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Is there life after death?
A lot of people are convinced they have the answer, what do you think and why? Other than, because the good book told me so or that's what my parents told me. I'm not really trying to diss your faith, I'm just looking for something a little more concrete.
No, actually, the dailymail article is terrible. If he actually has a proof, I'd like to see it, rather than seeing 'Quantum Physics' and expecting it to be right.
Biocentrism, or the theory of same nature, is an archaic one from philosophy that has nothing to support itself but is just not self-contradictory so it is still accepted. But it isn't nearly complete and thus isn't really falsifiable. It is meant to be an answer to 'Why is there anything at all?'
As to the quantum physics part, that branch in physics, for such results, demands calculations and mathematical proofs. It is the most non-intuitive branch of physics. No proof was claimed - and as much as I am willing to read that article - there are mindless references to various other controversial theories that also have no proof.
Also, the other 2 are due to hallucinations by expectations of subjects themselves, false memories, or something lacking in our information of how brain works. Likely one of former 2.
The NDE hallucinations are not consistent, and conducted usually on theists or agnostics. Find consistent results with atheistic antitheists, preferably someone from analytic philosophers, to be taken seriously.
Thus, the articles are misleading and biased enough already. And you are quoting unreliable articles as definite proofs of your statement. Only due to benefit of doubt is your proposition still supportable.
I claim that an eternal afterlife will be in an omnipotent teapot revolving around earth and collecting souls. Everything vague can not be proven wrong.
Apparently, biocentrism isn't an archaic theory (it seems to be a result of atheism). And it was proposed by a doctor (so much for my claim).
But the sources are still biased and unreliable.
I'd never support such a theory without definitive proof. And the way it was written in the article, well, I'd rather read conspiracy theories for news than such articles, even though both seem roughly the same.
Interesting. How much did they pay the participants? Sounds really crazy to participate.
One comment, the same experience regardless of religion or beliefs isnt an indication all would end in the same place.
The bright light isnt judgement. Judgement day in scripture is at the end of the age. So the light could be the angels standing guard of the gate. Jesus raised Lazarus after he had begun to smell. So we don't know what happens beyond these 20 minutes.
There appears to be something as seen in this experiment. But, since it wasnt technically "their time," then would they have gone beyond the initial death experience, if it were not yet their time?
And is there an "appointed" or "pre-known" time?
So even though their consciousness remained, in hovering awareness, if there is a "known time" that is only completed through time of real death, then possibly the fullness of the experience did not present itself during the death in the experiment.
Yes, but not in the conventional sense of what Heaven and/or Christianity teach.
Life is energy and energy changes its forms or gets stored up in other ways. Your life energy surely goes somewhere after your body stops moving. Whether it's decaying as food for a tree to grow on top of you or an energy somehow returning to a pool of energy feeding life on earth, I don't know.
But what it's assuredly not is you walking through a gate to a cloud city with streets of gold and an authority figure waiting to either give you an eternity of bliss or to send you to be turned into sausage forever and ever.
You claim to know assuredly that you are exempt from Hell and God does not personally rule over heaven. How do you know this? When did you become better and smarter than your brother.....oops, not the devilish brother; I mean when did you become smarter and better than God?
When people challenge your paradigm the only response you ever give is that within your paradigm they are wrong and arrogant and will be punished. In that respect we're never even in the same debate.
You said you know assuredly......try to focus on your own words and thoughts and explain how you know assuredly the things you claim to know. If you know these things assuredly, shouldn't everybody know? Please tell.
You avoided explaining how you know assuredly that God does not rule over Heaven and there is no eternal punishment of sinners in Hell. How do you know these things?
Because yours is a fairy tale. It's like asking me to tell you how I know gnomes and dragons and the chupacabra don't exist. I actually don't. But all those things listed are equal or more likely than that an omnipotent dude is doing all the things you claim him to be doing.
Hurray! The chupacabra has died for our sins! We're saved!
Now let's wait decades and then each of us can write our own explanation of what happened to the chupacabra and what it means. That's the most accurate way to make sure people worldwide understand it and can build their lives around it centuries from now.
You do realize there are heavy weights in consistency and singularity of message. Christianity is seen in the Old Testament. Everything we believe comes from, and fulfills everything the Jews believe.
The Jews waited for Him, and as foretold they rejected. It was by rejection that the Gospel was driven out to all nations. Then Jesus is going full circle in the end to take His place in Jerusalem. After some catastrophic events there in the middle east.
Here is an example of consistency. With fulfillment outside of what they understood. The Jewish scriptures told of a time the Israelites were being bitten by scorpians or serpents and dieing while wandering in the desert. God's solution He told Moses to post a serpent staff and all who are bitten and look at it will be healed.
There was never an explanation for it. Mysterious, said once, never referenced or practiced. Like a one time solution.
The next time its mentioned, its found as an old relick and the Jews set it up and worshiped it. And then God corrects etc.
But no explanation on the purpose. Then Jesus refers to it out of the blue and applies it to His up coming crucifiction. He said would be lifted up like Moses lifted the serpent in the wilderness.
Moses holding the serpent up representing the law, for people to face and be healed by looking at it in the face, Jesus defines it as sin and judgement of being under the law, and Messiah would be lifted up on it in ransome. And Moses lifting it up in the wilderness and Jesus descending upon it and lay His life down on it. Well thats explained in Genesis, where the story line was laid out. And you can connect it forward as the Catholics have brass crosses with Jesus still on them. Catholocism is featured in end time prophesies. So after the one time work, following Him is beyond the brass cross above the bed.
Its threads like this brass serpent told about once, then idolized without understanding it. And a picture of the law giver Moses lifting it up and the Son of God decending to die on it. And to have His people stop and idolize a piece of brass after.
Science is catching up, not the other way around. We knew things by faith that science learned later. Science confirms Biblical accuracy. Its our misunderstanding and denial of it that closes our understanding.
Example
Seawater follows currents in the ocean.
Psalm 8:8: “The fish of the sea that pass through the 'paths of the seas.' ”
The Bible indicates that there are “paths” in the ocean where the water follows a predictable course. Indeed, the interaction of numerous factors (including geography, temperature, salinity, prevailing winds and the Coriolis effect) creates currents with dramatic influence over regional transit, climates and marine life.
Yet these paths in the sea were not extensively studied until the mid-1800s, when Lt. Matthew Fontaine Maury of the U.S. Navy began scouring old sailors’ logs for information about wind and ocean movements. Maury’s study of the Bible (which he “constantly read and frequently quoted,” according to naval historian Capt. Miles DuVal) may have convinced him that he would find patterns, and find them, he did!
Describing the impact of Maury’s first “Wind and Current Chart” on navigation, DuVal wrote, “Previously the average passage from New York to San Francisco required 188 days but in 1851, the Flying Cloud … made this voyage in 89 days and 21 hours.” Studying the “paths of the seas” turned out to be a lucrative innovation!
Light. God is light. You only understand sunlight from solar energy. Its a star. Angels are stars. Lucifer the bright morning star fell. Stars implode when they fall.
So if our universe of black space originated, this may be the first debree expelled into what we know as our universe.
God is light that stars are made from. He is light that made beings and servants of light. So fruit trees could grow without sun, because God is light.
And if you study it, you find the sequence of creation to be more informative than previously thought, as well as multidimentional in the Scriptures purpose.
Yes, they did exist. there are many types of angels. The stars in the sky may correlate to angels for each of us.
Lucifer is the bright morning star that fell. So yea the angels existed before day one. Day 1 was the day heaven and earth were made.
And they are of star qualiity. And when God placed the hosts in the sky He appointed times. And also there is a connection with being numbered like the stars. And Jesus talks about each having an angel. So each in a way can represent each of us. Thats a thought not doctrine.
And also science has made presumptions, even when proven wrong they leave in text books.
Dating carbons etc have properties that cant exist in the time frames given. So the inaccuracies from the beginnings, invalidate the later conclusions built on it.
So then what, should we ignore inaccuracies for the sake of false premises built on inaccuracies?
Is the idol of evolution worth sacraficing truth and accuracy, is it worth dishonest evaluation, While ignoring facts?
If time as man knows it did not start ticking according to the rising and setting of the sun, then was day four where sun appeared a 24 hour day, or was it a day in light years?
"But what it's assuredly not is you walking through a gate to a cloud city with streets of gold and an authority figure waiting to either give you an eternity of bliss or to send you to be turned into sausage forever and ever."
The burden of proof is on you, you claim to know this, prove it.
No, the burden of proof is on the person afraid of death and punishment. The person not afraid just goes about their business - as I will do this very moment.
Once again, you avoid backing up your claim of knowing assuredly that God does not rule over Heaven and Hell is not eternal punishment of sinners. Your words, claiming you know more than God, with nothing but hot air coming from a wet pile of dust to back up your claim. Prove what you are saying you know "assuredly" is true or admit you don't know what you are talking about. What makes you so sure? How do you know? If you can't explain, I have to conclude you are a liar when you claim to know assuredly that God does not rule over Heaven and Hell is not eternal condemnation of fire for sinners.
"But what it's assuredly not is you walking through a gate to a cloud city with streets of gold and an authority figure waiting to either give you an eternity of bliss or to send you to be turned into sausage forever and eve"
Scientists that understand math disagree with creation evolution theories. Adaptatations are adjustments but we never saw a new unrelated animal come out of another.
So to make adaptation what it is not, is just covering bs with lies. The new spin everytime they have to redefine words to make them fit.
Evolution is a nothing god, that exists in pseudo-scientists imaginations .
The Bible has proven itself. And all creation tells of Him..
At least my sky God has evidence I can see right in front of my eyes, and has proven Himself by showing "coincidences" at ridiculously impossible odds.
So God shows physically in front of our eyes evidence we can see, and affirms it by showing its at odds that require Him as Creator, Authorship, and Savior... whereas evolution holds impossible odds in their hands with no proof or affirmation of its claim.
So I can only believe what I see sir! And evolution shows no proof at all,:just a hypothetical story authenticated by nothing more than creative fiction at far fetched impossible odds!
But I have a God who knows all things you seek to know, He made them. And He knows exactly how it was done.
And the evidence is piled high to Heaven, and He reveals more everyday.
I love those tidbits that show Him in strange ways, eyewitness to His own creation.
Example 1 of 1000's,
Jesus describes accurately both "Hell" and the "Lake of Fire." These are two different places, in two different locations.
This short video shows these two places exactly as Jesus described them. Jesus knows science inside and out!
If I said that after death you will become a mini God and have your own solar system to rule over, you might respond that this most assuredly will not happen. It does not follow that you have to prove to me that it won't happen. Especially since you wouldn't care about my screwy ideas.
Now you have backed down from claiming to know assuredly that God does nor rule over Heaven and Hell is not eternal punishment for lost sinners, and you have taken the total wishy-washy position of "personally, I don't think so". Personally, I think you don't know what you are talking about and are going by wishful thinking.
Is anyone navigating your "energy" or does it wander? And when the earth is gone, which seems to be a svience prediction. The general concensus is it will be destroyed one or another.
Does your energy then become lost in space?
I'd be scared to be energy floating around after death without a caretaker of my soul. Seems like it would be like being lost in the grand canyon. How do you connect with other energy persons, can you find your family?
I don't know, but why do I have to know? It will be whatever it is going to be regardless. And although you find comfort in the Christian Heaven belief is it really any comfort if that turns out to be wrong?
And I dont just believe blindly. I have shown many logical reasons and
presented a variety of evidence.
Its unfortunate that there is a battle for truth, and a battle to show it. Its crazy, deception and misrepresentation of the Bible is accepted to the degree of the most comfortable choixes. Bible calls it ear tickliners. Everyone is an expert, and every lie is made truth by popularity. Its a bat dhit crazy world. If you have rose colored glasses on, well thats your choice. Its humorous tha society looks like a episode of Gotham, but no really we resemble a worldwide Gotham. Last week Prnguan and Riddler were campagning, and looking devious. Just like campaign 2016.
Our purpose is to show truth, Jesus didnt call anyone casually. Let light shine, but not in a false expected kumbaya way. Jesus challenges, He is controversial, Christianity is the knowledge beyond the grave. We gather with Him, and are connected to His purpose in the world. And His ultimate goal
And also warn people to atleast look, we would be aweful if we didn't. That's like saying we know our neighbor is planning a terror attack, and then doing nothing about it would make us aweful household names of shame.
Our purpose in this age is to reason with people who don't know God's Word, and pnly know a skewed version of it through now militant atheism, and people arent given the real info, its validation, evidence, and its reasoning, and the sensibility and consistency of God's Word and His Salvation, and to challenge false data with true data. And to present truth and evidence to allow people to make decissions based on hearing truth.
For example, Academic studies as in Archaeology have circulated complete inacuracies and even lies, willingly.
They fabricated and presumed and jumped quickly on spreading invalidation even in historic merit.That's a war on truth. And really that's pretty nazi type behavior against the Bible. There are forces in battle. And prophesy shows its progression in full detail within sequesce of order and everything unfloded as .
And it closed the ears of people who would have went toward God, and it matters a great deal. Its not ok. It's the opposite of ok.
We have "free will" so to speak, we lost "free will" at the fall. We now have "free choice but from an under dog, tainted choice by weak will."
But at the very least truth should be given. Giving free choice to all, without falsely held, taken by academic authotity, in opposition to reality of truth uncovered in archeological confirmed historic merit.
It would be unconscionable to not challenge thoughts of people.
Whether you choose to believe is up to you. But truth be told, its to weighty to not set facts straight.
There has been more evidence uncovered today than ever before, proving evidence of God and the Judeo-Christian faith to be sound, reasonable, and a logical conclusion.
We have weight through modern day ability to find truth in archaeology, science, and abilities in technology to evaluate prophetic fulfilments that are accurate and clear, and easy access to information to connect dots, and apply history in comparison to their prophetic fulfillments, and also the fulfilled layers leading to fulfillments.
So in making solid validation in the Bibles historic accuracy is important. We can't just let the Bible be misrepresented.
.
Prophesy is misunderstood, it's not crystal ball fortune telling.
Prophesy is pre-written history with designated participants, made to be vessels of honor or dishonor, with events and times with an evolving purposeful design to give a redemptive response to the worsening condition of man and God intervened to bring His creation back to Himself.
For me, Heaven is my home. I have eternal life now. I know I have eternal life now and forever. If you don't have eternal life now, you have eternal death now and are a walking and talking dead person.
Death is not a "dirt nap", it's a state of being separated from God who gives life. This debate offers a false hope of "napping" if a person is not in heaven when dead. The reality of being dead forever is that once your time dying in this world is over, then you will be dying forever with no countdown of time in the next world. This world is the only place God has where you can experience His goodness and love, in Hell you will not be able to know His goodness and love because there will be nothing good in the fire.
Do i believe that there is an after life? Yes, i'd hope so at least. However i don't think that it would be perceived as heaven, my view of an after life would be like a parallel universe where we continue our lives elsewhere.
Is anyone navigating your "energy" or does it wander? And when the earth is gone, which seems to be a svience prediction. The general concensus is it will be destroyed one or another.
Does your energy then become lost in space?
I'd be scared to be energy floating around after death without a caretaker of my soul. Seems like it would be like being lost in the grand canyon. How do you connect with other energy persons, can you find your family?
Science supports what your saying but a lot of people believe that this is an argument for a type of heaven described in religion simply because we don't know where the energy is going so why can't it go to a heaven? Don't know if I'd go that far but it sounds like a good point.
Nature shows God. All of creation shows God. The physical laws of our universe prove Him. So even without a word, there is no excuse.
We are spiritual beings, that can't cease to exist. So we will either exist in eternal light and love. And in connection of fellowship as one with the Father and Son and in oneness in love, joy, peace, patience, and understanding. In harmony and undivided.
Judeo-Christian beliefs have held concepts that have been perceptively understood. The concepts of faith resemble principles found in science. Particularly in Physics, and even more specifically in Quantum Physics.
The question is weight of coincidence vs weight of accuracy and concepts in diversity of precepts extending accross many principles and addressed interconnecting concepts and equations found and proven in modern science. Biblical precepts scientifically explained today as prior to knowledge and understanding in ancient writings.
Here are a few Biblical concepts, that are scientific as existing, yet puzzling on their functions, interactions, and presentation.
. The Macrocosm - Our universe is finite, had a starting place or beginning, and has a projected end.
. "In the beginning."
-The equation of "pi" is found in Genesis 1: 1 In the beginning .... within Hebrew Bible Code.
-The equasion of "e" is found in John 1: 1 In the beginning .... -within Greek Bible Code.
One may indicate by a stretch, that if one of these found in the short space of each of these verses could be attributed to coincidence. But both of these found in two seperate written languages, both of which start out with Creation and light entering the world. And within short verse, advanced equasions hidden in ancient texts, advanced math not known till 1700 and 1800s.
Properties of Light related to God., and Time, and Space.
Multidimensional reality,
Photons communicate and subparticles move like one, Gods Word is a double edged sword dividing between intentions and motives, Jesus discuses going through the eye of a needle. Through the cross we go through the work He did.
The Father and Son and Holy Spirit are one, His body also that we be one with one another and one in Him, sounds like microcosm.
I would like to think so. I don't think there can be any actual proof until you're dead. But if a parent chooses to believe in it because their child died before them, or a spouse wants to believe it so they will meet their loved one again, who is anyone to try to take that away? Personally I choose to believe that there is something more than the single run we have going on in this life, I want to believe my loved ones have gone to a better place.
