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 Why are African Americans more violent than whites ? (62)

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Dermot(5736) pic



Why are African Americans more violent than whites ?

Incarceration for violent crimesEdit

In 1994, African Americans accounted for 45 percent and 50 percent of crimes for murder, rape, robbery, and aggravated assault. In general, African Americans are approximately six times more likely to be arrested for violent crimes than are whites. African Americans are also most overrepresented in robbery in 1993, comprising 62 percent of arrestees. African Americans accounted for 52.5% of homicide offenders from 1980 to 2008, with whites 45.3% and "Other" 2.2%. The offending rate for blacks was almost 8 times higher than whites while blacks account for less than 15% of people living in the United States.


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3 points

1)Black people tend to inherit nothing but dust and live in giant socioeconomic shitholes known as ghettos.

2)Black people are often poor, being poor makes you stupid, because being poor usually means inadequate nutrition and a shitty environment full of shitty people, being stupid from your shitty environment and nutrition tends to make you more violent, because the more stupid you are the more likely you are to needlessly commit acts the violence, and the more poor you are the more likely you are to need to commit violence at some point in your life to sustain your own black ass.

3)Black people often have higher testosterone levels which make them more violent.

4) Black people have lower IQ's than white people on average, both for genetic reasons and environmental reasons, but not all populations of blacks are so stupid, I am not making any form of racist statement here, there are populations and individuals within every race that have various placements on the intelligence spectrum. But blacks who have that unique combination of a horrible environment and those border line retard genetics which are present in certain african and african-american gene pools are among the stupidest people on earth.

5)Black people don't like to be called names. That's what my black Karate instructor told me after he hit me with a bokken for calling him a nigger when I was a 12 year old green belt.

2 points

Did you know that Californians account for 17% of all people shot and killed by police this year despite only accounting for 1/50th of the States of the Union? Why do cops target Californians?

And when are we going to discuss the overtly sexist policing of this country? 95% of the people shot and killed by police this year are males despite them only making up 49.2% of the population.

1 point

You don't understand, it's only discrimination if the "victimized" demographic isn't white or male :P

Dermot, I assure you that your premise is false. The matter has been studied extensively by criminologists and for decades it has been known that the correlation of violence exists between poverty and crime, not dark skin and crime.

1 point

It has nothing to do with skin color. Their culture is anti police and the belief that they are oppressed. Their criminality stems from their beliefs. The blacks who escape this mindset or weren't born into it, succeed and do well.

Amarel(5669) Clarified
1 point

While you are correct that there is a correlation between poverty and crime, there is also a correlation in the US between blacks and poverty. Poverty is the lurking variable left out of the debate topic. As a result, it is accurate to say that black people are statistically more likely to be involved with violent crime in the US, though it would be incorrect to infer that this is causal in any way. There is nothing about ones pigment that relates to ones propensity for violence.

marcusmoon(576) Clarified
0 points

Skin pigment and violence do not relate causally, but they can correlate statistically. There is a fallacy in assuming all Blacks or all Black communities are a single gene pool. The Black genes in the middle class suburbs are much more likely to mix with any genes in the suburbs than they are to mix with any genes in the poor inner city districts.

Importantly, genepools do tend to cluster unrelated genes together. Because of this, when an environment selects out for a gene that contributes to survival, it may simultaneously preserve a gene that has nothing to do with surviving in that environment.

It is unclear whether there is a statistically significant difference between distinct American gene pools in the rate of various genes that contribute to traits like high aggression, low conscientiousness, low intelligence, and other characteristics known to have a high correlation with criminal activity.

We do know that different African American populations have different crime rates. Why would Milwaukee have a higher rate than Dallas, for example? Local culture is a likely influence, but there may be a genetic component that is more common in the Milwaukee gene pool than in the Dallas gene pool.

The fact that inner cities have higher violent crime rates than suburbs may also have a genetic component. As individuals from poor inner city districts achieve success, they tend to migrate to the suburbs, taking their genes (and whatever advantage those genes confer) with them. This leaves a higher concentration of "unsuccessful" genes, some of which correlate with criminal activity) in the inner city.

The result is selection in favor of keeping genes that predispose people to engage in particular sorts of criminal behaviors in the inner city. This can have the net effect of genetic drift in some populations toward higher aggression and lower conscientiousness and intelligence. The genes for darker pigment are just along for the ride, and have nothing to do with anything. The same factors contribute to similar issues in Appalachia, and why Appalachian communities differ so much from other majority White communities.

1 point

Nom I rarely ask the easy questions most people shy away from talking about theses issues and do anything to avoid taking a position , the racism card is played and used all the time when questions like this are asked and that normally stops any meaningful exchanges taking place .

Skin colour had to come into it because that's what all the stats are saying that the figures for African American crime rates are way higher than for any other group /class /colour that's a cold hard fact and cannot be denied .

