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Debate Info

75
67
Democracy Capitalism
Debate Score:142
Arguments:113
Total Votes:149
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Argument Ratio

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 Democracy (61)
 
 Capitalism (52)

Debate Creator

Kinda(1649) pic



Capitalism vs. Democracy

Democracy is one of capitalisms greatest enemies and vice versa.

Which one do you think is more important to society and for what reasons?

Democracy

Side Score: 75
VS.

Capitalism

Side Score: 67
5 points

if this were truly a democracy, capitalism as we know it would be dead. fact of the matter is, each time a country tries to be democratic, they aim for socialism, but the u.s. and other western capitalists always seem to go in for the sabatoge. america claims to support democracy, but if you look at their foreign policy, its the exact opposite.

Supporting Evidence: war on democracy (video.google.com)
Side: democracy
ThePyg(6738) Disputed
1 point

If this were truly a Democracy, being gay would be banned.

Democracy merely gives power to the majority, who vote with their emotions as opposed to regard for civil liberties.

Capitalism would be banned? Makes sense, people don't believe in civil liberties, they believe in their morals and entitlements.

Thank God we have the Constitution.

Side: Capitalism
tyronjamison(81) Disputed
2 points

No, being a democratic country doesn't mean that that just because the majority of people voted for something, it means the government has to take action. For example: Say that the majority of population in Canada wants people who wear turbans on Canadian soil to be executed, or sent to jail. Just because Canada is democratic, doesn't mean that people wearing turbans need to be dealt with, why is this? because it infringes upon the Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms(FUNDAMENTAL FREEDOMS in the Charter to be exact). Same if same-sex marriage was banned, it would violate Fundamental Freedoms because it takes away your freedom of association, and it also violates Equality Rights because you like your own sex.

Side: democracy
3 points

What type of democracy is possible when "In the United States at the end of 2001, 10% of the population owned 71% of the wealth and the top 1% owned 38%. On the other hand, the bottom 40% owned less than 1% of the nation's wealth" - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Distribution_of_wealth#In_the_United_States ?

and America isn't a democracy anyways, its a democratic republic who has a unrepresentative electoral system. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Duverger's_law and http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electoral_College_(United_States)#Criticisms_of_the_Electoral_College

add to that how much money it takes just to have a viable chance to run in an election and its pretty clear that the interests of the top 10% of the population is certainly catered to more then other groups. Their voice is louder so to speak.

Side: democracy
3 points

Um, what?

The debate shows a fundamental misunderstanding of both. Any government, democratic or otherwise, is impossible without some means of wealth distribution. Any form of wealth distribution, capitalist or otherwise, is impossible without government.

You need both.

Side: what the hell are you talking about
1 point

Lol, I don't know were the Debate creators coming from?

"Democracy is one of capitalisms greatest enemies" XD

Side: what the hell are you talking about
3 points

1) This argument is flawed to begin with, because Democracy and Capitalism can co-exist.

2) Democracy... every citizen gets a vote, to select a representative that he or she believes will govern on his behalf.

3) Capitalism is just the concept that private citizens can own and exchange property however they see fit.

That being said, let's assume we're trying to decide which is MORE important, rather than which should be the law of the land.

That being decided, it's Democracy.

All you have to do is answer this question:

Would you rather your fate be decided by someone who was born owning all the land around you (who could in fact be very greedy and evil), or would you rather decide for yourself which person decides your fate (who if is evil, the mistake was yours for choosing him)?

In one instance, you have a say, in another instance, you are put upon by prior generations.

Democracy wins, hands down. You don't think this is accurate? Capitalism is the system by which Paris Hilton exists with more money than you'll ever see, and simultaneously has zero skills and a horrible personality.

Side: democracy
1 point

Democracy wins, hands down. You don't think this is accurate? Capitalism is the system by which Paris Hilton exists with more money than you'll ever see, and simultaneously has zero skills and a horrible personality.

Lol

Question isn't whether or not they can co-exist.. because they do. Question is which is more important.

Side: democracy
KAZ4541(35) Disputed
1 point

democracy can never co exist with capitalism because in order for there to be rich people, there has to be poor people, and the rich people will never want the interests of the poor to be represented. thats why corporations are constantly busting up unions. it is also why the corporations always send economic hitmen into countries to overthrow democratically elected governments who do not allow sweat shops to be opened. one obvious example is indonesia. many other examples exist throughout latin america.

