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When it comes to national healthcare smokers and drinkers are already taxed to subsidise the costs. It only makes sense on that reasoning to tax fatties.
"When it comes to national healthcare smokers and drinkers are already taxed to subsidise the costs. It only makes sense on that reasoning to tax fatties"............oh FUCKING HELL......................SMOKING AND CONSUMING ALCOHOL IS A CHOICE...and no fuckface, im not a "fattie" myself, just in case you were thinking of coming back with insults because you cant deal with the truth.People are obese for many reasons.THEY SPEND THE SAME AMOUNT OF MONEY TO EAT ,IF NOT MORE ,(which is good for the economy)SO WHAT IS YOUR (and joes') FUCKING PROBLEM.
THEY SPEND THE SAME AMOUNT OF MONEY TO EAT ,IF NOT MORE ,(which is good for the economy)
The reason they're fat is because they eat more. Thus one can conclude that by eating more one has to buy more food. Spending on alcohol and cigs is also good for the economy.
Your hypocritical and double standards seem to hugely contradict your views of equality. I actually find it very fucking idiotic. Even more so then your usual nonsense. It's not just a difference in opinion here or a few facts. You are COMPLETELY 10000% wrong. Fatty.
"You are COMPLETELY 10000% wrong."..... AND YOU ARE A 100% MORON(not a typo), WHICH IS EVIDENT IN YOUR REPLY!!!!!!!!!!"Your hypocritical and double standards seem to hugely contradict your views of equality" NO...i just mock fuckwits, like yourself, in order to gain equality, for all........................................................................And just for the amusement of your small mind,LAUGHOUTLOUD dumbass........smoking and alcohol ARE a choice.IF you take a look around outside your tiny mind you will know this.EATING IS A HUMAN RIGHT and NOT THE ONLY CAUSE FOR OBESITY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!....AND..............."THEY SPEND THE SAME AMOUNT OF MONEY TO EAT ,IF NOT MORE ,(which is good for the economy)" ...............................THIS IS AN EXAMPLE OF ME MOCKING FUKWITS LIKE YOU!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!see now you should have known that, since you think you know me so well...I WISH I WAS YOUR OBESE WIFE, THEN I COULD SIT ON YOU AND SUFFOCATE YOUR FAT MOUTH,SNUF YOU DEAD. I WOULD GET AWAY ON A LESSOR CHARGE OF MANSLAUGHTER,AFTER POINTING OUT WHAT AN ARSEHOLE YOU WERE FOR CALLING ME "FATTY"
See. Proof of howmuch shit you talk. You've barely argued my case. Always talking about IF you were gay, IF you were this, IF you were that. Wake up woman. I don't mind you talking shit if you were to atleast attempt to prove me wrong. You don't cause you can't.
Smoking, drinking and eating are all choices.
99% of fat people out there are fat due to lifestyle and dietry choices.
So instead of talking shit again... prove me wrong. For once.
OH REALLY......So instead of me, prooving me right, why dont you provide proof that im wrong.....TALKING SHIT;KINDAKINDAKINDAKINDA..............OH okay so ive just talked shit about shit,again......."Smoking, drinking and eating are all choices" ....SO should all those wacky "breatharians" have the right to say, that all of us, who choose to eat or drink should pay more for health care AND ETC?And so should those people who are allergic to various food items etc get the right to ask us to pay more for healthcare ETC,because we are consuming food that they cant? SHIT SHIT SHIT SHIT SHIT...IDIOTS WILL DELIGHT IN YOU....The smarter ones look elsewhere for proof.
Obesity can be caused by, diabetes, many drugs people take to counteract other health issues, mental disorders, physical disorders, and recently there have been studies showing that some people may even have a birth defect preventing them from EVER feeling full. Bottom line, health care is a pooled risk, we all pay in, we all take out as needed. We cannot pick and choose who pays more.
As far as taxing alcohol and tobacco consumption, the idea is to discourage people from using said products, not to fund health care. We cannot tax people's food as it is a necessity!
