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It can be used by LGBT activists, to play the "human rights" card, and push for legalizing incestuous marriage.
They can say something like: "If gays can get married, why can't they marry members of their family? It will hurt nobody, since no children can be born out of this marriage".
Usually, if LGBT can do something like that, it means they will.
But what harm does homosexuality, homosexual incest or heterosexual incest with use of contraceptives do to anyone? I'm not trying to be hostile or anything, I'm just trying to see your point of view.
1. According to surveys, homosexuals are much more promiscuous, as a group, compared to non - homosexuals. The few percent of them who have stable partnerships, represent a statistically insignificant minority.
2. They do some oral things, that make them prone to STD transmission, and contraceptives cannot protect them. That also raises their chances to contract diseases, that are rare for modern society, like staphylococcus and typhoid. The are statistics, I can give you links if you want.
3. Even regardless of disease transmission, the way gays have sex is anti-physiological, and creates major health problems for them.
About incest:
Yes, if condoms are used, heterosexual incest sort of "does not do harm to anyone". But legalizing incestuous marriage, is in my view sliding down a very dangerous slope.
I understand what you're saying. Being a homosexual male myself, I am aware and slightly fearful of the diseases and health complications that come with homosexual intercourse. I will not be participating in much, if any, sexual activities you've named and/or eluded to. This, however, does not mean I do not condone these sexual practices. When done safely, certain "harmful" sexual practices are almost as safe as vaginal sex. Most people who practice these activities take the utmost care in the beforehand preparation. I do not believe that we have to ban these practices, but educate on them. I do believe a lot of the diseases spread through homosexual intercourse is done out of ignorance rather than the acts themselves. We can slow down the spread of these diseases by educating the masses about the dangers and how to safely practice them, because whether we ban it or not, its gonna be done anyway (by both heterosexuals and homosexuals). In fact, because its banned, it makes the sex all the more thrilling, which doesn't help your cause at all. I believe its named somewhere along the lines of "The Romeo and Juliet effect" or something like that.
I do agree on your views on incestuous marriage, though I only discussed sex, and not love unions. I see the complications in homosexual intercourse, but not in gay marriage. Care to share your views on that, as well?
I see the complications in homosexual intercourse, but not in gay marriage.
There are several objections to gay marriage, and they fall in two major categories:
actual state of affairs, and legal context.
The actual state of affairs in countries like Britain and USA, is that only a small percentage of gays have got married, where it has been allowed, and since it has been allowed. I think the figure is no more than 2%. So, the question is: what was the real reason for fighting for gay marriage, not gay civil unions?
That brings us to the next category, legal context.
In countries where law is precedent - based, the LGBT movement has demonstrated its intent on using legal precedents, as bridgeheads to further their agenda. They have a whole army of lawyers supporting them.
The worst things they do is reforming school education, to encompass "education" on LGBT subjects. The logic goes like this: if gay marriage is legal, than the gays lifestyle is just a variant of norm. I think this should not be taught to kids. Leave them alone, they'll make their decision on this, when they're grown up.
Some other "achievements" of the LGBT movement:
- the toilet law, which allows boys into girl's restrooms, and vice versa, at schools.
- forcing a college professor who does not approve of homosexuality, to watch gay porn
- forcing the boy-scouts to accept gay troop leaders
- forcing small hotels to service gays against the owners' faith
- outlawing psychiatrists who aid gays in quitting their lifestyle
- attacks on Christian preachers, for citing the Bible in their churches
- outlawing public citing of statistical data on gay health
- false statements about genetic origins of homosexuality, long since refuted by science, being constantly cited by mass media
I also want to point out that I do not equate the LGBT movement, and gays.
I think the movement is evil, and endorsed by immoral politicians, to be used for their power goals.
Regarding gays, I think (and this is only my opinion), they are a group of lost people, trying to seek refuge in a way of life which is destroying them. They can be helped, but only those of them who want to be helped.
You've got a point. Though I do agree on some of the achievements of the LGBT movement, I do believe they have an agenda. Thank you for not equating the people categorised within a movement, to the actual movement. The movement is very pushy and I do think a number of things they push for have underlying motives. Regarding a few of their achievements, all of the ones you've named do seem for the better of the LGBT community, not so much the movement's agenda.