One of the major objective of all religions is control and manipulation of the masses. They are fear-based in order to cow the followers into compliance. If you don't believe, follow, walk the walk, talk the talk, you will fry in hell for eternity. Apparently it works; there are still billions who believe.
Those who love Him, delight in His ways. If religion is under compulsion, then it is not faith. The law is a tutor, leading to Christ. If the Son sets you free, you are free indeed.
If you are being pushed in faith through fear, then you have not entered into His rest. God hasn't given us a spirit of fear ...
Matthew 11: 28-30
“Come to Me, all who are weary and heavy-laden, and I will give you rest. Take My yoke upon you and learn from Me, for I am gentle and humble in heart, and you will find rest for your souls. For My yoke is easy and My burden is light.”
Romans 8
14 For all who are being led by the Spirit of God, these are
sons of God.
15 For you have not received a spirit of slavery leading to fear again, but you have received a spirit of adoption as sons by which we cry out, “Abba! Father!”
16 The Spirit Himself testifies with our spirit that we are children of God,
17 and if children, heirs also, heirs of God and fellow heirs with Christ, if indeed we suffer with Him so that we may also be glorified with Him.
2 Timothy
17 For God hath not given us the spirit of fear; but of power,
God was very particular about His written Word. If He was that particular, then dont you think He is able to deliver His Word to evey generation?
Do you know God? God is not subject to man.
Man cannot thwart God's will and purpose. And no matter what man or demon does, His will and Word is beyond their reach. Even if they purpose against Him, their attempsts cant prosper.
His Word will accomplish every bit, and every Word of God is bread. "The children's bread," If we ask for bread does He give us a stone?
Also He sent His Holy Spirit to dwell in us and teach us all things, and He is also the revealer and interpreter, if you know God, you know His Word is part of our armour, sword of the Spirit. Do you seriously think He would leave us without His Word?
Hebrews 4
12 For the word of God is living and active and sharper than any two-edged sword, and piercing as far as the division of soul and spirit, of both joints and marrow, and able to judge the thoughts and intentions of the heart.
Ephesians 6
10 Finally, be strong in the Lord and in the strength of His might. 11 Put on the full armor of God, so that you will be able to stand firm against the schemes of the devil.
12 For our struggle is not against flesh and blood, but against the rulers, against the powers, against the world forces of this darkness, against the spiritual forces of wickedness in the heavenly places.
13 Therefore, take up the full armor of God, so that you will be able to resist in the evil day, and having done everything, to stand firm.
14 Stand firm therefore, having girded your loins with truth, and having put on the breastplate of righteousness,
15 and having shod your feet with the preparation of the gospel of peace;
16 in addition to all, taking up the shield of faith with which you will be able to extinguish all the flaming arrows of the evil one. 17 And take the helmet of salvation, and the sword of the Spirit, which is the word of God.
Heb 10
14 For by one offering He has perfected for all time those who are sanctified.
15 And the Holy Spirit also testifies to us; for after saying,
16 “This is the covenant that I will make with them
This is off topic, please stay on topic. Looking for a debate on the afterlife, not on quotes from religious books. That would be a whole other debate and take up far too much room with example after example.
Again, those are man's words; there is no proof of God. It's all about faith; the suspension of disbelief and accepting something as true without facts to back it up.
There is to much evidence for me to deny the Bible is the Word of God. God has confirmed it on many fronts. And not just grazingly but overwhelmingly. So I have no doubt who wrote it.
If you believe that religion is worth anything other than an obsolete tool for administrative purposes that humans are still clinging to, I disagree.
Won't those of us who don't pray to your God, or even regard him as much as the Pascal's wager, go to hell if the Christian fantasies turn out to be real? If yes, then it is a false choice if we are to suffer eternal damnation for using the brain your God has given us - not like he could not create a mindless Utopia where we wouldn't make the mistakes if he loved us all.
And if he still says that he loves us, then I'd rather suffer eternal damnation than be with him. Is this his law upon my heart (not to mention this long debunked myth about heart)?
Your uninformed and easily mislead. The deception is thick, everyone is an expert. What you described has nothing to do with Christianity.
Man was fallen, He didnt have to save us. We are eternal beings, but to dust we retuned. Eternal death is eternal darkness absent of light and God.
He descended to be a man, walk in our dust, and save us from under the serpent from the fall.
God is judicial. He cannot deny justice. Satan has dominion over flesh fair and square. The dust is under him.
Jesus walked a mile in our shoes and then ransomed us paying the full judgement. The key is if you want to accept the way. And have Him bring you out of a dark fallen workd back to a kingdom of light?
I do understand much of ancient Indian philosophy, which is basically all about religion (as it would be in the west if Socrates had not changed its course). Also, it is very similar to what you talk about, just a bit more existential and welcoming. The things not specifically about religion are somehow related to it.
But, let's say that I deny that all our existence is due to presence of organic matter and electric signals (though I don't). As Descartes would have said, "I think, therefore I am." So, a free will exists independent of our brain and can think on its own (not going to why we aren't hollow or at least why we still have an organic brain that works due to mundane processes), and it controls our body. It is eternal and unchanging (?).
Since this 'soul' can't become God, there must already be one (again, from Descartes, and quite reasonable). Thus, the only way to deny existence of a God is to deny that you can think and make decisions by your free will.
Also, as a final assumption, let's take that he is the ultimate creator and does not need a creator for himself, ie. he can eternally exist without any cause, and that our universe can't do that and thus needs a creator. Also, let's take it for granted that the assumptions are unquestionably true, and that the God that is is benevolent, omnipotent and loves us. Let it all follow directly from each other.
I can't use my antitheist or marxist arguments in that case. But, either God created us or he didn't. You said we are eternal beings. But, God is omnipotent, isn't he? Thus, he can create eternal beings (My first argument). Also, he must have known that no way to understand him is possible by the analytic philosophy he gave us. Thus, he created us such that we would not be able to reasonably comprehend him.
Also, you claimed that he is just. Since he loves us, and would thus never want to harm us, and justice is making him do it, it exists higher than him. Thus, he himself should be subject to the same justice for creating us such that we can not comprehend him. The appropriate outcome should be that he creates a purely analytical method to comprehend him. And I would serve the justice higher than him rather than him and thus wouldn't pray to him until he creates a proof of his existence beyond any methodological doubt.
Also, who decided that he be the God rather than me? (If you say that he didn't create us) I shall not obey he who wants to rule over me without my consent, and he, being the loving God he is, must understand and so should his method of justice. But he doesn't, and thus all assumptions collectively are proven wrong.
Well, I guess that took a lot of time for this forum. It's not like I have to take the burden of proof. As your religion is an obsolete administrative tool, it is clear that it was meant for totalitarian regimes where people aren't allowed to think for themselves. History confirms it. I'd go far enough to call religions as clingy parasites and their followers as addict hosts. As Marx would have said, religion is the opium of people.
Deceptions are universal, copious, and thick. Its easy. Truth is subjective. But can it be really? Is truth subjective in a court of law. But now we are trying to make it subjective.
We try to overturn verdicts, by force of violence. The facts dont matter. We sue for our rights by trampling on others.
So what is spiritual eventually bleeds through. And we are hemorrhaging. And if you think a man in 300 bc established a religion you are comfortable with, be comfortable then.
You are not comparing you are feeding. What have you personally weighed?
No other religion has complete full circle picture, line upon line, with all pieces connected as though designed by the Deity that is beyond our space and time.
Some of those religions are founded on spiritual principles, but of the the lower gods. The Bible is clear that there were minglings of fallen angels that produced genetic mutations such as giants, who were aggressive, inhumanly strong, and destructive, even cannibals.
When we see similarly worshipped gods across different cultures, and they present similar stories and pictures, they may have come from one source. Fallen angels taught them and appeared to them as gods. And because fallen angels originated from God, then fell, there would be some similarities.
But where other religions stop, Judaism and Christianity go further to beyond the will of fallen angels to the source of light and life. So were they stop in stories, the Bible Gods Word explains the depth of Spiritual things.
Where religions stop at the sun god, the Bible explains the origin of our universe. The mystery of the microcosm and the properties of the macrocosm. Where other religions focus on exalting gods of this world who take credit for the elements of nature, God rules them and uses them to show us beyond space and time.
Religions that tell of a different way are on highways. Jesus said to go to the highways and invite them to His wedding feast.
The sensibility of the problem, why its a problem, fixing the problem, and restoration is far from a simple made up story.
It is connected like string theory, it resonates throughout our universe, His spoken Word creates and hold together, and also prefiltered our lives with prophesy of prewritten history.
As it is designed to direct our days. For the sake of those who are ultimately His own! "Let the dead bury their dead" He came to seek and save the lost. Not just "save the lost"
Its covenant, contractual. Both parties have a part in the contract. Seek Him .... you'll find Him. Its contractual cvenant. He gave Jesus and signed the contract in blood.
We sign it with our willingness, and exchange our lives of flesh for a mantle of salvation, delivered through the cross and Resurrection, in His glorified body.
We will be as He is. From flesh to a body that is like His. One with Him, sword divides the intentions and motives of the heart, divides to the microcosm making us one body with Jesus as the head. He forged the way, and made the road, and opened the gate, but the road is narrow not a highway.
You'd be surprised how much quantum physics tells of Spiritual principles. Other religions dont go beyond the elements. But YHWY takes us in our faith to the origin snd meaning of the elements. Because He created them!
Jesus looked for lost sheep. Children of the Kingdom, creations that were to be his from the foundation of the world.
Jesus prays on earth for His own, and interceded and mediates day and night for His own. He doesnt pray for those not His own. They are lost, and always will be. His own will recognize His Word, and will come to it.
Its not meant to be welcoming to those who are not His. It is meant to call His own, "my sheep hear my voice another they simply will not follow" " my sheep are in my hand no man can pluck them out."
Posts we Christians write are to set out the truth right next to the deceptions. To partner with the Spirit to gather His own. Its not meant to convince the lost, it is meant to call the sheep who will recognize truth.
God doesn't need us, but He uses us that we can work with Him. Its a joy to work with Him, but He fills the Work with His Spirit.
And His Spirit takes on an incredible journey filled with the fresh breathe of His Living Word, and the revelations of understanding that are range from sweet to mindblowing. Often both in the same breathe. And to be in Him means we move with Him.
Its sad how unaware of truth today has become. There is no time in history that has been so ripe for His coming.
There was always evil, but now everyone is as evil as the regimes. People are murderous from their cell phones with every mouthy post. And everyone is an expert, and its easy to adopt any truth you like!
If you want truth, you have to manually dig it out. May take 3 google pages to find a hint of truth. But hey, we are not in end tiimes. "Peace and safety" Truth lies dead in the street. I wonder if thats one of the witnesses in revelations?
Never have people been 100% affected, till now!
This scripture is fulfilled today. As Jesus said love will wax cold.
These behaviors are prevalent across the board.
Each behavior can be studied and applied like never before. Sure they existed, but this is the nature now of every society.
Social media brought these behaviors to an epidemic proportion.
This is prophesy of mans end. These were not seen in their day to this degree. It was partially seen, but now is in every home. - see 2 Timothy 3!
There was always evil, but now everyone is as evil as the regimes. People are murderous from their cell phones with every mouthy post. And everyone is an expert, and its easy to adopt any truth you like!
If you want truth, you have to manually dig it out. May take 3 google pages to find a hint of truth. But hey, we are not in end tiimes. "Peace and safety" Truth lies dead in the street. I wonder if thats one of the witnesses in revelations?
Never have people been 100 affected. Till now!
This scripture is fulfilled today. As Jesus said love will wax cold.
These behaviors are prevalent across the board.
Each behavior can be studied and applied like never before. Sure they existed, but this is the nature now of every society.
Social media brought these behaviors to an epidemic proportion. This is prophesy of mans end. These were not seen in their day to this degree. It was partially seen, but now is in every home.
2 Timothy 3
3 But realize this, that in the last days difficult times will come.
2 For men will be lovers of self, lovers of money, boastful, arrogant, revilers, disobedient to parents, ungrateful, unholy,
3 unloving, irreconcilable, malicious gossips, without self-control, brutal, haters of good,
4 treacherous, reckless, conceited, lovers of pleasure rather than lovers of God,
5 holding to a form of godliness, although they have denied its power; Avoid such men as these.
6 For among them are those who enter into households and captivate weak women weighed down with sins, led on by various impulses,
7 always learning and never able to come to the knowledge of the truth.
8 Just as Jannes and Jambres opposed Moses, so these men also oppose the truth, men of depraved mind, rejected in regard to the faith.
9 But they will not make further progress; for their folly will be obvious to all, just as Jannes’s and Jambres’s folly was also.
10 Now you followed my teaching, conduct, purpose, faith, patience, love, perseverance,
11 persecutions, and sufferings, such as happened to me at Antioch, at Iconium and at Lystra; what persecutions I endured, and out of them all the Lord rescued me!
12 Indeed, all who desire to live godly in Christ Jesus will be persecuted.
13 But evil men and impostors will proceed from bad to worse, deceiving and being deceived.
14 You, however, continue in the things you have learned and become convinced of, knowing from whom you have learned them,
15 and that from childhood you have known the sacred writings which are able to give you the wisdom that leads to salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus.
16 All Scripture is inspired by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, for training in righteousness;
17 so that the man of God may be adequate, equipped for every good work.
Faith should be convinced - and we are the body of Christ. We together make His body with Christ as the Head. Jesus will not come again in fallen flesh. He has already overcome flesh and death. And has already ascended to the Father. He will come again in glory with His people. But He has no need to dwell in flesh of a person. HisvDpirit dwells in us and makes us one in Him.
One body with one Head, Christ. Who defeated flesh and death once an for all.
The next time He comes He comes in the body He was raised from the dead. There is no need to be born of flesh again.
Clarity and a sound mind. These are of God. He is judicial. In Him there are no shadows. No confusion.
The one who builds on false inaccuracies has built a house like the one in the parable of the wise builder vs the foolish builder building a house.
One builds a foundation based on false information, making it no good at its very foundation. Building on it is not good because it's already built on inaccuracies, so then the outcome is a foolishly built house that collapses with winds of doctrine and trials.
False, because it lacks credibility at its foundation. And there is no witness of truth by the Spirit and Word. Which always agree without contradiction. Truth doesn't contradict His Word. The Holy Spirit doesn't contradict His Word.
These are witnesses to each other. And in a court of law held by the just judge of all, only confirmed facts would be found truthful testimony by their witness of each other.
Then it comes down to choosing to accept lies or investigate. If you don't investigate, then how can you be an authority on its credibility as truth or myth and discern falsehood?
God wouldn't be a fair judicial judge if He hid the evidence and displayed unconfirmed testimony. Your testimony if from God would be confirmed by Him.
Just as He confirmed who Jesus was then. If He does not bear witness, then the testimony is false.
The Word Spirit and Father are a cord of three strands that cant be broken. A kingdom divided can't stand.
Its not the work of God to deceive, light reveals.
He is judicial. In His courtroom He provides abundant evidence and testimony and witness. The truth is confirmed always! He bears witness to confirm every fact. Evidence, not speculation.
We really are very different from each other. By proof, I mean a logical flow of arguments that definitively ends at God being real, as do many others. The proof of Descartes, that I mentioned earlier, is now archaic. We can now logically deny that we are sentient at all.
Also, by comprehending him, it is about a set of arguments that lead to his true nature and what he wants of us. Open to criticism and peer review like it should be. For the empiricists, the arguments shall follow from directly observable noumena, while for the rationalists, it should follow from the directly knowable and undeniable.
But, as Nietzsche said, "There can be no God. For if there is one, I can not believe that I am not He."
Who gets to decide that who will become God? And why wasn't my name on the list?
If validity of claims is any measure, then Hinduism is the greatest religion. It is old, open and has composed the masterpieces of knowledge - the 4 vedas. They had calculated astronomical distances accurately, and there are accounts of time being a dimensional line like length. The details are much more intricate than any other religion, and well founded. They could even solve the cubics and the quartics before western world properly understood them. There's been the yoga and the martial arts. A complete Ayurveda that treated people just by using natural ingredients. Then there are the details of various types of firearms. All of this from many years ago, much before even Jesus (the vedic period is just about their compilation.) Not to mention that the religion itself is based on philosophy. Wanna hear prophesies? It was predicted long ago that after about 5000 years from now, almost all of the world population will be non-religious. I expect it to hold valid.
So, well, I guess you shouldn't praise your religion on whether it has made some valid claims. Or that it goes into some details in its other claims.
I claim that the details are meant to make people obey, to instil the fear in them that they will be punished if they don't obey. As it follows, there are many killings for religion throughout known history.
The final thing is about existence of something beyond space and time. Well, how can he even interact with this world if he doesn't exist here?
I have an exceedingly well rounded, line upon line, multi dimenensional body of evidence, that is piled up as high as heaven!
I have so much evidence, it is unreasonable and without a logical argument to refute Him and His Word! Not one argument can stand on any merit. The validity of God and the proof of His Word is so copious and confirmed, that those who are blinded by deceptions today, will slap themselves tomorrow for all eternity!
If you dont know the logic, then you obviously did not weigh the evidence! You are accountable to seek truth. Its there loud and clear like a blowing round of Trumpets!
