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34
26
Yes No
Debate Score:60
Arguments:47
Total Votes:62
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 Yes (26)
 
 No (18)

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Is God justified for what he did?

I dont care if you believe or not. I just want to know if you think what he did in the bible was just.

Yes

Side Score: 34
VS.

No

Side Score: 26

I guess it depends on the person. Some people believe he is justified because of the reasons for his actions. For example people ask "Why did God flood the Earth?". Well here is a verse.

And God saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every imagination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually.” - Genesis 6:5

Here is a link: http://answersfromthebook.org/2009/10/07/why-did-god-send-the-flood/

So he flooded the Earth because mankind was just corrupt to the fullest. Meaning they sinned continously with no regret.

So people wonder "Why did God do what he did to Job?".

That is a valid question of course but the answer is pretty much in the beginning of the book.

" To answer that question we have to go back to the beginning of time when God allowed Satan to tempt Adam and Eve with the fruit in the Garden of Eden. We should probably ask the same question here. Why would God allow Satan to tempt them? All the worlds problems, injustices, and tragedies that have happened since the beginning of time can be traced back to this moment when Adam and Eve decided to listen to Satan instead of believe that God could satisfy the desires of their hearts." PastorJeffsBlog.Blogspot.com

Here is the link: http://pastorjeffsblog.blogspot.com/2011/04/why-did-god-allow-satan-to-hurt-job.html?m=1#!

It basically said that you cannot force someone to love you or do right. Satan was never forced to do right or love God and he choose the path or hatred. With Job God primarily wanted to show to things.

1) To show Christians that with faith in God you can go through the fire and the flames and carry out the life on your lot. Also one thing people think is that God did all that. It was actually Satan. Satan asked for permission and God granted it knowing that Job may complain but remain faithful.

2) God wanted to set the bar saying that if Job can endure this than any person with God's faith can survive and conquer what they have in their lot.

Some people also wonder why God had to make his only son be a Martyr instead of just speaking healing amomg the earth.

Main this is to show the world his love. There is no other way he could do so and forgive every person for their sins. It is supposed to show the extreme amount of love God has for mankind. I cant name another way to show extreme love.

Here is another link for that though: http://carm.org/christianity/christian-doctrine/why-did-jesus-have-die-our-sins

A lot of people wonder why God destroyed Sodom and Gomorrah. This is a touchu subject for some.

The prime reason Sodom and Gomorrah were destroyed was because of the massive amounts of sin that was commited daily. One of the critical parts of the story is where God said he would save the city if even 10 people were righteous in the city. Abraham was able to bring God down to 10 but Sodom and Gomorrah was destroyed because not even ten existed. The sins were countless and so God sent angels down to rescue Lot, who was Abraham's nephew, and his wife and two daughters. They received a specific order which was to not look back while God destroyed the city because of the wickedness that existed there. Lot's wife looked back and turned into a pillar of salt. Then God destroyed the city with supposed meteors.

" The Bible states that the fire and sulfur, or brimstone, rained down "from the Lord out of the heavens" (Genesis 19:24, NIV) - Christianity.About.com

Here is the link to the site: http://christianity.about.com/od/biblestorysummaries/a/Sodom-And-Gomorrah.htm

The final one I want to touch one is the point of hell. Why would God make Hell as a place for punishment? Isnt it brutal or wicked or un-loving? Also if humans only have finite crimes why must they spend eternity there?

These are all very good questions. Hell itself was never created for humanity. It was initially for Satan and his angels since they rebelled. This was their punishment especially since they did not regret what they did for pride was what Satan had in his heart. So Hell is primarily for Satan and the fallen angels. Next Adam sinned. When sin was released into the world hell became entangled with it. God didnt punish Adam and Eve with hell but Adam entangled it by his choice to eat the fruit of the tree of knowledge of good and evil. With this happening a being will be born into sin. So God wants you to follow his path so you can go to heaven. Satan however wants you to join him and thus will give you the sight of your heart's desires. God sent his only son to become a martyr so all of man kind would be forgiven for their sins. This is to make heaven even more obtainable for humans. However Satan is still the prince of this world so he has control over the earth.

Here is the link: http://www.altoonabible.org/BiblestudyHell.htm

These are jusy answers from my studies. I dont have all the answers. This is just what I know about the Christian faith so far. If anyone has a queation or wants to dispute feel free. It would please me to have someone dispute this so I can see how much I have learned and I may even learn more.

Side: Yes
1 point

So what about the fact that humans suffer eternal punishment for finite crimes?

Side: No
1 point

The crimes are never "finite". The crime commited is eternal. For example if you murder a person that person is gone for eternity and will be judged only for the duration of their life which isnt fair. It is an eternal crime. Stealing leaves a permanent memory with you and with the angels and with God. Forever it is written that you did what you did so no crime is truly "finite". Sin is sin.

