CreateDebate is a social debate community built around ideas, discussion and democracy.
If this is your first time checking out a debate, here are some quick tips to help get you started:
Arguments with the highest score are displayed first.
Argument replies (both in favor and in opposition) are displayed below the original argument.
To follow along, you may find it helpful to show and hide the replies displayed below each argument.
To vote for an argument, use these icons:
You have the power to cast exactly one vote (either up or down) for each argument.
Once you vote, the icon will become grayed out and the argument's score will change.
Yes, you can change your vote.
Debate scores, side scores and tag scores are automatically calculated by an algorithm that primarily takes argument scores into account.
All scores are updated in real-time.
To learn more about the CreateDebate scoring system, check out the FAQ.
When you are ready to voice your opinion, use the Add Argument button to create an argument.
If you would like to address an existing argument, use the Support and Dispute link within that argument to create a new reply.
You can share this debate in three different ways:
#1
#2
#3
Paste this URL into an email or IM:
Click here to send this debate via your default email application.
Click here to login and CreateDebate will send an email for you.
My theory on mythology
You all say the mind can imagine some crazy things, but can it imagine something we have never seen before, or can it only picture what it has seen? If it is the former, that wouldnt make sense, how can you imagine something you have never come across? Sure we have never seen a floating spaceship shooting lasers in a black hole, but we have seen spaceships, whcih came from birds, we have seen shots fired from guns, we have seen the power of energy, coming from lightning, and we know that there are things with huge gravitational pulls, so we could add those all together and form something we have "never seen" BUT.
If the mind is the latter, then that would make more sense, as primitive cavemen, we would never have seen anything that could even closely resemble god, unless it showed itself to us, we could have never come up with such a complex, such a magnitudal force of being able to do everything, we dont see that today anymore, so what would it have been back then? What could we possibly have witnessed that led us to believe there is a concious, intelligent force behind everything? I highly doubt we just "imagined it up" We must have encountered something of divine nature, that doesnt mean its an angry old man, that is just the human characteristics we gave it, it is not a human thing, its something much greater than us...
Star Wars... Is that pure imagination, or did Ewoks reveal themselves to George Lucas at some point in time? Avatar... Did mystical indians really reveal themselves to James Cameron? Spiderman... Did Stan Lee encounter a web-slinging boy who was the victim of a freak accident? Is it your supposition that everything imagined had at some point revealed itself to those who imagined it?
star wars: we have ancient stories of star people, ewoks resemble bears, we have seen bears and we have seen little people... avatar... we have seen "ancient star people" (the stories are passed down through generations) we also have encountered indians and we went through a period in time which much resembles the story of that movie.... spiderman.... there are stories of mythical heros, and we have seen spiders too, so why not put a hero and a spider together and make a spiderman? yes that is exactly my supposition, all imaginations are a collection of things we have seen before
I don't know of many (read: Any) mainstream Gods that aren't imagined in some form to resemble man or animals, the very things that have been present since the inception of deism.
As for those that aren't; It's human nature from a socio-evolutionary point of view to empathize with fellow beings, this in turn, I posit, leads to inanimate objects being anthropomorphized. Thinking bad weather is 'angry' and the sun's light to be 'benevolent'. It's this kind of thinking that leads to the belief that elements of nature are endowed with spirits, as thought by numerous hunter-gatherer tribes still present in the world today.
I believe this covers all notions of Gods and supernatural beings that have the form of man, animals or formless spirits to be explainable ends of the human psyche and observed qualities of the world.
The Ontological theory doesn't work precisely because there's been no version of god which was new.
Simply saying "something than which nothing greater can exist" does not imply necessarily some experience of this thing. It is exaggeration of our knowledge, one of the tools our imagination uses.
In fact this theory does more to disprove experience of a god than to prove it precisely because the human mind is incapable of pure creation--that we are not capable of making something up from nothing.
