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32
44
Obama McCain
Debate Score:76
Arguments:33
Total Votes:103
Ended:11/15/08
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 Obama (16)
 
 McCain (17)

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Who is the elitist?

Need some help deciding? (s367.photobucket.com)

Obama

Side Score: 32
VS.

McCain

Side Score: 44
Winning Side!
4 points

I really don't think any of them are actually an elitist, but Obama has convinced me as the type of guy who wouldn't be fun to hang out with. I mean... I like to shoot guns at a gun range, he would just think i'm some hillbilly clinging to his gun because he's bitter and too naive to understand progress.

other than that though, neither of them are actually "elitist". neither of them believe that only certain people should be allowed to speak in public forums, neither of them believe that only certain people should run for government, and neither of them believe that certain kinds of entertainment should be banned because of "poor taste".

after all, that is what elitism is ya know. "everything i like is good and anything i don't like is bad, Proper english is the way, not words like ain't or rad. Since i'm right and you're wrong, you can not state your case, and if i think real hard, you suck because of your race".

Side: Neither
Inkwell(328) Disputed
1 point

get a dictionary. In the context of politics, the definition of elitism is believing in governance by a small group who are specially qualified by some characteristic. It might be money. It might be education. It might be geography. Obama is much more often caught in condescending or elitist statements. McCain married money;if he is elitist, it is regarding military service as that is his family's tradition. Neither of these guys is elitist in the manner of the Kennedy clan. I do believe that Obama shares the Al Gore trait of always believing he is the smartest guy in any room, no matter how accomplished the crowd. I think he does look down on people who don't share his views. But I have no idea if he believes that only his style of elite should govern. McCain doesnt seem to have a pretentious bone in his body aand he has dealt with all sorts of types in governing.

Side: McCain
ThePyg(6756) Disputed
0 points

well, you tagged McCain as the elitist...

Side: Neither
2 points

Actually, both candidates are elitist. Almost anyone running for President from a major political party would be an elitist, since they would have to believe that they are qualified (and one of a very small group) to make decisions which affect all of us.

Side: Obama
2 points

Elitist is sort of a tough label, but I have to say that Obama has grand views and grand plans. He sees this country the way it should be as well as the way it is. He realizes what it is like to be a minority, I am sure he has known what it feels like to be poor, he certainly spent times in his life working with those less fortunate, and he still sees the good, as opposed to the greed.

Shouldn't we want our president to be a HIGHLY educated elitist? In the words of a Maureen Dowd column last week: shouldn't we DEMAND it?

Side: Obama
0 points

Both McCain and Obama are elitist. Both consider themselves high-ranking party members and both try to get as many big donors to their camps as possible.

Side: Obama
-2 points
lisamargaret(1) Disputed
2 points

i hate to be rude- after all i don't even know you but... you're an idiot. to compare a man who was captured as a prisoner of war to, at the time, a child who wasn't in Hawaii on vacation but rather just lived there due to parental circumstances is ludicrous at best.

Side: McCain
0 points

I really doubt very much that you had no intention of being rude. If you really and truly wanted to avoid being rude, you could have written the following:

"To compare a man who was captured as a prisoner of war to, at the time, a child who wasn't in Hawaii on vacation but rather just lived there due to parental circumstances is ludicrous at best."

In other words, the following comment was totally uncalled for.

"You're an idiot. "

Especially since you do not know me. Did it ever occur to you that I was being facetious?

Side: Obama
0 points

OK, how about this....

Obama cares for no one but himself. For example, his lack of interest in his own brother who lives on only one dollar per month. Obama lives in luxury, takes a private jet to vacation in Hawaii, raised nearly half a billion dollars for his campaign (something unprecedented in history) and yet he has no interest in the plight of his own brother. Why? Because, his brother cannot be used for his ascent to power. Obama cares for no one but himself.

Compare this to what the McCains did. They brought a child from Bangladesh with facial deformities - a little girl with no chance for a normal life – and with plastic surgery restored her beauty and adopted her as their daughter. Millions of ordinary people, who are not even wealthy, have fostered children of total strangers in third world countries and give about a dollar a day for their education and upbringing.

Who is the Elitist? Obama!

Side: Obama
RevFred(349) Disputed
1 point

Haha yea, he should have been there too I guess. Not fighting for your country when your FIVE YEARS OLD is pretty elitist i guess. What branch of the military were you in when you were five?

Side: McCain
1 point

I was a boyscout. But it was a very militant branch ;)

Side: Obama
Jamais(268) Disputed
0 points

Again not for either side!

Side: McCain
7 points

Republicans as well as the news in general like to throw around the term elitism as if it were synonymous with intellectualism and never point out the differences. They understand that elitism if not properly defined is usually understood, by a large population of Americans, to describe someone of upper class and thus generally well educated. Not having to worry about money an elitist is assumed to not worry about the hardships of the middle and lower classes and to think of lofty ideas. Obama, through is past records and his stances on political and social issues, has proven he isn't an elitist. what he is, is an intellectual and that is not a bad thing. To have someone who is actually smart and open to intellectual ideas and dialog in the Whitehouse would be nice for a change.

I don't think McCain is completely an elitist but he does have traces of elitism. The multiple homes speak only a little, it is his views on how things must be done, the one way things must be done that would put him in the classification of elitists. His views that decisions he mates are right for other members of society even if the consequences of those decisions will never physically impact him help to put him as an elitist.

