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Debate Score:145
Arguments:149
Total Votes:169
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 The Meaning of Life (115)

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Saintnow(3684) pic



The Meaning of Life

This is designed as a philosophical discussion.  If you hate God, you probably won't be able to refrain from cussing or using His name in a blasphemous fashion, and you can expect to be banned quickly.  If you are able to discuss the topic here civilly, I believe we can get some good discussions going.


We can start with some questions of definition....what is life?  Some would say it is nothing more than complex chemical reactions, some would say it is organisms which interact with their environment.  In this definition, life can euphemistically be thought of as a gift from nature, or a more cynically be viewed as a curse of nature due to the sufferings and pains we must witness and/or endure.  Some, like myself, will say life is God's making for His own pleasure, and it is a gift from God.  The key point here is "gift" or "curse" or what else???...meaninglessness?  Your comments are welcome as long as you refrain from cussing and engage me in the topics of the posts.  So far, the topics include "life", "gift", "curse", "meaninglessness".


If life is not given by God, then what is it's meaning?  Many have said things such as "life means whatever you say it means", or "life means you try to survive as long as you find it's worth surviving" or "life means we have a driving force to accomplish things".  I say life means God is good because He gives life and giving is good.   I think there is plenty of fuel here for good civil discourse, and I hope to find people willing and able to provide enjoyable discussion here.




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Cuaroc(8825) Banned
3 points

I think there is plenty of fuel here for good civil discourse, and I hope to find people willing and able to provide enjoyable discussion here.

Probably would be. But since you posted it it'll be meaninglessness to even attempt to debate you.

3 points

In this definition, life can euphemistically be thought of as a gift from nature, or a more cynically be viewed as a curse of nature due to the sufferings and pains we must witness and/or endure. Some, like myself, will say life is God's making for His own pleasure, and it is a gift from God.

Do you not see the moral turpitude and irrationality in reconciling the facts you listed (suffering and pain), and the belief that God created such inexorable woes for his own aesthetic, or otherwise, pleasure?

---

Aside: Do you think 8 year old sex slaves indefinitely imprisoned unless otherwise killed-- by way of disembowelment, decapitation, incineration, or some other gruesome, iniquitous fashion --should view life as a 'gift' from god?

5 points

+1

Saintnow(3684) Disputed
1 point

So you are taking the position that life is a curse of nature because of the pain and suffering we see and feel?

You are asking the wrong questions based on your irrational hypothesis. I am going to ask you questions so maybe you can look at things differently and forget your anger toward God for a minute. Do I deserve to have good things when some 8 year olds have nothing but evil all day long? Why am I better than others who suffer more than me? What makes you better so that you should not be the one suffering in place of the 8 year old? Why does God allow you to enjoy good things while so many in the world have nothing but pain? What makes you so good that you are not the 8 year old whose sufferings you are blaming God for rather than blaming the people who cause the suffering? So you thank God for nothing you know as good, and you insist life is cruel and God is not good?

Don't you see the irrationality of trying to say God is not being good to you, and He is not good because He has allowed pain and suffering to continue?

Harvard(659) Disputed
1 point

So you are taking the position that life is a curse of nature because of the pain and suffering we see and feel?

I'm not suggesting that life necessarily a "curse" since pain & suffering; rather, pain & suffering is a necessary function which would only be sensible if there was no omnibenevolent god who created the medium through which said pain and suffering manifests; and it would be erroneous to claim that he did not intend for pain & suffering (such as the holocaust or harems of prepubescent children who will never know the 'good' that you insist life brings) since he knew such grotesque acts would follow from his creation.

Don't you see the irrationality of trying to say God is not being good to you, and He is not good because He has allowed pain and suffering to continue?

This has nothing to do with me - I am a pantheist. However, I do see the irrationality in believing that an all-loving, good god, incapable of wrongdoings, having the power to alleviate pain and suffering but refusing to do so since 'free will'. Yet, he supposedly did so in past (as written in the biblical texts).

Yes, it is perfectly rational to find that nonexistent hypothetical monster monumentally wicked for creating such a world while knowing the amount of pain and suffering that would ensue.

God intentionally created pain & suffering; he set up a series of events that would lead up to the slaughter, rape, evisceration, etc.

Lastly, god did/does not just allow pain and suffering; god created pain and suffering (since he created everything).