But maybe you are one blinded on purpose. If not look at the evidence!
I will highlight pieces, but too much to detail. Ask on each if you want to discuss.
A) Over 300 prophesies told of Jesus in detail, even down to calculating days till when Jesus entered Jerusalem on the donkey. 23 prophesies just in Psalms.
.....1) The crucifiction death was described for the Messiah 700 years before crucifixion even existed. (In several old testament scriptures, in different "books" of the Bible -old testament Jewish scriptures) FYI Jews rejected Him, just as foretold, and their scriptures tell of Him word for word. Did the Jews do this on purpose?
Read Psalm 22, it sound like it was dictated verbatum from the activity around the cross, and His words from the cross.
Now He may have been able to fill in words spoken from the cross by knowledge of the scripture. But thats only a small piece of fulfilment in this one chapter of Psalms!
Could Jesus have invented and orchestrated the crucifixtion in time or even at all? Because Psalm 22 sounds just like a crucifixion.
Jews didn't invent crrucifixion, it was a Persian- Roman execution. Did Jesus orchestrate Roman guards dividing His garments, or could he have scheduled the guards to give Him vinegar to drink?
And could He have forced the hand of Pilot? It was the Jews that brought the crime against Jesus to Pilot. Jesus wasnt stirring up the Romans. He was just making Pharisees miserable, but they did not control Roman rules at all. So then Pharisees thought of as worms in Roman rule, won a verdict in a court that really had no reason or willingness to crucify Jesus. So did Jesus orchestrate it through conspiracies? Is it reasonable to think He even could have??
Then you have Paul a murderer of Christians, without good reason leave notoriety and respect of Jews, to preach Jesus to gentiles as a poured out bond servant. No promise of wealth or a book deal, but a promise of harship and prison and martyrdom. Again resonable logic, why did he?
Then you have details of prophesy filled throughout history. Again line upon line. Literally like dominoes in a laid out specific order. 2000 of which have been fulfilled. And 500 that are evident to be in process ready to be fulfilled. Again a few vague one like in Nostradomous you can dismiss. And Satan can get some right dimly, but he doesnt know details. And his plan is twarted, so his plans often fulfill in part. But God's fulfill in measure upon measure. God makes sure it is so thick of evidence, not one can open their mouth on the last day!
He shows evidence everywhere, and confirms it in His Word.
He has even hidden his messages in letters, beyond mathmatical probability to the ridiculous degree!
Thats why He often says He will make the wise foolish, and will mock at their stupidity. Why mock? Because they mislead themselves, and that is bad, but they also made many stumble, and their foolishness will be on display. And also God will hold every mouth and pen accountable for their part in deceptions, evils, and murders on the last day. (How many will be included by their pen in murders of babies, and cops, and how many will be accountable for teaching against God the creator, the student to the professor, and how many in media will pay for spinning and steering by lies.
And He confirms in nature, and in its order. He also shows His truth in every field of study, and mankind wars against Him.
Here are a few examples of in letters
In two Creation verses, one in Hebrew and the other written in Greek.
Genesis 1: 1 Just in the first verse by one type of "code" He has adv of math - pi. Now that could possibly, but not easily be dismissed as a lucky coincidence.
But not with God!
He confirms He did it on purpose! So in John 1: 1 in Greek. He shows another advanced math in the same type of code. In two separate time periods, and Im sure it wasnt on purpose. But John 1: 1 again in the 1st verse, inspired into code is the adv math formula for "e"
Then you have TORH written backward and forward like bookends in 5 books of the TORH. Did they even have any cultures writing from left to right during Moses day?
Yet in the 49 interval its found in pairs, 2 forward, 2 backward, with YHWY in the middle book. Intervals of 49 for TORH but YHWH is at intervals of 7. Which is His special number and is a squ root of the 49. Again these arent hidden deeply or twisted.
The are not reasonable in math probability. They are the signature of the Author! Then He even confirms it, West write left to right and East writes right to left. All the writing either direction point to the Word of God, YHWH. And to add even further as God does! Jesus Christ sits on the timeline of history. Not mahommad or buddah or evolution, God is mocking educational atheism and skepticism from proof even sitting on the whole worlds dating system. BC and AD.
And all of these things together are just the tip of the iceberg!
There is more and more and more, all equally as fabulous.
So now each of these alone could be soeculative, but God has made the evidence undeniable! So all will be accountable in the face of stacks to Heaven of evidence. And they still refuse His Salvation. They rather stay in the fall of darkness, then to be carried out through the eye of a needle!
Also your defining a structure of religion. God was involved with Enoch and Noah. These were earlier tha India.
Judaism and choosing Abraham came through a purity of genes and seed. Thats why God was pargicular about geneologies. And about their interactions and in the care of His Word. With each letter of importance through 5 scribes literally comparing letters not just words.
The Bible is so full of doctrine that the Jews are limited in it. Every letter word and number is on purpose.
Its not possible to create that document with one wtiter and a nasa grade computer, let alone 66 ancient writers spread out over 1000s of years.
The concontinuity and the puzzle pieces fit, as though all 66 were one big picture cut into 10,000 pieces, with precision and each placed strategically woven into each event and through each prophet, to be found hidden and revealed.
He even outlined acceptable prophets vs unaaceptable.
And Job was written even before Genesis. And also Enoch. Enoch and Job are similar in style of writing. So the "religion" is that old! All the way back to Adam, Cain, Abel, and Seth.
And the Bible is clear as well as other texts like Enoch and even secular ancient writings describe some of the same dynamics.
Fallen angels seeding women, and even beasts. Mutating dna and genes through a currupted line.
God kept it pure to bring Jesus forth. Or there couldnt be Salvation.
There was only one way, that is why Jesus prayed in anguish. There was only one way, and He is the one way!
So some of those stories are connected, they are just in the dark movements of fallen angels. And the whole world is under the serpent. Dudt to dust. Jesus came to bring us through the cross and Resurrection, as through the eye of the needle.
As I said, if validity of other claims is any measure, then Hinduism beats any other religion hands-down. You want to talk about Adam-oldness? The vedas refer to Hinduism as 'Eternal Religion', as is confirmed in all the stories, and the term 'Hinduism' was coined by external parties entirely. So, it has been around as long as souls have, and they have been around as long as God has (excluding cardinality). Value of pi was calculated accurate to 4 decimal digits, and then there is the entire trigonometry. They don't talk about eternal lives in any heaven or hell - those are all temporary till you reach God himself by devotion.
If I can reject their stories as being fabricated, then I surely can reject yours. (Not to mention the historical evidence that they might be true.) That won't really be a significant thing on my list.
Only a few people wrote about Jesus - and I'm tempted to think they fabricated so much due to administrative necessity - which is specifically not how recording history works. The prophecies were made after it had all happened (reminds me, I'm yet to see the rapture). He couldn't even have magically risen days after death with godly powers. It has all been too geographically isolated to take seriously. As he died (again) long before the word could spread, I don't think any of it can be true.
All of it has been to keep people in line. (Again, history confirms how those who deviated were punished.) They didn't care about not having it grow too much because they never thought that the purpose would ever be over, and thus it has grown into a big religion.
Also, circular reasoning doesn't create for a valid line of arguments. Like any preacher that I have argued with online (the number isn't big, though), you haven't tackled most of my questions directly.
Now that we belong to big republics (I assume), I don't need to give in to old tools to survive in a society. Without the danger, the number of religious affiliated people is decreasing. As predicted in the vedas. (Also, the Hindu God doesn't exist outside of space and time, so it is even more believable. But they say that God provides evidence based on what you want to believe - an archaic play on the confirmation bias - which is a red flag big enough for me. Faith has no value in truth.)
So, rather than assuming that the biblical God exists and using other ancient folklore to prove it, there should be a line of arguments based on the directly observable, or the directly knowable and undeniable. All the observable noumena is available to start from - and the scientific methods of reasoning that anything that has happened for long enough will continue to happen and what necessarily follows from true premises is true.
As to the remaining part of your argument, I doubt that Jews would have written such a thing. Unless they converted, that is. The powerful get to decide recorded history, and with all of this, christianity has been powerful enough (they made great administrative tools for the purpose) to decide what shall be written. I'd rather believe someone who wasn't affected by their power - and it has all been geographically isolated during the time, which isn't a necessity for someone with godly powers. But for weak and slow humans, it is.
The problem with that is that I can not really advocate for any religion. I generally advocate against all that have notions of a judgement in afterlife.
But, for secularism, I can recommend books to you. Or even an order of reading. There is no central text of the religion that all accept, so even that's not really easy. I can choose for you which books are worth reading.
Also, I don't find religion to be a subject important enough to study extensively. It has been a race of control that is no longer valid enough even to pursue. I used to, when I couldn't think better. Now, even if I do, I can't help noticing the parts that I now find annoying.
Thus, I'm not really eligible enough to compare the religions for you. Though I am to tell you how to do it. It would be in my interest that the religious people become more aware about other religions, no matter what the leaders might say.
To line up with historic accuracy, There would have to be other prophesies fulfilled on which the prophesy below is dependent on. Prophesies are often fulfilled in layers, stacked one on top of another. Inter-dependent on each individual fulfillment, in a sequential order, and falling in their place like dominoes.
Three prohesies had to be accurate and fulfilled in order of sequence for all the other related prophesies to be fulfilled. Not just one! In this example all three related prophesies were fulfilled as they were foretold and written.
Bible Prophesy
Zech 12:2-3 and Zech 14:2-3
. Behold, I will make Jerusalem a cup of TREMBLING unto all the people round about, when they shall be in the siege both against Judah and against Jerusalem. And in that day will I make Jerusalem a burdensome stone for all people: all that burden themselves with it shall be cut in pieces, though all the people of the earth be gathered together against it…
. For I will gather all nations against Jerusalem to battle; and the city shall be taken, and the houses rifled, and the women ravished; and half of the city shall go forth into captivity, and the residue of the people shall not be cut off from the city.
Then shall the LORD go forth, and fight against those nations, as when he fought in the day of battle.”
.
1 - The Hebraic religion historically shows a timeline of interactions with God. Judaism is a culture a people of faith detailing prophetic words inclusive of themselves, other nations, in past, present, and in the future.
Details written include their own discipline and judgements. Charged keeping and transcribing every jot and tittle in precision and accuracy.
The Jewish culture enforced strict adherance to scripture, and required the people least to the greatest to memorize it all. Even for the common people it was mandatory.
2 - Jewish scripture upheld by Jewish people have written prophesies that declare a ripping of their faith from themselves. In their own prophetic scriptures, declaring that they themselves will miss the time of the Messiah, and be judged for it.
With others prophesies promising to scatter them among other Nations as if being chased like driven leaves, blown away by strong winds. With other prophesies promising to gather them again and return them to their own land.
ALL these came true. And after WW2 there they were a Nation moved by God like He was a gardener planting flowers.
Then fulfilled prophesied we see in front of our own eyes! Israel surrounded by her enemies as foretold, and they are a cup of trembling, and a burden that brings terror to tear up the Nations that support her.
As it is written, Israel has becomes a Burdensome Stone to those who lift her. Yet Israel will hold her place. Prophesy is History pre-written, clear history is not interpretations of history. Hindsight of course is 20/20.
3 - Prophesies of Abraham and Sarah were not just a promise of decendents by blood, but to father nations. Rejection of Jesus as foretold, which they did, is how the Spirit fulfilled these prophesies.
We see prophetic fulfillments as the Old and New Testaments have been translated into every tongue. Christians serve the Jewish Messiah in every nation and in every tongue, just like prophets foretold, and just like Jesus foretold.
He wasn't just slipping up and accidentally foretelling these things to us. Prophesies like these are repetative throughout the scripture, He intended them to be noticed.
It is as much a miracle that the Jews missed Him in the fulfillment of all the Prophesies of Messiah's coming, than Peter walking on water!
1 - to scatter them to all the Nations, and
2 - then bring the Jews back from all the nations He had scattered them to, other related detailed prophesied.
3 - Fulfilment brought them back after WW2. .. ... Thousands of years after these prophesies!
Coincidence? Or is this inaccurate?
Was Terrorism a Biblical Prophesy?
Was the Middle East Crisis a Biblical Prophesy?
How is it that over thousands of years of this culture of people, who historically have been reasonable in comparison to other nations.
The Jews didn't bring much on themselves historically.
Why then, and how are they a matter that brings TREMBLING (or TERROR!!) to the door of every Nation?
Has Israel been a burden to lift?
When lifting Israel have those Nations face Trembling, and being cut into pieces?
News flash there is a judgement. It wont go away by denying it exists. Maybe you should find out for sure, instead of making God in your image.
When you design God after your own thoughts and your own ways, you seeve the creature not the creator.
We are already judged. The good news is He walked miles in our shoes to win us back through His death on the cross. He did it so we wouldnt be judged!!!
To carry us out of the fire, not throw us into it!
We already are destined for fire. Jesus did it all to bind our wounds, resusitate us and carry us out through the eye of a needle. Only way was what He did. Otherwise Satan has dominion over our dust. It is judged and he is the warden.
If you understood it, you would understand Gods love.
He hates flesh, sin, and darkness, but He wants to surgically remove that and create in us a new heart join us to Himself.
Darkness cant stand in light. If you love darkness your heart cant live eternity in the pure light of eternal love and life.
The ancient Hebrew sages believed, of course, that God created the heavens and the earth. However, some of them believed that the Word of God was the very template with which He did it. This strikes some of us as simply a colorful exaggeration that goes beyond any direct evidence. There are hints here and there. There are two well-known references to the creation in the Scripture: Genesis 1:1 and John 1:1. Let’s look “underneath” the text of each of these.
Genesis 1:1
In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.
In Hebrew:
Genesis 1:1 in Hebrew
If you examine the numerical values of each of the Hebrew letters, and the numerical value of the words (see chart), and apply them to this formula:
The number of letters x the product of the letters
The number of words x the product of the words
You get 3.1416 x 1017. The value of π to four decimal places! Hmm.
John 1:1
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
In Greek:
John 1:1 in Greek
This time if you take the numerical value of each of the Greek letters (see chart), and the numerical value of the words, and apply them to the same formula:
The number of letters x the product of the letters
The number of words x the product of the words
You now get 2.7183 x 1040, the value of e. Curious!
Significance?
Each of these is another of those puzzling ostensible “coincidences” that are too astonishing to dismiss, and yet present challenges in suggesting any real significance.3 And taken together, they do evoke some conjectures. There are, however, at least two problems: why just four decimal places (they both deviate from the fifth place onwards) and what do you do with all the “extra zeroes”?
I frankly don’t know. Nevertheless, I thought it would be an excellent conversation piece as we return to our academic schedules this month. The rabbis would suggest that each of these may simply be a remez , a hint of something deeper
The recent discovery that the speed of light is not a constant has created quite a stir—and rethinking—in both physics and cosmology. (Although the spate of recent articles always fails to credit Barry Setterfield for calling this to our attention over a decade ago!) However, there does appear to be at least two intrinsic constants in the universe: π and e.
We all met π (“pi”) in school when we had to deal with the circumference of a circle and similar matters. “Pi are squared” sounds like bad grammar, but it is correct geometry for the area of a circle, πr2. We approximated it with 22/7, until we got into engineering circles where we learned that, more precisely, it was 3.141592654… (It has recently been calculated to a trillion decimal places!1)
As we have previously mentioned in several of our materials, π is also a “hidden treasure” in the Hebrew text of 1st Kings 7:23.2 When one corrects the letter values for a variation of the spelling, the 46-foot circumference of Solomon’s “molten sea” is specified to an accuracy of better than 15 thousandths of an inch!
Natural Logarithms
Perhaps less well known to most of our less technical subscribers is the base of Naperian (“natural”) logarithms, e . It shows up in myriads of places in advanced engineering and mathematics such as:
In wave mechanics, X = Aekt
Or electrical theory, Q(t) = Qe-t/RC
In advanced math, Eix = Cos x +iSin x, where i = (-1)1/2
And the distribution of prime numbers: A(x) = x/logex
It is defined by e = lim (1 + 1/n)n
n-> and it is usually approximated by 2.718281828.
Here is one authorship signature in the Bible. One of many!
Show me this n Hindu please. Since you say its there, where is it?
Percieving an idea after the fact and it being written into the text prior to it being put to an equation are two extremely different things.
To a mond that has logic it os clear!
The ancient Hebrew sages believed, of course, that God created the heavens and the earth. However, some of them believed that the Word of God was the very template with which He did it. This strikes some of us as simply a colorful exaggeration that goes beyond any direct evidence. There are hints here and there. There are two well-known references to the creation in the Scripture: Genesis 1:1 and John 1:1. Let’s look “underneath” the text of each of these.
Genesis 1:1
In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.
In Hebrew:
Genesis 1:1 in Hebrew
If you examine the numerical values of each of the Hebrew letters, and the numerical value of the words (see chart), and apply them to this formula:
The number of letters x the product of the letters
The number of words x the product of the words
You get 3.1416 x 1017. The value of π to four decimal places! Hmm.
John 1:1
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
In Greek:
John 1:1 in Greek
This time if you take the numerical value of each of the Greek letters (see chart), and the numerical value of the words, and apply them to the same formula:
The number of letters x the product of the letters
The number of words x the product of the words
You now get 2.7183 x 1040, the value of e. Curious!
Significance?
