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Debate Info

60
30
yes no
Debate Score:90
Arguments:129
Total Votes:90
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Argument Ratio

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 yes (53)
 
 no (30)

Debate Creator

beastforever(555) pic



do animals have consciousness?

http://scienceline.org/2015/03/do-animals-have-consciousness/

yes

Side Score: 60
VS.

no

Side Score: 30
2 points

There are many levels of consciousness ranging from the simple survive and perpetuate yourself all the way up to deep contemplation. It's a sliding scale, not either you have it or you don't. Heck, as much credit as people give themselves for having consciousnes there are definitely some human mouth breathers out there who don't really have it.

And there is a tremendous arrogance to humans declaring they are the only ones capable of being conscious. When humans write into their ancient texts that indeed they are and God is the reason and animals are just there for us to eat and use that whole shebang is simply humans trumpeting humans. It proves no more than if a termite colony could communicate to you the reasons it deserves the eat your house.

Side: yes
1 point

all the way up to deep contemplation.

I wouldn't go ahead and say that humans are the highest possible level of consciousness.

There are many levels of consciousness ranging from the simple survive and perpetuate yourself all the way up to deep contemplation.

Which isn't much different from machines in design. Why limit yourself to evolutionary, organic systems? Are you implying that only a system that has evolved under natural selection, rather than been designed by another, capable of being conscious?

Side: no
1 point

Fair enough. I won't limit it then. ...............................................................

Side: no
Amarel(4987) Clarified
1 point

Are you implying that only a system that has evolved under natural selection, rather than been designed by another, capable of being conscious?

To date, we can only reasonably believe that organic evolved brains have consciousness. We don't know enough about the phenomenon of consciousness to know whether designed systems can be conscious. So far it is science fiction.

Side: yes
2 points

I believe they have a level of consciousness that we may not know of or understand yet. I know they are capable of the same emotions we are, mourning their dead, watching after their young, curiosity.....

Side: yes

I personally believe they do have some sort of consciousness, although what consciousness is for us might not be what it is for them..

Side: yes
2 points

I do think animals are conscious, simply because their brains are so similar to ours and we have consciousness (lets not go into zombie theory). They seem to demonstrate emotions, and while consciousness is by nature untestable even in humans, the only thing they lack relative to humans is attestations of consciousness. While their consciousness would be more primitive and presumably unequipped with language I still believe it exists.

I don't think most people like to think about this though, as they eat factory farmed food instead of free-range.

Side: yes
outlaw60(15500) Clarified Banned
1 point

"The state of being awake and aware of one's surroundings."

"While consciousness is by nature untestable even in humans"

Are you not awake now Leftist and aware of your surroundings ?

You on the Left are tooooooo entertaining !!!!!!!!!!!!!

Side: yes
NowASaint(1388) Clarified
1 point

Of course they are conscious and they don't want to be eaten alive. That is why cut their heads off and drain the blood before we eat them.

Side: yes
Amarel(4987) Clarified
2 points

Which do you believe should be most heavily weighted in determining consciousness; whether a being makes choices, or whether a being has experiences?

Side: yes
outlaw60(15500) Clarified Banned
1 point

The state of being awake and aware of one's surroundings.

Do you personally believe you are conscious ????

Side: yes
WinstonC(1226) Disputed
1 point

Consciousness can be defined that way, however another definition was being used by both the questioner and myself. The definition we are using is the subjective properties of experience, or qualia (source 1, definition 2). If you're genuinely interested in consciousness as we are referring to it then check out the link below (source 2)

(1) http://medical-dictionary.thefreedictionary.com/consciousness

(2) http://www.iep.utm.edu/qualia/

Side: no
1 point

Hello B:

Yes, and they go to heaven too............

excon

Side: yes
outlaw60(15500) Clarified Banned
1 point

Hey STUPID an animal has no soul unless you agree with the Muslims that goats are for breeding by Muslims LMMFAO

Side: yes
1 point

Well Duh !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

The state of being awake and aware of one's surroundings.

Are you on the Left truly that confused ?

Side: yes

That's easy to find out. Can they make decisions by themselves without being commanded about it or it representing automated stimuli?

Yes, they can. The closest that come to humans seem to be dogs (since they're the most domesticated by us).

Side: yes
Amarel(4987) Clarified
2 points

It's possible to have a robot that makes decisions on its own, without being compelled, and yet has no experience of the decision making process. Thus, your test for consciousness is not sufficient to determine consciousness.

Side: yes
1 point

It's possible to have a robot that makes decisions on its own, without being compelled, and yet has no experience of the decision making process.

I'd like to see it, for there seems no reason to believe that such a scenario might be possible.

Thus, your test for consciousness is not sufficient to determine consciousness.

I don't remember what exactly that refutation was called. The philosophical zombie problem, perhaps?

Side: no
beastforever(555) Clarified
1 point

It's possible to have a robot that makes decisions on its own, without being compelled, and yet has no experience of the decision making process.

robots run on code, which is logic, and hence indirectly we have compelled them to use the code lines to make decisions.

Side: yes
beastforever(555) Clarified
1 point

hmm, even if they do respond to external stimuli, the question that creates a problem is when we ask if they too have a sense of self, just like we do, most of which forms meaning to the word "consciousness".

Side: yes
1 point

You won't be getting that by asking them about it. The best you can do is to test it by it's effects, as I mentioned there.

Without the effects of consciousness, it'd be a meaningless and redundant concept anyway.

Side: no
1 point

It is most reasonable to assume that animals, who have brains and act as though they have consciousness, in fact do have consciousness. I don't think this is a great revelation as people have believed and denied this idea at various times and places throughout history.

Side: yes

Of course they have consciousness. They are alive and react to stimuli.

Are you asking if they are aware of their own existence?

Side: yes
beastforever(555) Clarified
1 point

To be aware of one's existence is itself a criteria for consciousness.

Think about it, would you actually use the word consciousness?

Side: yes

They have done experiments to test animal consciousness and their main test subjects they work with are chimps. They found out that the main difference between a chimps consciousness and our own is that they can't comprehend that other living things are experiencing reality from a different perspective.

Side: yes

They found out that the main difference between a chimps consciousness and our own is that they can't comprehend that other living things are experiencing reality from a different perspective.

good to know that.

consciousness is different for them and us, they have a "chimp" consciousness, while we have consciousness, the way it is..

Side: yes
1 point

The chicken I ate last week had no consciousness, and I was thankful for that as it was tasty and did not fight as I ate it.

Side: no
AlofRI(2816) Clarified
1 point

They had a chicken on "America's Got Talent" last week that played ... I believe it was ... America the beautiful ... on the piano, and never missed a note. Must've done it "unconsciously" ???

Side: yes
NowASaint(1388) Clarified
1 point

well it would have been unconscious before I ate it if I ate it.......I think the one I ate was not the same chicken that was playing the piano.

Of course animals have consciousness. That does not make them equal to human, which is usually the illogical leap of logic people who ask the question are trying to make....it's part of the animal rights religion.

Side: yes
NowASaint(1388) Clarified
1 point

The keys are lighting before the chicken pecks them...it's just pecking at the lights, it does not know the song. Even if it did know the song, big deal. I've seen a parrot sing Pop! Goes the Weasel", one of the funniest things I remember.....the bird sat dead still silent about three seconds before it's head popped up as it said "Pop!!"

Side: yes
1 point

try the same with a dead human body, I don't know about tasty, but I'm sureit won't fight back.

Side: yes
NowASaint(1388) Clarified
1 point

I guess you think you are just a monkey so eating your dead body would be the same as eating a monkey.

Side: yes