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You mean the culture known for oppressing women, rioting because of blasphemous literature, cutting off the hands of thieves, and stoning women who get raped is admirable? I'd hate to live in your idea of a bad society!
MY BODY IS MY OWN BUSINESS I often wonder whether people see me as a radical, fundamentalist Muslim terrorist packing an AK-47 assault rifle inside my jean jacket. Or maybe they see me as the poster girl for oppressed womanhood everywhere. I’m not sure which one it is.
I get the whole range of strange looks, stares, and covert glances. You see, I wear the hijab, a scarf that covers my head, neck, and throat. I do this because I am a Muslim woman who believes her body is her own private affair.
The Qur’an teaches us that individuals should not be judged according to gender, beauty, wealth or privilege.
Verily the most honoured of you in the sight of Allah is the most righteous of you. (Qur’an 49:13)
What the Hijab is...
1-An act of Obedience to The Creator
2-An Act of Honour & Dignity
3-An act of Belief & Faith
4-An act of Modesty
5-An act of Purity
6-An act of Bashfulness
7-An act of Righteousness
8-A Shield
What the Hijab is NOT...
1-It is NOT something new. Muslim women follow the example
of righteous women in the past such as Mary, the mother of
Jesus.
2-It is NOT a symbol of oppression.
3-It is NOT required in non-public places where there are only
muslim females and close male relatives.
4-It is NOT a means to restrict a woman’s freedom to express
her views and opinion, or to have an education and a career.
5-It is NOT an act of defiance, confrontation or protest to non-
Muslims.
6-It is NOT a portable prison.
Wearing the hijab has given me freedom from constant attention to my physical self.
And good for you, really, way to go modesty and privacy, but that doesn't change the fact that in some places and in some instances, religious head coverings are symbols of oppression, women are forced to cover themselves, and, abroad, is does serve as a political and religious statement.
I wonder if christians ever read their own Bible. They say muslim oppresses woman by veiling infact it is not. Its not only the Quran that say their own Bible also says.
1 Corinthians 11:6
6.If a woman does not cover her head, she should have her hair cut off; and if it is a disgrace for a woman to have her hair cut or shaved off, she should cover her head.
The words are so strict that if a woman does not covers her head her head be shaved off.
It was also quite interesting to hear that Virgin Mary never used to show her hair either and used to cover up. Tradition or religion?or was she oppressed?
When I see a woman wearing a hijab I dont think shes going to kill me or that shes oppressed I try my best to assume the best of everyone but always leave room for the reality that people are dangerous (all of them) and they might hate me. What I do think when I see a women dressed in hijab is "I wonder if she thinks I'm going to hell,that god doesn't love me" or that maybe I'm a slut. I also wonder if Muslim woman can be friends with another woman who is not Muslim.
I also wonder (not when I see a Muslim woman but in general) how can anyone ever truly find and love and give themselves to god if there is no temptation to make them more disciplined. I don't believe god would appreciate the honor of some one who has no choice in the matter more then a person who chooses to honor him dispute being surrounded with temptation and corruption.
It was quite interesting to hear that Virgin Mary never used to show her hair either and used to cover up. Tradition or religion?or was she oppressed?
I see that you are keeping using the words (I think and I wonder):
I do not know where did you get this point of view as it appears that you did not deal with any Muslim before. Maybe you got this point of view from the media that is launching a war against Islam without trying to understand it. And I advice you not to adopt anyone else 's point of view without investigation.
In fact you have the free will to choose what is right or wrong. And in the same time God (the creator ) showed you (the creation ) the best way for you to follow, and you choose what you see good for you as gos says " No compulsion in religion", but beware of that you will be reckoned by God for what you do.
I couldn't give two shits about whether Mary showed her hair or not.
I use the words (I wonder and I think) because I wanted you to understand that my opinion and perspective are my own and not necessarily anyone else's. It is true that I do not have much experience with the Muslim religion (or any religion) so let me phrase things a little differently.
When you (a Muslim woman) sees me ( a non Muslim woman) do you think that God will "reckon" with me because I am not Muslim. Sines I don't cover my hair, do you think I want men to rape me or that all I want is sex? Are you (a Muslim woman) friends with any non Muslim women? Think of this as an opportunity to educate me on the general views of Muslim women.
1-Yes God is going to reckon all mankind whether one is a Muslim or Non-Muslim for that what they do, starting from one's belief and ending with one's deeds.
2-. Since you don't cover your hair, and you think you do not want men to rape you or that all what you do not want is sex. But at the same time you do not guarantee others to behave and feel modestly, and this is how one would open the door to the immorality to prevail.
3-Yes, I have many non Muslim friends and the God says "O mankind! We have created you from a male and a female, and made you into nations and tribes, that you may know one another. Verily, the most honorable of you with the God is that (believer) who is pious . Verily, the God is All-Knowing, All-Aware.
4- And I will take this as an opportunity as you said to educate you on the general views of Muslim women.
"2-. Since you don't cover your hair, and you think you do not want men to rape you or that all what you do not want is sex. But at the same time you do not guarantee others to behave and feel modestly, and this is how one would open the door to the immorality to prevail."
I never stop or judge people for being modest, there is nothing wrong with being modest, though you and I may have different views of what modesty is. I believe that if a woman is raped (whether she dressed modestly or not) the rape was not her fault. It was the fault of the man who raped her. If a woman was naked and a man raped her, the raped happened because HE was immoral not her, she was just naked.
I read through the sites you posted and I appreciate the perspectives.However, I dont think you and I will ever truly understand each other. You are (and the Islamic culture) deeply rooted in your religion and though I do believe in God, I follow no religion. Versus from the Koran or the bible or any other text are subject to interpretation, they can mean different things to different people. Therefore I believe that the only way a person (man or women) can be free is to live in a society that does not base its laws on those of any religious text or interpretations of said texts. I could be wrong but I don't think you would agree and there for the world and reality will probably always be very different between us.