I hate this research going into all this bullshit, letting people blame their own problems of obesity on others. Before it used to be called lack of self discipline. Now its a mental disorder or a birth defect. There's 2 things you need to do to loose weight. Exercise more and eat less.
As far as taxing alcohol and tobacco consumption, the idea is to discourage people from using said products, not to fund health care. We cannot tax people's food as it is a necessity!
So how do you suggest lowering the rates of obesity? It's literally a pandemic in western countries. Plus the money is rerouted back into health care as well as used to discourage. We don't have to tax food, but we can tax fatties!
So how do you suggest lowering the rates of obesity? It's literally a pandemic in western countries.
I agree that it is a pandemic however, the key is to hit the fast food companies and all these companies making the unhealthy food and marketing it. How about taxing them? Or providing incentives to eat healthier like tax breaks for companies making food healthier. Instead of taxing the people who are obese for many reasons.
Diabetes is a result of obesity.
My father has diabetes and he is anything but obese. He is only 110 pounds but he does not need insulin. My uncle, who does need insulin was not obese until being diagnosed and taking insulin injections. Its a two way street, people can develop diabetes from being obese AND in some cases, can become obese from the treatments.
We don't have to tax food, but we can tax fatties!
Why is it you insist on using such language? Why would taxing them even help? Health care is a pooled risk like I said.
Wait I can't call fat people fattys but I can call people who smoke, smokers?
Hitting fast food companies does help, but end of the day its up to people themselves. Giving tax breaks etc. doesn't help much as obesity is caused by addiction to these foods.
People are fat because they are unable to control themselves. I don't mind helping them and there are a lot of initiatives in place. It all begins with parents and how they discipline their childrens eating habits. However if after several attempts to help them fails (as they have) then I feel they should be taxed or 'punished'. Its this liberal and soft approach that needs to go. A disciplined stance will keep them in line. Literally.
I really don't want to go into all the millions of details resulting in todays fat age, but I hate the blame game. People need to take accountability of their own actions.
People need to take accountability of their own actions.
That I do agree with, I just don't think making them pay more for health care is the solution. I do not feel anyone should have to pay more or less for health care.
Hitting fast food companies does help, but end of the day its up to people themselves.
True however, it is a matter of culture as well. You will notice that many other countries do not have such problems. That is something society has to correct.
Umm thats not true! Some people have medical conditions that make them over weight! I am an obese person myself, My health happens to be in fairly good condition! So obese people my never end up in the hospital because of their weight. So if an obese person has to pay more because they are weight then maybe some one with cancer should have to pay for health care!
One way to fix the problem is to not have Nationalized Health Care ;)
BTW, is it true that if a person has liposuction, the number of fat cells is reduced and so the person is not able to get back to the size they once were?
I agree we should just get ride of it all together. But fat cells have memory in them. Also if u get liposuction, all that does is reduce the fat and make u look better in person. But it does not teach the mind how to control that persons eating habits and to control portions.,
Yeah but the cost of that is outrageous ($ 20,000 and $ 55,000). Not to mention all the health risks that go along with the stapling. It just doesn't seem worth it to me. lol
If u wanna see the risks and other information visit this site
I have a friend who had it done. At first I thought he was crazy because of all the bad, possible side effects, but we have some of the best Health Care here in the U.S. and he was fine ;)
A very small percentage of people are obese due to medical conditions. Obese is unhealthiness so you cannot be healthy and obese. You can appear to be healthy though.
Anyone who causes health problems due to their lifestyle and habits should pay more. That applies to people who have smoked all their lives and then get cancer.
I agree but with u on the anyone who causes health problems due to their own habits and lifestyle should pay. But they r saying that just obese people should. So they r pretty much singling out obese people like its such a big problem.
Nobody is saying it's just obese people. Alcohol and tobacco is taxed internationally and has been for a long time.. so nobody talks about it. Obesity is a newer issue.. so when people talk about it.. they're not singling it out they're bringing it up.
