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Debate Score:27
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 A Terrible Argument Against the Existence of God (21)

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ThePyg(6737) pic



A Terrible Argument Against the Existence of God

Something I notice that some Atheists like to bring up is the whole "if God exists, whence cometh evil" argument.  Now, I can see how therem are flaws with religious beliefs and such, but I sometimes see people liking to say "God is a dick if he exists."

Really, folks?  We're talking about the Transcendent and the Para-normal.  God, if he exists, lives outside of our simpleton, mortal understanding of shit like "God's Plan" or "Morality."

I don't believe in God for the same reasons that I don't believe in the Easter Bunny.  Never seen one and have never seen any evidence.  I'm not going to act all arrogant and exert my authority on the issues of Morality by saying "God is a dick if he lets children starve to death in Africa."  Why?  A dick in the standards of mortality?  Sure, I'd say so.  But God is supposedly immortal and para-normal and shit.

So what I'm really seeing here is that when people say "God's an asshole for letting the holocaust happen" they're kind of just being... assholes.  

Get serious, folks, and stop making Atheists look bad.

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4 points

I agree that "God is a dick" is a shitty argument, but when applied in both forms of the problem of evil, it's the best argument against a Judeo-Christian like God. Remember that Christianity, Judaism and Islam all assume objective morality, outlined in their books. If God violates this morality, we can set up the problem of evil.

It should be applied more efficiently than your examples, but "transcendent paranormal shit" is an even worse rebuttal.

1 point

Actually we don't assume objective morality, you see, that is why you cannot simply take the good things from every religeon, so you need the creator to decide. I mean, who else will?

ChuckHades(3197) Disputed
1 point

OK, correct me if I'm wrong, as my knowledge of Islam is limited, but you have the ten commandments, yes?

ThePyg(6737) Disputed
1 point

So it's an argument that applies mostly (only) to the Abrahamic type laws. And once again, assumption that you know what God is thinking.

Consider that man wrote the bible, trying to interpret as best as possible what God was saying?

I just don't see this fallacy as working greatly against the existence of most Gods. If God believes we should obey Moral Law, how do we complain when he allows or possibly even causes something like the holocaust? do we complain when our parents drink even they tell us not to?

You're ASSUMING that you know the scheme of things.

ChuckHades(3197) Disputed
1 point

So it's an argument that applies mostly (only) to the Abrahamic type laws.

At it's strongest, it is probably required to apply it to Abrahamic morality, so that it is impossible to rebut on the grounds of subjective morality.

And once again, assumption that you know what God is thinking.

If the three texts are to be believed, then they are the word of God.

Consider that man wrote the bible, trying to interpret as best as possible what God was saying?

If the ten commandments are too vague to draw conclusions on God's morality, that is in itself an argument against the existence of God, or at least whether he authored the Bible/Q'ran/Torah.

I just don't see this fallacy as working greatly against the existence of most Gods

Nor is it supposed to. Note how I said "Judeo-Christian like God".

If God believes we should obey Moral Law, how do we complain when he allows or possibly even causes something like the holocaust?

Because such an event is contradictory to his nature, if the doctrine is to be believed.

do we complain when our parents drink even they tell us not to?

False analogy. Our parents are not omnipotent, omniscient, omnibenevolent beings. Their existence isn't invalidated by hypocrisy; a Judeo-Christian like God's is.

You're ASSUMING that you know the scheme of things.

I base all of my claims on the matter in the very teachings of the Abrahamic religions. Unless they are willing to argue against the divine authority of the scriptures, I am making no more assumptions than anyone else.

Perhaps we are coming in from different angles. I agree that simply stating "God is a dick" is a terrible argument, but when applied in the problem of evil, and bolstered with Abrahamic scripture, it transforms into what I am arguing, something rather effective, if you don't mind me saying.

3 points

I try to avoid guessing at what God would be thinking if he was real. But if I were to talk about the problem of evil just from an angle of 'what was he thinkng?', it doesn't even seem that farfetched. If you're a parent, you have to learn to let your child introduce bad things into their life, so they can learn to make choices and deal with consequences. Of course, a difference is that parents probably have the end goal of making a capable adult, which requires resilience and experience with pain, while God's end goal is to let everyone into heaven, which doesn't require those things.

I have seen people say before that something perfectly good couldn't possibly create evil. I haven't really explored that, and I haven't used it, but it seems a little diferent different than guessing at God's thoughts regarding evil.

I have a problem with people refusing to assign responsibility at all to God for bad thigs happening. It's one thing to suppose reasons why he might, and it's another to pretend he can be omniscient and omnipotent and somehow not be responsible for bad things.

1 point

Assumption that these "bad things" you speak of hold any relevance to the scheme of things.

2 points

in my honest opinion god is a figure that gives people hope and something to put their faith in when all else lets out and they have nothing else left for them.

1 point

God invented pain...

He invented everything.

1 point

If you ask any doctor he will tell you that pain is a good thing........................................... Because it can be a alarm of some sort to tell you if you are killing yourself.

Dremorius(861) Disputed
1 point

God also invented the icky lusty way on how we reproduce... and he also invented hell- only a mind as twisted as hell is capable of such evil...