1- modesty is to prevent inadvertent exposure of part of the body.
2- Hijab for men
People usually only discuss ‘hijab’ in the context of women. However, in the Glorious Qur’an, Allah (swt) first mentions ‘hijab’ for men before ‘hijab’ for the women. The Qur’an mentions in Surah Noor:
“Say to the believing men that they should lower their gaze and guard their modesty: that will make for greater purity for them: and Allah is well acquainted with all that they do.” [Al-Qur’an 24:30]
The moment a man looks at a woman and if any brazen or unashamed thought comes to his mind, he should lower his gaze.
3- Hijab for women.
The next verse of Surah Noor, says:
“ And say to the believing women that they should lower their gaze and guard their modesty; that they should not display their beauty and ornaments except what (must ordinarily) appear thereof; that they should draw veils over their bosoms and not display their beauty except to their husbands, their fathers, their husbands’ fathers, their sons...” [Al-Qur’an 24:31]
Complete ‘hijab’, also includes the moral conduct, behaviour, attitude and intention of the individual. A person only fulfilling the criteria of ‘hijab’ of the clothes is observing ‘hijab’ in a limited sense.
‘Hijab’ of the clothes should be accompanied by ‘hijab’ of the eyes, ‘hijab’ of the heart, ‘hijab’ of thought and ‘hijab’ of intention. It also includes the way a person walks, the way a person talks, the way he behaves, etc.
Example of twin sisters
Suppose two sisters who are twins, and who are equally beautiful, walk down
the street. One of them is attired in the Islamic hijab i.e. the complete body is
covered, except for the face and the hands up to the wrists. The other sister is
wearing western clothes, a mini skirt or shorts. Just around the corner there is
a hooligan or ruffian who is waiting for a catch, to tease a girl. Whom will he
tease? The girl wearing the Islamic Hijab or the girl wearing the skirt or the mini?
Naturally he will tease the girl wearing the skirt or the mini. Such dresses are an
indirect invitation to the opposite sex for teasing and molestation. The Qur’an
rightly says that hijab prevents women from being molested.
4- Capital punishment for the rapists
Under the Islamic shariah, a man convicted of having raped a woman, is given capital punishment.
5- Western society falsely claims to have uplifted women:
Western talk of women’s liberalization is nothing but a disguised form of
exploitation of her body, degradation of her soul, and deprivation of her honour.
Western society claims to have ‘uplifted’ women. On the contrary it has actually
degraded them to the status of concubines, mistresses and society butterflies
who are mere tools in the hands of pleasure seekers and sex marketeers,
hidden behind the colourful screen of ‘art’ and ‘culture’.
USA has one of the highest rates of rape
United States of America is supposed to be one of the most advanced countries
of the world. It also has one of the highest rates of rape in any country in the
world. According to a FBI report, in the year 1990, every day on an average
1756 cases of rape were committed in U.S.A alone. Later another report said
that on an average everyday 1900 cases of rapes are committed in USA. The
year was not mentioned. May be it was 1992 or 1993. May be the Americans
got ‘bolder’ in the following years.
Consider a scenario where the Islamic hijab is followed in America. Whenever
a man looks at a woman and any brazen or unashamed thought comes to his
mind, he lowers his gaze. Every woman wears the Islamic hijab, that is the
complete body is covered except the face and the hands upto the wrist. After
this if any man commits rape he is given capital punishment. I ask you, in such
a scenario, will the rate of rape in America increase, will it remain the same, or
will it decrease?
6- Qur'an Says (interpretation of the meanings :''Say (O Muhammad SAW): "Shall We tell you the greatest losers in respect of (their) deeds?"Those whose efforts have been wasted in this life while they thought that they were acquiring good by their deeds!."They are those who deny the Ayât (proofs, evidences, verses, lessons, signs, revelations, etc.) of their Lord and the Meeting with Him (in the Hereafter). So their works are in vain, and on the Day of Resurrection, We shall assign not weight for them. "That shall be their recompense, Hell; because they disbelieved and took My Ayât (proofs, evidences, verses, lessons, signs, revelations, etc.) and My Messengers by way of jest and mockery.''.
I know that you have the right to believe what you want and there is no compulsion in religion, but I fear that you may become one of them (the greatest losers).
In the christian bible it says the same thing.The bible says :
For adultery (including urban rape victims who fail to scream loud enough)
If a damsel that is a virgin be betrothed unto an husband, and a man find her in the city, and lie with her; Then ye shall bring them both out unto the gate of that city, and ye shall stone them with stones that they die; the damsel, because she cried not, being in the city. Deuteronomy 22:23-24
For a woman who is not a virgin on her wedding night
If any man take a wife, and go in unto her, and hate her ... and say, I took this woman, and when I came to her, I found her not a maid: Then shall the father of the damsel, and her mother, take and bring forth the tokens of the damsel's virginity unto the elders of the city in the gate: And the damsel's father shall say ... these are the tokens of my daughter's virginity. And they shall spread the cloth before the elders of the city. ... But if this thing be true, and the tokens of virginity be not found for the damsel: Then they shall bring out the damsel to the door of her father's house, and the men of her city shall stone her with stones that she die. Deuteronomy 22:13-21
no, not often, but often in certain governments of the world, then we would be screwed. However, the majority of Muslim leaders are extremists, not the people.
We are not here to escape from the questions or to change our believes just to fit our purposes .
God knows best what is best for you and you do not know.