Side: Capitalism
2 points

Seeing as I'm anti-capitalist.

Democracy is more important - not because it keeps capitalism at bay but because it gives everybody a say and the ability to be manipulated rather than a small amount of people.

Side: democracy
2 points

Capitalism vs. Democracy is not even compatible nor substituted, and they are complements of two different systems.

Capitalism is a economic system while Democracy is a political system.

Seeing that you are anti-capitalist, luckily, you live in the socialist democratic constitutional monarchy of the UK.

Side: Not Compatible
Kinda(1649) Disputed
1 point

You've misunderstood.

Firstly the main proponent of the argument is to ask what you feel is more important to uphold in a nation

Secondly the 2 ideals conflict. Capitalism concentrates power to the rich whereas democracy distributes power by giving everybody equal voting power.

So with that can you now answer the question and tell me which you think is more important, capitalism or democracy

Side: democracy

I like voting.

Side: democracy
1 point

You cannot debate on which is better due to the fact the capitalism is an economical system and democracy is governmental system. People these days -__-

Side: Democracy
1 point

If we characterize Democracy and Capitalism as enemies, must we assume that one must defeat the other? Such a defeat would be comparable to stopping a high-speed train with a concrete wall. In order for our Society to continue to thrive, we must agree on a common interest shared by the conflicting ideologies of Democracy and Capitalism and build our future through a cooperative effort that satisfies the needs of both. Otherwise, we are, as many have characterized, an out of control herd stampeding toward a cliff. Our downfall will come from our own arrogance, ignorance and indifference.

Side: Democracy
1 point

In the USA we are not capitalist, we are free market. We have anti Trust laws that break up monopolies.

Sometimes, especially in our current environment, there is an unfair over correction that is harmful to a business owner. They aren’t big enough to sustain it, but are forced into loosing their businesses because of “a war on capitalism” Like the raisin farmer in California. I believe he won in the Supreme Court, but he didn’t deserve the cost he incurred to stay alive.

These are the people that need protection from this society we are becoming!

http://www.forbes.com/sites/danielfisher/2015/06/22/supreme-court-extends-fifth-amendment-to-raisins/#3f7e9e126f75

Teddy Roosevelt broke up the capitalist in the early 1900's. And it needed to be broken. They built great industry. We are where we are because of them. It was corrected, they kept the wealth they made, but the monopoly was broken and out of 1 came many oil and gas companies, for competitive free market competition. .

But keep in mind, without these businesses we'd be far behind in the progress we know and enjoy today. And also they employed much of the population of the day. Although, we did need corrections to improve working conditions, increase safety, and pay higher wages. But the beauty of America isn’t that we were perfect. But the systems we have to correct greed when greed doesn’t correct itself!

We are a land of equal opportunity

Anyone can take an idea and create a successful business, and charge "what the market will bare" and make a living and/or gain wealth.

Many have overcome obstacles for the successes they achieve, with risk.

And as far as inheritance and the hand me down wealth - inheritance tax is probably the highest proportional tax in our society. So if you consider "fair share" we accumulate wealth to provide a better life for our families and to pass to our children.

The starting point, or tipping point varies of both failure and success in over generations. And sometimes it continues as it is for generations without change.

American success is built on ideas, enterprise, risk, and the wants and perceived needs of the general market.

An Informative History Lesson on Capitalism

https://www.khanacademy.org/humanities/us-history/history-survey/us-history-survey/v/20th-century-capitalism-and-regulation-in-the-united-states

Many through our history are "capitalist" but not many did so without loss, even bankruptcy.

Here is a Capitalist Parade – And while your at it look at the giving back some of these people did. Do you think that would happen in the USSR or Denmark or Turkey?

Milton Hershey – Drooped out of school, he was a poor student. Apprenticed for 4 years then - after two failed attempts, he set up the Lancaster Caramel Co. sold it then made the worlds largest Choc factory – then built a community and a home and school for children.

Walt Disney - fired by a newspaper editor because, "he lacked imagination and had no good ideas, started a number of businesses that didn't last too long and ended with bankruptcy and failure

Henry Ford – businesses failed and left him broke five times

R H Macy - Macy started seven failed business before finally hitting big with his store in New York City

F W Woolworth - Before starting his own business, young Woolworth worked at a dry goods store and was not allowed to wait on customers because his boss said he lacked the sense needed to do so. I guess he said F... YOU, and opened his own store, followed by successful chains of stores!