So what we r saying here is that everyone that choose to have an unhealthy life style should pay more in health care? Because if so, then wouldn't everyone have to pay a bit more? that includes Drug users?, People who get STD's from unprotected sex?,and what about people that do extreme stuff such as athletes? do they too have to pay more because they r more likely to have health problems?
Yes.. they should all pay more for their healthcare. It makes sense.
I'm not too sure about athletes. They're definately not 'extreme'.. but they do have an increased chance of damaging themselves. Thing is they tend to have private healthcare anyways so I don't really think they should be included.
thank u. Idk if there is more people who r obese because of eating habits or if there is more from medical conditions the point kinda is that they should not all pay for it because not all of them have it from lifestyles.
In less than one out of every 100 cases, there is a medical reason for obesity
It's pretty obvious tbh. It's just the culture of 'the blame game' where people want to point their fingers at everybody but themselves. Genes, society, medical causes etc. It's YOU.
yes... they have a higher level of health problems and in my mind its their fault their fat but i also feel people who have mental handicaps should too
So should people who smoke, drink etc pay more as well? There are many studies suggesting that people who are obese may actually have mental and physical imbalances that cause them to be more prone to being obese, so its not just their fault.
I think people who smoke and drink heavily should also pay more just as obese people should. You say that some obese people have mental/physical imbalances that cause them to be obese? Do people have these imbalances in Africa? or central America? Because obesity doesn't seem to be a problem there. It looks to me like people are simply products of their lifestyle, and it is unfair that those who live healthier need to pay for the lifestyles of others they have no contol over. Smokers, drinkers and obese people take more from the system, so they should have to pay more.
Elderly people take out more than they put in too, as do children born with critical illness, as I said, the list is endless. Health care is a pool of money some take more some take less. People who have been putting in their whole lives and become suddenly ill do not have to worry as a result.
The difference between old, young, and otherwise disabled people is that unlike smokers, fat people, and drunks, they don't have an option in their problems. Obese people, smokers, and drinkers made lifestyle decisions that led to their state of health. Why should I have to pay for someone who makes the couscous decision to be unhealthy?
Because those are the people who need the most help. Is it not the purpose of helthcare to provide medical assistance to those in need? It does not make sence to have healthy persons pay any less than those of ailments, self inflicted or not. That is what the healthcare is there for, to help those who cannot readily do so themselves.
Yes, the point of health care is to provide for those who need it, but that doesn't justify people going out and creating those needs at the expense of the system. If someone decides, on their own, that they want to pick up a smoking habit or do something that is clearly unhealthy, why should I be responsible for paying for it? It would be like me making the lifestyle decision to buy a Ferrari, and then expect everyone else to pay for my incredibly high insurance cost. Its simply not fair that I need to pay for someone else to be reckless with themselves.
Self-destructive nature is a byproduct of poverty; keep in mind I am not limiting its range. When persons are broken by menial incomes, mediated idolism and social pseudorelativity, often do they search for an escape. Ulimately these escapes place them further in their own destructive reality. This is why I believe the redistribution of wealth, even when limited to medical expences, would in theory reduce the amount of said individuals impulse to avert their lifestyle with material subsidies. If that is not reasonable, please inform me of why.
I think it is unfair to make the claim that poor people tend to be unhealthier and more prone to smoking, alcoholism, and obesity. There are plenty of people who are very well off financially who are still alcoholics, smokers, and over weight. There are also plenty of poor people out there who are in good health. It seems like a slippery slope argument to say that poor people will drink and smoke more and will therefore need more health care and shouldn't need to pay more because they cant afford it. Even if this was the case, a higher tax on alcohol and tobacco products would only create more of an economic incentive for those people not to throw their money away on those products.
My comment was on the psycological progression of povertous persons, and was not an attempt to compare the prior to the prosperous. It is potentially a choice on either level, but the effects of social conditions cannot be considered negligeable.