Of course skin colour does not make one a criminal but the majority of criminals are indeed black so what are the causes ?

If poverty is claimed as the driving reason why is it still so in the U S ?

Are blacks totally powerless and have no other options except crime ?

Historical slavery was used as a justification for the plight of of modern day black Americans yesterday, my counter to that is look at my country as in Ireland and the wretched , ragged , starving victims of famine that fled to America only for the majority to be spit on , mocked , beaten and denied opportunity this was universal in its nature yet what happened , we succeeded, integrated and have people in all parts of American society from the top down .

What makes African Americans so different in this way ?

1 point

3 socioeconomic reasons: poverty, fatherlessness and culture.

Amarel(5669) Clarified
1 point

What is it about poverty that breeds violence ?

1 point

I wouldn't want to say it is a causal link because as far as I am aware there isn't good evidence for this (though it is widely accepted as the case). However, since blacks are poorer than whites on average and a correlation exists between poverty and crime it makes sense that blacks would have a higher crime rate than whites, provided other factors aren't confounding. An interesting exploration of the correlation between poverty and crime and potential causal factors can be found here:

https://link.springer.com/chapter/10.1007/978-0-306-48039-3_4

marcusmoon(576) Clarified
1 point

Amarel,

What is it about poverty that breeds violence ?

The correlation between poverty and violence, and the correlation between poverty and crime (in general) are very often put in the causal order you used, which is that the poverty is the cause.

I think it makes at least as much sense, and that there is a more direct causal link if we order them the other way around: Violence and crime cause poverty. This works on both an individual and community level.

When there is widespread violence/crime in a neighborhood, that disrupts commerce, causes potential employers to move their businesses elsewhere, raises prices on locally sold consumer goods, lowers property values, discourages/distracts students from focusing on their studies and maintaining good attendance, etc. All of these pretty directly cause poverty by limiting economic mechanisms for building wealth, such as steady local employment, entrepreneurship, home value appreciation, and accrual of personal and financial capital.

On top of this, incarceration almost guarantees poverty because it stops earning power while in jail/prison, limits opportunities afterward, leaves families/offspring without financial support, and retards enculturation of children whose parent/s are unable to guide them due to being incarcerated.

Sloth(2) Disputed
0 points

My understanding of what you have said, WinstonC, is that you believe all black people are raised without fathers, resulting in increased violence. I agree with you that poverty and culture are important factors in the way a person is raised, and I sincerely hope that your inclusion of "fatherlessness" was just a poorly played joke on a racial stereotype. In response to FactMachine, I can see how you would believe that one bad thing leads to another, but I believe a clear logical fallacy was committed in your argument. My interpretation of your argument is that black people are poor, and being poor leads to lack of intelligence, and that lack of intelligence leads to an unreasonable need to commit crimes to maintain their poor lifestyle. Unfortunately the facts you are listing have been scientifically proven false (click the link) and fail to prove that black people are more violent than white people. Individuals are more violent than others, regardless of skin color. Black people are not more violent than white people.

Supporting Evidence: Testosterone Differences (academic.oup.com)
Amarel(5669) Disputed
1 point

"My understanding of what you have said, WinstonC, is that you believe all black people"

Try again.

marcusmoon(576) Disputed
1 point

Sloth,

My understanding of what you have said, WinstonC, is that you believe all black people are raised without fathers, resulting in increased violence.

I appreciate that you are stating why you disagree so clearly, because it shows not just that you missed what Winston was actually saying, but because it helps identify the source of the misunderstanding. Thanks.

Part of the problem is that you assume an implied "all" when what is being discussed are statistical aggregates, and why different populations' statistical aggregates differ. The topic is not all African Americans, but violent African Americans.

All the published statistics make it clear that the vast majority of American Blacks, (as well as Whites, Hispanics, Asians, etc.) are NOT poor, NOT violent, and NOT criminals.

However, there is a marked difference between the rates of these things by demographic group. The question is why, and I think it is an important question.

My interpretation of your argument is that black people are poor, and being poor leads to lack of intelligence, and that lack of intelligence leads to an unreasonable need to commit crimes to maintain their poor lifestyle.

You inferred some unstated causal relationships, and muddled which things cause what in the stated/implied ones.

Part of the problem is that you SEEM to be looking for some indication of racism where there is none. For example you say: I sincerely hope that your inclusion of "fatherlessness" was just a poorly played joke on a racial stereotype

Neither a joke nor a stereotype.

Single Parent Household rates per the Kids Count Data Center

Asian/Pacific Islander - - 17%

White - - - - - - - - - - - - 25%

Hispanic - - - - - - - - - - 42%

Indian - - - - - - - - - - - 52%

Black - - - - - - - - - - - - 67%

It is fine to disagree with the data or the logic, but the accusations of racial stereotyping get in the way.

The tendency for some people to make accusations of racial stereotyping, and to declare things offensive when they dislike the facts is a lot of why honest conversations about things like this are so hard to have, and to make productive of useful analysis.

