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Debate Info

25
19
No, that doesn't make sense... Of course! Virgin Mary, duh!
Debate Score:44
Arguments:21
Total Votes:62
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Argument Ratio

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 No, that doesn't make sense... (13)
 
 Of course! Virgin Mary, duh! (8)

Debate Creator

johnbonham32(2428) pic



Was Jesus God's kid?

No, that doesn't make sense...

Side Score: 25
VS.

Of course! Virgin Mary, duh!

Side Score: 19
3 points

1. If sex after marriage isn't a sin, and Mary was married, why was it necessary for her to have been a virgin? And what were the chances of her being a virgin?

2. Even if all of number 1. doesn't matter, and the Virgin Mary did immaculately concieve, again, why? Was god just really horny or something? Why not just let a kid be born and then tell him what to do?

3. Many women of that time claimed their first child was immaculately concieved. And even today, there's a psychosis that exists where women think their child is the son of god. Who knows why, but at the time women were married away far too young, often to a stinky hairy old man who basically came home and raped her after the night of celebration. It makes sense the woman would supress that memory, and thus blame the preganancy on some miracle.

4. The story is almost a word for word copy of the conception of an egyption god, I think Isis, right down to the father being a carpenter.

Side: No, that doesn't make sense...

1. Virgin didn't and doesn't necessarily mean sexually untouched. Many women were considered "virgins"if they were marriageable or simply young: denoting naivete and innocence.

2. Seems like a fairly moot counterfactual. Just stick to the story as it is presented and never mind what might have been. We know very well, in hindsight, that the story could have been told in any conceivable way. But the New Testament is what is considered canon and that is what we have to deal with.

3. Or maybe she did immaculately conceive?

4. Not a very important point. Divine Hero mythology carries a number of universal motifs: being avatars, performing miracles etc., stretching back through history and its subsumed cultures. Whether it is similar or identical to another does not mean it is untrue.

Side: No, that doesn't make sense...
iamdavidh(4856) Disputed
1 point

1. Well, regardless of the definition one places on "virgin" - immaculate conception seems to mean she was a literal virgin.

link

"without stain of original sin" pretty clearly means she never had sex.

2. It seems that "sticking to the story" does not lend itself to much debate. If I were to simply stick to the story, of course one would conclude inherently that must be the story. The purpose of the second point was not to unearth some contradiction within the New Testament, but shed light on what one may see as an absurd assumption (that god had sex with, or magically impregnated, a young virgin) when there are plenty of other viable options available to an almighty being.

3. I guess anything is possible, and if one were to stick to the story, your second point, there is not much use for my third point. However if one were curious as to why this particular story would emerge, and at the same time questioned the story's validity, then I believe my third point lends some possible reasons as to why...

4. I believe this last point is the most important actually (well, outside of the fantastic nature of the story in general) because it gives a very specific reason why that would be the tale told.

One could argue with a completely original story, "who would make something like that up?" But then you see that it's a retelling of a story told thousands of years earlier, and that it was a story that would have been known well during the time of Jesus, then you can see kind of a motive.

Yes, just because someone cried wolf 500 hundred times, doesn't mean there isn't a wolf the 501st time. But it would only be natural to doubt there's a wolf this time.

If one has faith in the New Testament, then that means they do not have faith in the mythologies preceding the New Testament. And if these mythologies are earily similar to the New Testament, what makes one source any better than the other? Only proximity on a timeline it would seem, in which case if you're looking for the most recent version of the same story, Mormonism should be the faith of choice.

Side: Of course! Virgin Mary, duh!
RedStorm(3) Disputed
1 point

Some one needs to do secondary school R.E. again, Immaculate conception means that Mary was conceived without original sin which means Mary didnt have the human tendency to turn away from god and therefore Mary never sinned (I don't believe in a need for Immaculate conception and lots of other Christians don't but Catholics LOVE it). You must be referring to the VIRGIN BIRTH, that's what its called, not immaculate conception.

and ALSO it says in the bible she was BETROTHED(or engaged)to Joseph when she became pregnant

Side: Of course! Virgin Mary, duh!
iamdavidh(4856) Disputed
1 point

1. there's no reason for anyone to learn this myth in school, and certainly not relearn this myth in adulthood.

2. no, it means that Mary was a Virgin when she had a kid. That's the arguement.