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There are still peasants, and they still need help.
It is true that the poor do need help, but it is just as much their job to be able to make what they can of the assistance as it is society's job to provide it. If they continue to do things that they know to be harmful and wasteful, they fail to keep up their side of the bargain and therefore leave the government no obligation to keep up its side
"Do people have these imbalances in Africa? or central America? Because obesity doesn't seem to be a problem there. It looks to me like people are simply products of their lifestyle", .................SO why dont you,go find out & tell us all, why they are not and dont just say "lifestyle choices" because you will find, that, is not the answer.IS ANYONE HERE A DOCTOR?or are you all just worried about your precious dollars, and so havent actually done any research to see the shit from the clay?
I think it would be unfair to tax people based on mental handicaps because people who are handicapped haven't made the decision to be like that. Its not fair that you tax someone more just because, through no fault of their own, they need more medical assistance. If it IS their fault, then taxing them more makes perfect sense (ie: smokers, drinkers, and the overweight)
It is amazing the prejudices that people have. Honestly, do you think people want to be overweight? Being overweight does not automatically mean people are lazy and deserve to pay more for health services. Also, people with mental disease should not have to pay more. That is so ridiculous. Making comments such as the one here shows how close minded some people can be.
Wow you are so ignorant and unfeeling. and your mind is messed up, people have their reasons for being obese and while i understand that some people have the choice, others dont.
Making healthy choices requires self descipline, sacrifice and is a responsible thing to do - not just for the personal interest of the concerned individual but society in general. People who are fit tend to be more productive, miss less days at work, contribute less to the high medical costs, are likely to be more happy and positive in their outlook, and are more likely to make others around them more active and productive. There are some diseases which cannot be controlled and people should not be blamed for those. But there is no excuse for lazyness or bad eating habits. Why should the person who makes the healthy choice have to pay for the irresponsible choices of those who don't. There have to incentives and disincentives for responsible social behavior - being obese is not a socially responsible thing. That cost should be passed through to the perpetrator. We tax smokers, drinkers, bad drivers, people with bad credit - then what makes obese people any different? Someone who goes to the gym and sweats out for an hour instead to watching TV and eating ho-hos - takes less out of the system by not having to go see a doctor for controllable diseases. So why should the premiums go up for this person? Tax those who are irresponsible and raise their premiums and lower the premiums for those who are responsible.
Only in rare cases is obesity uncontrollable. Sure, you can be influenced, but eating and exercising habits are completely up to you. I agree that uncontrollable risk factors contributing to obesity should be accounted for and given justice, but most obese people become obese on their own free will. Whether I'm right about all that or not, I think it's easy to see that since obese people spend more on health problems (they are unhealthy) that it is only fair that they pitch in a little more. Let's reward those who take the time and effort to keep healthy!
I feel that obese people should pay for health care because, it is a choice to eat as much food as you like and not watch what it does to you body. if obesity is in your genes then you know you have to watch what you eat extra carefully. I do no not feel that some people should get a courtesy just because a mindless decision they made.
I see both ways. I say yes. Sorry to all obese people. But it is your fault your obese. You do deserve to pay more, not only to learn a lesson, but to learn something, a difficulty most likely, in life. That is my opinion.
As a smoker I hardly ever go to the doctor or hospital. However, I will have to pay 50% more in health insurance. I don't need to see statics to know that obese people spend a lot more in medical than anyone else I know.
If smokers pay more so should the obese. People I personally know are in and out of the hospital due to diabetes, gallbladder, heart issues, blood pressure and so much more due to being overweight. By losing the weight all of these problems disappear. Almost every smoker I know works hard and isn't obese and hardly ever frequents the doctor or hospital. I'm not against paying more, but I do believe other heavy risk people should also.
Regardless, in the end, it will be the nonsmokers and non obese people that will cost the most due to them living longer: being on treatments, nursing homes...etc.
