CreateDebate is a social debate community built around ideas, discussion and democracy.
If this is your first time checking out a debate, here are some quick tips to help get you started:
Arguments with the highest score are displayed first.
Argument replies (both in favor and in opposition) are displayed below the original argument.
To follow along, you may find it helpful to show and hide the replies displayed below each argument.
To vote for an argument, use these icons:
You have the power to cast exactly one vote (either up or down) for each argument.
Once you vote, the icon will become grayed out and the argument's score will change.
Yes, you can change your vote.
Debate scores, side scores and tag scores are automatically calculated by an algorithm that primarily takes argument scores into account.
All scores are updated in real-time.
To learn more about the CreateDebate scoring system, check out the FAQ.
When you are ready to voice your opinion, use the Add Argument button to create an argument.
If you would like to address an existing argument, use the Support and Dispute link within that argument to create a new reply.
To be part of a community of the like minded. This community allows members to recognize Obvious Common Sense. Common Sense is realizing fact. We all may have opinions- however a fact is. Evidence is reliable. Science cannot lie.
The fact that you're asking this question means you already have. Yes you should, join the 21st century. Throw all the fairytales away and join the intelligent community of rational thinking and progress.
That's pathetic. Just believing in god to double down "just in case" is wrong and according to christians won't get you to heaven. You can't make yourself believe and the rational thing to do is NOT to believe. This is a perfect example of the scare tactic of hell being used to manipulate people. All evidence points to Christianity being false. There's no REASON to believe in this god and therefore no REASON to believe in hell. I pity those who blindly follow that stupid religion out of fear.
DISPUTE IT YOU STUPID MOTHER FUCKER. Seriously every fucking time some christian cries over my statements and doesnt back it up! SHOW ME WHAT EVIDENCE YOU HAVE. I have science, i have archeological record, i have logic and reason, i have historical evidence (or lack there of). What do you have? A 2000 year old book? Why do YOU bother whining about everything without backing it up!
How many times will christians/theists use Pascal's Wager!?
If God is a benevolent being, he will judge you on your merits. Feeding the poor, donating to charity, among other humanitarian efforts, are all more noble deeds than simple belief in God. The acts I referenced all have a direct positive impact on the world. If Gold is benevolent, why would he send someone who does good deeds to hell simply for not believing in Him?
No, if God is real and benevolent, he will judge you on your good deeds. Not on something as superficial and inconsequential as "belief" in him. Belief in God is therefore irrelevant at this point. Go out and do good deeds out of the kindness of your heart, not because God said it's the right thing to do.
The fact that this god needs to be so dearly worshipped and given full attention only makes it more obvious that it is a creation of man. Honestly if more people were educated on what real satanism is i think there would be a huge upswing in satanists.
You equate me not believing/listening to God as being equal to this situation. God is almost certainly non existent. My wife (I don't have one) does exist, she is a real human being that is living.
Of course I can. Why would God allow someone who has committed rape, murder, etc into heaven so long as he genuinely regrets his sins? But if we have a person who does good deeds throughout his life, but lacks belief in god, God will send him to hell for not believing. God sounds jealous that this mere human chose not to believe in him.
Why would God allow someone who has committed rape, murder, etc into heaven so long as he genuinely regrets his sins
God doesn't allow people who murder, and rape into the heaven if you ask God for forgiveness and don't do it ever again then you would get into heaven but if you keep doing it over and over again yes you would go go the hell.
But if we have a person who does good deeds throughout his life, but lacks belief in god, God will send him to hell for not believing. God sounds jealous that this mere human chose not to believe in him.
You can't get into heaven by doing good deeds you have to earn it by believing in Him and doing what it says in the Bible and life like Jesus did.
God isn't jealous he just wants everyone to go to heaven.
God doesn't allow people who murder, and rape into the heaven if you ask God for forgiveness and don't do it ever again then you would get into heaven but if you keep doing it over and over again yes you would go go the hell.
This is absurd! So people who murder, rape, etc, then ask God for forgiveness of their sins and never do those bad things again, get to go to Heaven? But someone who has never done those wicked crimes, and does lots of charity, feeding the sick, etc, who lacks belief in God will go to Hell? How is this fair judgment? Clearly the former group of people have done more to make the world a worse place then the latter group.
You can't get into heaven by doing good deeds you have to earn it by believing in Him and doing what it says in the Bible and life like Jesus did.
Why is belief in God more "good" than doing good deeds? Which of those things makes the world a better place? Good deeds make the world a better place, belief in god alone does not.
Christians also suck at common sense. Atheism is not some community full of devil worshiping whores who murder and lie all day. In fact, most Atheists still do follow the values put in place by the bible, because they honestly are good morals to live by. Fact is, we don't need a god to explain the existence of life or the universe anymore.
Common sense is NOT that a magical man in the sky was just there and not only did he create the entire earth, not only did he magically put two people on this earth, not only did he magically create the sun and other stars, and not on only did he create Heaven and Hell, but he did this in six days. That is NOT common sense and that IS what the bible says.