Saintnow(3684) Disputed
1 point

By the way, I want to mention that you are being terribly cold hearted in your comments as you are implying that God does not care for the people who are my friends and family and are suffering terrible diseases with more pain and suffering than the 8 year old sex-slave who you are pretending to care about by insisting God does not care for that boy and God is not good. What good do you think you are doing by telling people that God is not good and does not care for them? I think you're coldhearted...self-centered....and now I'm sure you will want to tell me all about the good things you do and the people you are kind to and love...but why do you not try to help that 8 year old sex slave yourself? Talk is cheap.

1 point

The meaning of life is the absence of independence - which can't be referenced.

jolie(9804) Banned
1 point

What if the whole purpose of life is to live for the sake of living? In other words, life just wants to keep on living. Then, in that context, what it means for us humans is that our purpose is to increase the chances that life will continue. To that end we must increase our technology so that we can manipulate and control our environment. We need to beat global warming or learn to live with it (adapt). We need to travel to the stars so that we do not have all of our eggs (life) in one basket (Earth).

Saintnow(3684) Clarified
1 point

To live for the sake of living? So there is no right or wrong in anything we do, we are nothing but animals living for the sake of living and life has no meaning but we try to stay alive anyways?

What happens when a person gets tired of it and does not want to live anymore?

jolie(9804) Banned
1 point

One single person giving up on life does not put the entire plan in jeopardy.

jolie(9804) Banned
0 points

I do not define life as the life of a single human being because I believe our souls are eternal. I define life as ALL life. The survival of one species does not matter. The survival of at least one species is what matters most. The meaning of life is to make sure that at least one species survives.

Saintnow(3684) Disputed
1 point

If you travel to the stars, what good is that for me? How does that give meaning to my life? I would miss you if you were gone off to the stars....Missing you is supposed to make life meaningful?

Saintnow(3684) Clarified
1 point

The question here is about the meaning of life, not the purpose of life. The purpose of life to you is about what you do. What is the meaning of life to you? What does life mean to you?

Most people are going along the lines of what they want to do in life, so to them I guess life means doing whatever you feel like doing....I don't know. I still think the answer I gave in the OP is the simplest, plainest, and most logical answer...easy to understand and plainly stated.

Saintnow(3684) Clarified
0 points

Not bad; well constructed and eloquently stated. Can I correctly rephrase your concept by saying life is antithetical to death, and the meaning of life is to conquer death? So while we die, we live on through our children and life still has meaning even though we are no longer in it?

jolie(9804) Banned
1 point

I would not categorize the purpose of life as conquering death for 2 reasons:

1. Death is a part of life.

2. It is not the individuals life that is important, it is life in general that is important.

For example, it doesn't matter if humans become extinct. It matters if every life form becomes extinct.

Having said all of that, I believe that the thing you call you will always exist. I find it hard to believe that consciousness is nothing more than random chemical reactions. In this context, death has little meaning. Therefore, I do not believe that the purpose of life is to conquer death.

Antrim(1306) Banned
1 point

The meaning of life is to eat as many marmalade sandwiches as you can.

Saintnow(3684) Disputed
0 points

Cute, but I would appreciated it if humor would be kept in context of the OP. If you think the meaning of life is to eat as many marmalade sandwiches as you can, then I guess you think life has very little meaning. Let's see if we can relate your comments to the comments in the OP.....I think we can say your comment fits under my suggestion of "life means we have a driving force to accomplish things" which is found near the end of the OP. I would have at least hoped you would be driven to accomplish better things than eating marmalade sandwiches.

Maybe you can define "life" or "meaning", since by the way you are using those terms I am not sure if you have any real meaning for those terms.

Antrim(1306) Clarified Banned
2 points

Well Okay then, add some good old Irish country butter to your marmalade sandwich accompanied by a black frothy pint of chilled triple X guinness and there you have the meaning of life on a plate and in a big dimpled glass. Now, not even Jesus Christ Superstar could argue with that.

daver(1771) Banned
1 point

There is probably no meaning, or purpose to life. Just as there is no meaning or purpose for the fire that burns inside our sun, or the clouds that drift over out heads, or the galaxies that spin toward the farthest reaches of the universe. A thing can simply be the effect of other things. It seems to me that all of it can just exist without some purpose or destiny. It's a lonely universe, but still quite a big deal anyway. Don't you think?

