CreateDebate is a social debate community built around ideas, discussion and democracy.
If this is your first time checking out a debate, here are some quick tips to help get you started:
Arguments with the highest score are displayed first.
Argument replies (both in favor and in opposition) are displayed below the original argument.
To follow along, you may find it helpful to show and hide the replies displayed below each argument.
To vote for an argument, use these icons:
You have the power to cast exactly one vote (either up or down) for each argument.
Once you vote, the icon will become grayed out and the argument's score will change.
Yes, you can change your vote.
Debate scores, side scores and tag scores are automatically calculated by an algorithm that primarily takes argument scores into account.
All scores are updated in real-time.
To learn more about the CreateDebate scoring system, check out the FAQ.
When you are ready to voice your opinion, use the Add Argument button to create an argument.
If you would like to address an existing argument, use the Support and Dispute link within that argument to create a new reply.
We can start by listening to them. I don't know what more we should do. If they are not understandable, sick Israel on them.
They are just a bunch of rowdy punks that seem to want our attention, so we give them that and they start making incredible claims... oh well, they waisted their time talking...
It's ultimately up to the governments that let these people exist to do something about it, and I think they should show some initiative by requesting U.N. support.
Lol. That is what Israel is for! They kick ass and take names! But they do more than just kick ass, they kick ass where it hurts the foundation of societies. So the U.N. doesn't have to do anything, Israel will take care of it all! ;D
LOL. That's so politically incorrect.... am I rubbing off on you ;)
You know, I wish there was a forum were we could talk to them but in order to have a productive conversation both sides need to exist on the same plane. How do you have what one may consider a reasonable conversation with someone that thinks you're Satan and should be put to death?
When have they tried having a conversation? I don't remember that. I remember them blowing themselves and others up. And yeah, I consider someone who doesn't value human life as unreasonable and deserving of being dealt with. NOTE: I don't think of them as inhuman nor did I ever say they were.
Try to learn some history on the subject, and you'd probably understand why they're all so pissed. American has been funding middle eastern genocides for years. Saddam Hussien was funded by America, until we suddenly decided to impose democracy on them. America (and the UK) continuously support Isreal.
What we need to do to deal with radical Islam is this... stop butting in. Stop funding them. Stop attacking them. Just leave them alone and let them get on with it. Stop mindlessly supporting Isreal. Stop telling people they can't have nuclear technology when we have thousands of nuclear weapons ready to rock and roll at any given notice. Has it ever occured to you that we support Isreal, we're stocked with nukes, and we keep going to war with middle eastern countries to impose OUR way of life onto them? Just because we think (rightly) that our way of doing things is beter doesn't give us the right to impose it on others. Let them deal with their own issues.
If I was in their situation, I'd be pretty ticked off too.
By the way, I don't in any way sympathise with terrorism, or islam for that matter. The world would be a much better place with Islam (and religion in general). BUT what I do hate it the western world talking about middle eastern and islamic countries like they're all mentalists hell bent on destroying us. Sure, they have their share of nutters, but so does everywhere else.
Anyway, as a I said before. The best way to deal with radical islam is leave them the crap alone, stop bossing them about, and let them get on with it.
It's not the human life that they do not value, it's what exists inside of the humans. An alien value system, that even you show a lack of understanding about.
You only saw them kill themselves because you didn't pay attention beforehand (most likely because you have your own life and don't live in the region). It's like an iceberg, you only see the part that sticks out of the water. These 'people who do not value human life' are fighting because they believe that human life should be different, that we are tainting life... why else would they die to kill "innocent" people? They obviously see that your life is corrupt and interfering with theirs, and they are willing to sacrifice their lives to save their way of life... that's not devaluing life, that's the opposite. All you see though, obviously, is your freedom, and then these people coming out of the dark, from places that you don't understand (or care to) and then killing people, but you're missing the part where they kill themselves too. They are heroic, in their minds. They are giving their lives for the same reason a "good" man would stand in front of a bullet for a child... but you don't get it, and call them bad and imagine that they all just crawl out of caves hating freedom.
You are, essentially, making the exact same mistake they are in attacking. You are not understanding that these people have different cultures, different beliefs, and entirely different value systems.
The ones that kill themselves may think the way you describe. I don't care about them. I care about the ones that are using the suicide bombers; the radical imams that want to take control of the world and force their views on the world. Those are the ones we should target.
Well of coarse. We should target anyone that is a threat to anyone else... but not all "radicals" are the one's killing themselves. Not all radical liberals protest. It takes a certain type of person to go that far...
I don't really get what you're trying to tell me. What I'm saying is that there's little we can do about suicide bombers. We can tighten security and find them before they hurt anyone. But where we can have the greatest impact is on taking down the financial backers and the organizers.
Why no conversation, you ask? I'm not an expert on the middle-east, or US foreign policy, but I'm assuming that people don't resort to sacrificing their lives for a message unless they feel that they have no voice. Why do monks set themselves ablaze as a form of protest?