In the christian bible it says the same thing.The bible says :
For adultery (including urban rape victims who fail to scream loud enough)
If a damsel that is a virgin be betrothed unto an husband, and a man find her in the city, and lie with her; Then ye shall bring them both out unto the gate of that city, and ye shall stone them with stones that they die; the damsel, because she cried not, being in the city. Deuteronomy 22:23-24
For a woman who is not a virgin on her wedding night
If any man take a wife, and go in unto her, and hate her ... and say, I took this woman, and when I came to her, I found her not a maid: Then shall the father of the damsel, and her mother, take and bring forth the tokens of the damsel's virginity unto the elders of the city in the gate: And the damsel's father shall say ... these are the tokens of my daughter's virginity. And they shall spread the cloth before the elders of the city. ... But if this thing be true, and the tokens of virginity be not found for the damsel: Then they shall bring out the damsel to the door of her father's house, and the men of her city shall stone her with stones that she die. Deuteronomy 22:13-21
If you blame the leader extremists, then you would leave to question why their leaders are often extremists.
During the Satanic Verses affair, you couldn't see Ayatollah there, holding up signs and screaming about how someone said a scary word which somehow means that they should take Salman's life.
If the Muslim people are not "extremist", how do/did they allow extremist to run their countries? If the Muslim People are no "extremist" why don't/didn't they vocally support the US attempts at ridding them of extremist?
If a person sits back and allows a criminal to break into their home rape and imprison their family then kill their neighbors I would think that person supports that criminal, wouldn't you?
It depends on which extremists, the ones in Afghanistan were created by the CIA, or they have enough power. And who said they allow them to run their country? I assure many people here hate KSA because if its extreme and incorrect version of sharia. I mean, think about all the dictators in the world, why do the people allow them to be dictators? They don't, they just can't stop them . All you need is a trip to UAE, Kuwait, Qatar, and Syria (before the uprising)
"It depends on which extremists the ones in Afghanistan were created by the CIA"
The extremest where not created by the CIA. The may have been supported by the CIA but they were not created by them. By that reasoning someone created racists, dictators, sexists and war lords or maybe...... they were actually created through their own choices and with the support (or indifference) of their own society.
"I mean, think about all the dictators in the world, why do the people allow them to be dictators? They don't, they just can't stop them"
They do allow them to take charge, probably because they agree with what they are saying. The civilian population (of any country) vastly out number any government/dictator population in that country. Therefor the only reason the dictators stay in power is because they have the support of the people.
a. Islam is without doubt the best religion but the media is in the hands of the westerners who are afraid of Islam. The media is continuously broadcasting and printing information against Islam. They either provide misinformation about Islam, misquote Islam or project a point out of proportion, if any.
b. When any bomb blasts take place anywhere, the first people to be accused without proof are invariably the Muslims. This appears as headlines in the news. Later, when they find that non-Muslims were responsible, it appears as an insignificant news’ item.
c. If a 50 year old Muslim marries a 15 year old girl after taking her permission, it appears on the front page but when a 50 year old non-Muslim rapes a 6 year old girl, it may appear in the news in the inside pages as ‘Newsbriefs’. Everyday in America on an average 2,713 cases of rape take place but it doesn’t appear in the news, since it has become a way of life for the Americans.
2. Black sheep in every community:
I am aware that there are some Muslims who are dishonest, unreliable, who cheat, etc. but the media projects this as though only Muslims are involved in such activities. There are black sheep in every community. I know Muslims who are alcoholics and who can drink most of the non-Muslims under the table.
3. Muslims best as a whole:
Inspite of all the black sheep in the Muslim community, Muslims taken on the whole, yet form the best community in the world. We are the biggest community of tee-totallers as a whole, i.e. those who don’t imbibe alcohol. Collectively, we are a community which gives the maximum charity in the world. There is no community as a whole in the world which can show even a candle to the Muslims where modesty is concerned; where sobriety is concerned; where human values and ethics are concerned.
4. Don’t judge a car by its driver:
If you want to judge how good is the latest model of the “Mercedes” car and a person who does not know how to drive sits at the steering wheel and bangs up the car, who will you blame? The car or the driver? But naturally, the driver. To analyze how good the car is, a person should not look at the driver but see the ability and features of the car. How fast is it, what is its average fuel consumption, what are the safety measures, etc. Even if I agree for the sake of argument that the Muslims are bad, we can’t judge Islam by its followers? If you want to judge how good Islam is then judge it according to its authentic sources, i.e. the Glorious Qur’an and the Sahih Hadith.
5. Judge Islam by its best follower i.e. Prophet Mohammed (pbuh):
If you practically want to check how good a car is put an expert driver behind the steering wheel. Similarly the best and the most exemplary follower of Islam by whom you can check how good Islam is, is the last and final messenger of God, Prophet Muhammad (pbuh). Besides Muslims, there are several honest and unbiased non-Muslim historians who have acclaimed that prophet Muhammad was the best human being. According to Michael H. Hart who wrote the book, ‘The Hundred Most Influential Men in History’, the topmost position, i.e. the number one position goes to the beloved prophet of Islam, Muhammad (pbuh). There are several such examples of non-Muslims paying great tributes to the prophet, like Thomas Carlyle, La-Martine, etc.
Tell me the bad thing you know or heard about Islam and I will try to upload the part of the lecture relating to your question or I might write it down and post it for you.
It is your right to know, and my duty to tell ..... the truth.
These are some basic questions I have about Islamic culture I'm not sure if they are entirely relevant to the culture of only to different regions or country's please inform me of your perspective?
All praise is due to Allah, the One who said: “ And do not come near to the unlawful sexual intercourse…” And peace and blessings of Allah be upon His slave and Messenger Muhammad, who said: “When a person commits zina, Imaan (faith) leaves him, until it is like a cloud over his head…” Undoubtedly, all Muslims have some knowledge of the prohibition of Adultery and fornication, however we are living in a western society whereby this crime has become widespread and commonly accepted. This acceptable crime has even crept into some of the Muslim homes, to the extent we find those who are proud to see their son entering the house with a girl accompanying them.
The Prophet (s.a.w) said: “There is no sin after shirk (polytheism) greater in the eyes of Allah than a drop of semen which a man places in the womb which is not lawful for him.”