It never meant to imply i believed someone was claiming that here, I have heard people who believe that this is the case, i was just clarifying.
People must have done some serious misreading if they believe the bible teaches hate! Haha.
It is fact that we do not NEED a god tot explain the existence of the universe. I never said anything about believing; people can believe whatever they want. I only stated it was not needed to explain life or the existence of the universe.
Common sense is NOT that a magical man in the sky was just there and not only did he create the entire earth, not only did he magically put two people on this earth, not only did he magically create the sun and other stars, and not on only did he create Heaven and Hell, but he did this in six days. That is NOT common sense and that IS what the bible says.
I would argue that is common sense. I think you're mistaking what science says with common sense. Even Richard Dawkins contests that to a person of average intelligence, its reasonable to look around at the Earth's life and complexity and believe there is a designer. However, modern scientific research has gone against this for the most part. Besides, you never defined common sense for me. I want to know what exactly your basis is before you make further claims regarding common sense.
It never meant to imply i believed someone was claiming that here, I have heard people who believe that this is the case, i was just clarifying.
Well, I don't know who you hang around with, but no one I know or have heard of believes this.
People must have done some serious misreading if they believe the bible teaches hate! Haha.
Agreed! I actually really appreciate you saying that.
It is fact that we do not NEED a god tot explain the existence of the universe.
Alright, sure. But that doesn't falsify it.
I only stated it was not needed to explain life or the existence of the universe.
I assume you meant to stick in an 'accurately' somewhere in there.
the reason why atheists attack religion is because religion is holding humanity back. We would be so far ahead if it wasn't for the christian period in the middle ages. Also religion starts much more conflict then the atheist v christian one. Homophobia, attacks on other religions, general ignorance and non acceptance, and claims that i will go to hell if i don't believe. At the end of the day it is completely justified for one to despise religion however i do believe focusing on ones own beliefs is more important than focusing on others.
"the reason why atheists attack religion is because religion is holding humanity back."
An atheistic delusion.
"We would be so far ahead if it wasn't for the christian period in the middle ages."
If it wasn't for the Church developing universities and continuing progress in science, there wouldn't have been any advances in the Middle Ages in Europe.
"Homophobia, attacks on other religions, general ignorance and non acceptance, and claims that i will go to hell if i don't believe."
Islamaphobia, attacks on religions, general ignorance and stereotypes claim that I no nothing about science because I'm a Christian.
We would be so far ahead if it wasn't for the christian period in the middle ages.
Eh, religion's role is kinda overplayed in that. It was partially responsible, but when something as dominant as the Roman Empire collapses, shit goes tits up, regardless of what God you believe in.
Also religion starts much more conflict then the atheist v christian one. Homophobia, attacks on other religions, general ignorance and non acceptance,
Since when were they exclusively religious conflicts?
At the end of the day it is completely justified for one to despise religion however i do believe focusing on ones own beliefs is more important than focusing on others.
There can be no justification for despising an unprovable concept that is most likely false, and can't hurt anyone.
Why would everything go tits up when rome fell? england and france got their shit organized and easily could have continued with scientific discoveries but didn't. about the "exclusively religious issues statement" Im not saying they were exclusively religious but without the religious conflicts many wars wouldn't happen. I can despise the catholic church and it is justifiable. Wars, they've raped kids, I'm constantly told I will go to hell, and i have to take a boring as fak religion course at my school. IT IS HURTING ME MAN! my uncle is gay and my christian great uncle won't accept him as his son! its not fair its a border line cult, its beliefs are very primitive and farfetched, and it plays a large negative role in my life.
Why would everything go tits up when rome fell? england and france got their shit organized and easily could have continued with scientific discoveries but didn't.
The Western Roman Empire was unimaginably important. England and France were part of the Roman Empire, and were tied to its culture, just like most of the civilized world at the time. Its collapse brought about the dark ages, the Catholics made it a little worse, but blaming religion is akin to complaining about a slight itch on your face when your leg gets blown off.
Im not saying they were exclusively religious but without the religious conflicts many wars wouldn't happen.
Very few wars were truly religious in nature, as a ratio compared to all wars in history.
I can despise the catholic church and it is justifiable.
Ah, you've changed your position. You originally said you hated religion, which is irrational (well, all hate is irrational to me, but for the sake of debate). Now you say you hate the Catholic Church, which is a religious body of people. I can see how the average person would justify hatred towards people.
Wars,
Not in the last 800 years.
they've raped kids
Please show me the line in the Bible when Catholics are asked to rape kids. Else you must accept that this is not a fault of religion, it's a fault of letting creepy old men spend 95% of their time around children.
I'm constantly told I will go to hell,
Why care? If you don't believe it, the words are meaningless.
and i have to take a boring as fak religion course at my school.
So hate your schooling system, not religion.
