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Debate Info

83
75
Like it Hate it
Debate Score:158
Arguments:75
Total Votes:223
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 Like it (40)
 
 Hate it (35)

Debate Creator

JakeJ(3255) pic



What do you think about ABC and NBC’s refusal to air an anti-‘Obamacare’ ad?

Like it

Side Score: 83
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Hate it

Side Score: 75
4 points

1. Youtubes search engine effing sucks and any douche who spams keywords will get their lame video to pop-up a million spots before any relevant information.

That said, I couldn't link the actual commercial for you.

2. I did watch the full 30-32 second commercial on this guy's blog, but I hate this guy so I'm not linking it.

3. The commercial covered all of the false fear tactics,

-old people will lose Medicare,

-there will be rationing and people dying on the streets,

-Canada and UK look like post-apocalyptic death zones due to their socialized healthcare

-four horsemen of the Apocalypse (not literally, but that's the feel they're going for)

So good for them. Maybe the the private health industry should be spending the millions a day they are spending on commercials that lie on treating people who they insure instead,

maybe this conversation wouldn't even be going on then.

Side: Like it
3 points

I believe the ad is below (YouTube search does suck, just use Google, then you can click on the video to jump to the YouTube link).

I agree with their refusal to air it. It's just one blatant deception after another designed for the sole purpose of scaring the American people. Shit like this should be illegal.

The Ad
Side: Like it
2 points

So it IS a specific ad? Well, that's different....I haven't watched it, 'cause there are other people in the room who probably don't wish to be disturbed...but if it's a specific ad and not ALL anti-obamacare ads that may be okay.

Side: Like it
jtopolnak(158) Disputed
2 points

I'm sorry that you are in such denial. Open the hood and look into into it and stop looking at what you hear and see on TV. Just use your common sense. Take a model for instance Social Security and Medicare which are entitlements that are having problems and going broke. Already the CBO is saying that Medicare and Social Security is going to be completely broke 2019. How would you expect a national health care to be any more efficient. It won't, even the Obama administration is now trying to demonize the CBO which they are a non biased government entity that just uses economic mathematics to figure out where we are going and the Obama admin is saying the CBO is wrong. Who are they to tell them, It's Obama who is not telling the truth. Look I'm worried where this country is heading under Obama. Sadly to say i voted for him, but unlike so many liberals I'm able to get my head out of the sand and see who this guy really is. Of course Obama going on TV and asking us to trust the government when he even said himself that he has not read the bill. Are you serious? And you want us to believe you. you know Jessald when we are old and we don't have any Social Security we will look back on the day that George W Bush oh yes I'm bringing him up warned about Social Security going dead and tried to give the money back to us so that we can invest it ourselves. But the Dems grilled him on this because that would mean giving money back to us that is ours but that they don't have because it is already spent. They are already borrowing against the debt of entitlements on Social Security and Medicare is right behind. Yes the 9 trillion that is real money that is owed. And by the way that amount is based on one Fiscal year. That is the budget deficit if you go to the total debt that gets even scarier its almost 20 trillion. Look the left loves to feed on you young uneducated, so before you throw your slander and derogatory words around on a debate. You open yourself up to the obvious which tells me that you don't have a clue and i would say go educate yourself and put down your X box and do the research hopefully you will see the real for yourself.

Side: Hate It
jtopolnak(158) Disputed
1 point

That ad was simple and pretty much told the truth. My brother is a dr. and is the biggest liberal out there but he has read the entire bill unlike most and says that it is a medical nightmare. ABC should have run this ad it wasn't that bad.

Side: Hate It
JakeJ(3255) Disputed
0 points

State run media should be illegal.

::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::

Side: Hate It
JakeJ(3255) Disputed
0 points

So before you stopped to think about freedom of speech or why it's stupid that we have entire TV stations that praise this Presidency no matter what it does. You rushed off to you tube to find something wrong with the video and say "good for them". All because you knew it was against a healthcare plan that you agree with.

Class act..