Side: Yes
Doherty95(299) Disputed
1 point

I guess it depends on the person. Some people believe he is justified because of the reasons for his actions. For example people ask "Why did God flood the Earth?". Well here is a verse.

And God saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every imagination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually.” - Genesis 6:5

Here is a link: http://answersfromthebook.org/2009/10/07/why-did-god-send-the-flood/

So he flooded the Earth because mankind was just corrupt to the fullest. Meaning they sinned continously with no regret.

So people wonder "Why did God do what he did to Job?".

That is a valid question of course but the answer is pretty much in the beginning of the book.

Why didn't he intervene before it got to that state, so he didn't have to kill them all?

God must have known befor it got to that state what was to come, so if he didn't want to kill them all why didn't he intervene to steer it away from this corruption?

Also why did all the children have to die?

Especially the babies, they would be too young to be wicked surely?

Also this doesn't justify God killing all the animals. Did they deserve to drown to death for the sins of man?

Another thing why hasn't God destroyed Satan yet like he destroyed everyone in the flood?

Surely any reason he would have to destroy them he would have equal reasons to have destroyed Satan.

So people wonder "Why did God do what he did to Job?".

That is a valid question of course but the answer is pretty much in the beginning of the book.

" To answer that question we have to go back to the beginning of time when God allowed Satan to tempt Adam and Eve with the fruit in the Garden of Eden. We should probably ask the same question here. Why would God allow Satan to tempt them? All the worlds problems, injustices, and tragedies that have happened since the beginning of time can be traced back to this moment when Adam and Eve decided to listen to Satan instead of believe that God could satisfy the desires of their hearts." PastorJeffsBlog.Blogspot.com

Here is the link: http://pastorjeffsblog.blogspot.com/2011/04/why-did-god-allow-satan-to-hurt-job.html?m=1#!

It basically said that you cannot force someone to love you or do right. Satan was never forced to do right or love God and he choose the path or hatred. With Job God primarily wanted to show to things.

1) To show Christians that with faith in God you can go through the fire and the flames and carry out the life on your lot. Also one thing people think is that God did all that. It was actually Satan. Satan asked for permission and God granted it knowing that Job may complain but remain faithful.

2) God wanted to set the bar saying that if Job can endure this than any person with God's faith can survive and conquer what they have in their lot.

What God did to Job was clearly an abuse of power. If anyone allowed someone to kill all of someones children and torture that person to prove a point, they would be considered a monster and the act immoral. How is proving a point to Satan a justifiable reason to allow Satan to do that.

Even if it was to show those two things you mentioned, if someone did the above to show people no matter how bad things get it could get worse. Also to show that if they can endure that than you can endure anything. does any of that justify it?

Also how does letting Satan test Job justify him allowing Satan to kill all of Job's family?

Some people also wonder why God had to make his only son be a Martyr instead of just speaking healing amomg the earth.

Main this is to show the world his love. There is no other way he could do so and forgive every person for their sins. It is supposed to show the extreme amount of love God has for mankind. I cant name another way to show extreme love.

Here is another link for that though: http://carm.org/christianity/christian-doctrine/why-did-jesus-have-die-our-sins

My response depends on whether Jesus is seen as the son of God or God himself.

If Jesus is seen as God's son my response is simple. If someone had wronged me, does it show more love for me to give my son as a human sacrifice or just to forgive them?

If Jesus is God than God sacrificed himself unto himself to save us from himself.

You say There is no other way he could do so and forgive every person for their sins., however I don't see how you get to this. God set blood sacrifice as the way to atone sins, he could have just forgiven them.

The prime reason Sodom and Gomorrah were destroyed was because of the massive amounts of sin that was commited daily. One of the critical parts of the story is where God said he would save the city if even 10 people were righteous in the city. Abraham was able to bring God down to 10 but Sodom and Gomorrah was destroyed because not even ten existed. The sins were countless and so God sent angels down to rescue Lot, who was Abraham's nephew, and his wife and two daughters. They received a specific order which was to not look back while God destroyed the city because of the wickedness that existed there. Lot's wife looked back and turned into a pillar of salt. Then God destroyed the city with supposed meteors.

" The Bible states that the fire and sulfur, or brimstone, rained down "from the Lord out of the heavens" (Genesis 19:24, NIV) - Christianity.About.com

God apparently knows what we are thinking, he knew that Abraham wouldn't find 10 people. So he was going to destroy the cities anyway.

Also he could have intervened earlier, to stop them from being so corrupt.

Also Lot's wife being turned to a pillar of salt for disobeying God. God gives many commandments in the bible, and everyday people disobey them. Why doesn't he turn them into a pillar of salt?

