they can be as fascistic as possible by forcibly suppressing opposition. Which is what antifa does regularly, even without a central command.

Antifa may not be nationalists, but how can one care for their different ends when they share the same evil means?

Side: Of Course
Rattbag(25) Disputed
1 point

The difference is who the two groups choose to suppress. Fascists suppress everybody (or at least their chosen minority group). Anti-fascists try to prevent that from happening by stopping the oppressors from organising.

Antifa have no dispute with groups that don't try to restrict the rights of others. They don't oppress others, they work to prevent others from being oppressed.

Side: No
Rattbag(25) Disputed
1 point

Please read my argument before disputing it. I literally just stated that Antifa isn't a communist organisation.

Side: No
1 point

It's members range from communists, to anarchists, to mainstream liberals

Birds of a feather.

Side: Of Course