Side: Hate It
iamdavidh(4856) Disputed
2 points

lmao Jake,

Where was this indignation at an entire news station that "praise this Presidency no matter what it does" during the Bush Administration? Holy s--t you would need the Jaws of Life to pull Faux out of Bush's ass after 911.

For you're information, many of the shows are very critical of much of what the president has done.

1. He hasn't done away with don't ask don't tell.

2. They think single payer is the solution to Healthcare, and are tired of Obama trying to compromise with the right (especially in light of the sorry miseducation of people like yourself who actually think this President is a Lefty)

3. They want out of Iraq last week.

4. They want plans for leaving Afghanistan starting now

You need some perspective Jake, Obama is center left. And the Left has plenty of gripes about it. All the right spews all day is "blah blah, socialist, blah blah, most liberal President ever, blah blah guns, blah blah, he wasn't born here"

It's retardation bordering insanity.

ABC and NBC are far far far closer to the center than Faux. The only "liberal" media to even come close to faux in it's distance from the center is MSNBC, and even Olbermann and Maddow have questioned this administration more in the short short time it's been in charge, than Faux dared question that draft dodging war criminal Bush in his entire 8 year fiasco.

Don't come talking to me about class act.

If the Insurance industry wants to air a commercial, maybe they should try airing one that isn't a 30 second string of lies.

There is nothing in the first amendment that says a privately owned news station has to air every piece of bs that comes across their desk.

Side: Like it
Cerin(203) Disputed
2 points

I'm sorry, but could you explain what freedom of speech has to do with this? How do you have freedom to air whatever you want on a private TV network?

Ironically, under the Fairness Doctrine, you would have had the right to this type of "freedom" on someone else's property. Fortunately, such wonderful conservatives like Ronald Reagan overturned such unfair laws, and now ABC and NBC have the freedom to not air trash they don't like.

Side: Like it
3 points

ABC and NBC are private corporations and have the right NOT to run this or any other ad !!!

but i wanna also say that i have viewed the 33 second ad and while i disagree with it's content, i don't understand the refusal to air by ABC and NBC

i wish the networks would make public the criteria for airing (or not airing) a paid advertisement

Side: Like it
2 points

Those ads were paid for by a group called the "Legal American Voters". I could find no organization with this name on the search engines I used, the fact that they don't want to be known is only proof that their intentions are not the best.

Another case not to run their ad is their name "Legal American Voters", as if only illegal Americans are in favor of the plan. Deceptions are never done by honest people.

Side: Like it
1 point

That's "League of American Voters".

........................................

Side: Like it

Thanks for the correction, I'm a little deaf. I'll check out their site.

Update: This I pulled from the League of American Voters homepage.

Bob Adams is Executive Director of the League of American Voters, a national organization dedicated to educating voters on their elected leaders’ support for the common sense values of free enterprise, family and national security.

Over the course of more than a decade, Adams has established a rich history of involvement in state and national politics, beginning his political career in 1994 as a Press Assistant to Republican Congressman J.C. Watts, Jr. of Oklahoma.

Throughout the Bush Presidency, Adams served as a key strategist and in senior communication roles with the American Legislative Exchange Council, the nation's largest, bipartisan membership organization of state legislators.

In 2008, Adams lost a tightly contested race as a candidate for the West Virginia Senate by 200 votes out of nearly 54,000.

Bob Adams is an Advisory Board Member of the Congress of Racial Equality (CORE), and a Board Member of the Arizona Latino Commission and Birthright of Charlestown, West Virginia.

He and his wife Allison, have four children.

It is just a Republican organizationn bashing the other party. Not even a half-way decent group of Republicans, just a sore loser.

Side: Like it
2 points

That's America, bitches!

You bitch about the fairness doctrine, then you bitch about this.

So quit your, bitchen.

Side: Like it
ThePyg(6743) Disputed
4 points

The Fairness Doctrine is government censorship.

We're not saying that NBC or ABC HAS to air the ad... but we can still criticize them for it. Criticism is the key component for free speech. Without it, we have anarchy.

Side: Hate It
Pineapple(1448) Disputed
2 points

Sure, you've got the right to critisize them for it.