Each of these is another of those puzzling ostensible “coincidences” that are too astonishing to dismiss, and yet present challenges in suggesting any real significance.3 And taken together, they do evoke some conjectures. There are, however, at least two problems: why just four decimal places (they both deviate from the fifth place onwards) and what do you do with all the “extra zeroes”?
I frankly don’t know. Nevertheless, I thought it would be an excellent conversation piece as we return to our academic schedules this month. The rabbis would suggest that each of these may simply be a remez , a hint of something deeper
Within any system large enough, some pattern must appear. The formula couldn't possibly have been written in the Bible, but was obtained after a huge trial and error, or by chance.
An interesting link for you. There is Pi upto 31 decimal places.
They were also aware of the golden ratio (which is presented rather too obviously to ignore) as is evident by various ancient depictions. (For example, that crescent moon on Shiva's head comprises of 2 circles, whose diameters are in golden ratio.)
Not really God, but it is religions that I do not want to exist.
Perhaps you didn't understand when I used the term 'antitheist'. It means that I am against all organised religion.
Due to reasons I've already stated well enough. Basically, they're parasites to human progress that are no longer necessary (even if they once were).
Antitheism will be the next wave of attacks on religion. I'm waiting for the time to come when religion is a tool only for the retarded. Because, well, that's the best that can be done and pushing it any further would be a terrible idea.
I expect it to be rather simple. Because, well, anyone reasonable should understand what is reasonable, and the others are not even targeted. For them, I expect the passage of time to play its role.
In Bible Codes, some are far out and take it far out. But some are a signature of Dive Authorship. And these ones are definitely signatures as if He etched His Word with His own hand.
Pi found in Genesis 1: 1 and adv math e found in John 1: 1.
These aren't spread out, found in difficulty, and in need of twisting. These two adv math codes are found, each found using within one verse. And each one found separately in chapter one of two seperate books, written in two separate millennials, in written in two separate languages. And the nature of interpretation works with what is there from the ancient text.
And the odds of them occurring at any point at all within all 66 books of the Bible is in probabilities of unreasonable proportions.
What do you think is the probability of a few of these together found coded in the Bible? If just musing at first glance, wouldn't you say, " no way?" I'm not even saying in the whole Bible. What is the probability all these are found in only six books out if 66?
As for me, I dont think a calculation is needed to tell me that is an unreasonable probability in calculations of a snowflakes chance in Hell!
Even crazier, pi and e are coded in two different languages, Hebrew for Jews and Greek was a time period of the Gospel's progression out to the Gentiles.
And both verses state "In the beginning," so they each speak of a time period of Creation and in Jesus as the Creator. And advanced math equations not known yet for 1000s of years to come.
In Genesis 1: 1 pi equation is encoded, in creation of the world and universe and in God stitching prophesy into appointed times to bring Creation full circle.
And in John 1: 1 in Greek while the Gospel is propelled out to the Gentiles, you find in verse one the equation for e, which is compound interest, multiplying exponentially.
So even the equations found communicate the purpose of the event. And even the Bible Author God, divided these times by purpose as shown in the 1st verses of these two books, Genesis and John. Then to add to this timetables for dating history is BC and AD.
So the Bible notes each beginning with a math equation. Then took the division of time line for dating history. And then add TORH TORH YHWY HROT HROT in the beginning of each of the five books of the Bible at intervals of Bible numbers of importance in the written text throughout every book of seven and forty-nine .
These singuarly are a stretch against reasonable probability, but for all to be right there on the top, not buried or crazy, together all these are proof of God and His Word. All of these together are impossible odds without Divine Authorship. Together these are more than just an oooh wow, these are against odds of probabilities that are not even be conceivable.
Now in contradiction beween the improbability of two faiths.
A comparison between Christianity and Evolution as ecplanation of Creation.
So on one hand, Evolutionism states strands of DNA self assembled and mutated and against all odds of occurance and against all odds of science principles and without any evidence of a physical example in front of our eyes, we are told to believe it. And that it is factual.
Then you take just these few pieces of many in evidence, tangible and available to view in everyone's individual hands. With everyone having the ability to test it, and even count out the codes for themselves, and literally proving itself in person from the beginning and in person showing agsinst all odds He not only created, but He put it in writing against all odds to prove it!
You have to be evil or an idiot to at least not step back and say there is more to God and the Bible than I currently think. Maybe I should look further!
Why does Israel and God's Word and Jesus divide huge significant effects to everyone in the entire world, a mid point in half, like God is the center of the entire world, even the universe?
The below shows something crazy, that in no way was in the hands of an old Jewish guy to control.
Jesus holds place of time world history is defined by His birth into the world. Time is divided by Him - B.C. and A.D.
An equidistant method of coding tales a pattern of letters and pulls thise letters out to reveal hidden messages.
This code found in the TORH, the first five books. It shows directional writen languages that show countries that read and write left to right or right to left. Like Jesus on the time-line of world history. Written language in the Hebrew text has code revealed, as if directed from a directors chair perched in Jerusalem.
Torh spelled out read in two directions in the Hebrew scripture. TORH spelled both direction left to right, and right to left, with YHWY in the middle.
The secrets of the Torah are revealed... in the skipping of the letters.
49 (72) letter sequences:
• Genesis TORH - in Hebrew at a 49 letter interval pattern
• Exodus TORH - in Hebrew at a 49 letter interval pattern
• Leviticus ? YHWH in a 7 pattern, square root of 49
• Numbers HROT - in Hebrew at a 49 letter interval pattern
• Deuteronomy HROT - in Hebrew at a 49 letter interval pattern
The Internet is full of experts. The problem today in every area, its easy to find false information and think it is expert information. Its how media is successful at steering.
It takes effort to find truth. Fyi, that is an end times dynamic.
Deceptions always existed. Never before to this degree!
For Bible examples of contradiction propaganda. There is an agenda.
The common deception is the Gospels are not eyewitnesses. Well scholars have confirmed the writings, skeptic scholars without effort assume them away.
Many pull out supposed discrepancies. One of which is "the final words of Jesus."
I personally tool all 4 Gospel accounts from Jesus' trial to burial and found something interesting on my own.
I saw exactly where each writet was standing, their unique emotional state, and more... This is the best section to do this with, because they were not traveling in a close knit group.
They were in hiding and scattered. Yet each fit like a custom fitting glove, and is clear there was no calaboration. If there were it would have inconsistencies showing many views from inconsistent locations during the event.
I followed their movements, and their surroundings, and noted what they each heard and saw.
And it resulted in 4 different accounts of one event with location of event as a point of view by their locations.
What they saw and heard as they had written tells exactly us literally were they stood and walked and their activities witnessing the events were consistent.
There is ZERO doubt that these are eyewitness accounts.
Try it yourself. Trial to burial, compare them. Its amazing!
Mark has a minimal possibly that it is a written account dictated by Peter. But I think it was a matter of being next to Peter.
Either way its either Peters eyewitness account or Marks with Peter. The other 3 are so descriptive of view, its not even questionable!
And also Mark doesn't contradict the others at all.
But to the so called "experts" and also those who listen to them and take them as experts, are proven as nothing more than lies of unlearned idiots, mouthing off about something they couldn't have even read.
And if they did read it they should demand a refund of any money spent on their educations.
The court and cross accounts in each Gospel is unique because they weren't viewing the event together as a group.
They were scattered, this portion of the Gospel is written from a more unique and per individual prespective. The disciples were completely separated out of the group, and either hiding alone, or with just a few of the others. We can see that difference in throughout this event specifically.
John was inside the courthouse area with Mary, and at the foot of the cross with Mary.
John was going through this day at Mary's pace, managing Mary's grief, along side her all day.
Luke was the second closest, still hanging low, but his vantage point was inside the court area, but on the side toward where the people exited headed to Galgatha. Luke caught many details of the court case, and also caught some side conversations, after Jesus was sentenced in the court area and also while Jesus was being lead to Golgotha.
Matthew was behind where the Pharisees were, and was outside of the court room, opposite side of were Luke was.
And Mark was not in the court area close enough to detail testimonies or the commotion after the sentencing.
Mark was likely hanging low with Peter, and also along with the rich man named Joseph, who donated his tomb.
Mark's account shows he was likely with Peter and Joseph, the tomb gifter. The account is described as if it were from prespective of one on the furthest edge of the entire event, yet within proximity to record them from a prespective of one standing further away from the action that the other three.
Mark's prespective is from by the road side, where people were going past. Passing through the commotion while going about their daily routine.
Most of Mark's comments are as if from a prespective of watching it all from an area where people passing through, and not where people were in huddled together as spectators inside the crowd. "Passing by" and "shaking their heads." And not from in the midst of the crowd, noise, and chaos.
Mark writes Jesus' criminal sentencing and the crucifixion as recounted by a prespective of one close enough to see the activity outside the courthouse, and hearing bits as people went by them, on the road to Golgotha, but not close enough to record the details of testimonies and conversations.
At the trial John sat with Mary inside the court room, a premium seat. And at the cross, John was directly in front of the cross.
Luke made it to Galgatha before John and Mary. So you can imagine that Mary was an emotional wreck, and John moved at her lead as he comforted her.
Luke made it down to where they were erecting the cross to its upright position before John. He catches Jesus saying Father forgive them ... and also the conversation Jesus had with the thief on the right side.
Luke was standing closer to the thief on the right side. And Luke also seems to be in the midst of a less noisy and less hostile crowd compared to Matthew's position.
Mark pretty much stayed in the business road, at the outer edge or outside of the crowd, with Peter. Peter was the biggest scaredey cat that day. Mark exclusively discusses fear of the rich guy who donated his tomb. Mark seems to have been hanging with Joseph the rich guy, and with Peter. And they seem to be furthest from the midst of the crowd.
Matthew was standing on the far side, of the left side thief, and Matt was in the midst of a noisy hostile crowd. And his mentality was the most conflicted emotionally. He hears every gripe loud as thunder. His mentality and personality shine through his account of events. When writing it, he is there again. Very emotional about it.
Thallus, in the third book of his histories, explains away the darkness as an eclipse of the sun—unreasonably as it seems to me.’
Apparently, Thallus attempted to ascribe a naturalistic explanation to the darkness during the crucifixion.
Phlegon was a Greek historian who wrote an extensive chronology around AD 137:
In the fourth year of the 202nd Olympiad (i.e., AD 33) there was ‘the greatest eclipse of the sun’ and that ‘it became night in the sixth hour of the day [i.e., noon] so that stars even appeared in the heavens.
There was a great earthquake in Bithynia, and many things were overturned in Nicaea.’
Image Locutus Borg Solar annular (ring) eclipse; an eclipse could NOT have caused darkness at the crucifixion because they don't occur during the full moon
Annular (ring) eclipse. An eclipse could NOT have caused darkness at the crucifixion because they don’t occur during the full moon.
Phlegon provides powerful confirmation of the Gospel accounts. He identifies the year and the exact time of day. In addition, he writes of an earthquake accompanying the darkness, which is specifically recorded in Matthew’s Gospel (Matthew 27:51).
However, like Thallus, he fallaciously attempts to interpret the darkness as a direct effect of a solar eclipse.
Africanus composed a five volume History of the World around AD 221. He was also a pagan convert to Christianity. His historical scholarship so impressed Roman Emperor Alexander Severus that Africanus was entrusted with the official responsibility of building the Emperor’s library at the Pantheon in Rome. Africanus writes:
On the whole world there pressed a most fearful darkness; and the rocks were rent by an earthquake, and many places in Judea and other districts were thrown down.
This darkness Thallus, in the third book of his History, calls, as appears to me without reason, an eclipse of the sun. For the Hebrews celebrate the passover on the 14th day according to the moon, and the passion of our Savior falls on the day before the passover; but an eclipse of the sun takes place only when the moon comes under the sun.
And it cannot happen at any other time but in the interval between the first day of the new moon and the last of the old, that is, at their junction: how then should an eclipse be supposed to happen when the moon is almost diametrically opposite the sun?
Let opinion pass however; let it carry the majority with it; and let this portent of the world be deemed an eclipse of the sun, like others a portent only to the eye. Phlegon records that, in the time of Tiberius Caesar, at full moon, there was a full eclipse of the sun from the sixth hour to the ninth—manifestly that one of which we speak.
But what has an eclipse in common with an earthquake, the rending rocks, and the resurrection of the dead, and so great a perturbation throughout the universe? Surely no such event as this is recorded for a long period.
Africanus rightly argues that a solar eclipse could not have occurred during the lunar cycle of the Passover, as this diagram shows. He also questions the link between an eclipse, an earthquake, and the miraculous events recorded in Matthew’s Gospel. Eclipses do not set off earthquakes and bodily resurrections.
We also know that eclipses only last for several minutes, not three hours. For Africanus, naturalistic explanations for the darkness at the crucifixion were grossly insufficient, as he showed by applying real science.
In other words, if you are in a jury and we wheeled in a sampling. Just a portion, it would be hands down unanamous for any reasonable juror to conclude God DOES exist and His Word IS of divine authorship, with authenticating signatures throughout!!
You're basically just praising bible. (I can't really access those articles, though considering that the Bible is long, I wouldn't be surprised.) That doesn't count for the proof of an omnipotent 'thing' that loves us.
The end times... I wouldn't call them that. But, just for religious reference, Hindus predicted the next reset to come after over 4,20,000 years from now. I don't expect it to come even then. It says that religion will die about 5000 years from now - which seems to be an estimate far too generous. But, considering that the times were highly religious, it is a good estimate.
I have just proved beyond a reasonable doubt that the Bible is unusual in accuracy beyond the writers physical abilities.
Jesus could not have made occur the [few] samples that I used of prophesy, He couldnt have forced them to happen they were not in physical control of "just a man."
I proved God exists and communicated in writing. And since that is true He sent His Spirit to dwell in His children.
So therefore just in this small sampling a logical conclusion would be...
1 the Bible is a serious book to consider as communication from a Deity.
2 that the Bible is not just predictive, but that it is prewritten History appointing events like using google calendars. Scheduled appointed and completed!
3 that Jesus is who He said He was, and even secular writing confirm some unexplained events occurring
The bottom line is its all unreasonable to dismiss!
Your Bible isn't a logical treatise. You can praise it all you like, that wouldn't convince me. I care little about all those accidental prophecies it contains. If you have any rule to extract prophecies from it, rather than just picking them from billions of possible combinations, I might take it more seriously.
As for now, you can only use what it states directly. Or what there is sufficient evidence to believe that it states.
You did neither, and have just been praising it for what I have no reason to assume it even means. It doesn't, thus, follow that any of it is true at all. It does follow, though, that you christians have taken it so seriously that you would do anything to not let it go, no matter what random connections you might need to make.
In comparison, the vedas are direct, and even the numbers are represented much more properly in tales. Also, they don't need desperate interpretations to stay alive.
From how you have said it all, it seems like rejecting christianity is a load too light for me to be concerned.
The time seems almost ripe to deliver the next wave of attacks on the regime of religions.
As things that are too obviously coincidences? On 2 of the gospels at the first line? Using any formula that you might want to? (For the record, it is of no consequence what the product of letters is or their positions.)
Pretty high. I'm surprised that you guys weren't desperate enough to find the values of, say, the gravitational constant or the avogadro number. Probably the formula got too complex like that.
Unless, that is, you can answer why would those values be at these specific places and under that formula. That significantly lowers the probability of randomly finding them. I'm willing to ignore the other things as intentional by your God (you know, the order, and the discrepancy in value).
I'm going to read the Bible. And I will only see what is in there directly, and the logic behind it, rather than desperately trying to prove anything true about it. After all, that's the necessity for attacking its validity. I'll be looking closely enough to criticise it.
You, read the Rig Veda. So that you understand what a mathematical religious text is like, and see that the desperate attempts to find any valid meaning ought to be futile.
Hindsight is 20 20. So we can look back over the entirety and see exactly how God meant interpretations. Its not a mystery!
You must not like the interpretation. Perhaps you love darkness to much to give up.
2 Timothy 4
3 For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but wanting to have their ears tickled, they will accumulate for themselves teachers in accordance to their own desires, 4 and will turn away their ears from the truth and will turn aside to myths.
We're not understanding what he means, but are just trying to find meanings where there are none. Obviously, we will find a meaning if that is big enough, but that proves nothing.
Thats like saying just because you saw the criminal and a sketch artist drew it, and it resembles another sketch from another witness that they cant possibly be the same person.
Its a brand new breed of illogical people a truely unreasonable mindset in the end of days, isnt it?
Although not meant as doctrine. We see a fluidity in Gods Word. Even the boaring run on names in geneologies of the Biblr have messages confirming the message of the Bible.
So the Bible in Genesis some in the 1st chapters. No digging or spinning. Just skimming the top! And this is just Bible Code. Bible code itself is coded by several methods. Then you also have prophesy and science and reasonable explanations behind the why. And the Bible continues in the same directives.
There are two well-known references to the creation in the Scripture: Genesis 1:1 and John 1:1. Let’s look “underneath” the text of each of these.
Genesis 1:1
In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.
In Hebrew:
Genesis 1:1 in Hebrew letters
If you examine the numerical values of each of the Hebrew letters, and the numerical value of the words (see chart), and apply them to this formula:
The number of letters x the product of the letters
The number of words x the product of the words
You get 3.1416 x 1017. The value of π to four decimal places!