If we are talking about Privatized Healthcare, it is up to the business.
But, if we're talking about Nationalized healthcare, than it only makes sense that unhealthy people pay more for something that OTHERS also have to pay for.
No, absolutely not! By the time we finish culling people out that have a specialized illnesses based on an unfavorable lifestyle we'll be back where we started from not to mention the unfairness of such an attitude.
No they should not. We cannot decide who pays more or less for health care, it is a pooled risk. If we start with the obese then we go to smokers, drinkers, etc. The list never ends.
are you serious, no obese people should not pay more for health care. And if you seriously think all big people are big from just eating, you need to look further into health. I for one am bigger person, but i am also big, because of health issues. Medications i was giving have lead to enlarging my body. Though i can run farther and longer than most of the slimmer people i know, i eat 5 times less then they do as well. And through all of this my body stays the same. Some individual are just meant to be big, doesn't mean we should be paying more to get health care. That would be like saying, Should someone with diabetes, cancer, or any other disease be paying more. Health care is there to help, we shouldn't be raped up the ass for it, because we have a health issue. And if your so friggen healty what are you using Health care for, thats abuse. Even skinny people have health issues, there is a thing as being to thin.
Obesity is a disease. Obesity can be a combination of the following:
The genes you inherited from your parents
How well your body turns food into energy
Your eating and exercising habits
Your surroundings
Psychological factors .............. A substantial increase in health risks has made obesity the second leading cause of preventable death in the United States.
People with obesity-related genes are not destined to be obese. But they will have a higher risk of obesity. In the modern environment, they may need to work harder than others to maintain a healthy body weight by making long-term, sustained lifestyle changes.
Next time admit it when you're wrong. I don't want to have to search and post up links when you can do it yourself unless you like to keep yourself in the dark and argue in ignorance.
Why cant you stop being an arsehole then,and i will stop stomping on you.Mostly, all you seem to do in an attempt to prove something, is belittle people via derogatory remarks.Other than in those situations,i have been nice to you,even agreeing with you on various oppinions,sometimes upvoting you also with no comment.As i told you once befor,"Pull your head out of your arse. FOR YOUR OWN SAKE!"
The problem with you is how upset you get over such little things and your inability to direct that through reason and logic. I don't have a problem with cusses aslong as you can back it up with a decent argument. You don't. You make it personal. You follow me around and reply on nearly every post. You stick your nose where it doesn't belong. You bring shit from one debate onto another. You put arguments on one side.. and after I 'annoy you' you argue on the other side even if it was a completely different debate.
To avoid this.. if you have problems- convo it. Don't bring it into debates.
HOW does it personally upset me in the sense you mean?...as im not gay nor am i fat nor am i the things you call most people on this site, i am indeed a little bitch, and some friends even call me the "ANALLYZER"because of my ability to sum up and put arseholes in their place and yes i admit i am rather good at detecting the shit from the clay but as i have stated on numerous times "i em not pUrfYct".YES I DO CARRY ON A BIT-YOU GIVE ME REASON TO-NOT EVERYONE APPRECIATES ARSEHOLES.YOU SEEM TO SUFFER FROM RSI IN THAT AREA IN JUST ABOUT ALL YOUR DEBATES.AND -NO THANKS -I DOUBT I WOULD GET THROUGH TO YOU IN A PRIVATE CONVO EITHER.
It's not about getting through to me cause like I said not only are you wrong but you can't actually argue.. only bitch. It's about keeping the shit out of the debates. You're right though. You bitch. You can't argue for shit though.
Some people look at it as yes, but some experienced say yes, but we cannot say that many could have in between. Maybe in a case of hunger, some obese people proof that they are capable to have everything they eat than those who are not obese.
the decision to charge higher healthcare premiums for obese individuals is a complex ethical and policy question that requires careful consideration of various factors. It is important to balance the need for addressing healthcare costs with promoting fairness, inclusivity, and ensuring equal access to healthcare for all individuals.
