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Debate Info

50
44
Moral Immoral
Debate Score:94
Arguments:76
Total Votes:99
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 Moral (38)
 
 Immoral (32)

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AveSatanas(4426) pic



Satanism: Moral vs Immoral.

Let's see who's ignorant. Is Satanism evil or immoral? Do people generally know alot about this religion? Would you consider practicing it in one form or another? Post your thoughts.

Moral

Side Score: 50
VS.

Immoral

Side Score: 44
4 points

Satan taught humans to think for themselves; and not to half-live in mindless obedience under God.

And in the bible, God had killed 2,476,633 people.

Satan killed only 10.

Side: Moral
dkforizzle(175) Disputed
2 points

Lets assume that both entities exist. Since youre using the bible as valid proof of your argument i will also use it. In the bible God is the embodiment of absolute good. Everything he did was moral whether you like it or not, because the Christian God can only do good and even if you interpret good differently t doesnt matter because he is omniscient and knows what you do not. Since satan is his enemy it means that he stands for the complete opposite, which is not perfectly moral because that is what God is.

Side: Immoral
2 points

That is what they think and what the bible teaches yes. Though its clear to anyone outside the religion looking objectively at it with a modern sense of morality that it is fucked up and hypocritical.

Side: Immoral
Facadeon(510) Clarified
1 point

God had already defined morality in his own laws/commandments, such as "do unto others as you would do unto yourself" but he murders 2 million people, many of which were innocent; including the 42 youths who just called someone a baldhead and got serious bear treatment, which shouldn't be moral in anyone's perspective.

Anyway, Satan gave people the gift of knowledge, while god got pissed, as he prefers blind faith.

God inspired men to create the Bible, a book responsible for many many more deaths, such as the stoning your children for swearing, which was practiced back then. Satan also never talked bad things about god, but god damned Satan.

Not to mention, God, the person of all goodness, had created the most evil place in the world; hell.

So God is responsible for the eternal suffering of many people to this day. Everyone in there doesn't even deserve to face that eternal punishment, since sinning is a tiny thing compared to an infinity of the worst suffering possible.

Side: Moral
Doherty95(299) Clarified
1 point

So you're saying God (Yahweh) is morally perfect? If you read the Old Testament, you will see that is not the case to quote Dawkins

“The God of the Old Testament is arguably the most unpleasant character in all fiction: jealous and proud of it; a petty, unjust, unforgiving control-freak; a vindictive, bloodthirsty ethnic cleanser; a misogynistic, homophobic, racist, infanticidal, genocidal, filicidal, pestilential, megalomaniacal, sadomasochistic, capriciously malevolent bully.”

If you read the old testament you would see this, and yet you still call him good?

And i am not saying that Satanism is moral, but i had to respond to this statement.

Side: Moral
SovietSpy(709) Disputed
1 point

I am wondering who is the ten that Satan killed? Can you please tell me that?

Side: Immoral
AveSatanas(4426) Clarified
2 points

In the story of Job Satan makes a deal with God saying basically "No balls, you wont let me test Job's faith to you,". So god says ok, and allows (because satan can do anything without permission) satan to torment job and test his faith. If job fails then satan was allowed to kill him and his family. Well long story short he failed and satan killed 10 of his family along with him. So it was really still god who killed them. Like, did the gun commit the murder or the person shooting it? Satan was just a tool. This story is also a brainwashing tool because it basically drills into the reader to NEVER lose faith because you will die or worse. Real great god huh? Totally lookin out for his followers.

Side: Moral
1 point

Most types of Satanism seem to be on the moral side of things. It's really only the cliche-usually-teen-rebel satanism that isn't, or the really darker-sinister types of Satanism that I can never find information on.

Side: Moral
1 point

It's just rebellion. Rebellion in and of itself is neither moral nor immoral. Actions are what makes something moral and satanists seem no more or less inclined toward immoral actions than other religions are the non-religious.

Side: Moral
AveSatanas(4426) Disputed
2 points

Rebellion only discribes the angst teen fake Christian satanism. There are other independent forms. None of which promote doing evil in any way. If they did I'm sure there wouldve been satanist wars. Also you don't see a satanist pushing their beliefs onto others, especially Christians, publicly.