Good ole Colonel Sanders and his Fried Chicken - rejected 1,009 times before a restaurant accepted it

Albert Einstein - teachers and parents to think he was mentally handicapped

Thomas Edison - teachers told Edison he was "too stupid to learn anything

Sidney Poitier brutally rejected by American Negro Theater for his heavy Bohamian accent

Others with similar stories - H J Heinz - Emily Dickinson - Lucille Ball - P T Barnum - Fred Astaire - Jerry Seinfeld

http://www.onlinecollege.org/2010/02/16/ 50-famously-successful-people-who-failed-at-first/

And African Americans – Successful in the face of adversity

http://www.theroot.com/photos/2010/02/black businesshistoryanentrepreneurialtimeline.html

Like anything in the social front, with twisting, and media led head hunting, and the public's eagerness to follow without knowledge. Capitalism is redefined, then accepted for whatever they want.

Like the urban racial legends believed with a fury, that Democrats and Republicans switched places. So those Republicans who believed in Civil rights and paid for it putting their money and their lives where their heart was on the matter, are NOW called White Supremacists, while Democrats who were always white supremacists (and also some Black slave owners also) are hailed as civil rights heroes!

I hate to say, I’m not name calling. But that’s just stupid!But if we think its true then it must be. Regardless of history of facts and even the blatant manipulations in our society today.

Supporting Evidence: An Informative History Lesson on Capitalism (www.khanacademy.org)

Supporting Evidence: Supporting Evidence: An Informative History Lesson on Capitalism ( (www.khanacademy.org)
Side: Democracy
1 point

A democracy is a system of government while capitalism is an economic system and they are like oil and water. Capitalism puts corporate profits above all else and abhors democratic decisions or controls that impede increasing profits. Capitalism aims at reducing workers compensation in favor of higher profits and abhors unions. Slavery is a goal of capitalism. While capitalists say they favor a free market, they strive for monopolies and as they continue to swallow up smaller corporations there is not where to go but implosion.

Side: Democracy
4 points

Well, despite this debate being retarded, I will say that Liberty is more important than popular opinion.

This is why we have a Constitution in the United States; so that Liberty can not be voted out by the Majority. Democracy is a good system for issues that are not a question on individual rights, but for issues like private property and civil liberties, there shouldn't be a populist decision. The decision should be natural: Liberty comes first.

but they are perfectly compatible and basically it's how it's always been. even back during the City-State democracies of the Greek times. Merchants sold their goods and consumers had choice. And, of course, the big issue of Communist Dictatorships vs. Capitalist Democracies when the USA and USSR were at a rivalry.

The USA has always been Capitalist. Over time, regulation started to grow majorly once the Industrial Revolution took place. Before, Capital was farm land, saloons and the occasional oil tycoon. Once work became a 9-5 thing and life was becoming easier (people didn't have to worry about dying if they didn't water their crops during the Spring), the working class decided to raise the issue of worker's rights (since many even believed that slaves were treated better than workers). So laws were passed, and then FDR comes along during a Depression. He puts in laws that make government even larger and more involved with business regulation, and even though it technically didn't work, the War helped boost the economy, so everyone thought that it did. So that's how it's been since.

Are we still Capitalist? Compared to the rest of the world, we are very Capitalist. All we have, really, is Ireland, Israel, Australia and Japan left to back us on Capitalism. The rest of the world is either Fascist, Socialist, Social Democracy, Communist or even Hierarchy/Monarchy. Or just some shitass Dictator who has his own crazy laws (like Iran).

But America, one of the first countries to bring Democracy back into Modern Civilizations (let's face it, they made it popular again, no matter what you skeptics might think on the other developing countries in Democracy) has been very Capitalist for years.

What does this all say? That your debate is stupid and doesn't work. Capitalism can work with Democracy.

Side: Capitalism
Kinda(1649) Disputed
0 points

Cuntface, you've got millions of facts wrong. But who cares what you think - you'd rather have people running around crazed up on drugs raping and killing each other than give up your fucking liberties (lmao!)

90% of your post isn't even relevant to the question. All you've got is a rant about how deregulation is good (even though the global economic meltdown proves it's bad) and that regulation is bad (even though it's been the real reason for America's economic advancement) and how you're capitalist etc.