Knowing that every single thing we call imagination is just combinations, exaggerations, extensions, dissections, etc of things we've perceived shows for a fact we do not have knowledge of any such being. If experience of said being leads to knowledge as this theory puts forth, it actually proves by the theories own (albeit faulty) foundation that we've never experienced a god.
And while I cannot disprove via this theory all the Zeus's and Apollos and other non-all powerful beings, I can for a certainty disprove the Christian infinite version of god using this popular theory's own rules.
Here's proof god does not exist if we base proof solely on premise your argument is valid:
Imagine infinity and you cannot do it.
Is that absolute proof this particular type of god does not exist?
Of course not because the argument is fundamentally flawed.
It does prove the argument does the opposite of its intent though.
imagining infinity is actually very easy, no beginning or end is alot easier than you would think, this is what the shamans studied, infinite past and infinite future, endless cycles of infinite universes being created forever, infinite possibilities, infinite is something easily graspable, it just seems impossible
No, you described infinity (and only two directions of it when there would be infinite directions of it... and CD nor all of the internet have the capacity for you to describe this in whole). You cannot imagine it. This is a fact of the human condition. You imagining that you are imagining infinity only shows you've never truly tried to grasp the concept of infinite beyond the generic surface... It's impossible I promise you.
no, this is what happens, when you reach the highest conciousness of life, you basically have god conciousness, which is infinity, if you reached this point through living a lifestyle that is required to reach this point, you would experience an eternity in your concious awareness and you realize everything is interconnected through everything, even thoughts and emotions, those form our reality too, they are not physical perceptions, but we can still perceive them, all of this ties into being able to create your personal reality, but our reality collides with everyone elses reality too, and all of our realities determine the state of reality around us, especially with thought and emotion, because these are vibrational measurements and they affect everything, even the particles we havent detected yet and probably wont for a long time, unless you look at it this way:
If a society that is far more advanced than ours and has learned the truths of life, they have learned that science is only a method of explanation, this is detrimental to the advancement of a civilization, you might find this theory interesting http://www.infobarrel.com/Ancient_Egyptians_And_Levitation_Of_Heavy_Stone_Blocks_For_The_Pyramids a society far more advanced than ours knows the secrets to life, all reports of extraterrestrial/interdimensional beings is not too far off, especially when you have the multiverse theory, and quantum mechanics coming about, plus if youve never looked up a white hole http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/White_hole this is interesting as it lends so much credence to the ability to travel through different universes, and the universes within our black holes all have black holes within them that lead to more universes, all with different laws of nature than our own universe, we are just a tiny spec in something, and all of these universes has to have some concious force behind it, some invisible hand at work, and it is not so much controlling this force as it is connecting with it.
White holes are only hypothetical. They have not been observed to actually exist.
Egyptians did not levitate stones to build the pyramids. They had tools that would allow them to build them without magic, just as computers and tall buildings today are built without magic.
Why do you keep saying things with no explanation? You need to show me why what you are saying is true or you should stop believing in it. Why do you not claim the one million dollars?
no, this is what happens, when you reach the highest conciousness of life, you basically have god conciousness, which is infinity, if you reached this point through living a lifestyle that is required to reach this point, you would experience an eternity in your concious awareness and you realize everything is interconnected through everything, even thoughts and emotions, those form our reality too, they are not physical perceptions, but we can still perceive them, all of this ties into being able to create your personal reality, but our reality collides with everyone elses reality too, and all of our realities determine the state of reality around us, especially with thought and emotion, because these are vibrational measurements and they affect everything, even the particles we havent detected yet and probably wont for a long time, unless you look at it this way:
You've proof of none of this. And you've still not described infinity... seriously, not trying to be offensive, do you perhaps have a touch of schizophrenia or some other mental diagnosis which causes these odd tangents and obvious disconnects?