The toilet law only applies to transsexual persons, I'm assuming. That's fine, since the gender of that person is not their sex. It would cause them psychological damage if they had to use the gender bathroom that they didn't identify with.
I'm not familiar with the forced watching of gay porn incident. Could you educate me more on this?
There will be gay troop leaders regardless of if it is allowed or not. I'm assuming that law just allows openly gay troop leaders. Gay does not equate to paedophile, so I don't see the problem.
I do not agree with forcing hotel owners to service gays, but I'm guessing that came from how tired the LGBT were about not getting services just because of who they love or have intercourse with. I can see the motive was not so evil, but they do need to realise that its their choice because its their business.
Well, I understand outlawing psychiatrists that "deal" with homosexuality. I mean, its not a psychological disorder anymore, right? So why still have those who specialise in "getting rid" of it. I do still believe in choice so I do not agree with this either, unless the psychiatrists are pushing gays to "become" straight.
I completely do not agree with attacking Christian preachers for preaching against gays. Its their own religion and their own sermons based on their own opinions. I don't agree with this, however, I also completely understand. A lot of Christian and former Christian LGBT members have been hurt emotionally, psychologically and sometimes physically by the church. I, myself, have experienced the torment of growing up in a church and being made to go every Sunday to be told how I am going to hell for who I fall in love with and am sexually attracted to. I hated myself for years and tried everything I could possibly think of to "get rid" of my homosexuality. About 3 years of total self hatred and a suicide attempt later, I am absolutely fine with my sexuality. Though I am no longer hurt by the church's teachings, I get over things more easily than most other people I've met. Some people just don't let go of things quickly. So, yeah, that's not so evil either.
The public citing outlawing is another response to hate, so is the statistical lying, though I think that could have some underlying motives.
I believe the LGBT are being led by someone or some people with ulterior motives. The only way to stop these people from manipulating a group of people who are so psychologically and emotionally damaged that they can't see the manipulation is to stop the hate.
I'm disputing, since it's still my stance on this subject.
Now, about those issues you've mentioned:
1. The toilet law (sorry, the name was invented by me, but the law is real), by its nature affects all children, who attend schools were it's applied. Regarding transgender children, I have two remarks:
- I think this phenomena is largely overrated, and at the same time promoted by the said agenda
- this law can also cause psychological damage to non - transgender children, who, as you understand, are the overwhelming majority.
2. Regarding gay troop leaders: your logic is quite good here, even when open gays are banned from becoming troop leaders, there still might be closeted gays among them. But still, their numbers will not be so significant. Regarding gayness and pedophilia, simple maths show that the situation is not so obvious. The facts are, 95% of all assailants are men, and 32% of all victims are boys. Given the fact that about 4% of men are gay, there is a significantly higher rate of pedophilia among gays, than among straights. The counterargument from LGBT has been that man - boy rapists are a separate category from gays, but I think this is really just a desperate form of defense. Also, consider NAMBLA.
I do not agree with forcing hotel owners to service gays, but I'm guessing that came from how tired the LGBT were about not getting services just because of who they love or have intercourse with. I can see the motive was not so evil, but they do need to realize that its their choice because its their business.
It's their business, and their faith. Remember, the legal system is only strong when it's consistent, and according to the constitution of most free countries, people have freedom of faith.
Well, I understand outlawing psychiatrists that "deal" with homosexuality. I mean, its not a psychological disorder anymore, right?
Its psychiatric status was removed by APA, but I think this organization is dubious to say the least. Please check the following links, and try not to pay attention to the sites domain, the information speaks for itself:
I completely do not agree with attacking Christian preachers for preaching against gays. Its their own religion and their own sermons based on their own opinions
Like I've said, it's the integrity of law that makes it strong. There should be no exceptions. People have freedom of faith.
I'm sorry you were psychologically damaged by the church, but from what you wrote I can see it may be a case of bad priesthood. A true Christian should hate the sin, but love the sinner. Saying they're going to hell may not be the best way to help those in need of guidance. A better way is to give a positive example.
The public citing outlawing is another response to hate, so is the statistical lying, though I think that could have some underlying motives.
Freedom of speech should not be restricted, when people speak the truth. Here is an example of statistics:
I believe the LGBT are being led by someone or some people with ulterior motives. The only way to stop these people from manipulating a group of people who are so psychologically and emotionally damaged that they can't see the manipulation is to stop the hate
Are you sure they are psychologically and emotionally damaged, only because of hate? In my country, I did not see much hate towards gays, until they started trying to copy the Western gay agenda.