A person has committed zina (Adultery or Fornication) if they voluntarily and deliberately perform sexual intercourse with other than one’s spouse.
women who get raped are not sentenced to stoning as you said (lied),rather than they are helped to restore their normal life.
Conditions of stoning:
A person is convicted of zina(Adultery or Fornication) by any one or more of the following ways: The first one is that the zaani (fornicator or adulterer) makes a confession, without going back on their word until they are awarded the punishment. If at some stage they retract their confession, they must not be subjected to any penal punishment. The second way a person can be convicted of zina (Adultery or Fornication) is by four reliable and pious men testifying that they witnessed the sexual act. Each man must testify that he actually saw the male sexual organ inserted into the female’s vagina. This stringent condition is to protect innocent Muslims and to block the road for those who want evil to spread amongst the Muslim society. As for the third way a person may be convicted of adultery, this is when a woman who has neither husband nor master is found pregnant.
In the christian bible it says the same thing.The bible says :
For adultery (including urban rape victims who fail to scream loud enough)
If a damsel that is a virgin be betrothed unto an husband, and a man find her in the city, and lie with her; Then ye shall bring them both out unto the gate of that city, and ye shall stone them with stones that they die; the damsel, because she cried not, being in the city. Deuteronomy 22:23-24
For a woman who is not a virgin on her wedding night
If any man take a wife, and go in unto her, and hate her ... and say, I took this woman, and when I came to her, I found her not a maid: Then shall the father of the damsel, and her mother, take and bring forth the tokens of the damsel's virginity unto the elders of the city in the gate: And the damsel's father shall say ... these are the tokens of my daughter's virginity. And they shall spread the cloth before the elders of the city. ... But if this thing be true, and the tokens of virginity be not found for the damsel: Then they shall bring out the damsel to the door of her father's house, and the men of her city shall stone her with stones that she die. Deuteronomy 22:13-21
It is supposed to refute the stoning argument, there are so many conditions that not one case of adultery has been reported in the early Islamic kingdoms (they actually understood Islam unlike modern leaders of Islamic countries.)
In the christian bible it says the same thing.The bible says :
For adultery (including urban rape victims who fail to scream loud enough)
If a damsel that is a virgin be betrothed unto an husband, and a man find her in the city, and lie with her; Then ye shall bring them both out unto the gate of that city, and ye shall stone them with stones that they die; the damsel, because she cried not, being in the city. Deuteronomy 22:23-24
For a woman who is not a virgin on her wedding night
If any man take a wife, and go in unto her, and hate her ... and say, I took this woman, and when I came to her, I found her not a maid: Then shall the father of the damsel, and her mother, take and bring forth the tokens of the damsel's virginity unto the elders of the city in the gate: And the damsel's father shall say ... these are the tokens of my daughter's virginity. And they shall spread the cloth before the elders of the city. ... But if this thing be true, and the tokens of virginity be not found for the damsel: Then they shall bring out the damsel to the door of her father's house, and the men of her city shall stone her with stones that she die. Deuteronomy 22:13-21
sounds barbaric, but no current Christian culture (that I know of) makes and carries out its laws based on scriptures (thank god), unlike Islamic cultures.
Under the Islamic shariah, a man convicted of having raped a woman, is given capital punishment. Many are astonished at this ‘harsh’ sentence. Some even say that Islam is a ruthless, barbaric religion! I have asked a simple question to hundreds of non-Muslim men. Suppose, God forbid, someone rapes your wife, your mother or your sister. You are made the judge and the rapist is brought in front of you. What punishment would you give him? All of them said they would put him to death. Some went to the extent of saying they would torture him to death. To them I ask, if someone rapes your wife or your mother you want to put him to death. But if the same crime is committed on somebody else’s wife or daughter you say capital punishment is barbaric. Why should there be double standards?
is this the culture that makes out they are a caring peaceful culture..i dont get this feeling when ive watched alot of tv programes on them, and investigations, inside a mosque stated they are awaiting to rule ,take over us. i feel they hate us very much,.do they want us all to convert to islamic ways, that will never happen the british people will not allow it too, wake up england .i feel it is a barbaric culture, women are beneath them, locked away in a cupboard under the stairs. if you live in this country, you respect the rules of the country, and respect the people of that country surely. i will never convert to islamic ways.they scare me, i live in fear in my own country that is not how i should feel.
my wife is wrapped away like a precious jewel where as your wife or daughter or sister are exposed my friend you can take my money but not my wife would you expose your pin number to me no but its ok to check out your daughter is it maybe your mum is hot aswell what do you guys call it milf i think is that how you want women maybe go puchase one at the palour or get a women delivered tell her to come dress as a school girl this is a bad way of life and it is just a small breifing
sorry are you not jumping the gun, i do not believe ive given you details to my culture or religion have i. so how do you know ive not experienced islamic ways....
not that hard because most of the things you say are not true and many of the evil "Islamic ways" are done by extremists. Sharia Law says nothing about global domination, but it does talk about spreading the religion and getting people to know about it (peacefully) also women are not oppressed or not treated unequally, it was before Islam when women were oppressed.
for instance: "Wives have rights corresponding to those which husband have, in equitable reciprocity, through, in certain situations, men would have the final word and they enjoy a preference, Allah is mighty, wise. (2:229)"
“it is the duty of every Muslim man and woman to seek knowledge” (proof that the Taliban are bad muslims because they restrict education for women)
Before Islam, women were nothing but a symbol of sex, but The Koran says that women can choose who they marry. , “o ye who believe! It is not lawful for you to forcibly inherit women”
Another example that the koran does not degrade women is: "Consort with them graciously. If you dislike them, it may be that you dislike something in which Allah has placed much good. (4:20)"
Thus debunking, "i feel it is a barbaric culture, women are beneath them, locked away in a cupboard under the stairs. "
That's all very well, but that's not what we've seen from Islam. It's great your religion has a good mission statement, but that doesn't mean it's members follow through with that. Look at Christianity, for example. The religion and the followers labor under the delusion their mission is to spread the word of Jesus Christ, when in fact the religion suppresses the word of Jesus and it's followers are about as far from following the path of Jesus as possible! It's very clear that the scripture of all religion can be ignored, altered, or interpreted by everyone from high ranking clergy to lowly sinners for their own benefit. So quoting Islamic scripture to try to deny and suppress criticism of Islamic barbarism is pointless.
