Who deserves more Israeli land?
Side Score: 98
Side Score: 73
I agree with the "both sides are being immature" sentiment, but the fact is that the world powers promised the Jews, quite some time ago, a nation of their own in the Middle East. The Jews took it, and it became Israel. They've had to fight for it ever since. I think Israel has, by now, established that they are a cohesive force and deserved to be recognized as a nation by all. They, as a nation, deserve the land that they've held for nearly a century. The Palestinians can spend their time fixing up the huge area they already have, rather than insisting upon the tiny portion that the Israelis have committedly improved for decades.
Side: Israeli Jews
This kind of oversimplification really gets on my nerves. The assumptions are hugely incorrect.
First, not all Israelis are Jews. Second, there are Palestinians who are Israeli citizens. Third, deserving of property implies that there is such a scale that is used universally.
Lets start with false assumption #3: On your hypothetical scale, which of us deserves the land your house is on? I think you only _deserve_ 1/4 of it and should be restricted from access and changes on the other 3/4. You paid for it? So what? According to this system, you don't DESERVE it. In fact, due to low incomes and high unemployment, Mississippi isn't deserving of it's land, so lets reallocate it off to laborers from California and Texas. Who cares if they're not actually living there.
Now, assumption #2: Most Palestinians are not terrorists or Muslim fundamentalists or bad people. Nor are they saints who valiantly sally forth to martyr themselves for a noble cause. They are everyday people like you and me who want basic things like jobs, food, clean water, safety, and a stable environment. They have an equal right to participate in a democratic government. However, they have failed to create any semblance of a stable democratic entity. The cannot trust their own leaders which only serves to exacerbate a bad situation.
And, finally, the first assumption. Not only are not all Israelis Jews, but not all Jews support Israel. In fact, the ultra-religious Jews don't believe in a country of Israel because only God can provide that--not some elected party. On the other side, you have Jews who are devoted to their own nations--like the USA.
So, before this gets too long and deep for a CD post, let me summarize by saying that this issue is not so simply divided and that in the end its not a matter of who deserves land but how we can protect the rights of Palestinians, Muslims, Jews, Christians, Druze, Israelis, and other peoples involved in the Middle East conflict.
its obvious that the UK screwed the Israelis and Palestinians over. but some key things must be took into concept. Palestinians never owned the land they so claim to have today. when the Romans conquered the holy land they renamed it Palestine. then the turks took them over, then the Ottoman empire owned it, and the after ww1 great Briton owned it. so when the UK pulled out and the Israeli population formed their country and when the Palestinians and nearby countries got their ass kicked when they denied to recognize then as a country and tried to take them over, Israel became a nation through a military victory. so whether they deserved the land or not, they do know. and now to say that the local Arab population that lived there who were nomadic during most of history say they've always had an nation their dubbed Palestine, when we know they did not start calling them self's "Palestinians" to the 60s, you look and sound pathetic. an other thing to point out is that if the local Arab population really wanted to have their own land during the time they were owned by numerous other nations, why did they not rebel? or ask for independence? like the Jews did during Roman control. so obviously most of the Arabs were content and happy with the rulers who lead them till a Jewish state came into being. this is not about who really owns the land. the spoils go to the victors, its really just a group of people with no religious tolerance and who scream in the name of god! before they blow 20 innocent people.
Although both sides are acting stupid and immature about the whole thing, the fact that Israeli Jews are trying to have peace talks while the Palestinians are constantly declairing war means that they are slightly more mature. But in my own opinion, both sides should learn to live in peace and harmony and STOP saying that they deserve more land than the other. But if I had it my way, I would treat both sides like 2 year olds and just take all the land away from both of them until they learned to share equally. And I'm not trying to dis any Jews or Palestinians, but that is just the fact. I mean, I'm Jewish and I love the mother land, but both sides are acting immature and like 2 year olds and should therefore be treated as such.
Side: Israeli Jews
If the Israeli's fought and conquered the land, it's theirs.
But at what cost?
In the end if the Israeli's give the land back, I have a feeling the Palestinians will find something else to fight about. But with that said, I still think they should give the land back - if anything just because nothing has worked so far.
Maybe giving them back their land will actually cause peace.
But with those two babies, who the fuck knows.