3. her being betrothed and not married ads to my arguement, not yours,

as having sex while not married would be a sin, thus making it impossible for her to be "without original sin" so she would have to be a virgin by your own rules

so you saying she was not is very inconsistant,

but typical of defenders of these myths,

again, definition of immaculate conception

it's hard to argue that any one of those definitions does not mean that she was a virgin,

and while "virgin birth" may be a term used to describe it, "immaculate conception" seems to mean the same thing + the daddy is god.

Side: No, that doesn't make sense...
2 points

i think so because i do not want to be doomed by him

Side: No, that doesn't make sense...

I don't think that Jesus was the son of God. I have no doubt in my mind that he was, indeed, historically, a real person, but the son of God? I don't think so.

Side: No, that doesn't make sense...
1 point

LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL

Side: No, that doesn't make sense...
0 points

im gonna burn in hell for saying this (i hope not) i think Jesus was just a prophet...

Side: No, that doesn't make sense...
Messenger(39) Disputed
1 point

Don't take lightly something as grave as being condemned to hell. How can someone be a wise prophet but also claim they are the son of the living God, and not be in actuality, totally insane? You either accept Him at His word, His miracles and teachings, and as being "one with the Father" and the Savior of the world, or you deny all of it. He can't be both—a prophet is defined as a person who speaks by divine inspiration or as the interpreter through whom the will of God is expressed or the chief spokesman of a movement or cause—His cause being that He, the Messiah, had arrived according to prophecy and to share the good news that He was the Son of God and that all men must believe this, and repent in order be forgiven and inherit the kingdom of God. So, it's one or the other. (Hint: Jesus IS the son of God.)

Side: Of course! Virgin Mary, duh!
0 points

It is a physical impossibility to produce human offspring without both a male and female sex cell (the egg and sperm respectively). There has never been a single recorded case of parthenogenesis ever happening in humans, and everything we know about human physiology and biology show it to be an absolutely ridiculous notion.

I can guarantee with 100% confidence that even if Jesus did exist, he most certainly was not the product of a virginal conception.

Side: No, that doesn't make sense...
1 point

i agree there...

Side: No, that doesn't make sense...

If I were God and I did Mary, then after Mary gave birth to the late JC she woulod be a MILF. I mean, if God could resist himself how can some ordinary man? All I can say is that Joseph must have been one lucky dude to get a chance to hit that every night. ;)

I'm going to burn in hell, ain't i?

Side: Of course! Virgin Mary, duh!
0 points

yes joe you are ill start the fire

Side: Of course! Virgin Mary, duh!
3 points

Was this retarded debate created to belittle christianity?

Side: yes
2 points

Hey wait a second. I'm Christian! Granted, not the best Christian in the world, but a Christian just the same. I was not making fun of Christianity, the religion. I was making fun of Mary, a religious icon. Mary is not all there is about Christianity and she does not define Christianity. The teachings of Jesus define Christianity.

Granted, I may have offended some but that was not my intent. Neither was it my intent to belittle Christianity.

Also, Jesus knew what Judas was going to do and he did nothing to stop it. In a sense, then, one could argue that Jesus wanted Judas to do what he did. Otherwise, why not stop it? Now, if Jesus can cut Judas some slack for what he did, I hope he can take a joke and cut me some slack for being irreverent for the sake of some lolz.

I can't think of one joke that everyone finds funny so I just target a select few (those that like crude, rude, obnoxious, offensive jokes). This forum is like the office water cooler. I can tell person A a joke but I have little control over person B who overhears what I say and even less control on how they will react.

I'll stop here before I dig myself deeper ;)

Side: No, that doesn't make sense...
2 points

Thats cool, I didn't say you were making fun. I was talking about the wording of the title of the debate and the tags. It just made me angry.

Side: No, that doesn't make sense...
duncer(418) Disputed
-2 points
3 points

Well, to make a really long story short! God sent the angel to tell Mary she was due to have a baby and she must call him Jesus. When Jesus was born, God's "spirit" so to say went into the baby's body. That is the story I believe in!! No one can change my mind, no one!!!

Side: It is a confusing concept I know
1 point

ok... some people need to think about this...Mary was a virgin when she was pregnant with jesus...alot of you confuse yourselves...Jesus is indeed Gods son...And we all are his sons and daughters...There is your answer Yes he is! if you read the bible i guess it would make alot more sense to you

Side: Of course! Virgin Mary, duh!