John 1:1
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
In Greek letters
John 1:1 in Greek
This time if you take the numerical value of each of the Greek letters (see chart), and the numerical value of the words, and apply them to the same formula:
The number of letters x the product of the letters
The number of words x the product of the words
You now get 2.7183 x 1040, the value of e.
o.1 Tamar then resorted to posing as a prostitute and Judah unknowingly got her pregnant. When confronted with the evidence, he confesses that his sin was greater than hers.2 Tamar gives birth to two sons, Zarah and Pharez. Both are, of course, illegitimate.
The Torah provides that a bastard results in being cast out of the congregation for 10 generations.3 The strange remark in Ruth 4:12 was, in fact, a prophecy: the tenth generation from Pharez was none other than David. And to emphasize this, the book closes with David's genealogy:
Now these are the generations of Pharez: Pharez begat Hezron, And Hezron begat Ram, and Ram begat Amminadab, And Amminadab begat Nahshon, and Nahshon begat Salmon, And Salmon begat Boaz, and Boaz begat Obed, And Obed begat Jesse, and Jesse begat David.
Ruth 4:18-22
The inheritance of David is here prophesied before the days of Samuel. 4 But there's more.
The Hebrew Text of Genesis 38
One of the reasons that the sordid tale of Judah and Tamar has been included in the Scriptures is because this incident is included in the family tree of the Messiah.
It is interesting that hidden within the text of Genesis 38, at 49-letter intervals, are the names of Boaz, Ruth, Obed, Jesse, and David-in chronological order ! [See figure] ; note that Hebrew goes from right to left, and the names are coded backwards.)
These names anticipate, five generations in advance, the next five generations climaxing in David, a total of ten generations. Here in the Torah we find the names of the principals of the Book of Ruth, and a delineation of their descendants leading up to the royal line. How did Moses know all this centuries before the fact? We know that Moses himself wrote the Torah: Jesus verified that very fact numerous times.
The presence of such features of the Biblical text is a profound demonstration of its supernatural origin. There is absolutely no way that these details could have been anticipated in advance except by Divine guidance and the control of the most subtle aspects of the recorded text-far outstripping any insights of the authors themselves
Everything was on purpose, even names.
Names in genealogies -
Adam, comes from adomah, and means "man." As the first man, that seems straightforward enough.
Seth, which means "appointed." When he was born Eve said, "For God hath appointed me another seed instead of Abel, whom Cain slew."
Enosh, which means "mortal," "frail," or "miserable." It is from the root anash: to be incurable; used of a wound, grief, woe, sickness, or wickedness. (It was in the days of Enosh that men began to defile the name of the Living God.
Kenan, from which can mean "sorrow," dirge," or "elegy." (The precise denotation is somewhat elusive; some study aids unfortunately presume an Aramaic root synonymous with "Cainan.") Balaam, looking down from the heights of Moab, employed a pun upon the name of the Kenites when he prophesied their destruction.
Mahalalel, from mahalal, which means "blessed" or "praise"; and El, the name for God. Thus, Mahalalel means "the Blessed God." Often Hebrew names included El, the name of God, as Dani-el, "God is my Judge," Nathani-el, "Gift of God," etc.
Jared, from the verb yaradh, meaning "shall come down." Some authorities suggest that this might have been an allusion to the "Sons of God" who "came down" to corrupt the daughters of men, resulting in the Nephilim ("Fallen Ones") of Genesis 6.
Enoch, which means "teaching," or "commencement." He was the first of four generations of preachers. In fact, the earliest recorded prophecy was by Enoch, which amazingly enough deals with the Second Coming of Christ.
....[Methuselah - The Flood of Noah did not come as a surprise. It had been preached on for four generations. But something strange happened when Enoch was 65, from which time "he walked with God." Enoch was given a prophecy that as long as his son was alive, the judgment of the flood would be withheld; but as soon as he died, the flood would be sent forth.
Enoch named his son to reflect this prophecy.]
The name Methuselah comes from two roots: muth, a root that means "death"5 ; and from shalach, which means "to bring," or "to send forth." Thus, the name Methuselah signifies, "his death shall bring."
And, indeed, in the year that Methuselah died, the flood came.
Methuselah was 187 when he had Lamech, and lived 782 years more.
Lamech had Noah when he was 182.7 The Flood came in Noah's 600th year.
187 + 182 + 600 = 969, Methuselah's age when he died.
It is interesting that Methuselah's life was, in effect, a symbol of God's mercy in forestalling the coming judgment of the flood.
It is therefore fitting that his lifetime is the oldest in the Bible, symbolizing the extreme extensiveness of God's mercy.
Lamech - Methuselah's son was named Lamech, a root still evident today in our own English word, "lament" or "lamentation." Lamech suggests "despairing." (This name is also linked to the Lamech in Cain's line who inadvertently killed his son Tubal-Cain in a hunting incident.)
Noah - Lamech, of course, is the father of Noah, which is derived from nacham , "to bring relief" or "comfort," as Lamech himself explains.
The Composite List Now let's put it all together:
Hebrew - - - - - - - - English
Adam - - - - - - - - Man
Seth - - - - - - - - Appointed
Enosh - - - - - - - - Mortal
Kenan - - - - - - - - Sorrow
Mahalalel - - - - - - - - The Blessed God
Jared - - - - - - - - Shall come down
Enoch - - - - - - - - Teaching
Methuselah - - - - - - - - His death shall bring
Lamech - - - - - - - - The despairing
Noah - - - - - - - - Rest, or comfort
Here is a summary of God's plan of redemption, hidden here within a genealogy in Genesis! You will never convince me that a group of Jewish rabbis deliberately "contrived" to hide the "Christian Gospel" right here in a genealogy within their venerated Torah!
Evidences of Design
The implications of this discovery are far more deeply significant than may be evident at first glance. It demonstrates that in the earliest chapters of the Book of Genesis, God had already laid out His plan of redemption for the predicament of mankind. It is the beginning of a love story, ultimately written
in blood on a wooden cross which was erected in Judea
almost 2,000 years ago.
In Genesis 1: 29 to Genesis 2
Hebrew names for 25 variety of trees and sure enough in the code known as ELS (equidistant letter sequences)
e.g. Wheat can be found in Genesis W ( 5 letters ) H ( 5 letters ) E ( 5 letters ) A ( 5 letters) T. ) all 25 names of the trees are found in that passage describing the garden of Eden. The
Find meaning in this hvhhbvcfgbccxvbvxfthffgjtrescvh
Is it obvious? There is no meaning to be obvios.
The codes found are against odds
For 1 they are often found in number intervals Bible number spacific. 2 they are textually relevant.
Like you may be able to find the word sahara desert in mobey dick at 200 letter intervals. Its nonsense and an irrelevant comparison.
Whereas in the Bible it is often found in patterns of biblical numerology. There are other patterns codes are found in, some end up intersecting and are connected to each other and are in texts that are relevent to the findings.
Another code type makes pictures like you would outline a galaxy.
You dont understand it. You need to seek to find. You need to desire understanding and He will give it.
It is revealed by Him. No scholars can read it, and no simpleton can read it. It is a book that needs both the book and the supplements to read it.
The book by itself is closed. The Spirit by Himself always shows in accordance with the Word.
God put in checks and balances to keep us securely on the narrow way. And to keep us from detours of false prophets, and to correct our way when we make a wrong turn.
Psalm 119:105
Thy word is a lamp unto my feet, and a light unto my path.
Isaiah 29
9 Be delayed and wait,
Blind yourselves and be blind;
They become drunk, but not with wine,
They stagger, but not with strong drink.
10 For the Lord has poured over you a spirit of deep sleep,
He has shut your eyes, the prophets;
And He has covered your heads, the seers.
11 The entire vision will be to you like the words of a sealed book, which when they give it to the one who is literate, saying, “Please read this,” he will say, “I cannot, for it is sealed.” 12 Then the book will be given to the one who is illiterate, saying, “Please read this.” And he will say, “I cannot read.”
13 Then the Lord said,
“Because this people draw near with their words
And honor Me with their lip service,
But they remove their hearts far from Me,
And their reverence for Me consists of tradition learned by rote,
14 Therefore behold, I will once again deal marvelously with this people, wondrously marvelous;
And the wisdom of their wise men will perish,
And the discernment of their discerning men will be concealed.”
15 Woe to those who deeply hide their plans from the Lord,
And whose deeds are done in a dark place,
And they say, “Who sees us?” or “Who knows us?”
16 You turn things around!
Shall the potter be considered as equal with the clay,
That what is made would say to its maker, “He did not make me”;
Or what is formed say to him who formed it, “He has no understanding”?
17 Is it not yet just a little while
Before Lebanon will be turned into a fertile field,
And the fertile field will be considered as a forest?
18 On that day the deaf will hear words of a book,
And out of their gloom and darkness the eyes of the blind will see.
19 The afflicted also will increase their gladness in the Lord,
And the needy of mankind will rejoice in the Holy One of Israel.
20 For the ruthless will come to an end and the scorner will be finished,
Indeed all who are intent on doing evil will be cut off;
21 Who cause a person to be indicted by a word,
And ensnare him who adjudicates at the gate,
And defraud the one in the right with meaningless arguments.
And here, we come to the backbone of biblical reasoning. It isn't available to he who has no faith before reading it.
Defeats the whole purpose of saving souls, doesn't it? As I said, faith has no value in truth, and this method of reasoning should generally be enough for me to reject it in its entirety. (As I said, I've already rejected much more logical things due to such reasons, so for Bible, it doesn't seem like something I would have to think about a second time.)
And if you are closed to weigh it then how can you understand it?
If you dont want God to exist, then He will let you go on.
My message is seek while you can find Him. Soon you wont be able to find Him. If you seek with openness He will show you. If He shows you and you turn to Him He will come in and dine with you. He is found by those who seek Him.
So my message is its closed because you havnt asked it to be opened! Not because you are not part of the party, but because you returned the invitation to RSVP with "not coming!"
Chuck Missler has been a recent find. He is not my only sourse, since I literally first heard of him a few weeks ago. But he has become a faborite source. I explain that because He has well written examples.
I dont follow man, I expect God to show me, and He does. Holy Spirit is alive and dwells within His sheep. But we recognize truth in others. Sheep know the voice of Jesus and can hear truth.
Again these are a drop in a bucket of piles of evidence
"And I will pour on the house of David and on the inhabitants of Jerusalem the Spirit of grace and supplication; then they will look on Me whom they pierced…"
- Zechariah 12:10
"…Thus it is written, and thus it behoved Christ to suffer, and to rise from the dead the third day:"
- Luke 24:46
John the Baptist wore camel's hair and ate locusts and wild honey (Matt 3:4).
And by the Spirit, John recognized the true purpose of Jesus of Nazareth from the beginning, before Jesus' ministry had even started.
John introduced Jesus to the crowds in John 1:29, saying, "Behold the Lamb of God, which taketh away the sin of the world." John understood. He got it.
After his resurrection, Jesus met two men on the road to Emmaus, and he expected them to already understand through the Scriptures that Christ was meant to suffer and die. "And beginning at Moses and all the prophets, he expounded unto them in all the scriptures the things concerning himself,"
(Luke 24:26-27).
We would all have loved to be there on the road to Emmaus that day, walking with the resurrected Jesus himself as he detailed the different prophecies that concerned his death and resurrection.
Still, the apostles and other New Testament writers do a good job of filling us in. The Old Testament is filled with prophecies and types of Jesus' suffering and death and resurrection as payment for the sins of the world, and the New Testament points those out.
Psalm 16: 8-11
Simon Peter starts out on the day of Pentecost explaining that Jesus the Messiah had risen from the dead, "Whom God hath raised up, having loosed the pains of death: because it was not possible that he should be holden of it," (Acts 2:24).
Peter then pulled from the Psalms to prove the truth of his testimony.
"For David speaketh concerning him, I foresaw the Lord always before my face, for he is on my right hand, that I should not be moved: Therefore did my heart rejoice, and my tongue was glad; moreover also my flesh shall rest in hope: Because thou wilt not leave my soul in hell, neither wilt thou suffer thine Holy One to see corruption. Thou hast made known to me the ways of life; thou shalt make me full of joy with thy countenance.
"Men and brethren, let me freely speak unto you of the patriarch David, that he is both dead and buried, and his sepulchre is with us unto this day.
Therefore being a prophet, and knowing that God had sworn with an oath to him, that of the fruit of his loins, according to the flesh, he would raise up Christ to sit on his throne; He seeing this before spake of the resurrection of Christ, that his soul was not left in hell, neither his flesh did see corruption. This Jesus hath God raised up, whereof we all are witnesses." - Act 2:24-32
The sacrifice and resurrection of the Messiah are throughout the Old Testament.
Psalm 22, written by King David a millennium before Christ, gives us the very perspective of the Lord hanging on the cross.
It describes how the people mocked Christ
(Psalm 22:7-8; Mat 27:41-43),
how they cast lots to divide up his clothes
(Psalm 22:18; Mat 27:35),
how his bones were out of joint
(Psalm 22:14), how the wicked had surrounded him and pierced his hands and feet
(Psalm 22:16) – the scars of which Thomas later got to touch and feel (John 20:27).
Psalm 22 ends by saying God's righteousness would be declared to "a people that shall be born"
In Psalm 22 - crucifixtion not practiced yet. But here is an excerpt, it sounds like prophesy of crucifixion. David did not experience this. Yet he wrote it.
There are 28 scriptures just in psalms that were fulfilled in Jesus!
Ps 22
14 I am poured out like water, and all my bones are out of joint: my heart is like wax; it is melted in the midst of my bowels.
(Bleeding from cuts and whipping, and also piercing His side. And internal bleeding)( bones out of joint! That would be from hanging with stress pulling on His joints)
15 My strength is dried up like a potsherd; and my tongue cleaveth to my jaws; and thou hast brought me into the dust of death.
(Weakened by the beatings, and parched of thirst, He called for a drink, they gave Him vinegar on a sponge)
16 For dogs have compassed me: the assembly of the wicked have inclosed me: they pierced my hands and my feet.
(Did Jesus tell the guards to pierce His hands and feet? This didn't happen to David, and it wasnt practiced. So where did the thought come from?)
17 I may tell all my bones: they look and stare upon me.
(It will be a public display, a public humiliation)
18 They part my garments among them, and cast lots upon my vesture. (And they did this too)
Is 53
4 Surely our griefs He Himself bore,
And our sorrows He carried;
Yet we ourselves esteemed Him stricken,
Smitten of God, and afflicted.
5 But He was pierced through for our transgressions,
He was crushed for our iniquities;
The chastening for our well-being fell upon Him,
And by His scourging we are healed.
6 All of us like sheep have gone astray,
Each of us has turned to his own way;
But the Lord has caused the iniquity of us all
To fall on Him.
7 He was oppressed and He was afflicted,
Yet He did not open His mouth;
Like a lamb that is led to slaughter,
And like a sheep that is silent before its shearers,
So He did not open His mouth.
8 By oppression and judgment He was taken away;
And as for His generation, who considered
That He was cut off out of the land of the living
For the transgression of my people, to whom the stroke was due?
9 His grave was assigned with wicked men,
Yet He was with a rich man in His death,
Because He had done no violence,
Nor was there any deceit in His mouth.
10 But the Lord was pleased
To crush Him, putting Him to grief;
If He would render Himself as a guilt offering,
He will see His offspring,
He will prolong His days,
And the good pleasure of the Lord will prosper in His hand.
You - Well, I guess that took a lot of time for this forum. It's not like I have to take the burden of proof. As your religion is an obsolete administrative tool, it is clear that it was meant for totalitarian regimes where people aren't allowed to think for themselves. History confirms it. I'd go far enough to call religions as clingy parasites and their followers as addict hosts. As Marx would have said, religion is the opium of people.
Actually its the opposite a "one world government" controlling a "one world religion" is literally Satans regime coming to its final end of exaltation. As he had already begun and started spinning his webs in Russia, Germany, and China, Catholocism, Islam, etc...
Tolken's one ring to rule them all, Tolken laid out Biblical principles or Biblical realities. That fiction Armagedon. Like CS Lewis books. They were friends in the faith.
Judeo-Christian religion was its only hinderence. In the end the Bible says He will use a vicious army and bring judgement through them to Israel, and the whole world will be in it.
Israel made it back to their land and other things also completed.
So as one world regime promises pwace and safety, guess who wont cooperate? Enemies surrounding Israel. I wonder who they might be? But then in the final battle, Ezek 39, He demolishes that evil too, along with the one world regime.
It's a nice thought which helped, and continues to help millions, to alleviate the harshness of everyday life.
Fortunately, or maybe unfortunately, science has proven most of the scriptures of the various man made religions to be no more than gobbledegook, well meaning gobbledegook, but nevertheless, gobbledegook.
Nothing after death? Absolute nothing? So what are unexplained spiritual things around us? Just mind tricks. We all just have tricky minds that experience everything explainable, even if an explanation doesnt exist?
Do YOU believe in unexplained "spiritual things", "like", people talking to dead relatives and friends ...through a "medium", or just "Saintly" spiritual things??
I don't have THEE answer to an "existence" after death. I just don't believe in "You have to be good according to a belief, or you are going to rot in (some place called) HELL!"
I don't know. I would like to think there is. The problem is there is no way to provide tangible evidence that one does or does not exist. We definitely should not perform actions that assume it does, but it might. I have a hard time with the subject because I get emotional problems just thinking of the possibility that when I die that'll be it. I feel like I only have so much time to exist.