Side: Israeli Jews
The original suggested plan for the two countries was for it to be split 50/50 by the UN. Israel accepted but Palestine rejected. All land that Israel has gained that was not in the original borders was gained in battles initiated by palestine which Israel won. However, the Arabs attacked Israel more than once and continued to lose. I am not saying the violence either side is implementing at the moment is justified, but Israel acted out of self defence and deserves every speck of land that they occupy right now.
Side: Israeli Jews
While the question is phrased a little vaguely, The Israelis deserve the land they are currently on. When Great Britain gave land to Israel, they gave them only a fraction of what was considered Palestine. They gave the remaining 75% of the land called Palestine to form a Palestinian Arab country. This country today is called 'Jordan'.
Side: Israeli Jews
I strongly believe that the Israelis deserve the land. They have won many wars like the one back in 1967, otherwise known as the Six-Day War. They won that war fair and square.
They have been there since biblical times, which traces back to about 2-3 millenniums ago. Even God told Abram that all the land they see belongs to them.
Now, you are probably thinking, Then why don't they go elsewhere?, but why and where would they go? It wouldn't make sense if they go to America, Asia, or Europe. What in the world would they be doing there? They have no religious or land rights/ties there.
Ha, I can already tell that you are going to bring up the Holocaust back in the 1930-40's. But go ahead, bring it up, you're only helping me. Why didn't they go back to Germany then? That's easy, would you go back to the same place where they killed about two-thirds of your people? The Jews wouldn't feel safe where they have killed their people. They wanted a safe environment where they knew they wouldn't face as many problems.
Israel was their chosen destiny.
Now that I have listed many reasons why the Israelis deserve the land, I guess it’s up to you to decide. But nothing will change my mind about my beliefs. I gave you my perspective on what I think, so I believe that my work here is done
An no, I am not a Jew or Palestinian, I am Mexican-American, so I am not siding 'with my side'.
Side: Israeli Jews
The way this debate is phrased is dubious, to say the least. Israel deserves ALL of Israeli land, but that begs the question as to whether or not it is their land in the first place. Personally, I think under rational circumstances it should be split up evenly, however I can sympathize with the Palestinians who got forced out of their territory by a 2000 year old Zionist sense of entitlement.
Maybe they never should have attacked Israel to provoke them into taking the land in the first place...
It was the Palestinians who threw the first stone in this case.
For every action, there is a reaction. Unfortunately, the Palestinians went in thinking they'd take all of Israels land. That just didn't happen. Instead, they got land taken from them when they lost the war.
Now, they are fighting tooth and nail and ignoring the fact that they caused the mess they are in today.
Yes, there are many palestinians suffering. But there ar alot of Israeli's suffering too. Nobody wants to see their child die because bullets sprayed across the border. I feel for both groups when it comes to that.
Sadly, the palestinian government isn't powerful enough to reign in the militias. And U.S. sanctions don't help. I blame the U.S. for that.
But can you blame the Israeli's for respnding the way they did? When the U.S conquered Japan and Germany, the people didn't start a massive guerilla fight. They knew that it was their consequence.
So why then are the palestinians trying to avoid theirs?
Side: Israeli Jews
You are completely obvlious to the situation at hand. You are only taking into consideration the attacks that the arabs have done on Ireal. But why would the Arabs attack to begin with?
The Palistinians have been living in the land for century's at peace. After the holocaust the Jews all decided to intrude this country with the help of Britian using several riots and terrorist acts. The Palestinians were rightfully protecting their land that was passed down by their ancestors. In modern day the Palestinians are minorities living in poverty while the Jews live in wealth on top of the ruins where they once lived. So now i ask you, who started the war in the first place?
Correction: Although the Israelis feel that they are entitled to this land, it is not the "promised land" spoken of in the old testimet. And it goes much farther than that. It has been worldly agreed upon that this land shall be for them to have and the Palestinians are making such a big fuss about it while they have a much bigger portion of land to call there own. The only reason they want it, in my opinion, is because the Israelis transformed it into a glorious and prosperous area, while the Palestinians have done nothing to better there much larger portion of land and claim that the only reason the Israelites have done such a magnificent job is because THAT land is better than THEIR land!
Side: Israeli Jews
What exactly are you correcting. You affirm they feel entitlement; I never said anything about the minority or religious Zionists who are in it for prophetic reasons. Also, by no means has it been worldly agreed upon. The Palestinians didn't agree, and they should have been those chief in consideration.
If we must, I would gladly go into the brutalities imposed on the Palestinian people by the Israeli government as further justification that they are not more righteous.