Lastly we have seen what happens when we let someone we(some) would want to sit down and have a beer or meal with, that average joe somebody that could be our friend stay, in the Whitehouse. It hasn't worked, i would rather have a competent and compassionate, as well as well educated person commanding the most deadly military in the world. Actually i would rather sit down and have a meal with that kind of person anyway as well.

Side: McCain
2 points

Check out the graphic, not broken:

McCain vs. Obama

Side: McCain
2 points

Yeah, you know how minorities from broken homes are all like, "I'm so much better than you," tch, what a bunch of elitists. I'm amazed that Conservatives tried that one with Obama, pretty wild. Especially considering McCain can't remember how many homes he has and married an heiress who had more money before she was born than most see their entire lives. Not that being born wealthy = elitism, but it can certainly contribute in many cases.

Anyway, I'm replying because of the "have a beer with" part of your arguement. Seriously, go to a bar right now, and count how many of those people you think should be leading the most powerful nation in the history of the Earth. I hate the "have a beer with" arguement. I don't want a President I can have a beer with, I want a President that has the Constitution memorized and can beat Deep Blue at chess. I want that nerdy kid that got straight A's, not the guy who was squirting milk out of his nose.

Side: McCain
5 points

The answer to that question is the same as the answer to the following questions, which are related: Who has more money? Who has worked in Washington D.C. far longer? Who has more houses? Who has more cars? Whose family had more prestige, money, and power? Who was pals with millionaire crook Keating? I can't see how someone who pulled himself up by his own bootstraps, as the GOP always encourages people to do, then took a job helping those less fortunate in the Chicago are when he could have gotten any number of high paying jobs from firms, can be considered high falutin', or elite.

Side: McCain
Inkwell(328) Disputed
1 point

again, get a dictionary. IN the context, none of that is germane. And just which firms offered him these high paying jobs. I keep hearing about them but have never heard of a single offer he had to go to work for any firm for some high compensation. Just a myth until he answers the question who made him an offer. And do you really think Keating compares to a leader of the Weather Underground like Ayres or a racist hate monger like Wright or Farrakhan?

Side: Obama
2 points

In what sense of the word?

Obama knows what life is like on food stamps. So were not talkin a blue blood elitist with Obama. McCain didn't grow up financially elite either, but he sure married into it.

If you are speaking intellectually elite, I'm gonna say Obama. He graduated with a juris doctor, magna cum laude from Harvard. You can see in the way he presents himself, the way he speaks, his common sense that he is very intelligent. McCain graduated from the United States Naval Academy 894 out of 899. Neither cred is anything to laugh at but, if I were a boss, who would I hire? It gets even more obvious when you ask what "team" would I hire.

Side: McCain
ThePyg(6756) Disputed
1 point

i guess... you don't know what an elitist is...

Read about "Plato's Republic"... that is true elitism. Just because you're smarter than most or richer than most doesn't make you an elitist... it makes you in potential to become an elite. and even so, an elite (when used in neutral connotation) is not an elitist. elitism is a belief... that which Plato described quite closely to.

Side: Neither
Jamais(268) Disputed
1 point

Thank you for sharing. But what "elitist" means in this political context, is out of touch with main street. You know latte in hand. Aloof or arrogant. Could refer to finances or intellect.

Actually in today's vernacular it is pretty much in the eye of the beholder. Often used as a put down for someone you disagree with. Boils down to separation - that you are different from us. Part of the political machine.

Side: McCain
2 points

Bah, I'm going crazy reading everyone's definition of elitist. Yes, Ink's right, yes, Pyg's right, and yes, Jamais is right.

None of you are wrong. The dictionary has a definition, so did Plato's Republic, then there's what most people think when they hear the word "elitist."

When asked "which candidate is the elitist," that last definition described by Jamais is what people are thinking for the most part, not the dictionary or Plato's definitions.

So that is the arguement. You can't put forth an arguement, knowing very well people are going to view the arguement in one context, then just switch the context around. Even if it's supported by dictionaries and philosophers.

You really think anyone looks up the definition of words before spewing forth opinions ink?

And Pyg, seriusly, Plato? I made a Robert Frost reference on some dance arguement. I'm pretty sure my rating is down like 10% now. Consider the audience.

Side: McCain
ThePyg(6756) Disputed
2 points

it's not about context, it's the fact that most of these people don't really know what "elitism" is. it's like calling the metric system "communist".

really, they're using it more as an insult based on nothing than actually applying the term. You want an elitist, look at the federalists back in early America. how is "being rich" or "being educated" elitist? just cause other people decided it that way? than that would suggest that being elitist isn't even a bad thing... because it's good to be rich and educated (at least, in my opinion).

it's butchering language.

Side: Neither
2 points

Er, I can't argue with that. Words have definitions for a reason. People not knowing the English language who have spoken it their entire lives is one of my pet peeves, it's part of the dumbing down of our society and it sickens me. I'll concede your point, but maintain the entire argument is faulty. I don't really think either candidate is elitist.

Side: Obama
2 points

ah mcCain you did it again =P

Side: McCain
1 point

Something bothers me more than McCain's sugar mama enabling him to be monetarily wealthy while calling Obama an elitist. It's the underlying idea as others have already pointed out that being intellectual makes you elite somehow. Higher education is something that should be commended, not frowned upon. This is the real problem. McCain makes jokes about and is proud of being just about the worst academically in his class and people out there want that in a leader? They want someone who was a terrible student and a terrible soldier? Someone whose presidential campaign deemed the Straight Talk Express is mangled and manipulated by his party as we sit and watch?

That someone like this can say anything and be taken seriously, much less be in the running for the highest political position in this country makes us all look like fools.

Side: McCain