On the other hand, maybe it's not just a fairy tale. Maybe it does. Maybe I'll go to heaven or hell. And maybe hell isn't just a scary story. Hell, maybe I'm going to hell for saying this. But I have a hard time settling my emotional problems with nothing more than a story. But things go by so fast. Lol.
You don't have time to exist, you have time dying as a gift from God who wants to give you eternal life to save you from dying. Your emotional problem is not fearing you cease to exist in death, your problem is fearing you won't cease to exist and you don't know where you are going...and you have to think maybe you are on your way to frying like an eternal sausage in Hell. If you can believe you cease to exist in death, then there is nothing to be afraid of, you will be out of your confusion, out of your suffering, out of any responsibility for any evil things you have said, thought, or done. A person who really convinces themselves that they are getting out of existence in death is a proud and brave fool. It's good to see you have not reached that point.
Yes things go be very fast, your life is but a vapor that appears for a short time and then vanishes. The grass withers and the flower fades away. God offers you rest. He will take your burden away, He will change you and your emotional problems will be put away if you will trust Him, believe on what He did for you when He died for you to pay your price in death so you can be forgiven of the debt you owe God for your time. If you are not forgiven, you have to pay on that debt forever in the fire of Hell. That is not what God created you for, He created you for life, He wants you to have eternal life now as His gift to you. Life means God is good, God gives life and it's eternal. Believe Jesus is God who died for you and conquered death, ask God in Jesus' name to forgive you of your sins, invite Jesus to come in to you as your Savior and receive the gift of God which is eternal life through Jesus Christ the Lord. There is no other way, you will be lost forever if you will not be saved by God Himself who did all He could to save you from Hell.
Tangible evidence is provided, you have to believe the evidence points to the truth, you have to believe the truth or you will be lost in lies experiencing confusion (an understatement) forever.
The "evidence" is like saying we should believe women are actually from Venus or how could they be so weird. It doesn't really work to say a tree is evidence for god.
my point wasn't that someone said women are from Venus. That was an example. The evidence you just gave is not "tangible." Tangible evidence means you can physically touch it and that thing is direct evdence of what your trying to prove. At least in the tree of life example its tangible but not evidence of god because it can be explained by evolution.
The evidence is tangible, if you won't accept it you will have nothing to hold onto outside of death. If you will accept the evidence and seek God's mercy honestly, you will find it and He will make you whole and you will find rest.
No wonder you have emotional problems.
Look in the mirror, touch your face. Your body is being pulled down in death. You are touched by it, you can't get out of it by your own strength, you can't disconnect yourself from being held by it.....how tangible can you get? And you deny there is tangible evidence? You are asking to have it forced upon you in death and you'll wake up in Hell and still not believe God is good.
My point is I can just say if you die you wake up in an alien spaceship and if not you go to Mars and then I can call that tangible evidence and its still definitively not tangible evidence anymore than whatyou just said.
You can say anything you want to say, but you can't get out of death. Only God can get you out, and He will if you will believe Him and trust Him, if you will honestly seek His mercy as one who has sinned against Him and deserves to be separated from Him in death forever consumed in Hell. But you think you are too good for that, don't you? You think you are too good to be stuck in Hell forever, don't you? You think God does not have the right to leave you in condemnation, don't you? How come you are condemned to die?
You can say anything you want to say, but you can't get out of death.
That first sentence I agree with.
How come you are condemned to die?
Dying is not tangible evidence of god because it can be explained as my brain and body no longer functioning due to biological decay or other causes. If the consciousness is made by the brain (I know you can't prove it isn't) then there doesn't have to be any afterlife whatsoever. That is definitively not tangible evidence.
Forget a grail some guy drank from 2000 years ago. Show me a guy that can walk on water and present it on CNN, prove that he's not just doing a magic trick by having scientists analyze it, then when it's on CNN headline news, we'll talk.
God cannot be proven nor disproved. You are a moron who doesn't understand what the word "tangible" means.
Also, the Bible also says God cannot be proven nor disproven:
"And without faith it is impossible to please God, because anyone who comes to Him must believe that He exists and that He rewards those who earnestly seek Him” (Hebrews 11:6) Then Jesus told him, ‘Because you have seen me, you have believed; blessed are those who have not seen and yet have believed’” (John 20:29)
There's no other way to translate that other than that he cannot be proven nor disproved.
That's silly. You are as good as dead now. You need to be saved, and only God can save you from death, sin, and Hell. Your dying is tangible evidence that you need to be saved. It makes no sense to believe anybody or anything other than God has the power and right to save you.
If you want to toss out nonsense all your life and hope to turn into a good little ghost or a powerful ghost or whatever, your losing your soul and going to wake up in Hell.
The whole universe and everything that lives is evidence of God, all together or any individual part or combination of parts. If you won't believe God is there, you won't believe it even if you are thrust into the fire of Hell and can't get out.....and really that is what you are asking for when you deny God is good....you are saying God is not giving you evidence, that means He is not good but rather uncaring...you are accusing God falsely, the evidence is there if you believe it or not. The way you are going you are propelling yourself into Hell like a moth into a fire.
A tree is not evidence for god, god is not God. The thing you refer to as "god" is a straw man which is not God. The thing you refer to as god is anything you say it is other than God. If you're going to play this game in your dying thinking you are winning the argument against God, when your time is over you are going to wake up in Hell. Prove me wrong.
You've never heard the tree of life analogy religious people use claiming it proves god? Of course not, because you can't accept other religions beside your own even when they are Judeo-Christian.
Are you kidding? There is no such thing as an evolutionary tree of life. Believing in evolution is a religion, "Naturalism", which some "religious people" make the mistake of combining with God's will.
Why should I accept religions that are based on lies? Jesus Christ is a person who is the truth. You are following lies in hope that sinners are not confined in Hell forever, you have no solid basis for your beliefs because you add lies on top of lies and get confusion.....then you have emotional problems because your gut feeling tells you that you are in trouble and you are in trouble. You need to be saved from Hell, and only God the Savior, Jesus Christ who conquered death, can save you.
God loves you, and you are trying to prove that He really doesn't care that much. He cares so much that He sent His Son to be the propitiation for your sins so you can be pardoned and not condemned in Judgement as God the Judge became God the Savior and paid your price Himself so you can be forgiven of all of your sin. Repent of your sin and believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and you will be saved.
Priests are Catholics, they are not Christians, Catholicism is paganism which incorporates many Biblical terms and concept while it is not a Biblical faith......it uphold the Pope as authoritative over the Bible and it changes it's teachings to suit the direction the wind is blowing.
I do not dispute that many religions and many who claim to be Christians believe in evolution. You don't have to provide links for things I do not dispute.
You do believe in a god? I don't know why. A god is not God and it cannot save you from Hell. What you really believe in is a systematic method of justifying yourself, excusing yourself for your sin in order to fool yourself into thinking you have the right to exist outside of Hell. Common sense does not result in emotional confusion. The truth dispels emotional confusion. You need to believe the truth, for your own life's sake.
For the history of the Catholic Church which rejects the Bible in favor of the Pope's opinion on things, and the story of the Word of God which is the basis of Christian faith, I recommend you watch "Lamp in the Dark" and "Tares in the Wheat". Do not waste your time trying to give me a dictionary definition of "Christian" and then try to tell me Catholicism is Christian. The Bible determines what is Christian, not the dictionary or the Pope.
The videos are very well done high quality documentary movies.
Here's the first one :https://youtu.be/RmXBj2N9fhY
This video shows the Satanic roots of the Catholic church and it's non-Biblical/non-Christian teaching of belief in evolution. Neither evolution or Catholicism are in agreement with the Bible. The Bible is the standard of Christianity and truth, not the Pope and not evolutionary pseudo-scientists.
Tares Among the Wheat shows how the Catholic Church was behind the invention of the big band theory as well as Darwin's promotion of evolution. These things were purposely invented attempting to discredit the Bible and solidify control of the Vatican as it works toward establishing an enforced one world religion which will eventually be under the Anti-Christ who will present himself as God ruling over the world.
At this point your straight up religioust against any other beliefs besides your own. I don't understand how a Christian who is suppised to respect others' beliefs can talk that way. Its a sin not to accept diversity in belief according to various religions. I mean to not respect other people's opinions and beliefs the way you aren't.
I'm being realistic, you are being religious. You are religiously trying to convince yourself that you are not condemned and on your way to Hell. You are practicing a religion. Name it what you will...ghostism or whatever.
Why should I respect beliefs based on lies? I do not respect lies, I do not respect religions which push lies. There is nothing in the Bible which says I'm supposed to respect beliefs which go against the Bible....to the contrary, God hates those things and the Bible says I'm to stand against them.
If I respect your beliefs and I know they are based on lies, what good am I? You want me to say, "I know your beliefs are messed up and messing you up, but I respect your beliefs". Then I would be a liar, I do not respect beliefs based on lies.
You apparently do not respect my beliefs. That's too bad, I believe the truth and you search for light but behold obscurity. The truth will make you free, but men love darkness rather than light because their deeds are evil.
Respecting someone's beliefs isn't believing it for yourself. Respecting someone's beliefs means not being judgmental and not trying to assume your belief is right and the others are all wrong because what would you do if you were the one who woke up one day in hell? You can't answer it other than to ignorantly say "It won't happen." But you can't actually answer what would happen if your beliefs are wrong because you in your own eyes are always right, and that is the definition of ignorance.
I even provided evidence that there may be a life after death and you aren't exactly supporting that because your always right and everyone else is always wrong right? Wrong. There is no belief under which a human being magically becomes always right. People will prove you wrong about thing, including those who don't believe in the Bible, regardless of them being right or wrong. Everyone is wrong and you are probably prejudice against Jews, Muslims, Buddhists, and anyone who belongs to any other religion other than your own, even in arguments that aren't about religion.
You also would have no answer to give Satan if you were the one who woke up in hell and Satan told you it was for judging which actually is ant-sacred.
listen, Ghosty........try to get this through your esoteric head......
You are dying, what you are doing is not living. Life is eternal, you don't have it but God can give it to you if you will trust Him Dying is eternal and that's what you have. The things you present as "evidence" of life after death at best indicate nothing more than one's consciousness existing separately from ones body though temporarily plugged into it at, apparently centralized in the skull. Being clinically dead and being dead are two different things. You have one appointment with death, from which you do not return. If God does not give you eternal life, you don't have it and you won't have it; you will have eternal dying which is not living. There is no life after death, you either have eternal life and are living forever or you have eternal dying and are dying forever and will end up in the burning rubbish heap of Hell.
Israel (the Jews) is God's chosen people, the apple of His eye and all of the families of the Earth are blessed through Israel as the promises of God came through Israel. God defends Israel, He preserves them in times when He uses other nations to chastise them......and Jesus Christ will rule the world from Mt. Zion and in that day all of the Jews will know He is God the Son and all will be saved. Islam will disappear, Buddhism and Hinduism will be gone, all religions will be done away with as they are based on lies and there will be no lies in God's Kingdom.
I have an answer to give Satan....God Himself paid for my sins with His own blood and my sins are covered by His blood, He bought me with His blood, He owns me and the Lord Jesus Christ whose blood covers my sins rebuke thee Satan. Satan can't hold anything against me, God Himself paid my price with His own blood and I'm forgiven of all of my sin.
You need to use some common sense when you talk about "judging". Recognizing and pointing out the truth is not judging you. If you feel judged, it's because you are guilty of violating God's law and the truth rings your bell and you don't like it...you're resisting because of your pride, you want to keep your own way, you love your sin more than life and it's taking you down in death to Hell.
I guess it's about time to give up on you..see ya, ghosty. Let me know if you repent of your sin and believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and get saved by Him........if that happens, you'll have to get rid of that dumb screen name of yours.
I"m not always right, but when I point at Jesus and say He's always right, I'm always right about that. I'm on the winning side. Read the end of The Book (Bible, The Book of the Revelation of Jesus Christ). Jesus wins, and gives His victory to those who trust in Him.
If I was always right, I would be chess champion of the world and unbeatable.
Yes, but are you always right about the right interpretation of what Jesus or God says? Much of the Bible is open to interpretation. There's some people that believe the Messiah will come from heaven in the full grown form of Jesus and others say it will be a reincarnation like the antichrist right?
Also, for every time you do something in the name of Jesus, does that mean Jesus told you to do it and therefore your right? You could say kill a one year old baby at random and I could just say Jesus didn't tell you to do that and that was a hallucination.
How do you know the difference?
Also, what would happen if another non-christian apocalypse happened from another religion. What would you say to that?
My question wasn't what you'd say to Satan because you happened to be in hell. What I'm pointing at is what happened if Christianity turned out to be wrong what would you say to whoever the real God is? Let's just say it was the Avatar of Vishnu for example that became the Messiah instead. I am not Christian but I didn't get the Vishnu thing from my own religion either. It's from Hinduism.
Also, you are assuming the people who wrote the Bible wrote God's text correctly. You are also assuming the Bible hasn't been changed many times since origination. Otherwise, why trust the Bible if it's not the original document?
Most of the Bible in English is plain English a child can understand. You need to be concerned about the parts you can understand.
If I do something in the name of Jesus, it must be in line with His word or I am lying when I say I am doing it in His name.
How do you know the difference between reality and a hallucination? Are you serious? You really don't know how to tell the difference?
I'm saved from Hell. God Himself died for my sins, my sins are covered by His life's blood and I'm forgiven. I received Jesus Christ as my Savior, He lives in me by His Spirit by which I am born anew as His child. Satan has lost his right to have me in Hell with him. Satan holds that right over you.......the right to the same condemnation he is in as a sinner. Satan is your father now, the father of lies which you are following.
The avatar and Vishnu are things which are not God, they are straw men. What you are calling "the Messiah" is not God, it is a straw man. You have to face God, not a straw man. You have sinned against God. The soul that sins shall surely die. God is not mocked. You might feel like you are mocking Him, but in reality all you are doing is depriving yourself of the gift of God which is eternal life through Jesus Christ who conquered death and offers forgiveness to all who repent of their sin and believe on Him.
It's you who will be subject to Satanic attacks and accusations forever because of the things you have done wrong. I'm forgiven, my wrongs are covered by God's own blood. You cannot cover your own wrongs because you are a wrong doer, your death is not enough to get yourself pardoned from your wrongs. God offers pardon based on the fact that He paid your price in death, the price you can never pay, you can never pay enough to be free of your wrongdoings. That's why God will hold you in Hell forever if you will not repent of your sin and believe on His Son and quit hoping in this silly idea of ghostliness being life after death.
By the way, do you know that the icon you are using is an occult symbol? It has been adopted by modern Israel as "Star of David", but that is not what it is. I used to think the two triangles, one right side up and then flipped upside down signifies the promise of God to overthrow all of the corrupt governments on Earth and turn them upside down. The two triangles are actually symbolic of Satan, "666", the Anti-Christ. It was probably invented by people who thought they are serving God, but it may well have been invented by people who know the symbol is Satanic. Throughout history the Jews have been bent toward rebelling against God who chose them to represent His name in the world, adopting the idols of pagans (heathens) as their own gods.
He will overthrow (overturn) the kingdoms of this world one day when Jesus Christ who is God the Messiah rules the world form Mt. Zion, and that occult symbol fraudulently called "Star of David" won't be flying when Jesus rules the world. The Jewish government is corrupt against God as are the other governments of the world...corrupt in that they have rejected their Messiah and are in error against God.......yet God honors His word and will keep His promises of using Israel to make His name known. The whole world will see Jesus is the KING OF KINGS and LORD of all. He is Jehovah, the God of Israel.
There are always people trying to change God's word, it's nothing new. God keeps His word, it cannot be changed, it will remain unchanged throughout eternity. Throughout eternity, the smoke of the torments of the people in Hell will testify that God's word is forever settled and cannot be changed. That smoke will rise forever from the abyss of the dying; the damned who would not be saved.
"non-christian apocalypse"? What does that mean? Something out of Star Wars? Come down to Earth. The whole world will join in battle against Israel, and God Himself will fight for them and their armies will be pretty much wiped out. If you can't see that the world is gearing up for the fulfillment of Bible prophecy you have to be blind.
The Jewish people and the nation of Israel represent the promises of God, God has promised to preserve Israel forever, they are the only people in the world who have been deeded property on Earth...a deed delivered and held by God Himself.
I'm assuming that God used holy men who were moved by the Holy Ghost to record His word. He told them to write it down and preserve it for all generations, and because it's God's word and they were God's chosen holy men, those men obeyed God to record His word and God Himself made sure it was kept pure and unchanged. It's His word. It cannot be changed.
I'm also assuming that the eyewitnesses of the Lord Jesus Christ who touched Him, ate with Him, talked with Him after He rose from the dead and showed them the wounds in His hand and side were possessed by the same fervor as the holy men of old to keep God's word, and God endorsed His word by the miracles of His own hands in Jesus Christ and through the hands of His apostles empowered by His Holy Spirit to proclaim and publish His holy world for the whole world. I'm also assuming that the whole world and you individually as well as myself will be judged according to God's holy word and we have all sinned against God and are worthy of nothing but dying in Hell forever. If your sins are not covered by God's own blood, God has no reason to relieve you of your sin's condemnation. He took your condemnation of death on Himself in Jesus Christ because it's too much for you to take and God does not want you to try to take it on yourself. You are trying to take it on yourself, hoping in things which can't get you out of dying. Jesus is God the Savior who died for you to bring you out of dying into eternal life as a child of God.