But it's scummy to say, "You have the right to not do this, but if you don't we'll verbally attack you."

Side: Like it
2 points

Thank you! Conservatives act like the world is ending when an unfounded rumor of bringing back the Fairness Doctrine starts floating around. And then they act like the world is ending when they see other media outlets acting unfairly.

I wish I could say conservative-hypocrisy surprised me anymore...

Side: Like it
2 points

It is unfortunate that this debate has led to a discussion on the ethical guidelines behind a government funded option for health care. I believe the question was specifically aimed at ABC and NBCs refusal to air an anti-'Obamacare' ad. That being said...

These two networks are private broadcasters. They are not required to run advertisements, no matter the content. I agree that they have the right to do so, but sadly are taking a political position by choosing this advertisement to block. If they truly wanted to look fair, they should have aired it. Imagine these stations blocking a campaign commercial supported by either candidate during the election. I agree with blocking material of an adult nature, as to keep our children from seeing something they should not during the hours they are awake and believed to be safe. But to block something of a political nature? Not well thought out.

And really, must we reduce ourselves to criticizing spelling and grammar? Stick to the argument and avoid the menial comments on someone's typing. No one's perfect.

Side: Like it
2 points

It's nice to know there are a few stations that won't air trash propaganda. In other news, what do you think about Fox's refusal to air Obama's speeches?

Side: Like it

I don't know whether I like it or not! It would depend on why they're not airing it but it must be a pip if they don't want to.

Side: Like it
-1 points

We shoud just have a state where all of you Obama markist can hange out together and have their own government.

Side: Like it
1 point

You spelled "should" wrong. And "Marxists". And "hang". And you used "their" when you should have used "your".

Congratulations on failing four times in one sentence.

Side: Like it
jtopolnak(158) Disputed
1 point

Sorry Jessal my typing is fast and I don't spell check. That shouldn't matter if you still understand the sentence. By the way if you want the truth Obama is the biggest fraud out there he won't even open up is file so that we Americans can read is college thesis, gee I wonder what he must be hiding. the only president by the way i might add that has Ever done this.

Side: Hate It
3 points

Are you telling me you guys wouldn't be ripping Fox News to shreds if they refused to air a pro Obamacare ad!?

Side: Hate It
4 points

JakeJ is right. We totally would. Then again, putting the effort into an ad that's meant to scare the living hell out of people is pretty bad.

We should make more happy ads.

I think they should make pro-anti-obamacare ads instead of anti-obamacare ads. That way they can put a happy spin on it.

Side: Hate It
Prevaricate(57) Disputed
4 points

dear JakeJ:

your response doesn't address the debate question

btw ---- i don't consider FoxNews as a real news outlet. it's more of a propaganda outlet

Side: Like it
JakeJ(3255) Disputed
2 points

Dear Prevaricate:

My didn't you see my other response? I did address the topic, it is my debate you know.

Thanks, -Jake

Side: Hate It
jessald(1915) Disputed
3 points

If the ad they refused to air was nothing but one lie after another, then I would understand.

Side: Like it
Prevaricate(57) Disputed
1 point

attn Jessald:

did yah watch the 33 second ad?

i don't think it was "one lie after another"

Side: Hate It
3 points

First of all, I am not a conservative, and definitely not a liberal. I am a moderate. This whole idea of one station siding with Obama and the other doing the opposite is a clear sign that today's media cannot be trusted. Why? Media is supposed to bring the real news, not whatever fits their ideology or who pays them more. This incident only shows just how much media can really be trusted.

I stopped believing in the media once I graduated from high school at the age of 16.

The best way that such a thing doesn't happen is to somehow punish these media groups for the disinformation to show them that people should themselves decide who to support and not the media to make that decision. Why? Because as long as the people are misinformed, they can do as they wish.

Side: Hate It
1 point

The only real way to punish these organizations is to hit them where it hurts. Their pocket books. Stop watching their programs. Tell people that think the same as you to do the same. Write letters to them saying you no longer view their programs or patronize them in any way. Do research to find out who they are associated with and boycott them as well. This is happening with several newspaper companies. Words travel pretty fast and ultimately, actions speak louder thatn words.