Capitalism is the hoarding of power in the hands of 1% of America's population v.s democracy which is the distribution of power into 100% of America's population

Side: democracy
MegaDittos(571) Disputed
3 points

"democracy which is the distribution of power into 100% of America's population"------------- really just 51%

Side: Capitalism
ThePyg(6738) Disputed
1 point

Right, because making drugs illegal has helped so much in stopping addiction.

Once we accept that drugs can never be stopped, we can effectively help people even better. But as long as we pretend that we can stop drug use with unnecessary legislation, addiction and crime will always be rampant.

To you Socialists, you seem to forget that freedom is what keeps us safe in the end. A hostile government keeps people in the dark, making it unsafe for everyone else.

Capitalism is merely the use of capital in order to extend business. Nothing in the definition says that it's Corporatism (which is actually against libertarianism and capitalism).

Side: Capitalism
Houston(187) Disputed
1 point

It's funny how you say Pyg has facts wrong, when you yourself have them, too. 10% of Americans have 90% of the wealth. 1% of Americans doesn't have "all" of it.

Capitalism is the hoarding of power in the hands of 1% of America's population v.s democracy which is the distribution of power into 100% of America's population

Capitalism works through exchanging goods and money, not hoarding it. In a capitalist country, I sell you a ham, you pay me 5 bucks or so for that ham. I buy something else with that 5 bucks, that keeps the economy flowing.

Side: Capitalism

Capitalism and Democracy are unequivocally the best separate forms of economic and political systems.

Therefore, capitalism is truly unattainable without democracy because ultimately capitalism without democracy eventaully turns toward fascism and corporatism.

Whereas, democracy is also truly unattainable without capitalism because ultimately democracy without capitalism eventually turns toward socialism or communism.

However, for the sake of the debate, between the two, capitalism is still better standing on its own.

Side: Capitalism
Kinda(1649) Disputed
1 point

Therefore, capitalism is truly unattainable without democracy because ultimately capitalism without democracy eventaully turns toward fascism and corporatism.

Whereas, democracy is also truly unattainable without capitalism because ultimately democracy without capitalism eventually turns toward socialism or communism.

So you're saying if they're balanced right (like ying and yang - democracy good capitalism evil) it makes a great system?

Side: democracy
3 points

Apparently, the relation between economic and political freedom is too much to handle.

Economic freedom is an end in itself and is indispensable towards political freedom.

The preservation of freedom requires the elimination of such concentration of power by dispersal and distribution of power as a system of checks and balances.

By removing economic activity from the control of politics, the market eliminates this source of power.

Economic power can be dispersed while political power is much more difficult to decentralize. If economic freedom is absent, concentration of power is inevitable.

Therefore, in a democracy, the majority will always gain the concentration of power, but economic power fights back.

So, America is a democracy and capitalist, and without capitalism, the wealthy would absolutely have no power because of democracy's power is vested in the majority, and they would take that power away, thus, capitalism does keep it on a even level. Yet, it doesn't appear level because political power is not as materialist as economic power. In other words, there is more money vested in economic power.

Side: Capitalism
1 point

Why do you keep claiming that Capitalism is somehow evil? Capitalism is just trade. You have something I want, and I have something you want so let's trade. I'm not sure what's evil about this, since both sides are benefitting, but I'm sure you'll give me some hilarious reasons.

Side: Capitalism
0 points

In a democracy, once the non-producers out-number the producers the non-producers will vote themselves profits. Profits should go to the producers of a society through hard work, not voting one selves what has to be taken from a producer.

Side: Capitalism
aveskde(1935) Disputed
1 point

In a democracy, once the non-producers out-number the producers the non-producers will vote themselves profits. Profits should go to the producers of a society through hard work, not voting one selves what has to be taken from a producer.

This statement forgets the fact that producers "work" through their base of employees (or non-producers).

Side: democracy
1 point

What is your point? This is what hierarchy capitalism constitutes.

Side: Capitalism
MegaDittos(571) Disputed
0 points

Business owners never worked? The greatness of capitalism allows those who work and work hard to one day own a business and provide jobs to others (make non-producers producers) and you look at that as a bad thing. You must have a problem once they get to that point where they hire others and make them work?Take away these people and you have a third world country and I don't see many people immigrating there.

Side: Capitalism