For example, a christian always feels like it's their duty to go up to a satanist and ask them all kinds of questions and "save" them. Or say shit like "I'll pray for you". You don't see satanists doing that.

Side: Immoral
iamdavidh(4856) Disputed
1 point

I did not say rebellion was wrong.

It is rebellion though. All forms of it are. It is the following of a deity in opposition to... fill in the blank.

Satan is a symbol of opposition. Sometimes in what I'd describe as a very human and good way, and in the sense you are talking about, the classic teen rebellion, often in a self-destructive way. Still rebellion though no matter what it is.

Side: Moral

Please correct me if I am wrong. The Satanism being discussed is Atheistic Satanism, am I right?

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Let's just pretend that I am.

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Personally, I love this form of Satanism. If I were going to be an Atheist, I would belong to the Church of Satan, as founded by Anton LaVey. I have read his Bible and found it delightfully enlightening. Believe it or not, many of my philosophies have been inspired by the Satanic Bible.

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The Satanic Bible should not be confused with the Satanic Verses, (which I haven't read.) The Satanic Verses was taken off of the shelves before I could read it. However, from what I've heard about it, it's pretty nasty and offensive. It is thought the Muslims killed the author of that book because of his offensiveness.

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Back to the Satanic Bible.

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Anton LaVey was an eccentric dude that had wisdom beyond what I would have expected from an average asshole. He didn't like Christians because of their hypocritical behavior. You know, the kind that says that Jesus saves us, but we must be slaves for the rest of eternity? Like, yeah, for Jesus!!

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The question is: Moral vs Immoral?

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My Answer is Moral

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Someone else asked me "Wasn't it odd that information that was supposedly from God was on par or slightly above what everyone else was doing?"

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No. God is within. The Kingdom of God is Within. God is inside everyone as the Living Truth, that makes them live. Everyone gets their shit from God, more or less.

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The Reason Satanism is Moral is because it about selfishness. True selfishness is a valid path to God. The desires that come up from within our subconsciousness are from God, give or takes some twisting, confusing, and messed-up-ness.

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All life is one. Deep inside of our selves is the same core and code that is in everyone else. Also, in a mystic and conscious way, all consciousness ties into a central consciousness. Whether we like it or not, we are all human. That core, is also the core of all living things. In a sense, this is a God. The personalities stretched around this multi-faceted core think of themselves as 'individuals' but they are not. We are all one.

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As a spiritual one, such as myself, digs deeper and deep into my consciousness in my effort to find God, I begin to realize how connected everything is. I realize, if I hurt one person, then within my subconsciousness, I feel the pain. This is how we feel compassion and empathy. When one is hurt, we are all hurt.

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The difference is how "disconnected" are we from our inner self? If we hurt others, but deny the pain we feel, then we will not feel compassion. If we indulge in things that are harmful to ourselves and to others, we are disconnected from our "self." The beauty of this system is, however, the more you deny yourself, the more dysfunctional and painful your life becomes.

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A person CAN find his/her way to God in the Church of Satan, if they don't become assholes and deny the hurt they might cause others. Truth selfish and truth indulgence of the desires of the heart will lead a person into the glory and grace of heaven and God. The desires of the heart are real. What is heaven if you must give up what you want? What is salvation if you must abandon all that you found joy in?

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The Catch 22 of this system is that stupid things, such as drinking, whoring, stealing, and such may sometimes seem like what you want to do. However, you are not truly individual. Behaviors that damages your body, or others, will appear as pain in your life. You might as well find pleasure in shoving bamboo slivers under your fingernails.

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When the Satanist realizes his/her part in the wholeness of life, selfishness and indulgence are perfectly moral.

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What Satanists and Christians may not realize is, they are both after the same thing. One method is seeking Power by finding the Source, the other method is finding power by finding the Self. Funny part is . . . . . . , Self and Source the same thing.

Side: Moral
1 point

From what I've researched, most Satanists are more moral than the avreage Christian. Satanism does not teach hate or discrimination, and encourages people to find a path more suited to themselves instead of mass conformity.