The goal and point of a baseball team, for example, is to win games. But if they don't, how are we not supposed to blame the team, the players and coaches? Are we supposed to forgive their shitty performance because they are supposed to win? No. We criticize them. It's the same deal here. We have to judge the results of religion, not just the lofty mission statement.
Most of the members follow it well, but there are some crazy lunatics (who God does not love), But it is not pointless to quote Islamic scripture. why? to show that these people are very bad people and just wearing the label "Muslim", does not show that you actually do what Islam tells you to do, therefore, you are not so much of a Muslim, but you know, the amount of Muslims who practice Islam correctly, are more than the extremists and barbaric "Muslims". I was taught that if every Muslim leader knew what Sharia law actually is in detail, the Muslim countries would be very good with very little problems. but I know what you mean and you people need to stop criticizing Islam, from those people that come on television.
And it is always pointless to quote all scripture, one because I've heard it all before, and two because i don't believe the depraved writings of a bunch of desert nomads are true, nor do i find them endearing, nor do i understand why people allow it such influence over modern life. You might as well tell me about your dreams, at least they would be original. Probably.
I dont think anyone is able to do what religion asks to the letter, mainly because it's impossible and we're only human. So given that "true" believers and followers aren't really in any position to criticize, and that there is a huge amount of room left open for interpretation, and given that scripture, and the message preached by the professional parasites who study it has changed numerous occasions in numerous ways, i don't see how you can ostracize all the extremists just because they're insane in a slightly different way than the rest of you. Religion loves to take credit for the good stuff and dump the bad on humanity. You can see that here: people are allowed to interpret scripture and splinter and faction off, but if you make anyone look bad doing so, you get excommunicated.
you people need to stop criticizing Islam, from those people that come on television.
I get my opinion of Islam from what i see and what i research and what i read in their holy text. And it's not a good opinion, let me tell you that. Comparatively, the liberal western media is practically the press office for Islamofascism; they do way more to help it than to hurt it. But here, i claim my right to free speech and freedom from religion. I will criticize Islam as frequently and as rudely and I like, I will demand that its corruption is not allowed to have any sway over my life, and I insist on my right to do this. I will continue to respect your religion as much as it respects me, and i will continue to criticize it for as long as i see it poisoning the planet i live on.
If you don't like it, try packing up and moving to some Islamic country where religious law has made free speech blasphemy, and anyone speaking out against Islam is killed. There's plenty of countries like that to choose from, sadly.
I would not care if you criticize Islam as rudely as you like, all I am saying is that Islamic countries are not all barbaric, I mean look it UAE, it is only 40 years old and it is highly advanced and developed and the people here are friendly. And as I said, most tasfirs were done by the prophet Muhammad himself, if your interpretation does not I agree with that of Muhammad's, your interpretation is no longer considered valid. My dream? To become a scientist in Astrophysics. But you miss my point about true believers, I don't mean pure Muslims, I mean one's that are seriously far off. You don't believe in the Quar'an? Fine. I will not force you to and neither would good Muslims. The verses I have given you before are so obvious that anyone who would say otherwise is beyond an apologist. I have my reasons for choosing this faith too .
People in the UAE don't have freedom of speech or assembly or religious equality. The government detains and tortures its citizens. It's a progressive gem among Islamic countries, but that isn't really saying much.
It seems like far from "most" tafsirs were done by Muhammad, and it seems like vast portions of the Muslims community accept tafsirs done by men other than Muhammad, both past and present. And it seems Muhammad didn't quite address everything in the Quaran, nor do all of his interpretations apply to modern life, probably because he couldn't comprehend modern life. Also, you seem to forget, Muhammad was a man, and the Quaran was written by men. So between the men involved in making this thing and the lack of proper instruction and detail in the man-made explanation, I'd say many lessons it has to teach are still entirely up to interpretation. And when you mix that with bigotry, through-bred insanity, and the wide berth of respect the world for some reason affords religion, you've got a recipe for disaster.
I don't actually need to hear your dream, i meant that the visions you get when you sleep are about as true and grounded in reality as your scripture is.
You don't believe in the Quar'an? Fine. I will not force you to and neither would good Muslims.
Great, glad to hear i still have freedom from religion when it comes to you and other good Muslims, but what about the bad ones? In places where Islam has control (most of them), humanity suffers, as do human rights. And this is why Islamic culture is not admirable, even though, as you pointed out, not all Islamic culture is totally barbaric.
The verses you quoted before are so obvious... what? They promote near equality, I'll give you that much, but you're just quoting more scripture... which is a lie.
OK, for now, you can say they promote near equality, but it is still better than extremists' treatment of women. Actually people do have religious equality over here, if there is a Catholic and a Muslim trying to teach in a school with one position available, the Muslim will not go in so easily. Muhammad was a man, correct. The Qur'an was written by men, that is opinionated because, what's the point of being a Muslim? Muhammad was illiterate and non-Muslims in his time say that Muhammad recited the verses and had others wrote things down for him. Whether he gave the tasfir of the whole Quar'an is up for debate.
It is better than the extremists' treatment of women - if by extremists you mean almost every Islamic government, many prominent religious leaders, large portions of Muslim populations, and Muslims in western countries, allowed to beat and kill members of their own family and get away with it because aggressive Muslim "Human Rights" interest organizations have led us to believe it would be culturally insensitive to do otherwise.