I think this phenomena is largely overrated, and at the same time promoted by the said agenda
Do you mean transgenderism or the issue of transgenders and bathrooms?
this law can also cause psychological damage to non - transgender children, who, as you understand, are the overwhelming majority.
How so?
The facts are, 95% of all assailants are men, and 32% of all victims are boys. Given the fact that about 4% of men are gay, there is a significantly higher rate of pedophilia among gays, than among straights.
Don't they do background checks on the troop leaders before they hire them? I'm sure a paedophile would have a history of paedophilia before he had the requirements to apply for the job of troop leader. Also, I'm thinking a closeted homosexual would be more likely to be a paedophile than an open homosexual. It gives them more cover if they're not even associated with sexuality toward males. The out homosexuals should be less likely to be a paedophile for this reason, people would expect him to be a paedophile.
Its psychiatric status was removed by APA, but I think this organization is dubious to say the least. Please check the following links, and try not to pay attention to the sites domain, the information speaks for itself:
I do not believe the people who have been "cured" of homosexuality are actually cured. I believe they are basically brain washed into thinking that sexual interactions with the same sex is disgusting and, as a result, try to stay away from it all together. I've read of many stories where these psychiatrists used brainwashing (for lack of a better word) methods to "cure" homosexuals of their homosexuality. It seems its all based on the fact that the human brain can be taught to believe anything, one just has to find out how. Increasing self hatred to the point of total, irreversible disgust seems to be the name of the game, a bit like the catholic church and left handed people. Keep in mind that I've never met someone who's done this procedure and I've never done it myself, though I intend to try just to see how it goes.
Are you sure they are psychologically and emotionally damaged, only because of hate? In my country, I did not see much hate towards gays, until they started trying to copy the Western gay agenda.
I can only speak about what I've seen in my own country. Maybe it is only when they began speaking out that they started receiving clearly visible hate in your country. In my country, homophobia is the norm so its not really viewed as hate or even noticed by those who do not experience it.
"I think this phenomena is largely overrated, and at the same time promoted by the said agenda"
Do you mean transgenderism or the issue of transgenders and bathrooms?
I mean transgenderism among children.
"this law can also cause psychological damage to non - transgender children, who, as you understand, are the overwhelming majority."
How so?
Well, if a boy can walk in to a girls' restroom, when a girl is there, and she is forced to accept this, this can obviously be harmful for the girl. That law says nothing about age (as long as it's under 18), so the age difference can be significant. Of course, the other obvious issue is that this law can, and very likely will be made use of, by sexual predators.
The out homosexuals should be less likely to be a paedophile for this reason, people would expect him to be a paedophile.
I see a different mechanism here: the closeted pedophile might be afraid to be exposed, and given the strict stance of the organization, will most likely be afraid to join. Whereas, if open homosexuals are allowed to be troop leaders, they might be more at ease. There have been facts, when pedophilia among gay couples, who adopted kids, was not investigated seriously by the police for long periods of time, due to fear of being accused of homophobia.
I do not believe the people who have been "cured" of homosexuality are actually cured. I believe they are basically brain washed into thinking that sexual interactions with the same sex is disgusting and, as a result, try to stay away from it all together.
On the contrary, serious psychiatrists who do this kind of counseling, use deep psychoanalysis, to determine the root cause of choosing this lifestyle. usually, it has to do with either one of the parents being a tyrant, or of psychological trauma caused by sexual abuse. This initial problem is then addressed. It's absolutely unprofessional to promote self-hatred in patient - and that concerns all psychiatry, not only the parts used to help gays. What you came across, were charlatans at best.
Maybe it is only when they began speaking out that they started receiving clearly visible hate in your country
I can only speak for myself, and the friends I've had. While it is definitely not seen as the norm, people would still treat gays as human beings, and not be aggressive towards them. I mean normal people, there is plenty of aggressive morons in any country. My personal approach is that I never attack gays for their orientation, but at the same time find it immoral to encourage them.
Actually homosexuality is an expression of people. And as long as that expression do not bring harms to the others, I think we can't just say that it is a bad stuff. I'm straight by the way.