Saintnow(3684) Disputed
1 point

If there is no meaning, why is it a big deal? Is it a big deal because you decided that there is no meaning or purpose to the sun and you are no better or different than the sun? How is that a big deal? It sounds to me like a meaningless deal. So you think life "probably" has no meaning or purpose. Ok. thank you.

Saintnow(3684) Disputed
0 points

So a person who grieves over a child or loved one taken away by death is wrong to grieve the loss when they don't grieve losing the view of a cloud as it drifts overhead and out of sight? Life's meaning is no more than the meaning of a spinning galaxy?

1 point

Great comments and discussion so far, thanks to all of you. Merry Christmas and good night...Glory to God in the highest, and on Earth peace, and good will toward men.

ArsonAce(14) Banned
1 point

Life is about each individual experiencing reality or illusion. We are all part of the same unified string theory. We are frequency which is a form of energy, so energy is never lost which means we never die, just our body dies. Which means, we come back in a different life forms to experience all aspects of life. Life is like saying God is experiencing life through all of us. God could be someone or all of us put together as a unified string. Including animals and materials things like rocks.

5 points

+1

5 points

+1

1 point

What about contradiction, or discrepancy? Do you think that they are normal parts of the string, or like glitches in a computer system?

Saintnow(3684) Clarified
1 point

Sorry, that guy got banned for ignoring the OP an ignoring me in the discussion. If you want to talk about your ideas regarding "contradiction" and "discrepancy" and how they relate to the meaning of life, or to the meaninglessness of life...which if I recall is the summation of your ideas, that life has no meaning at all because to imply meaning would negate itself due to indicators which seem to say it's meaningless? I'm trying to get these belief systems held by individuals stated clearly in ways we can all understand.

Saintnow(3684) Disputed
1 point

Who or what are you contradicting, and what is the discrepancy?

Saintnow(3684) Disputed
1 point

So you believe all is God, and God is all. Ok, but what is the meaning of life? What does it mean? It means you go around and around forever with no point other than to go around and around, suffering and dying over and over and over again? So you are stuck in a never ending cycle of being illusion or reality and then you die and become illusive reality? I don't even know what I'm saying as I try to put your words in context I can understand.

If you experience illusion, or if you experience reality, how would you know the difference? If life is a illusion and death is only a point in the cycle of recycling of whatever "force" is in you, then you are nobody and force is somebody but it's not you because it's an illusion?

ArsonAce(14) Clarified Banned
1 point

Meaning of life is to be enlightenment and then attain nirvana.

Saintnow(3684) Disputed
1 point

So you think life means God does not care about you dying? That would mean that life means God is evil, in your opinion, correct?

Saintnow(3684) Disputed
1 point

You have completely failed to explain the meaning of life. I'm not in the mood for this nonsense.

1 point

Thank you all for your excellent comments and manners. After a while, I'll try to make a summation of everybody's comments and offer my own commentary.....and I think you all know I support the concept of God's being good as the meaning of life. I believe life means God is good and in the OP I gave a brief summary of why I believe this....The meaning of life is that God is Good. Life means God is good.

Before I go into more detail explain my logic, I want to hear more of yours....and some I would like to hear in simpler terms. I'm trying to sort out the ideas and concepts you all have in ways I can accurately state them in my own words so you can agree that I understand your beliefs and logic in those beliefs. Tired again tonight, probably won't be awake much longer.

sohn(3) Banned
1 point

The meaning of life is to find the inner peace by acquiring knowledge about the world and yourself.

5 points

+1

Saintnow(3684) Disputed
1 point

You are talking about what you want to do. You are not explaining the meaning of life. The things you want to do are not possible for some people to even begin trying to do. The meaning of life must apply to people who are incapable of finding inner peace and incapable of acquiring knowledge about the world or it is not a valid meaning.

Saintnow(3684) Disputed
1 point

why? You do not explain why in any logical fashion. Some people don't want to find inner peace and don't care to know about the world and themselves. How does your "meaning of life" apply to them?

1 point

I have yet to encounter a compelling reason to attribute any external meaning to "life". The necessary result of physics acting on matter is good enough for me.

Saintnow(3684) Disputed
1 point

So you find life meaningless. I can see how you arrive at that conclusion...I think...but can you elaborate?

The mechanics of life is not the meaning of life....or are you saying life means physics act on matter and nothing more, so you believe there really is no such thing as life, and life means nothing at all?