Side: Hate It
2 points

This doesn't surprise me.

Fox News has aired adds both for and against the 'obamacare'. Just goes to show how partisan those two stations are.

Does this make anyone els think of totalitarianism?

Side: they love big brother
jessald(1915) Disputed
2 points

Totalitarianism? It's not the government that blocked the ad. ABC and NBC are private corporations. They decide for themselves what to air.

Stop fear mongering.

Side: Like it
ThePyg(6743) Disputed
1 point

Ah, yes, NOW it's cool when the media is favorable towards the government.

Side: Hate It
JakeJ(3255) Disputed
0 points

You want to think that I said "that is toalitarianism!".

I merely said that it reminded my of totalitarianism. Almost as if Obama was pulling the strings, of course that's not true. Give me a break.

Side: Hate It
0 points

Question: Do they air pro-obamacare ads? I know this is probably a very ignorant question, but nevertheless...Also, will they not run ANY anti-obama care ads, or did they just refuse one particular one?

And haha. It does kind of remind me of V For Vendetta. :"]

Side: More info
2 points

Actually, yes, Fox News runs Obamacare ads MORE than anti-obamacare ads. In fact, I don't ever remember seeing an anti-obamacare ad on Fox News... but there's bound to be a couple...

I don't know about ABC, but NBC is very well known for rejecting ads that they find Right Leaning. Hell, they refused to air an ad that suggested that we should send aid to the troops because it "might be considered a Political Ad". Right, because NBC is soooo not into politics.

Fox is about money and ratings, which is why they always air opposition; they don't give a fuck, as long as they got money Which is what makes them so awesome ;)

Side: Hate It

They are showing their true liberal colors. They are not concerned about the U.S. They are not concerned with journalistic integrity. They just want to get their liberal agenda passed. ;)

Side: Hate It
phuqster(123) Disputed
3 points

"They are not concerned with journalistic integrity"

They are displaying more journalistic integrity by not wanting to show what is effectively propaganda.

Side: Like it

They show all the other crap. They are definitely biased. :)

Side: Hate It
jtopolnak(158) Disputed
0 points

I wanted to say that I talk with many doctors from Canada and Great Britain and we always talk about the health care they have because I want to know. Just talked to my Canadian doctor friend this week. He says that they are always having problems with funding it and getting patients surgeries done when they need it. This is Canada where they have far less people can you imagine 300 million here in America. Don't you think that you would have to waite to see a doctor? It's pretty obvious you would have to.

Side: Hate It
Thewayitis(4071) Disputed
0 points

What agenda is this? To say liberal as if it is a bad word, liberal means change. Do you really like things the way they are? Blind, deaf and dumb; there is a club for people like you, the Republician Party.

Side: Like it

The year is 2009. After all of this time the human race either has learned what works and what doesn't work. If not, then we might as well just hang it up. Change for change's sake is not necessarily good.

Side: Like it
2 points

I would have no problem with them not running the commercial had they not decided to strongly support Obamacare.

Side: Hate It
2 points

It's typical of ABC not to run an ad, the media is so biased to Obama. For all of you Obama cronies out there that think this Health Care bill is any good you need to check yourself quickly. I think that there needs to be some kind of Health reform, but I actually was able to read 80 pages of the bill just in the first 80 it's scary. First reason why it's bad is the economic and funding reasons. Right now the CBO who is the governments own financial committee even say that without the Health Bill we are looking at a 9 trillion deficit over the next ten years. The CBO and almost every sensible economist out there has stated that these numbers are unsustainable. We will become a Banana Republic. All of this and still not adding in there the massive cost of this bill. Go read some or part of the bill yourself to see why so many grass root Americans don't like it, it is laden with special interest groups attorney language that once in place they can take it to any direction they see fit. The term "death PaneL" Ooh sounds scary but it is true. They don't call it that in the bill but there would be in the way of end of life decisions taken away from the families and would have to be decided by a bureaucrat. So i think that death panel makes the left mad because in a way it's blatantly true, just that it's worded and sugar coated in the bill so that it doesn't sound so crude. For the most reason and if you are not familiar with how the monetary system works of money and banking once you learn this your eyes will open you will see things that people don't have a clue on like Money and why this administration is driving us to bankruptcy. There is a great video on utube called Money banking and the federal reserve go check it out.