As for the rest of it, not entirely sure what you're trying to say, but it seems to me too many things about religion are up for debate to be using it to form absolutist opinions about things.
I never said the majority of the Muslim population wasn't peaceful, I just listed some walks of life where the religion of peace readily practices violence.
now you no what palestinians feel like where havent white people pushed themselves into someone elses country new zealand is full of idiots like yourself
Cutting off the hand is a serious matter in Islam, it should not be done for just any case of theft. A combination of conditions must be fulfilled before the hand of a thief is cut off. These conditions are as follows:
1- the thief shouldn't be under compulsion or misery, otherwise the punishment is not carried out. Also petty theft is exempt.
2- The thing should have been taken by stealth; if it was not taken by stealth, then the hand should not be cut off, such as when property has been seized by force in front of other people, because in this case the owner of the property could have asked for help to stop the thief.
3- The stolen property should be something of worth, because that which is of no worth has no sanctity, such as musical instruments, wine and pigs.
4- The value of the stolen property should be above a certain limit, which is three Islamic Dirhams or a quarter of an Islamic Dinar, or their equivalent in other currencies.
5- The stolen property should have been taken from a place where it had been put away(a secure place), i.e., a place where people usually put their property, such as a cupboard, for example.
6- The theft itself has to be proven, either by the testimony of two qualified witnesses or by the confession of the thief twice.
7- The person from whom the property was stolen has to ask for it back; if he does not, then (the thief’s) hand does not have to be cut off.
If these conditions are fulfilled, then the hand must be cut off. If this ruling was applied in the societies which are content with man-made laws and which have cast aside the Sharee’ah ( Islamic Law ) of Allaah and replaced it with human laws, this would be the most beneficial treatment for this phenomenon. But the matter is as Allaah Says (what means):
“Then is it the judgement of [the time of] ignorance they desire? But who is better than Allaah in judgement for a people who are certain [in faith].” [Qur'an 5:50]
The Prophet sallallaahu `alayhi wa sallam ( may Allaah exalt his mention ) cursed the thief because he is a corrupt element in society, and if he is left unpunished, his corruption will spread and infect the body of the Ummah (Muslim community).
What indicates that this ruling is definitive is the fact that a Makhzoomi noblewoman (from the tribe of Makhzoom) stole at the time of the Prophet sallallaahu `alayhi wa sallam ( may Allaah exalt his mention ) and Usaamah Ibn Zayd may Allaah be pleased with him wanted to intercede for her. The Prophet sallallaahu `alayhi wa sallam ( may Allaah exalt his mention ) became angry and said:
“Do you intercede concerning one of the Hadd set by Allaah? Those who came before you were destroyed because if a rich man among them stole, they would let him off, but if a lowly person stole, they would carry out the punishment on him. By Allaah, if Faatimah Bint (daughter of) Muhammad were to steal, I would cut off her hand.” [Al-Bukhaari]
in the christian bible it says the same thing. they say to cut of the hands because the hands have committed sin. it is only a matter that Christians do not follow God's laws.
Matthew 5:30And if your right hand causes you to sin, cut it off and throw it away. It is better for you to lose one part of your body than for your whole body to go into hell.
Deuteronomy 25:12then you shall cut off her hand; you shall not show pity.
Mark 9:43"If your hand causes you to stumble, cut it off; it is better for you to enter life crippled, than, having your two hands, to go into hell, into the unquenchable fire,
The fact that you would defend the barbaric practice of chopping off hands would be the most compelling argument for why Islamic Culture is NOT admirable.
And there is (a saving of) life for you in Al-Qisâs (the Law of Equality in punishment), O men of understanding, that you may become Al-Muttaqûn (the pious).
watch the next video and you will find the answer to all your questions.
sorry the video is little bit long, but it really deserves watching.
Dr. Zakir Naik - Is Islam The Solution For Humanity
America is supposed to be one of the most advanced countries in the world. Unfortunately it also has one of the highest rates of crime, theft, and robbery. Suppose the Islamic shariah is implemented in America i.e. every rich person gives Zakat ( 2.5% of his savings in charity above 85 grams of gold every lunar year), and every convicted robber has his or her hands chopped off as a punishment. Will the rate of theft and robbery in America increase, remain same or decrease? Naturally it will decrease. Moreover the existence of such a stringent law would discourage many a potential robber.
I agree that the amount of theft that takes place in the world today is so tremendous that if you chop off the hands of all the thieves, there will be tens of thousands of people whose hands will be chopped off. The point here is that the moment you implement this law the rate of theft will decline immediately. The potential robber would give it a serious thought before jeopardizing his limbs. The mere thought of the punishment itself will discourage majority of the robbers. There will barely be a few who would rob. Hence only a few person’s hands would be chopped off but millions
would live peacefully without fear of being robbed.
Islamic Shariah is therefore practical, and achieves results.
You're supporting Islamic culture with this argument... how?
Nothing in this is comforting and much of it is appalling. For example, as a musician, the only thing i might actually cut a thief's hand off for stealing is my instrument. And here i find it's one of the few things you cant be mutilated for in Islamic culture? Shocking.
You also compare Islamic religious law to Christian religious law, which is a bit like comparing syphilis and gonorrhea. There's some similarities, some differences, but they both suck.
You also seem to be under the impression that this is somehow gods law, that a book that was made and edited by men for the purpose of controlling other men, a book thats only claim to validity is in it's own text, is the word of god. It's not. Its the word of barbarians and savages, with a splash of cannibalism in the Christian mythology. And bravo for the Christians on taking such a huge step forward in no longer adhering the the law of the ancient Judean desert when it comes to mutilating criminals.
Muslims wonder why their culture is criticized as barbaric, and perhaps it is because Muslim culture still rigorously embraces savage, barbaric religious practices the way that Christians and Jews used to in the Dark Ages. Stop defending barbarism by calling it "culture," step into 2012, and i expect you'll find yourself criticized less for it.