WinstonC(1225) Disputed
1 point

"My understanding of what you have said, WinstonC, is that you believe all black people are raised without fathers, resulting in increased violence."

No, I'm commenting on a trend that exists; blacks have a higher rate of fatherlessness than average. As Marcusmoon has already noted, this is indeed true (Source 1).

As for the study you cited in reference to Factmachine (you should have put this part on Factmachine's post), you appear to have linked the wrong one because testosterone levels, while related, are not equal to instances of violence. If measured by the proportion of violent crimes committed by the race relative to the proportion of the demographic that is of that race then yes, blacks are more violent than whites (Source 2). This isn't to say that this is genetic, as aforementioned we know of three socioeconomic factors mediating this relationship; poverty, fatherlessness and culture.

Sources:

(1) http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/2013/jul/29/don-lemon/cnns-don-lemon-says-more-72-percent-african-americ/

(2) https://www.channel4.com/news/factcheck/ factcheck-black-americans-commit-crime

I'd like to cite Ben Shapiro, "It has nothing to do with race and everything to do with culture."

Violence is not a gene encoded into the DNA of black people, nor is it that way for anyone on the planet. Often times, when you see this sort of violence occurring, it isn't most often taking place in middle-class suburban neighborhoods near middle-class public schools.

The top three cities with the highest murder rate (Detroit, Baltimore, St. Louis) have a murder rate (per 100k people) of 43.82, 55.37, and 59.29--respectively.

The African American population in these three cities is 81.55%, 63.7%, and 18%-respectively.

The poverty rates in these three cities are 40%, 24%, and 30%--respectively.

African Americans aren't more violent than white people. There are just more African Americans living in negatively-cultured cities in the US--the bulk of them, from birth--and growing up in harsher circumstances, impacting them in their later lives.

There are plenty of African-American men and women in the United States who have been brought up in a rough culture in the US that disallowed them from being able to access certain things in their younger years, but rise from it eventually. 75% of people who are born into the lower class do not stay in the lower class. If they finish high school, enter the workforce/get an education, don't have babies before getting married, you fall into that 75%. There are plenty of African-Americans who have achieved success after living in impoverished cities.

1 point

Poverty has molded much of African American culture, making it more of a struggle. The violence then births racism, making it more difficult even for those not born into the poverty.

0 points

Hello D:

I suggest your hate for black people colors your argument..

excon

PS> Ok, you can call ME a racist now.. Bwa ha ha ha ha.

Dermot(5736) Disputed
2 points

My stating a fact has you running for cover as usual and oddly enough I do not like black or white rapists , thieves or murderers so because you cannot address a simple question yet again you pathetically play your favourite race card ; so can you attempt to answer or do you wish to flee ?

But the whole site knows you're racist why state the obvious ?

0 points

And yet it is only whites who are serial killers and commit mass shootings. ;)

marcusmoon(576) Clarified
0 points

Jolie,

And yet it is only whites who are serial killers and commit mass shootings. ;)

Are you trying to imply that Blacks are less well organized, poorer planners, and have worse aim than Whites? ;)

Is a Black gang banger who kills multiple people on separate occasions a serial killer? Why or why not?

1 point

I was just trying to stir the pot and based on the responses below, my job here is done ;)

Antrim(1287) Disputed
0 points

Is what you're saying that the non-white massacres in Paris, Nice, London not to mention the 9/11 atrocity and so forth, should not be considered?

What does earth look like from the moon where you must have lived for the better part of your life.

Amarel(5669) Clarified
0 points

The DC Sniper team was black .

0 points

There are always exception to the rule ;)

0 points

Because African Americans are more likely to be in poverty, and as a consequence of that they're more likely to be raised surrounded by this culture of crime.

It's not genetic, it's social. Minorities are more likely to be involved with crime because they're more excluded from mainstream culture both economically and culturally.

0 points

Because african americans live in generally poorer areas, which results in more crime.

0 points

No race is more violent than others, what i will say is that black people are more hot-headed and will immediately lash out at any and everyone. Whereas, white people are more calculated and will bottle their rage until they are able to unleash it on the masses; hence all of these mass shootings. Black people lack the ability to face their rage outwards and often target their own demographic, instead of the people they constantly complain about (rich people, white people, government). whereas white people will joyfully kill any and everybody with determination and forethought. Violence has nothing to do with intelligence, you don't have to be intelligent to blow someones brains out. Instead, self-restraint, forethought, and temperance can largely determine a persons' ability to function as a human being.

0 points

They're bad asses whereas the whites are little wussy men? .........................................

-1 points

Most of the Americans I know who come from Africa are actually very polite, intelligent, and happy to be living in a country as free and prosperous as The United States.

Amarel(5669) Clarified
0 points

Yeah, "African American" is a terrible designation .

-1 points

It's a black thang....ya wuddn unastan .

-2 points