Side: Hate It
jessald(1915) Disputed
2 points

Obviously we can pay for universal health care, we'd just need to raise taxes or cut other spending to do it. It's just a question of priorities. Are we willing to take a little bit from everybody in order to keep poor people from going bankrupt if they get hit by a bus?

We can and will pay down our national debt. It's getting high but is far from unpayable. Republican strategists know this, but are choosing just to yell and scream apocalyptic nonsense in order to score political points. It's pretty disgusting really. We need to be having a constructive debate about how best to improve the lives of the American people, but all we're seeing is bullshit like this ad which says little more than, "We're all gonna die!!!"

Side: Like it
jtopolnak(158) Disputed
2 points

Dude just me when you have a 2.3 trillion dollar deficit that means that the amount taken in of all revenue versus what is still left to pay in a fiscal year is still left over 2.3 trillion in one year. Just the facts that deficit is more than all of the Bush years combined! Why do you think that China has called us out over the last month? Because they are the ones buying our debt. Once again Jessald you need to REALLY go and educate yourself on Money. The Chinese buy US treasury bonds thats how we are able to fund and print money. When there is a 3 trillion dollar deficit Govco has to go to the Fed and ask for this money in US treasury bill then we have to find a buyer for them and then the money is now made either electronically and some is printed. That is a very simple way to let you know what happens. When we as a country only produce a domestic output of a Trillion but yet we overspend by 2.3 trillion how would you expect Obam Govco to balance that. There is no way that you can balance something out if one is greater than the other. Just to let you in on something there massive socialist budget that they want probably won't happen anyway because China and other countries are going to stop buying our debt they have already told us this. You know I could go on and on on this subject people go to 4 year of college to understand what I'm trying to tell you, but unless you really dig your heels and try to understand what I telling you then you will always have a pretty stupid debate because you are so under knowledge on anything on this subject. We can't pay for it the CBO and CBC all have said that it is not possible. I want some kind of reform myself but this Obama care is not the one. Go learn again I beg you to stop sounding so stupid and do some math on dollars in and dollars out and learn about bonds and International markets. Then you will see why most smart americans and some smart people that you hear on TV are saying it is true WE ARE GOING BANKRUPT!

Side: Hate It
jtopolnak(158) Disputed
1 point

You are such and over exaggerator that add doesn't say anything to the liking of what you have stated. Like a typical Liberal over exaggerate the story to what fits your belief. Have you ever talked with a Canadian or a Brit asking them their honest truth about the health care? I have and they hate it. You ask for taxes to be raised to pay for this. Have you even taken a look at what taxes would be if Obama got what he wanted? Last estimate I saw was $37,000 for each American. That would be a Marxist economy taking over 70% of every paycheck that is made. That is the reality of what the spending they want would bring. It won't happen though because in order for us to pass that spending other countries would have to buy that debt so that we can print the money to pay for it. Thank God for capitalism. This time Jesssald I made sure that my spelling would be ok with you. I know maybe this economy and me trying to help you understand maybe over your head. I know when someone hits a lib with good information and truth you all lash out at my misspelled words in retaliation because there's nothing in the tank to come back on with what I'm saying.

Side: Hate It
1 point

I hate to state the obvious at times, but I will make an exception at this time.

ABC and NBC refused to air the advertisement because of contractual obligations. Or said another way: ABC and NBC wanted more money for the broadcast of the ad.

Do I have any evidence to support such a claim? I sure do!

Does not ABC and NBC have a price at which they can be bought just as all for-profit organizations can be bought?

Side: not enough mulla
1 point

Not a surprise. Most of the media out there supports Obama. So much so that they are willing to lie to the American people about what he is up to. He does all these things behind our backs and ABC and NBC are just not wanting to admit it.

Side: Hate It
-1 points

<< --- People that just like Obama.

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Side: Hate It