I once again feel the need to differentiate between the peaceful, content, every-day sort of Muslims and the Islamofascists that are making a problem of things. However, if we're not expected to lump them together, peaceful, every-day Muslims need to stop letting bloodthirsty Imams speak for them and and stop letting madrasahs teach hatred to their children, because peaceful Muslims are the only thing giving these psychos any sort of credibility. And they need to set themselves apart as Muslims that can peacefully integrate with a host culture, not try to conquer it with blasphemy laws, halal meat, sexism, homophobia, Jew-hatred, human rights commissions, or expectations for special treatment.
And there is (a saving of) life for you in Al-Qisâs (the Law of Equality in punishment), O men of understanding, that you may become Al-Muttaqûn (the pious).
watch the next video and you will find the answer to all your questions.
sorry the video is little bit long, but it really deserves watching.
Dr. Zakir Naik - Is Islam The Solution For Humanity ?
I don't have any questions about Islam. I know a lot more than I'd like to already, frankly. I'm stating an opinion based on things that have happened, are happening today, and will continue to happen so long as we continue to promote religious faith as a virtue. I'm stating an opinion based on the enormous harm your religion has done to this world, and I dont give a damn what your scripture says, I've heard it all before, I think its lies, and it's the same literary nonsense, peaceful, barbaric, or otherwise, that motives bigots, hatemongers, terrorists, and all manner of religious zealots, fanatics, and nutjobs.
I am pleased to hear, as I always am that you interpret your scripture in a peaceful way. That says a lot more about you than it does your scripture. But that doesn't change the fact that people who follow that scripture, who worship the prophet Muhammad, and who have as much right to call themselves Muslims as you do use it to degrade humanity.
And I really do take it on faith that most Muslims are peaceful. Muslims I meet or befriend or debate with often have peaceful views, but I cant imagine why they, as a religious culture, would allow a bunch of hateful barbarians to run their countries, or why they would allow them to go on public media speaking as if they speak for all Muslims.
Islamic culture is so far from admirable it's laughable. Saying it's distinctly inferior to western culture is being way too nice. In countries where Islam has control, women, homosexuals, an generally anyone who isn't a Muslim male with a Koran in one hand and his dick in the other is pretty much screwed. You have women raped and then criminalized for it. Families killing their own members over some twisted since of honor. You have child soldiers and human shields. There's oppression of free speech and democracy. Children are taught from birth to hate Jews or hate America, hatred that has poisoned generations.
And, obviously, when you import Muslims you import Islamic culture, and you can see what a positive impact that's had.
And yes, we are all very well aware that there are peaceful Muslims. And Muslims that are Muslims by choice. That doesn't negate the atrocities of Islamic countries or those of Muslims acting on behalf of their religion.
Everything that is affected by any religion is extremely bad and wrong. If you admire Islamic culture then there must be something wrong with you, mentally I mean.
I don't really have a problem with and you never see protesters going around protesting porn, and there is some justification in not watching porn, such as: not making women look like objects, save marriages and stop porn addiction. That is my opinion as to why I and many other people don't have a problem with watching censoring porn. I think of it as exploitation of the body. And we have to admit that porn increases infidelity
you never see protesters going around protesting porn
That's because you can get around it, even if you're in Iran and places, but that doesn't mean it's not annoying.
not making women look like objects
Porn actresses are not all women.
stop porn addiction
Why is that bad though?
I think of it as exploitation of the body
Even if they love it, they're happy to do it, and they are paid in full? That doesn't sound like exploitation to me.
And we have to admit that porn increases infidelity
Do we really? Whilst I agree that it probably does, I feel you over judge the power of porn over marriages. It is a very powerful tool, but I haven't heard of it breaking up marriages often. Personally, porn has benefited my relationship, both individually, and mutually.
Also, from a liberal perspective, I don't agree with the government blocking people from doing what they want, especially where the debate is much more even sided, than say, LSD, or heroine.
My post was based on a study. That it increses infidelity. Why is porn addiction bad. Any addiction is bad and share one common reason, distraction. I think small Gov. intervention is no bad but it is very easy to cross the limit with Gov. intervention. I don't think of it as taking away porn, i think of it as not giving porn. (opinion)
My post was based on a study. That it increses infidelity.
I haven't seen the study, but I would imagine that it does not prove causation, only correlation (Btw, I'm also not even able to search for this study, as googling anything with 'porn' is blocked ...).
Any addiction is bad and share one common reason, distraction.
Distraction from what? And if distraction is bad, then is the internet not evil?
I think small Gov. intervention is no bad but it is very easy to cross the limit with Gov. intervention.
Telling me what I can and cannot see, restricting my access to the greatest source of information that the world has ever had, simply because the government disagrees with it (no harmful spillover effects to them) is, in my opinion, crossing the limit.
I don't think of it as taking away porn, i think of it as not giving porn.
Having spent 16 years of my life with porn, then coming here, it definitely feels like it's been taken away.
No they don't, they block porn, and many other things, including anything in a google search that has the word 'porn'. Hardly sophisticated (I can't access the link you sent me either).
And I'm not saying it's only correlation, but I'm not saying that you can assume it's causation. As I said, I haven't seen how it was done.
I think that there is far too much work done in the world, that immense harm is caused by the belief that work is virtuous - Bertrand Russel
Why is work good? Why is it better than something else that someone wants to do?
I don't really have a problem with and you never see protesters going around protesting porn
yes i do. Google it.
there is some justification in not watching porn
And there is no justification in censoring it to adults. Sex is a normal human activity.
some justification in not watching porn, such as: not making women look like objects,
These women chose to objectify themselves, as do men. They have every right to make that decision for themselves as consenting adults.
save marriages
No you're right, it's the porn that is to blame, not the fact that something small like porn ruining a relationship meaning it wasn't a strong relationship to begin with. And problems far beyond just porn which ruined 'said relationships.
and stop porn addiction.