And the argument that they made the place "prosperous"? Israel is very rich and that wealth comes in large terms, from American aide and other foreign aide that Palestinians never saw. Not to mention that much of Israels advancements come from American and modern technological advances that exploded after world war 2, and consequently correlated with Israels independence. In other words, Israel had propitious advantages that Palestine did not. That's beside the point, because who does the better job at mowing the lawn is irrelevant to who "deserves" or has the historical right to a piece of land.
That shit pisses me off.
"I don't know, maybe I die tomorrow... my daughter, my son... but I'm laughing, in front of them"
How fucking horrible, that these people are forced to live like this and America parades around in Iraq as if we're doing something great for them, and then start picking on Iran... Why aren't we stepping in??? How long has this been going on like this? With the Israelis and Palestinians? I mean, if America's going to do anything, it's stop these fucking loons once and for all. I'm sure the children there aren't going to care if America rolls in and declares war on both of them, will they?
I'm not religious, so to be quite frank, I could give a shit less about whatever they have been fighting over for so long. If it's just land, take it away from all of them. Shouldn't the UN agree? What would happen if the U.N. stepped in and said "Er, you people cannot play nice so I'll be seizing your toys for a few decades"...
I don't know... I really don't know much about it, but that looks Fing ridiculous.
Seeing as the people now known as the Palestinians lived on that land before it was partitioned into Israel, it seems that asking who deserves more Israeli land is bias towards Israel.
The Palestinians have been treated horribly by Israel on land that never belonged to Israel until after world war 2. In America at least you always hear how the Israelis are under attack yet just trying to defend their land. Israel has sectioned off areas that belonged to the Palestinians, it works to make a nation where ones ethnicity and religion determines ones rights and opportunities in life.
Both sides have committed crimes and done bad things, but that doesn't represent all the citizens of each respective group. The US gov is overly bias towards Israel as are the corporations and media. In America we only hear about the atrocities that the Palestinians commit, never Israel.
The Arabs have a right to be angry, their land was taken away and their people are mistrusted throughout the western world because of their religion and ethnicity. The Palestinian people are treated as second class citizens in their on their own land and grossly misrepresented in much of the western world.
While I'm going to be extreme and say that the Palestinians deserve all their land back, that will never be accepted(by the US and Israel) and thus the Palestinians should get their own nation and half or so of the land that currently makes up the area of Israel and Palestine because it really was theirs to begin with.
For starters the question is slanted and being slanted is not a proper way
to start a debate. The responses to the question are generally slanted,
not the question itself.
Maybe you should have asked it like this:
"Who deserves more land in Israel/Palestine?" or
"Who deserves more land Israelis or Palestinians?".
I honestly think that the Palestinians deserve the land. They started off with it! They were dragged out of their homes because the Jews believed that it was theres. People cant honestly judge until they go there. I have been there and the Palestinians literally have nothing so if you want to take over THEIR land then you should at least give them at tiny bit more than half. They have taken so many children. We have a dirty environment. DIRTY WATER too. If you want to judge this than go their yourself send me pics of how you think I'm wrong and then we will talk!
-There are good Jews in the world and I think they deserve as much as we do this is not a hate comment. I just wish someone will intercede over there. I'm sorry if it sounded offensive!!!
Nothing legitimizes a strategic land grab by world powers against a relatively defenseless state. The Palestinians are refusing to negotiate ON ISRAEL'S TERMS: Israel refuses to negotiate with Hamas, the democratically elected ruling body of Palestine. Israel is the second most militarily aggressive country on Earth, next to the United States.
As for the suicide bombings? Israel has the most advanced army on Earth, what the hell else is Palestine supposed to do to fight back? They're the last resort of an oppressed people.
Palestinian Land Loss, 1948-2000 (www.hamdden.co.uk)
I think you are a little confused in your history. You see, the people that created the Palestinian state were, in fact, the Jews. Palestine has never been its own country, there is no period in history in which the lands now called "Palestine" were under local, or national rule.
The land that Israel and Palestine now sit on has been under the control of a number of empires, the most recent being the British. The British, under the guidance of the U.N., granted Jews control over portions of Palestine and the Arabs were granted another portion.
Unfortunately, the Palestinians didn't like this idea and, with the collusion of Israel's neighbors, attempted to invade and take over what Israel was given.