To say that suicide bombers don't respect human life is a contradiction. Martyrs (for that is how they view themselves) recognize the value of life, as well as the shockwaves produced by extinguishing it. Would crushing daisies produce the same result as blowing up a bus full of people? Probably not, because human lives are so much more valuable than flowers. To have no concept whatsoever of the value of life is to be inhuman. To label your enemies as impossible to understand is to vilify them.
Every human is born with some capacity to reason. Some people are just given the wrong information, or easily swayed by the conviction of others.
This is actually a valid topic to debate, although some of the responses so far don't seem very productive. There are ways to "deal" with extremism other than ignoring them or using violence.
For example, in 2004, Saudi Arabia implemented a rehabilitation program for al Qaeda members willing to denounce the group, and offered them amnesty. After doing this, they went though counseling, and participated in religious discussions.
"The prisoners would meet in groups with respected clerics like Hawali, debating the tenets of al-Qaeda and whether these beliefs were true to Islam. As prisoners brought up rationales for terrorism, the clerics would use Islam to refute them. The group discussions were interspersed with one-on-one meetings with clerics and psychologists." -June 2007 Atlantic Monthly
It's like intervention for drug addicts or alcoholics in a way. Do we imprison all drug-users and then call it quits? There's a reason for programs like D.A.R.E., because people aren't (usually) born addicted to meth. Rehabilitation and prevention are important in "dealing with" radical Islam.
"Of the 1,500 Saudis who have entered the program since it began in 2004, the Saudi interior ministry claims that some 500 have been rehabilitated and, according to Prince Turki, “brought back from al-Qaeda.” While these graduates are not walking out of prison ready to make peace with Israel, they have renounced terrorism."
The article wasn't specific about the fate of the other 1,000 detained members, but I'm assuming they remained imprisoned. Imagine though, one out of three people who had been sucked into this warped mode of thinking walked away with a changed perspective. Five-hundred lives saved, and how many possible casualties averted?
According to the article, it was a combination of factors that curbed terrorism in Saudi Arabia. For one, all the violence pissed off the locals, and the ideals lost popular support. The government also conducted raids to ferret out extremists, so force is obviously needed. I just wonder why our government's policies don't include a program like this instead of the black holes of Guantanamo Bay and Abu Ghraib.
I think there would be problems with attempting to rehabilitate from a facility like Guantanamo. One of the methods used in the Saudi program was to reconnect the person with his family, and use their support/disappointment to help them along. Given the years of mistreatment and isolation, it doesn't seem that a rehabilitation program would be effective. How do you convince someone who's been tortured that you now want to help them to broaden their perspectives? How close does "rehabilitation" come to reeducation?
But a terrorist's family normally support the terrorist point of view. You would have to reeducate the entire family. Who would you reconnect the family to in order to use their support/disappointment to help the entire family along?
Deal with them in the same fashion and eye for an eye it is all they understand. They love the idea of death for thier beliefs as you love life. Areyou willing to die on any given day for what you belive in?
"We" as Jews, Christians, Agnosts, Athiests, and other non-Muslims DO NOT "deal with radical Islam". It is up to Muslims to decide the fate of fundamentalist Islam just as it is up to Christians here in the US to keep the Christian fundamentalists in line. But since I haven't seen the Christians stopping the Christ Fundies, how can Americans criticize Muslims for not stopping Mohammed Fundies? "One nation under hypocrisy..."
Yeah but Christ Fundies don't go around blowing people up. Are you suggesting we do nothing so as not to appear hypocritical and hope their brethren deal with them?
Really? Christian fundamentalists are harmless? What was Waco about? What's with the polygamist family here in TX? Jeez, I live in TX and can point to neighbors who are dangerous Fundies... unfortunately its not a crime to be insane.
friends to discus realistically: you have to knew Islam &what;is it call for? then ,when Islam become radical(as u said)?why these people call for jihad or mortal ? what are they asking for?
1-let me tell you . before Geneva treaty since > 1400 years Muhammad order his followers not to cut a green tree from any land they open it so what about human dears?
2- before Israel exists there was no radical Islam .....
before oil no one hear about meddle east except as a path for trading with the far east ( India).
3- what they want u knew " liberate AL aqsa mosque from Jews & have freedom for expression in the front of their Governor ( who are supported by Western governess for mutual benefits)
so; let Jewish people return their home again (Europe&USA;&Africa;) and all the world enjoy peace
how to deal like you deal your brother if you think he mistakes ??? thanks for reading
To have a dialog with islamic radicals is completely ridicoulous. If you give them some, they will wait a little and then do the same thing shortly....North Korea anyone?....simply said, ignorance breeds.
First, cut off the funds to radical islam by stopping the purchasing of oil and other goods from those muslim countries. Second, ask the government of those islamic countries to take care of their own business or someone else will do it for them in a way that may not end up in a very pleasant way. It is very unfortunate when in some cases military is the only way to solve a problem.
Talk to them what a Joke they would cut your throat before talking to you an eye for an eye is all they understand. The glory be to allah just for killing a zion see how far that gets you.
Man, I have a good idea too, let's just nuke everyone that disagrees with us!
See, this is why the world hates westerners, because of the few people in our population that don't realize that they're being as bad as the radicals and should just keep their mouths shut.