Side: Moral
2 points

Honestly, Satanism IS EVIL. Evil is immoral. Enough said.

Side: Immoral
AveSatanas(4426) Disputed
3 points

Due tell. What satanism are you talking about? Theistic satanism? Or atheistic satanic philosophy? Or maybe Laveyan satanism? What about Christian satanism? Oh you mean you had no idea there's more to it than your one sided beliefs? Oh darn how awkward. But seriously do some research. Satanism has nothing to do with your warped religion and is quite more fitting to a modern universal morality and society than Christianity ever was or will be.

Side: Moral
LordChallen(184) Disputed
4 points

This is silly but what the hell, I'm in.

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First, you are very immoral with your intent here. You have a definition of Satan that most Christians don't know about or understand. You set this up as a trap to ridicule and belittle those trying to make debate. If you came into my house started bitching out Jesus, and hating on him, I would be offended and ask you stop. Then let's say you start up and again and I get really offended and I'm about to kick you out of my house and say, "Hey, what's the big deal, I'm talking about the asshole Mexican named Jesus" I'd be pissed. You would have been intentionally upsetting me and then pretend that I was the one in the wrong.

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That is what you are doing here. You are intentionally upsetting people and then calling them stupid, and getting defensive then you call Satan a loser. You have been very verbal in your attacks against Christianity. So my question is: Is your brand of Satanism Anti-Christ? You say that your brand of Satanism has nothing to do with Christianity, and yet, you seem very angry about it.

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I have studied Satanism fairly extensively for the past 25 years. Satan is more or less, strictly Christian. Lucifer on the hand has roots in several cultures in dependent of Christians. Though Vatican tried to demonize any deity that wasn't their, Lucifer plays the same role as Christ in many cultures. He's not a rebel, so much, and yet, maybe a little. He was trying to help but God and the Humanity. Lucifer had nothing against anyone. His mission was pure love, for everyone and everybody.

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But there is nothing in your behavior make my think that you are talking about the Lucifer. All words have their roots, and Satan does have roots in Sanskrit, but that does not mean that is where the idea of Satan came from. Satan was practically a nobody. Krishna is the great god of the Sanskrit and Hindu and those gods were always killing each other. I don't get it, but I respect it.

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Satanism, though the channels of European heritage has always meant evil. I won't get into why.

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In the mid 1960 some dude in California founded the Church of Satan. I read his book and found it very enlightening. I don't know what has happened since, but he made very clear that he didn't actually believe in Satan, he was just didn't like Christians and he liked "stimulation." He would dress up like the devil and go out into public and everyone would freak out. He was sort of weird though. He felt cheated that he stimulated others, but they would not stimulate him. He like women wetting themselves, really got him off.

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But he had some very good insights that I have held onto over the years. But again, he wasn't really into the Devil. Just weird.

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Point is: Don't put the name Jesus and Satan in the same context and the act shocked when people misunderstand.

Side: Immoral
kozlov(1753) Disputed
1 point

There is no need to call my religion warped. I warship God, I do not follow any set Christian sect. And I was grouping all Satanic religions into one big basket. Now you say you are a Satanist, so QED, you would be a moral person. However, you are insulting me as we speak. So you are either a very poor Satanist, or Satanism is immoral.

Now now, yes some Christians are also immoral, but that is because they are not true Christians/believers.

I would presume Satanists believe in supernatural things, you would believe in creationism etc. So you would also believe in hell. Do you worry about going there? Do you have a moral code?

Remember the essence of Evil, it is immoral.

Side: Immoral
Sitara(11088) Disputed
1 point

There is no such thing as Christian Satanism. The two are opposed.

Side: Immoral
LordChallen(184) Disputed
1 point

kozlov,

Don't be sucked by these pricks.

One of the driving forces for founding the Church of Satan was to scare Christians.

The Church of Satan is really just atheism with a philosophy. I actually like it. It's very insightful.

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The name Satan is associated with Evil. But the Church of Satan doesn't even believe in Satan. That is why some of prick keep acting like we are stupid.