Israel, in its defense, won, pushed back, and took back over the Palestinian territories. (By the way, the Palestinian territories were never going to be independent if the Arabs won; Jordan and Egypt planned to incorporate the territory into their countries).
Israel, due to international pressure, internal political changes, and a desperate need to stop the frequent terrorist attacks on its civilians has had a policy of non-negotiation with terrorists and out-and-out war on them and their supporters while also working to give the Palestinians a nation.
In other words, they started the conflict and Israel has actually been rather kind in its actions. The Palestinians have more of a state than they have ever had in their history. They continue to support terrorism, and it isn't their right to do so.
Side: Israeli Jews
So therefore, even if i do have my history confused, Israelis still are not to blame for this epidemic between the two nations and should have ownership of more land if not all of Israel because of the British, not the Jews. So the Palestinians have their anger directed towards the wrong people. right? They should be mad at the British, not the Israelis!
the palastinians deserve the land more because the land is to big for the israelis
the arabs are to big for the land they own in isreal even though the arabs have egypt and other surrounding countries the arabs are still to big for this land they own they need more land in isreal for the arabs who have no home
i think the land of isreal should be split evenly between the arabs and the jews they should get it evenly because the arabs and jews have about the same amount of people but i also think the arabs should have a little more land so that the arabs can have more houses for their big population
I agree. It's just not that simple, and they'd never agree to it anyway so what's the point? The problem is that Israelis don't know who they are negotiating with, the people who want to just kill them all or the good guys, and vice versa. It could be solved, if terrorism threats weren't a constant problem, because at anytime, they could fall into the terrorist section of the Arabs/Israelis' trap that with kill their side completely, so they don't know who to trust. There are two groups to every side of an argument, the people who want to negotiate and the ones who want to fight. Their just like middle school bitches only they have bombs and nuclear missiles, because believe me, I was a middle school girl just last year, and if we fought with weapons like that rather than with facebook and stuff, we'd be so much worse than the Israeli Palestine conflict. Or any other major conflict. Sooooo much worse... And that's just in a tiny school in a tiny town in Iowa, Adel to be exact (that's not pronounced like the British singer Adelle btw. It's with a long a, like ay-dell.) and don't ask if we grow potatoes. Everyone does. THAT'S IDAHO, PEOPLE!!! We grow CORN! A lot of it; and soybeans.
Side: Israeli Jews
Well the Palestinians had it first. The Jews left, and you're all forgetting that God promised that land to Abraham's children, and although he was the son that was pushed aside and left out of the picture, Ishmael is the ancestor of the Arabs, and Isaac is the ancestor of the Jews so really there is no promise, and the Jews didn't call quack quack land back when they left so the Arabs, many of whom were already living there just stayed, so really they were always there, it was always their land. And then after the Holocaust, the British and the US felt so bad for the Jews, now without homes and jobs and families, they wanted to make them a home somewhere they didn't get persecuted, and that it wouldn't happen again. So they placed all the Jews in a spot where everyone hated them. And don't try to bring the Balfour Declaration into this, that was Britain giving land that they didn't have possession of to a different country who also didn't own it, without saying anything to the people already living there. They had no right to do that. And the British said that if they helped them in the 1st world war then they'd help give the people independence from the Turks and give that land to them as their homeland, but then the British didn't keep their end of the bargain. They turned around and stabbed them in the back by giving their land to a bunch of their enemies that they'd had wars with in the past. And I don't think they chose a good way to handle the situation with the fighting, and I'm not saying they are totally innocent, I feel it's just a big misunderstanding that's gotten way out of hand, and I don't believe either side deserves all the land, but it would be good if they would just knock it off with the Terrorism and hate and live together in peace. It won't happen for a long time though, that's for sure. Damn Britain and my USA... We are always making stuff worse!
I believe the Palestinians deserve to have more land. For hundreds of years, the Palestinians were living in peace. Then after WWII, the Zionist Jews were assigned Israel as their homeland. The Jews kicked the Palestinians out of their territory, destroyed their homes and sent them to townships. This was like the South African Apartheid, the Jews even supporting the South African government at the time. The Jews have no right to force Palestinians out of their land. Jews will even send Palestinian politicians to jail. They require limited permits in order for Palestinians to enter the "holy city" of Jerusalem, the "holy city". I do not think that is right. There are more Palestinians than Jews so I believe there needs to be a more fair and peaceful compromise.