IT IS HURTING ME MAN! my uncle is gay and my christian great uncle won't accept him as his son
People are hurting you, people are not accepting your uncle. Not religion. Just tell your great uncle to read the new testament, it abolishes Levitical law.
its not fair its a border line cult, its beliefs are very primitive and farfetched, and it plays a large negative role in my life.
2 out of those 3 are correct. But, staying with the theme of my post, religion is not playing a negative role in your life. People are.
You take a gun away from a murderer, you've still got a crazy son of a bitch. You take religion away from a bigot, you've still got a senile, racist old coot.
Atheisms have no faith, why would you want to go through life feeling a sense of emptiness? boggles my mind, im not saying join a religion but dont just lose your faith...
A feeling of emptiness? Hah! That couldn't be further for the truth. I can't speak for all atheists, but whenever I'm outside and observing the beauty of the natural world, it's like I get an emotional high. May seem silly, but it's the truth.
a feeling of emptiness as you dont believe in an afterlife, you believe you just die and thats it, thats pretty empty if you ask me. And theres nothing silly about an emotional high, thats your soul saying it wants more!
When you do not believe in an afterlife, you have so much more reason to appreciate what you have now in the life you are living.
Appreciating nature and finding beauty in the world absent theology is not the soul saying it wants more. Bypassing my view that the soul does not exist, I do not think enjoying life is a sign of wanting more. Rather the opposite, I think it indicates that you have found something in the present worth living and loving for.
Conversely, it strikes me that those who believe in an afterlife are the ones still searching for meaning in this life. Needing to believe in a cosmic or higher purpose, needing to feel significant... instead of simply being.
I do simply "be", when you do not believe in an afterlife, which my view of the afterlife allows me to appreciate what i have here, this experience im goin through, not believing in an afterlife would make less sense to have more reason because you wont remember it when you die so...?
An interesting thought, and admittedly not one I have actually come across before. To me, that still does not seem like living for now though. If your reason for appreciating what you have now is because you will be able to appreciate it later, it seems to me that the grounds for your appreciation is still based upon a tomorrow yet to come. For me personally, it is more than adequate to carry my memories with me and live as fully as I can in the time I am alive. If I were to live a day knowing I would never remember it afterwards, then I would still enjoy it in the present because it has a value in and of itself. It would not cease to have meaning.
I will also share that I do believe that our attitude towards life and our disposition towards people is something that we pass on through our interaction with others. I do not believe in a life after death for myself and nor do I believe in the soul, but I think that not all of us is completely lost when we die insofar as others carry the impression we made upon them. The differences we make can be small or they can be large, but they are made nevertheless.
You are correct that atheists do not believe in any sort of "life after death." However, just becuase I don't believe it doesn't exist doesn't mean I don't want it to.
Death is a... terrifying prospect to me. The fact I will no longer exist after I die terrifies the shit out of me. I know I won't be aware of it, but still...
Oh, and it's not because of my soul. I find the natural universe to be fascinating. Religion kinda takes that away...
well fear is a poweful tool, keeps us at a low vibration, and in a physical state, i dont fear death, i dont fear much at all, i try to outpoor as much positivity as i can, i realize that i may just be a crazy insane schizophrenic developing a severe case, but i like to believe thats not the case, and is just a label to keep those whose have power, in power, but hey, thats just me
No, why fear the inevitable, we all have to go through death, I just feel really empty when I think of non existence, which is reasonable. lol. Non existence would be better than hell, thats for sure
Are you implying that you believe in God simply because you don't want to accept that there's probably nothing after death? Or that that's valid reason to believe in God (if it's not your reason for it)? Or that there's a logical reason (other than your Christian beliefs) to believe in an after life, other than out of desperation and denial?
Uh no? Noone wants to accept that there is probably something after death, they want to believe it, but they don't, I was just implying that I have come to grips with the fact that an afterlife may not exist, but I highly doubt that is the case, and I am not a christian, just because I believe in "god" does not mean I believe in an entity creator.
a feeling of emptiness as you dont believe in an afterlife, you believe you just die and thats it, thats pretty empty if you ask me
Projecting your faith onto others, seems pretty religious to me.
And theres nothing silly about an emotional high, thats your soul saying it wants more!
Or it could be that a wonderment of nature is a beneficial human trait, one that gives us the drive to understand our universe and existence without filling the gaps with conjecture.
It is not a "choice"- it is recognizing fact. And if there is a god, wouldn't an "All Knowing" god know/understand why one has made the choice they have.
Because were stronger than you. We don't need a source of hope to fall back on. We don't need it. WE are the god's of our own lives. There's no empty feeling because we fill it by getting the most out of THIS life instead of living a pathetic existence for some other life.
yes we are the creators of our own universe, and just because you were given the powers of a god in your own little universe doesnt mean you arent part of a larger force at play
I didnt literally mean gods. We are the masters of our lives. We have no reason to suspect theres some "larger force at play". I do believe in things beyond out comprehension like the paranormal, supernatural, astral projection ect. These are all more reasonable than some higher force that created everything. However, i highly doubt that any godlike being watches all of us every second of every day. Thats a very human thing to think