Yes, just like making cocaine illegal has stopped cocaine addiction.
And we have to admit that porn increases infidelity
You can get through the block, just use a program (VPN) to reroute your IP to a western server, and it's fine. More just the idea of it that's annoying. And I do, but long distance :(
If our feelings did not follow our reasoning then there will be no differences between us and animals.
Our admiration should not follow just our feelings, but our feelings should be reasoned before you get your final decision of admiration for something.
that is what is called the choice , that choice is what makes you different from other animals.
The fact that you can support the crazy facist ranting's of a human monster like Brigitte Gabriel speaks volumes about you.
In 2007 at the Christians United For Israel annual conference, Gabriel delivered the following speech:
The difference, my friends, between Israel and the Arab world is the difference between civilization and barbarism. It's the difference between good and evil [applause].... this is what we're witnessing in the Arabic world, They have no SOUL !, they are dead set on killing and destruction. And in the name of something they call "Allah" which is very different from the God we believe....[applause] because our God is the God of love
In 2007 at the Christians United For Israel annual conference, Gabriel delivered the following speech:
The difference, my friends, between Israel and the Arab world is the difference between civilization and barbarism. It's the difference between good and evil [applause].... this is what we're witnessing in the Arabic world, They have no SOUL !, they are dead set on killing and destruction. And in the name of something they call "Allah" which is very different from the God we believe....[applause] because our God is the God of love
Sounds like a kook.
And for the record: Arab =/= Muslim
Most Arabs are Muslim but most Muslims are not Arab. Afghanistan, Iran, Turkey, Indonesia and Pakistan are not Arab countries.
I know, Iranian's consider it highly disrespectful to be called Arabs.
Well, yes, Arab is an ethnic group. The dominant ethnic group in Iran is Persian. So yes, if you call a Persian person Arab they are likely to object, regardless of their nationality. Though there are Arab Iranians, they are simply a minority.
how is she facist? This is how I see it: she was raised in that culture, where she was part of the most oppressed groups in the world (being Christian and a woman in an Arab country) she was able to escape, alive, and experienced what it was like to live without the daily fear of death. She unlike you or most people around the world has direct knowledge and experience of the culture of Islam and despite continuing threats on her life she has decided to speak out against it. Whats wrong with that. I think its a much better tactic then flying plains into buildings to get your point across.
I didn't say she was a facist, I called her rantings facistic. She is in fact an opportunistic bigot who is capitalising on popular hatred for Islam in order to stir up racial and religious hatred - thereby increasing her own profile, accumulating personal wealth, and satisfying her pay masters. People as crazy as this are thankfully not given a vioce in Europe. Not that we don't have hate mongers, but our hate mongers would never get away with being as crazy as this mouthpiece. Like Pat Condell, he's from Ireland, you check him out, there was a debate on here just a two weeks or so ago:
"where she was part of the most oppressed groups in the world (being Christian and a woman in an Arab country) she was able to escape, alive, and experienced what it was like to live without the daily fear of death."
This woman is a caricature of a person, she is a shell, her foolishness is beyond comprehension, her good vs. evil is an obvious false dichotomy. She is a pawn and parrot for the powers that be, she uses the mask of an oppressed muslim woman to proliferate her hate, the hate of the establishment. I feel physically sick just looking at her and listening to her speech, how a human could become so twisted and distorted. I would have more respect for her if she was a hate monger for radical Islam.
"She unlike you or most people around the world "
Don't even try to play that card.
"has direct knowledge and experience of the culture of Islam"
I have travelled through Iran for 3 months, please don't lecture me on direct knowledge and experience of Islamic culture.
"espite continuing threats on her life she has decided to speak out against it."
Ya, she's a real hero, pffftt!!!!!!!!!!
"hats wrong with that."
She is a nutjob who is taken seriously only by people with a desire to hate.
"I think its a much better tactic then flying plains into buildings to get your point across."
If you are a muslim.. you should know the statement "there is no complusion in religion" your duty as a muslim is to offer information and spread the word, but not to force anyone.. You cant just tell someone to revert.. theyd look at you like you're retarded.. Why not show others by your deeds, be the best at what you do, show compation, be generous, kind. invite someone of another faith to your house, introduce them to your family. let them see how you live.. Maybe by your good actions, it will peek someones curiosity and they'll start reading up on Islam.. but NEVER by force
I don't think that the Muslim religion is bad, that all people who fallow it are psycho or the Karen evil, what I do think is that the dominate culture and the majority of the people who happen to claim Muslim faith are not admirable. I don't think this of only this particular group, I also don't like the Christian culture (to name one other). I know that there are people who fallow the Christian Faith that are amazingly generous, loving respectful people but the majority are judgmental, controlling hateful hypocrites.
Islam asks for alms of 2.5% of Muslims’ income to care for the needy. As you know, we Latter-day Saints fast for two meals per month, then give a fast offering, for the same purpose.
Muslim culture put a high premium on hospitality. Typical Muslims seem quite eager to give the shirts off their backs–if that is what it takes–to show their guests a good time. It is so important to them, they will feel insulted if they are not permitted to show hospitality.
1. You will be cleaner. No other religion addresses cleanliness than Islam.
2. You get better health arrangements. Islam encourages diet 1/3 of full stomach for food, 1/3 drink & 1/3 breathing air.
3. You are taught self control, even from the simplest basic needs like food and water, you can now get life by the horns, nothing can be ahead of you!
1. You will be cleaner. No other religion addresses cleanliness than Islam.
...you're taking your hygiene advice from a bunch of desert dwelling savages who lived 2000 years ago? And claiming this is somehow superior to the way we do things now?
2. You get better health arrangements. Islam encourages diet 1/3 of full stomach for food, 1/3 drink & 1/3 breathing air.
Perhaps I'm missing something but using 1/3 of your stomach to breath does not sound like a better health arrangement.