You have cited a wild theory when we know how the Egyptians actually did build the pyramids, and we know that it was not levitation. Like, wtf. Even should the Egyptians have used levitation, it has 0 to do with the first half of your sentence.
a society far more advanced than ours knows the secrets to life, all reports of extraterrestrial/interdimensional beings is not too far off, especially when you have the multiverse theory, and quantum mechanics coming about, plus if youve never looked up a white hole http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/White_hole this is interesting as it lends so much credence to the ability to travel through different universes, and the universes within our black holes all have black holes within them that lead to more universes, all with different laws of nature than our own universe, we are just a tiny spec in something, and all of these universes has to have some concious force behind it, some invisible hand at work, and it is not so much controlling this force as it is connecting with it.
Why are your sentences so long?
Again, a theory that's not been proven and of which there is no proof, and one which happens to not support the rest of your argument even in the slightest.
1. As far as we know we are the most advanced civilization. There could be civilizations on other planets more advanced of course, given the sheer size of the Universe, but we have no proof of this. 2. As for this planet, we right now are the most advanced this floating rock has been inhabited by. This we know.
no it actually has a lot to do, a society far more advanced than our, say even 10,000 years advanced than our has probably utilized the power of the mind seeing as how its the most powerful thing we know, and the ancients knew this and they used it to help them build, we have lost the power of our mind
I doubt you have ever done infinitesimal calculus in your life.
Infinity is not quite so easy to imagine, and is in fact impossible simply because you lack the brain cells. Not an insult because unless you have infinite brain cells, you cannot imagine infinity. Perhaps the concept of it, but really, it is a very large and rather useless number. Most things in reality are not infinite, except perhaps how stupid people can be.
im not talking mathematics here, thats just the numbers behind the reality, im talking about the nature of reality, not the data of it, i dont care much for data so much as i care for the technique
But there are no numbers behind reality. Numbers are invented by humans. That's why some primitive cultures that exist today have number systems that only reach up to 7 or so. 1,2,3,4,5,6,7,a few, a lot, really a lot, infinite. And that's the best they can do.
Math is not real, except for counting. Otherwise it is an invention of man, and only some cultures do it as well as we do, with our complex mathematics and whatnot.
The nature of reality appears to be much different than what you think it is. Perhaps you are wrong about some things?
thats why im not talking about mathematics here, math has nothing to do with what we experience in our daily lives (well it does, in some ways) but if i want to go travel and connect with nature i dont need math to do that, the nature of reality is what we make it out to be
No, it really doesn't? You are still trying to say that egyptians lifted stone blocks with sound, rather than with lifts and mundane tools. That doesn't make sense. How can you know this? There is no way to know, except by looking at the pyramids. It appears they were built with mundane tools. Not sound and magic.
Why don't you build a machine that emits sound at a certain wavelength required to lift compact solids that weigh more than 50 pounds? Then I'll believe you once I see it.
do you know the story of jericho? they marched around the city for 7 days chanting, and on the 7th day they chanted and did a really loud shout and the walls crumbled, and also you have to realzie back then these people were extremely connected to the divine, and what happens during meditation? you hear extremely loud vibrations, plus back then they had beautiful singing voices, which might have been able to move the stones, im not saying they levitated them in the air and moved them magically through the air, thats ridiculous, im saying they used sound to help move the blocks
I don't think it actually happened though, like most of the bible. It's just a tale to show how powerful god is so that people believe in the bible, and thus follow the rules so that people in charge can make money off it and control people while feeling righteous.
It's not like it actually happened. Perhaps it was a metaphor. Back in those days, a popular way to defeat an enemy was to starve him to death. Surround the castle and don't let any food or supplies in. Catapult corpses inside to spread disease and fear.
Then the "walls collapse" once the people inside lose hope and are weak with hunger and the enemy can march in and kill everyone.
I doubt the walls actually fell though, at least not how you describe.
Yeah, you know..., once I was in a crowded elevator and I was able to move everyone out of the elevator simply through the vibrations created by my massive fart ;)