Stryker(849) Clarified
1 point

So you find life meaningless. ...can you elaborate?

I understand "how life", and can't find anything pointing to the "why life", that may prove to be an incoherent question.

are you saying life means physics act on matter and nothing more

Yes?

so you believe there really is no such thing as life

These two definitions popped up when I Googled "define:life"

I have no objection to either, and accept the existence of both.

the condition that distinguishes animals and plants from inorganic matter, including the capacity for growth, reproduction, functional activity, and continual change preceding death.

the existence of an individual human being or animal.

and life means nothing at all?

I have a hard time reconciling this question due to phrasing, the closest to an answer I can give is I see no reason to believe that life has any inherent meaning.

1 point

The meaning of life is probably meaning. "meaning what" Just meaning in general. That means you would have to just know something when it will soon become nothing by something.

Saintnow(3684) Disputed
1 point

I'm sorry, I don't understand this. How can something become nothing by something, and what is the something by which something becomes nothing? Are you trying to say something is nothing, and nothing is real?

WeeklyManner(129) Clarified Banned
1 point

I'm saying everything is real, but anything is not real because nothing is real but real in anything and everything but also real when it's nothing at every event of anything happening. Confusing, but it could be true.

Saintnow(3684) Disputed
1 point

In other words, you have some squirrels building nests in your brain and it's getting so messy in there, it's hard for you to make sense

1 point

I see a lot of people talking about what they do in life rather than what life means. Some Hindu types are talking about life's purpose which they believe is to attain "Nirvana". I'm not really sure what they mean by that, but the purpose of life and the meaning of life are two different things. Many here seem to be saying they believe life has no purpose or meaning.

1 point

Does anybody see that most of the discussion about the meaning of life is subjective to the individual and cannot be universally applied to all living things? "Life" includes all living things. The only way life's meaning can be ascertained is objectively. It's not about what you do, it's about why you are what you are.

The questions such as "who am I", "why am I here" "where am I going" "will I be me forever, or will I cease to be me in the future?"

questions like that....are always questionable if life does not have objective meaning which does not depend on what we do, what we say, or how we feel.

Cuaroc(8825) Banned
1 point

Where do you get this garbage, and why do you believe it? Oh yeah, you can't believe Jesus because according to His word you are on your way to Hell and you can't handle the truth.

0 points

I believe the meaning of life is to glorify God and share his word with all the known world. From a non-religious view I guess I could say the meaning of life is defined by what life can offer someone in a lifetime.

Saintnow(3684) Disputed
1 point

I think "to glorify God" has more to do with the purpose of life, but that may be a bit of splitting hairs. "to glorify God" would be the objective answer for the purpose of life, and if "the meaning of life is defined by what life can offer someone in a lifetime", then that meaning is subjective and variable.......undefined and incommunicable. Doesn't life offer us a lot of things we do not receive by choice or by error? Is there one thing life can offer which gives life meaning which you can verbalize plainly so I can understand?

1 point

When I said what life can offer someone in a lifetime I meant for it to be subjective. I misinterpreted the original question, but if we are just trying to define life then even that would be subjective.

0 points

So I would counter with this question: why must life have meaning? Or, why does it have to have only one meaning connected to only one thing?

Saintnow(3684) Disputed
1 point

Why don't you tell me your own answers to these questions?

I will say this, that the meaning of life must apply to all living things at all times or it is not valid. Many people here have implied meanings of life which do not apply to all living things at all times, so they cannot be valid for the meaning of life.

pirateelfdog(2655) Disputed Banned
0 points

Many people here have implied meanings of life which do not apply to all living things at all times, so they cannot be valid for the meaning of life.

Well, my point was that there might not be meaning of life that applies to all living things at all times. You seem convinced otherwise, so I would love to know why. Who's to say that there is only one 'meaning' of life?

And I'll reiterate my earlier question: why must life have meaning? I didn't answer because I don't have a distinct answer to this question, but you seem to be approaching "The Meaning of Life" with a mindset that you'll find an answer, and in my mind, that's not a guarantee. If you'd like to share why you're so sure that there is a meaning to life, I'd love to listen.

Saintnow(3684) Disputed
1 point

It seems like you are only saying that you have no answer for the meaning of life. If you have an answer, please offer it. This is the last time I'm going to ask you.