You realize what I said is arguably better evidence for God than anything you have posted the entire time you've been on CD right?
Also I said its proof of an afterlife. I didn't say it was proof of an afterlife without God. Etc. It's not even inconsistent with the Bible. And I do believe in God, I'm just not Christian.
Your trying to convert someone assuming they are Atheist or Agnostic and I am neither of those things. I just have irrational depression so it sounds like I am. So your attempts to change me don't really work because they assume I'm something I'm not.
I made a whole separate debate to guess the two religions I belong to. They go hand in hand.
Whatever you are providing evidence for, the only thing which can be scientifically tested is the testimony of people who were in a near death experience and they tell details of the people, things, and events surrounding their body laying unresponsive on the table. Most people, like you seem to be doing, take that to mean life is eternal and their is no punishment in death, no God to fear. If God is not One you would fear facing now, then the thing you are talking about providing proof for is not God.
I do not trust in or promote experiences as they are subjective to the senses and people can develop all kind of far out ideas based on an experience. I promote the truth. There is no darkness in the truth, no shadow of turning. You on the other hand are groping in the dark like a blind man, seeking light but beholding obscurity.....in a fog looking for evidence of the unknown and finding evidence that you don't know what you are talking about but you keep on going...onward through the fog.
I'm not trying to change you, I'm presenting the truth which will change you if you accept it. I can't change you any more than I can turn a rock into a bird. The truth is that if God tells a rock to be a bird, it will be a bird. Your problem is that you are not a rock and can choose to reject the truth, proving only that the hardness of a rock is not equal to the hardness of your heart.
What you presented is not proof of an afterlife, it is proof of consciousness after vital signs have ceased. There is no proof that the person who testifies of things they witnessed in the room while their body lay without vital signs was actually dead. It is appointed unto a man ONCE to die. Nobody dies, then comes back to life, then dies again except for Lazarus who was stinking dead four days in the tomb before Jesus called Him back to life.
I"m not trying to convert you, I'm presenting you with the truth which is in opposition to your ideas. By resisting the truth, you are opposing yourself thinking you are justifying yourself. You are hoping in obscurity and it can't save you.
Your depression is not irrational, your beliefs are irrational and depression is a symptom of your beliefs. When a person believes the way you do, it is rational for them to be depressed. Some people show it differently than others.
You are trying to work out the questions of life in your own mind and it's good that you have not decided like so many who are atheists/agnostics (the same thing just like Wicca and Satanism are the same at heart) or Buddhists or Muslims or Catholics or whatever.......think they have found and answer they can life with and they fool themselves into thinking they know enough or more than enough.
I don't need to guess your religions. You need to deal with the truth and stop being religious...be realistic.
By your own words you do not know God. When you talk about God, you really don't know who or what you are talking about. All religions are basically the same, about what you can do to avoid burning in Hell forever. Atheism is a religion. God is a person we know through God the Son Jesus Christ, God is not a religion, He loves you and wants you to be real with Him and stop being religious getting yourself depressed. The truth will make you free. You are making yourself depressed by dragging around chains of uncertainty.
If your blindfolded and your hands tied behind your back and you are in a section of town that is busy with lots of other stimuli you can pick up and know things by the other many indicators.
There is heavy amounts of evidence and what everyone misses is that evidence piled upon evidence told through every direction of confirmation.
If it were sparatic and vague and limited to some limited accuracies with twisting to fit, then you could dismiss as coincidence, like Nostradamous. Who is not being prophetic, thats a spirit of fortune telling. It is correct with twisting steered to accuracy by the imagination.
Satan gets it right at times too. Basically anything that is real from God, Satan has a mimic or copy cat. And has limitations, but is made to look similar. Like as in Islam, Mohommad took some of Jewish scripture and then took some of Christian scriptures, and made a book "it sounds like" but isn't, its actually opposite. Its anti- semetic and anti-christ.
Jesus said if they say Christ is here or there or in the inner room, don't fall for it. Like Catholocism inner room "confessionals," Jesus forgives by grace, not by works of penance.
Penance is payment, it pays a debt owed. But grace is the forgiveness of debt, and the Holy Spirit brings burdens of peace and joy to our battle against flesh, and we are covered day and night. We dont go and get penance for forgiveness. That would be like worshiping the brass serpent raised in the wilderness.
Its the incomplete Gospel, its an action of remaining in the desert after being brought out of Egypt. But then not entering into the Promise Land. "His Rest." (See Hebrews, they were disobedient and died in the desert between Egypt and the Promise Land, and never entered in.)
Satan has counterfits, but he is on a leash. Not all his plans pan out. But many do, because he is the god of this world and of the nature of man. So as God hardened Pharoahs heart and turned him to be a pawn of his will. To show specific things through His work in delivering Israel. Satan is turned like a hose and designed like a rudder of a ship. He is limited as a vessel of dishonor.
His "fortune telling" and actions are limited to what he can orchestrate, but even those are purposeful to God's final will. Then in Satans twisted version, 20/20 is made to be adaptive, hindsight is subjective and deceptive through vague twisting.
Not the case with God's Word. God's Word is accurate to the t. And it is reliable in prophetic warnings, and also in 20/20 hindsight it is proven to be confirmation by its accuracy and clarity.
If you look at evidence, and the testimony is proven true, confirmed by evidence from every prespetive, then its reasonably conclusive by any legal standard. God is judicial.
He confirmed Himself and His Word that under any scruitiny and among any judge and jury its a slam dunk! And that is faith, it understands the evidence, even unseen. Because what is unseen proves Him in every sense.
When there are piles of confirmation by many featured outlets, then denial is unreasonable.
Denying God, and His Word is actually unreasonable and ill9gical. And when the vail of blind stubborn hearts are lifted the name "a fool" will be the only appropriate name to be applied. When the scales on eyes without understanding are removed, you will weep bitterly, because it was right there and the only reason you missed it, was because you didnt know what you didnt know, and you clung to what you thought you knew. A closed mind sees nothing but what closed it.
Its like being in a cabin on a mountain peek, and stairing at a solid door, without opening the door to see the wide open view.
God's Word is so deep and informative, not only in spiritual and in Salvation. But in practicality and in laws of the universe and of our world, and in reasonable purpose
You can discover moral messages and wisdom, and salvation, but you can also hang your hat on its practicality, and through its accuracy with understanding, you can discover science and math from it. And some scientist have discovered major scientific discoveries by following the Bible's descriptions!
Example: The father of oceanography discovered currents and oceanography by seeing terms in the Bible that made him test it. He saw "pathways in the seas" and questioned where and jow to find and understand it. By understanding the Bible, he found currents and "pathways" for oceanography.
And that's just one example. So insread of disproving the Bible, he used the Bible to explains what we did not know yet.
Its interesting to see perseptive men bring advancements that couldnt have been known, yet the principles are accurate as though told by an eyewitness of "pathways in the sea";
His Word is purposeful and complete. And He confirmed it in every direction of thought, from the child to the scientist in a way we cant miss it. God's Word and communication is not accidental or coincidental. Its purposeful. On purpose, every Word and even every letter is designed on purpose.
Even the way DNA and RNA and the work horse factory of our bodies is a digital masterpiece programmed by design. And the way everything works is patterned, even in His Word. Like equidistant codes work like the codes in our bodies. Its incredible and amazing!
Anyone who wishes to prove otherwise is free to try proving how their version of heaven is true rather than some beer factory or Hades' Underworld without contradicting their own proof. And that's not my final argument, even then. (Doesn't really apply to the agnostics)
You don't really have something divine inside you that is commanding your body. That's simply absurd. There is no longer much need to rely on false explanations from religious propaganda. As there is nothing divine inside you, there isn't anywhere you can go after death, since you will lose all your being and identity then.
That depends on your portrayal of your God, but your leaders can't control me with such a tool.
Though I don't like the burden of proof that something can not exist, I can attempt one as I'm not really a skeptic. And I was born in a religious family. Now I'm against all organised religion - and this goal shall be soon attained. The processes are in motion to save humanity from obsolete fantasies that many people believe so much in. (You know, ancient Hindus calculated such a thing to happen)
So, what should something do for you to be certain that it is sentient (or it possesses that magical 'soul' thing)?
In the entire recorded history of mankind there has been absolutely no evidence whatsoever of an Afterlife.
No credible professional scientist or academician believes in one, either.
The Afterlife is mostly the fantasy product of the same sort of folk who believe in Sky Gods. That is, people who cannot emotionally cope with the reality of a short and finite life on one out of billions of planets in the Universe that has life. We are in no way special here, folks. Just another species of animal on one rock spinning aorund one star in one solar system on one galaxy.
Of which there are hundreds of Billions.
If religion is opium for the masses like Vlad Lenin said, then thoughts of an Afterlife is, like, Magic Mushrooms for the masses.
What you categorize as a "credible" professional scientist is based on your litmus test of atheism and evolution by which your icons must believe that life emerged out of non-living matter and intelligence and consciousness arose from mindless matter, both NONSENSICAL AND NON-SCIENTIFIC beliefs which demand the logical fallacy of begging the question.......all frauds promoting pseudo-science with a backwards approach of a predetermined conclusion which dictates reports and interpretations of discoveries. It's mind control, and you are possessed by it, Slappy. Be a man and shake it off.
You know I can present a list of professional working scientists of the highest caliber respected and appreciated for their knowledge and accomplishments. The only thing you can find incredible about them is that they believe exactly the same as do I, that God created the Heavens and the Earth and all that is in them in six literal days and evolution is a fairy tale, that we are sinners who deserve to die and burn in Hell and God the Man Jesus Christ is the only Savior who died for us to save us from Hell and He is bodily risen from the dead and seated on the right hand of God the Father and will judge the living and the dead, offering forgiveness and full pardon to all who repent and believe on Him, who receive Him by faith as he is, the Living God and the only Savior.
That's good preaching.....probably a waste on you but maybe a good seed for somebody else.
Your methods are dishonest, Slappy, only feeble efforts to excuse yourself of your sin.
In Bible Codes, some are far out and take it far out. But some are a signature of Divine Authorship. And these ones are definitely signatures as if He etched His Word with His own hand.
Pi found in Genesis 1: 1 and adv math e found in John 1: 1.
These aren't spread out, found in difficulty, and in need of twisting. These two adv math codes are found, each found using within one verse. And each one found separately in chapter one of two seperate books, written in two separate millennials, in written in two separate languages. And the nature of interpretation works with what is there from the ancient text.
And the odds of them occurring at any point at all within all 66 books of the Bible is in probabilities of unreasonable proportions.
What do you think is the probability of a few of these together found coded in the Bible? If just musing at first glance, wouldn't you say, " no way?" I'm not even saying in the whole Bible. What is the probability all these are found in only six books out if 66?
As for me, I dont think a calculation is needed to tell me that is an unreasonable probability in calculations of a snowflakes chance in Hell!
Even crazier, pi and e are coded in two different languages, Hebrew for Jews and Greek was a time period of the Gospel's progression out to the Gentiles.
And both verses state "In the beginning," so they each speak of a time period of Creation and in Jesus as the Creator. And advanced math equations not known yet for 1000s of years to come.
In Genesis 1: 1 pi equation is encoded, in creation of the world and universe and in God stitching prophesy into appointed times to bring Creation full circle.
And in John 1: 1 in Greek while the Gospel is propelled out to the Gentiles, you find in verse one the equation for e, which is compound interest, multiplying exponentially.
So even the equations found communicate the purpose of the event. And even the Bible Author God, divided these times by purpose as shown in the 1st verses of these two books, Genesis and John. Then to add to this timetables for dating history is BC and AD.
So the Bible notes each beginning with a math equation. Then took the division of time line for dating history. And then add TORH TORH YHWY HROT HROT in the beginning of each of the five books of the Bible at intervals of Bible numbers of importance in the written text throughout every book of seven and forty-nine .
These singuarly are a stretch against reasonable probability, but for all to be right there on the top, not buried or crazy, together all these are proof of God and His Word. All of these together are impossible odds without Divine Authorship. Together these are more than just an oooh wow, these are against odds of probabilities that are not even be conceivable.
Now in contradiction beween the improbability of two faiths.
A comparison between Christianity and Evolution as ecplanation of Creation.
So on one hand, Evolutionism states strands of DNA self assembled and mutated and against all odds of occurance and against all odds of science principles and without any evidence of a physical example in front of our eyes, we are told to believe it. And that it is factual.
Then you take just these few pieces of many in evidence, tangible and available to view in everyone's individual hands. With everyone having the ability to test it, and even count out the codes for themselves, and literally proving itself in person from the beginning and in person showing agsinst all odds He not only created, but He put it in writing against all odds to prove it!
You have to be evil or an idiot to at least not step back and say there is more to God and the Bible than I currently think. Maybe I should look further!
The long journey of the advancement of mankind and the expansion of the frontiers of knowledge as well as our awareness of the Universe, of which we are a minuscule part, would never have even started if no one had challenged the superstitious nonsense which forms the basis of all religions.
I agree, science has not produced a rational explanation for the ''beginning of life'', as the concept of the ''big bang'' is, in my opinion almost as fanciful a notion as the various man made religions.
However, science, and not hocus pocus religion will someday come up with the answer.
Let's hope there will a sufficient number of people able to recognise and understand the scientific proof and have the maturity to discard the of the mumbo jumbo which was spawned from the ignorance of the bronze age
So then my question is, SINCE admittedly no answer exists in science, then by what reasoning and by what facts do you dismiss the possibility of a Creator?
And by what reasoning and by what facts do you declare religion and faith as irrational? And without merit to explore and weigh as evidence of a Creator. Science has no answer! Yet all its minions think, it is actually confirmed as fact! How dare educators lie to children and treat speculation as facts!!!
It seems it is irrational to close of possibilities of answers and proof of their sourses without really being objective.
So therefore evolution admittingly doesnt know so it assumes. So then how is it scientific to dismiss weighing evidence of a Creator and dismiss proving validations of His Word.
So evoluyion creationists expect faith in an unknown process, while refusing evidence of a Creator.
The Bible is an authority yhat has as much if not even more confirmable evidence of validity as biology. Biology days this part is in this animal and also in another, and in a controlled experiment this minifact is confirmed, an eye can develope on a wing of a fly. So therefore evolution explaims creation.
Yet we have proof the Bible is of supernatural origin, with facts unknown to the writers according to their limitations in advancements, yet it is not allowed to show evidence.
If we are debating origin then shouldnt we validate what is possible. And since lifed origin is unknown than why isnt a Creator possible? And since scripture 8s historical and closer to the date of origin to the first signs of mankind like us is about 6000 years ago, then shouldnt we add it to experiment also?
He's saying you are another of Dawkins' trained parrots......ya'll say the same things in the same way, practically verbatim and I'm sure you make the same faces as Dawkins when you say them.
Copy and paste my sentence and you won't find it anywhere else as quoted. I will agree though that we do have the same argument, just as Christians have the same arguments. It's not all that surprising that people with a common belief, or lack of belief, would have similar statements. It's worded in a specific way though. I am not claiming there is no life after death. I am simply stating there is no proof to support there the argument that there is and without such proof it is illogical to believe there is.
Evidence to suggest there is a Hell? What do you want, you want to find yourself unable to get out of the fire? I suggest you get saved, but you think you were a Christian and then decided Jesus is not God or risen from the dead so you have no hope except to believe there is no Hell. Keep on believing, dying is not enough to prove you don't have the right to exist outside of Hell, do you think being forever unable to get out of the fire will convince you? Not really, you will forever hold out hope that your dying will end. Sorry, I know you hate the truth.
I am simply stating since there is no evidence to support the notion hell even exists, I choose not to believe it does and will not fear hell any more than I will fear being impaled by a unicorn tomorrow. You claim I hate the truth but you have not provided proof that anything you say is truth.
You are as good as impaled by a unicorn now. It's temporary dying. Hell is permanent, forever dying, your straw man "unicorn" does not compare to Hell. You will see. There won't be any unicorns in Hell. I really believe you are going to be there soon. You won't be saved, will you?
Yes, as long as you are not in Hell frying like an eternal sausage, it is because God wills it. God does not want you to be in Hell or you would be there now. Even if you end up in Hell, God does not want you there but He has nowhere else to put sinners who won't receive the Savior who died to save them from Hell.
God loves you so He gives you the freedom to hate Him. You choose to protect your pride, you choose to resist God's pleas for you to be reasonable with your Judge and seek His mercy.....you can make that choice until your dying is finalized and find yourself in Hell after God did all He could to save you from it and gave you more time than you deserve while you defy Him.
He died for you, paid your price, and you spit in His face like He is dumb and does not care. That's your choice.
God wants you to repent of your sins and seek His mercy. What do you want Him to do, put you in the fire of Hell to make you comply? It will be too late then, your death will be finalized after you did not care that He died for you so you would not have to fry like an eternal sausage in Hell.
Close your eyes, imagine yourself burning in a fire unable to die...you're as good as there now and God is trying to get you to reason with Him so His blood can cover your sins and you don't have to fry naked in Hell forever.
God wants you to repent of your sins and seek His mercy. What do you want Him to do, put you in the fire of Hell to make you comply? It will be too late then, your death will be finalized after you did not care that He died for you so you would not have to fry like an eternal sausage in Hell. He took your death on Himself, but you want your own death for yourself and somehow you think it's good.