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And just to plug for myself.

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Evil isn't as mysterious as people think. It is not part of what people call "duality." (Good/Evil) It is much more "linear" then that.

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God is all knowing. This means that God feels everything, everyone's pain, suffering, joy, laughter, etc. As we get closer to God, we too become more aware of what other's feel. This is how God knows what is in our hearts and how a true man of God can know what is in your heart.

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Evil can be explained by a play on world.

E-Vil = Energy Veil

De-Vil = De`Energy Veil.

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Technically, there is only one truth in the universe. God, the All Knowing. Through no lack of effort, God created the heavens and earth as part of a structured and layered illusion so that he could create personality for His Awesomeness. Everything else is illusion. You may have even heard it, "Life is an illusion."

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Evil is denial. When we hurt people, or we feel defensive, we build walls to hold back the pain. The more walls we build, the more "evil" we become. This is called "evil" because we lose the sense of connection to people and life. The lack of connections allows us to hurt without regret.

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Just because we don't feel the regret now, it is stored in the subconscious. Eventually, it will have to be faced. When this happens, the best word for it is "hell."

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The word "damn" is really the same thing as the word "dammed." It means to the stop the flow. In this case, it means to stop the flow of consciousness. This is same inflected. People stopped the flow of consciousness because they don't want to know. They become stuck.

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If one respects and understands the true nature of Self, this version of Satanism isn't evil. To really understand God, you will realize that God is Love. This means that God. . . . loves Stuff. He wants it. He gets it. God is Selfish. The good side of that is that God is all of creation, so good for us.

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When realize what we "truly want" we might be surprised that it serves others as well. Maybe we like to sing, teach, adventure, or stuff. Whatever our true desire is, somehow, it will be what the world needs.

Side: Moral
1 point

I don't understand it and it makes me feel afraid, so I think it's bad and evil.

It's immoral. Even though most satanists are normal people with jobs and even children, I will still look down on them for mocking whichever god they don't believe in.

Side: Immoral

You're joking, right . . . . ?

Side: Immoral
2 points

OBVIOUSLY. Holy crap.

I guess if people like Srom didn't use this site you'd just realize I was joking right away, but there actually are a lot of very very stupid people in the world...

Side: Immoral
Omnesiah(165) Disputed
1 point

Maybe you should do some research instead of being one of the ignorant oblivious people in the world.

I don't understand it and it makes me feel afraid, so I think it's bad and evil.

Do you understand exactly how your phone works? do you know exactly how your alive? no. Do you fear those? no. Grow up, and seriously look around before you dismiss it.

Even though most satanists are normal people with jobs and even children, I will still look down on them for mocking whichever god they don't believe in.

That statement is just completely wrong. Yes they do live normal fulfilled life's, and they don't mock any other religion any more than Christianity. They actually are an older religion with a better belief system that doesn't blindly follow the word of one being. Their philosophy tells them to think for themselves. Also if you look down on someone because of their religious beliefs than you don't deserve the respect as a person. Feel free to argue with them, but respect their beliefs.

Side: Moral
1 point

Well seeing as satanic cults are often associated with human sacrifice, ritualistic tourtière, and canabalism I'm going to say immoral

Side: Immoral
AveSatanas(4426) Disputed
1 point

Any examples of these besides in hollywood films? No? What a shame.

The "Satanism" you speak of is extremely rare. Like EXTREMELY rare. And it is probably more pertaining to the person or person's unstable psyche than actual satanic beliefs. I havent found a site nor book that tells people to do this that any modern day person could take seriously.

As far as ritual sacrifice, id like to point you to Leviticus 1.

Ive said it a million times but clearly you arent the best listener. Real satanism doesnt practice these things. It is independent of christianity. It comes in two forms: Atheistic and theistic. Both sides have a moral code, philosophy, ect, which are suited BETTER to modern day society than traditional christianity.

Side: Moral
warrior(1854) Disputed
1 point

I read about real life instances where these things happened. I read about them in a book about cults.

Side: Immoral

People should stop thinking about this idiotic creature and concentrate on the beauty of this world.

Side: Immoral