Why is it justifiable to turn Lot's wife but no one else?

The final one I want to touch one is the point of hell. Why would God make Hell as a place for punishment? Isnt it brutal or wicked or un-loving? Also if humans only have finite crimes why must they spend eternity there?

These are all very good questions. Hell itself was never created for humanity. It was initially for Satan and his angels since they rebelled. This was their punishment especially since they did not regret what they did for pride was what Satan had in his heart. So Hell is primarily for Satan and the fallen angels. Next Adam sinned. When sin was released into the world hell became entangled with it. God didnt punish Adam and Eve with hell but Adam entangled it by his choice to eat the fruit of the tree of knowledge of good and evil. With this happening a being will be born into sin. So God wants you to follow his path so you can go to heaven. Satan however wants you to join him and thus will give you the sight of your heart's desires. God sent his only son to become a martyr so all of man kind would be forgiven for their sins. This is to make heaven even more obtainable for humans. However Satan is still the prince of this world so he has control over the earth.

The bible says in revelation that non believers will go to hell. Is this a good reason to be tortured for eternity?

Is it moral for a God to torture someone for an eternity for not believing?

Side: No
1 point

God must have known befor it got to that state what was to come, so if he didn't want to kill them all why didn't he intervene to steer it away from this corruption?Also why did all the children have to die?Especially the babies, they would be too young to be wicked surely?Also this doesn't justify God killing all the animals. Did they deserve to drown to death for the sins of man?

Free will. He does not impede on that. How do you know that there were babies? Small children? It just said men. Every man was corrupt.

Also this doesn't justify God killing all the animals. Did they deserve to drown to death for the sins of man?

How did he kill them all if they are here today? Or how did he kill them all if he still put some on the ark?

Another thing why hasn't God destroyed Satan yet like he destroyed everyone in the flood?

Again? Satan is an eternal angel. God granted him that. He doesnt impede or break his promises.

Surely any reason he would have to destroy them he would have equal reasons to have destroyed Satan.

False. Satan is eternal. He was am angel. Like I said. He wont impede on that.

What God did to Job was clearly an abuse of power. If anyone allowed someone to kill all of someones children and torture that person to prove a point, they would be considered a monster and the act immoral. How is proving a point to Satan a justifiable reason to allow Satan to do that.

1) This was a point to future Christians. He is saying that through faith in him you can endure the greatest of tribulations. That isnt an abuse of power. It wasnt to prove a point. Not a monster or immoral. Not at all.

If Jesus is God than God sacrificed himself unto himself to save us from himself.

No. Jesus was the physical manifestation of God. He did this to show his love and to show that he forgives us for all our sins. He didnt save us from "himself".

You say There is no other way he could do so and forgive every person for their sins., however I don't see how you get to this. God set blood sacrifice as the way to atone sins, he could have just forgiven them.

Like I said. God did. Now how do you prove his love? Just by saying "all is well"? No.

Also he could have intervened earlier, to stop them from being so corrupt.Also Lot's wife being turned to a pillar of salt for disobeying God. God gives many commandments in the bible, and everyday people disobey them. Why doesn't he turn them into a pillar of salt?Why is it justifiable to turn Lot's wife but no one else?

Where did it say God turn he into the pillar? Show me that. Also like I said free will. He does not interfere with that.

The bible says in revelation that non believers will go to hell. Is this a good reason to be tortured for eternity?Is it moral for a God to torture someone for an eternity for not believing?

1) For not believeing which is deliberately rejecting God

2) Showing no respect for the life he gave to you

3) You followed Satan for all your life.

4) I am sure a person would sin during their lifetime.

So you cant say it isnt justified. Also Satan pulls you into hell. If you ignkre Satan amd follow God you dont go there. Hell wasnt made for humans. It was made for Satan and his angels.

Side: Yes

sure everything Zeus did was just

Side: Yes
1 point

Can you name a specific action so I can answer? .

Side: Yes

It says so in many scriptures and therefore must be true. ;)

Side: Yes

I dont think so. I dont think killing 20,000,000+ people for something you caused in the first place is ever just.

Side: No
2 points

God is waaaaaaaay too harsh.

And why the fuck would I have to pay for something stupid Eve did?

Side: No
1 point

You are mainly paying for what you are doing. Not much is on Eve.

Side: Yes
Emperor(1348) Disputed
2 points

Paying for what I'm doing?

AHAHAHAH

wow, talk about insane standards.

I'm just being me. If someone doesn't like it, they can fuck off, mortal or not.

Side: No

Ok, so I'm just going to go kill people for no reason other than I wasn't satisfied with ow they turned out and then say it is because I love you.

Side: No