Close your eyes, imagine yourself burning in a fire unable to die...you're as good as there now and God is trying to get you to reason with Him so His blood can cover your sins and you don't have to fry naked in Hell forever.
If God disliked me, I would be concerned. But I'm not concerned. Either way it's none of your concern. Furthermore, it isn't remotely close to what I said. You simply don't like to acknowledge the fact that you talk trash about God all the time. Spreading lies about another's behavior is always bad form.
These goofy things you say are the end result of your progress beginning when you claimed to have the right to exist outside of Hell, then denied God has the right to rule over you, then insisted you are living and not dying.
I'm not quoting verbatim, but it's close enough. You have become so warped in your attempts to reason, it seems your brain is fried and your not even an eternal screaming sausage in Hell yet.
The following copy of the thread shows exactly where I did not say whatever you seem to think I said:
Saintnow(3578) Disputed 1 point
No evidence has been presented to prove you have the right to exist outside of Hell.
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sylynn(93) Disputed 2 points
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Amarel(967) Disputed 1 point
Except of course that God wills it. .
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Saintnow(3578) Disputed 1 point
Yes, as long as you are not in Hell frying like an eternal sausage, it is because God wills it. God does not want you to be in Hell or you would be there now. Even if you end up in Hell, God does not want you there but He has nowhere else to put sinners who won't receive the Savior who died to save them from Hell.
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Amarel(967) Disputed 1 point
Even if you end up in Hell, God does not want you there
You think that God can want (will) something and not be able to get it. You don't think much of the almighty, do you blasphemer.
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Amarel(967) Disputed 1 point
If God cared about your slanderous words against him, you'd be in a lot of trouble.
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Saintnow(3578) Clarified 1 point
So you believe God does not care? Do you feel like God cannot love you?
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Amarel(967) Clarified 1 point
I believe God does not care that you are slanderous toward him.
I'm not concerned about Gods love.
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Saintnow(3578) Clarified 1 point
So you don't care if God loves you or not.....that's not my problem.
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Amarel(967) Clarified 1 point
If God disliked me, I would be concerned. But I'm not concerned. Either way it's none of your concern. Furthermore, it isn't remotely close to what I said. You simply don't like to acknowledge the fact that you talk trash about God all the time. Spreading lies about another's behavior is always bad form.
But it's your neuroticism, I should leave it be.
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Saintnow(3578) Clarified 1 point
If God is not displeased with you, why is He letting you die? What's wrong with Him?
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Amarel(967) Clarified 1 point
He isn't .
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Saintnow(3578) Clarified 1 point
If It's none of my concern, why are you telling me about it? Why don't you keep it to yourself?
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Amarel(967) Clarified 1 point
I never said anything about it. You just made it up and acted like I said it. It's weird that you do this since there is a written record right here
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Saintnow(3578) Clarified 1 point
You said you believe you have the right to exist outside of Hell and dying is not proof that God rules over you.
I said your self-deceived.
Then you come back and tell me you are a spark of the divine and too good to be condemned and left in Hell forever.
Then I said prove it.
Then you became more and more goofy and stupid in your responses.
It's all on record, yes. Waste your own time. I don't have time to follow your insanity.
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Amarel(967) Clarified 1 point
You're thinking of a different thread with a different person. I know reading is tough for you. Don't worry about it.
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Saintnow(3578) Disputed 1 point
Nope. It was you. It's all on record...waste your own time if you want to .
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Amarel(967) Disputed 1 point
All I said was that you are slanderous toward God. You ignored that bit and prattled on about love and sparks and whatnot.
If you want me to show you exactly where I never mentioned anything about a spark or love, fuck you.
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Saintnow(3578) Disputed 1 point
These goofy things you say are the end result of your progress beginning when you claimed to have the right to exist outside of Hell, then denied God has the right to rule over you, then insisted you are living and not dying.
I'm not quoting verbatim, but it's close enough. You have become so warped in your attempts to reason, it seems your brain is fried and your not even an eternal screaming sausage in Hell yet.
It's all on the record, you said it, admit it.
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Saintnow(3578) Clarified 1 point
You said you believe you have the right to exist outside of Hell and dying is not proof that God rules over you.
I said your self-deceived.
Then you come back and tell me you are a spark of the divine and too good to be condemned and left in Hell forever.
Then I said prove it.
Then you became more and more goofy and stupid in your responses.
It's all on record, yes. Waste your own time. I don't have time to follow your insanity.
The following exchange is where you seem to have specifically gotten confused. Carefully note how your reply fails completely to relate at all to my post:
Amarel(968) Disputed 1 point
If God cared about your slanderous words against him, you'd be in a lot of trouble.
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Saintnow(3578) Clarified 1 point
So you believe God does not care? Do you feel like God cannot love you?
YeAh, it's at the top of that copied thread I posted. I said I have the right to exist outside hell because God wills it. You said that even when I'm in hell God really wishes I wasn't (implying he is weak). I called you slanderous (for that and for acting like God is the biggest prick imaginable). You started talking about love. I said I'm not concerned. You started pretending I said things I didn't. And here we are.
Hahahaha......you admit that you think you have the right to exist outside of Hell. So God wills you to be outside of Hell now? Why doesn't God will you to live? Have you been a bad boy?
If God wills you to live, why are you dying? Seems to me that you are willed to die. Simple logic. If God willed you to live you would not be dying. You can't save yourself, you need to be saved from Hell.
hahahahaha. You finally admit you said exactly what I said you said. Good for you. God wants you to be honest.
I told you to prove that you have the right to exist outside of Hell. You said you are proving it by being outside of Hell.
I said you are dying outside of Hell and do not have the right to be outside of Hell. You said you do have that right. I said prove it. You said "I can't because I don't want to die now". I said you are dying now, you said you are living and not dying..........
After that you went ballistic with stupid statements giving me the impression you are on the edge of a nervous bizarre episode of delusions as you obsess over your inability to rationally prove that you have the right to exist outside of Hell, and you act mad at me for pointing out the insanity of your ideas.
I told you to prove that you have the right to exist outside of Hell
Right. I said God wills it.
I said prove it. You said "I can't because I don't want to die now"
That literally never happened. I never said that at all. I even showed you exactly where I never said that when I copied the whole stupid thread.
After that you went ballistic with stupid statements
No, after I showed that God's will justifies ones existence outside of hell, you started talking about love(for no reason), which I said I'm not concerned about. Then you argued against sparks or something which I also never talked about.
After you argued about shit I never said, you called me crazy and laughed maniacally. Odd
Ok, then prove to me that you have the right to exist outside of Hell while you are dying. You can't prove it because you don't want to be dead now, even though you are as good as dead.
You said you don't want to be dead now and I agree that you don't want to be dead, but you are as good as dead, dying, can't get out of death, you are stuck in death and dying, not possessed of life and living.
So how are you going to prove you have the right to exist outside of Hell when you are dying? Looks to me like you are losing everything in death.......so how can you have a right when you are losing everything?
If it were dumb, it would be easy. Go ahead, prove you are not going to a sex club. If it's easy, it's dumb. If it's not easy, there must be a reason...Pervert.
The point is that saying "prove it" doesn't prove anything (especially with a negative).
So if you say you aren't doing something and I say prove it, your inability to prove it is no indication that you are in fact doing the thing accused of. Telling you to prove you are not going to a sex club is indeed dumb. It is exactly as dumb as you telling me to prove I am not going to hell. It's illogically equivalent.
The point is that you are a waste of time. If you think you can prove you have the right to exist outside of Hell, go ahead and try to prove it, spend your whole life doing it. Why should I waste time with you?
I have proven several times that I have the right to exist outside of hell. Likewise you have repeatedly displayed a fundemental misunderstanding of the concept of rights. Remember? You think that property rights don't exist because things can be stolen.
But you're probably right, you should stop wasting your time on people who aren't buyin it.
Try blowing it out the other end, wash your mouth out with soap, and maybe after a while you won't stink so bad that the sight of your vile icon causes me to gag.
Do you really think anyone gives a flying fuck if a stupid fuck like you gags?
Your responses get dumber and dumber, I really think you are starting to crack and I don't see why I should waste time watching you fall apart...you are going your own way, you want it, you love it, you got it.
Who is dumber? The person who is falling apart in a way that shouldn't be witnessed any more, or the complete fucking idiot who recognizes that he doesn't want to waste his time but still does?
Try blowing it out the other end, wash your mouth out with soap, and maybe after a while you won't stink so bad that the sight of your vile icon causes me to gag.
Try blowing it out the other end, wash your mouth out with soap, and maybe after a while you won't stink so bad that the sight of your vile icon causes me to gag.
Greater love hath no man than this, that a man lay down his life for his friends.
Romans 5:8
But God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us.
Romans 10:9
That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.
John 1:10 He was in the world, and the world was made by him, and the world knew him not.
11 He came unto his own, and his He came unto his own, and his own received him not.
12 But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name
Revelation 3:20
Behold, I stand at the door, and knock: if any man hear my voice, and open the door, I will come in to him, and will sup with him, and he with me.
Romans 10:9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.
10 For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.
Jesus said: John 7:38
He that believeth on me, as the scripture hath said, out of his belly shall flow rivers of living water.
5 And hope maketh not ashamed; because the love of God is shed abroad in our hearts by the Holy Ghost which is given unto us.
6 For when we were yet without strength, in due time Christ died for the ungodly.
7 For scarcely for a righteous man will one die: yet peradventure for a good man some would even dare to die.
8 But God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us.
Greater love hath no man than this, that a man lay down his life for his friends.
Romans 5:8
But God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us.
Romans 10:9
That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.
John 1:10 He was in the world, and the world was made by him, and the world knew him not.
11 He came unto his own, and his He came unto his own, and his own received him not.
12 But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name
Revelation 3:20
Behold, I stand at the door, and knock: if any man hear my voice, and open the door, I will come in to him, and will sup with him, and he with me.
Romans 10:9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.
10 For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.
Jesus said: John 7:38
He that believeth on me, as the scripture hath said, out of his belly shall flow rivers of living water.
5 And hope maketh not ashamed; because the love of God is shed abroad in our hearts by the Holy Ghost which is given unto us.
6 For when we were yet without strength, in due time Christ died for the ungodly.
7 For scarcely for a righteous man will one die: yet peradventure for a good man some would even dare to die.
8 But God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us.
Just remember the last time we had this argument, you said "I know you're right, I just can't function like you. I have to view the world the way I do in order to get by. I don't expect you to understand"
Are you feeling ok? You seem to be obsessing, you seem to be on the edge of a meltdown. Take it easy there, I'm hoping you have enough tome to get saved.
You know the way you say things is really incoherent when you argue with me against God..but I know what you are trying to say because I know you are trying to prove that God is not good, so I decipher your nonsense.
Consciousness is simply an organic state of self-awareness. When the bio-mechanical functions halt, so does consciousness. Anyone arguing that "the energy must go somewhere" needs to be informed of bacteria and microorganisms that use that energy.
I like the think there's something more, but logical thinking leaves nothing but a faint hope of more. Certainly no pearly gates or virgins awaiting you upon death, that's for certain. I personally think one of the silliest, but probably most intriguing afterlives is that of Buddhists.
Organic state of self awareness? How are carbon based molecules self-aware? Does that mean you are not you but rather you are your body and worth less than your salt due to the labor involved in disposing of the carcass?
Living organisms are all equally unimportant in the grand scheme of things. You and I will both die, the world will continue to turn and life will carry on. Call it nihilism, but it's the truth. Life is meaningless but it's up to the person themselves to give it meaning. That's all.
All life is equal in it's ability to affect the universe, nothing is substantial in the entirety of things. No individual living organism will have a lasting impact on the universe. And I'm not misunderstood, you're just dense and thick-headed.
All life is equal in it's ability to affect the universe? So the life of a worm affects the universe the same as the life of Adolf Hitler and all the people who are going to be pressing the buttons to launch the upcoming nuclear war?
Nothing is substantial? Don't you love anybody? Does nobody love you? Are you sure it's me who is being dense?
Universally you feel you are nothing more than a piece of mutated virus which caused birth defects. Yes I'm paying attention but I think I'm paying more than my time is worth based on the fact of you being mean and nasty when I tell you the truth.
Sorry, my mistake, you are letting the world know that you consider yourself to be equal to an HIV virus spore. Good you cleared that up for us. Why you think so lowly of yourself, I don't know but if what you are saying is true, it's good for your kind to be wiped off the earth.
Thank you for illustrating the idiocy of evolutionary/atheistic belief.
Its evident by order of past performance. Past performance is an indicator. Its comparable to if a full moon always falls in a pattern, then we can determine the probability of that occuring. If the moon goes away theres no calandar or world for the calendar. Its the same probability if God fulfilled all those that He is finishing it.
So if 2000 came true then the odds are really high that the balance 500 would also. It is more sure than knowlegable investing in the stock market. Many millionairs have been made by considering those odds a sure thing.
So even though past performance in finance is no guarentee for future results, its not the same because markets historically fluctuate, yet its predictable wiith risk.
But the Prohetic of the Bible hasn't waivered. And has proven fulfillment without waivering or fluctuating. So without a history of falacy, the odds greaten signicantly compared to the market. So it is a sure bet that as the others were fulfilled so will the final prophesies be fulfilled.
In the grand scheme of things, myself and microorganisms will most likely affect the same amount of history. Unless I am to become a world leader or public figure my additions to life will be taxes and emotional capital onto others. In 200 years do you think people will speak of you or those same microorganisms? Probably not you, but probably the latter. You will die eventually, and soon after you will be forgotten. It's not that I don't value my own life, it's just that I don't put emphasis on my own over others. I'm not special in any way apart from being lucky enough to be born a superior species and neither are you.
in 200 years from now, I won't be counting time like you are. I'll be in unending enjoyment of eternal life with Jesus who conquered death for all who trust in Him. God does not forget His people, He keeps them safe forever. I do believe that I will forget the names and faces of people in Hell........but then, maybe not. I will be forever changed, I won't look at things through the faults of my personality as I do now. I will see things as God sees them, clearly, and I will know as He knows me.
What you are doing is devaluing your own life, making yourself equal to a worm and caring for yourself no more than you care for a worm. You equate your own death to the death of a worm, and then you try to tell me your way of looking at things is better than my way of looking at things according to God's word which implies you think you are better than me.
We are not a superior species, we are made in the image of God and of more value than the animals. If you think you are equal to an animal and your death is equal to the death of a disease causing bacteria, your mind is twisted for destruction. Who did that to your mind?
Humans are classified as animals, and just because you have some imaginary destination to go to doesn't mean you won't be irrelevant in the grand scheme of things. Relying on biblical talks invalidates your points, seeing as they are not a shared view.
I'm not offended in any way. I'll just rephrase your sentence on yourself. You're an unintelligent person with some dumb ideas. Now go back to your safe space (your local church).
There there now. I really didn't mean to hurt your feelings. Try to cheer up....i know that's a a challenge for a person who believes they are equal to a worm, but God loves you and you can be happy about it. Try to find it.
I'm sure you could be much meaner. You are bitter and hateful, a deadly combination....and why not be that way when you believe you are negating yourself in death?
I know English grammar, spelling, and punctuation well enough to know yours is poor with punctuation being your weakest point and I can easily point out dozens of your punctuation errors...but I have the grace to overlook them when I read as I place more importance on hearing what you are saying than on pointing out the flaws of your education...which seems to have dropped off before you got out of elementary school, judging by your ten year old grasp of usage of punctuation.
I can point out all my own flaws as well....but if I look at your writing critically for grammar and punctuation, which I generally do not, I know my English grammar and composition skills far surpass yours. Anyways, I glad you feel better by nitpicking my writing.
even with my dyslexic misuse of "your" when it should have been "you're" or "you are", you knew what I was saying and it was as comprehensible if it had been spelled correctly. How old are you? seriously? twelve?
If you couldn't learn your first language properly what makes you think your opinion is worthwhile? I'm simply stating that your lack of linguistic skills ties to the fact that you're unintelligent. That's all.
I rely on the truth. You cannot invalidate the truth. You invalidate yourself by insisting you are equal to disease causing bacteria.
The truth is not a shared view between you and I simply because you don't want to believe the truth, it is a view which is either believed or not believed and can be shared. I know many people who share in the truth. Most people will not believe the truth, preferring lies by which they think they can be excused of their immoralities. Relying on your own talk when you do not rely on truth is self-deceptive.
I'm sorry but there is no qualitative or quantitative evidence of the bible, hell or heaven being truth. You can't prove it with any statement other than "but god says it is so!", and FYI, just because a large population believes in something does not make it true. There's 1.6 billion Muslims in the world, does that mean they're right because so many believe it to be true? No.
A 2016 year old game of telephone is no different.
In grade school did you ever play the game "Telephone"?
If not let me clarify...
One person starts with an initial sentence, it is then passed on to another and so on and so forth. After multiple transfers of information, the starting information is often completely unrelated to the present information. Hence the term, a 2016 year old game of telephone. There was no proper Encyclopedia or fact checkers back in the days of Hebrew speaking humans, so no logical thinking person could believe that information could be passed on without alteration, especially over 2016 years when a class of school children can disfigure a message through just 10 transfers of knowledge.
Someone could've put in a story of Jesus slaying a dragon if they wanted to and no one would have any way to validate the information apart from word of mouth, which is highly volatile in accuracy.
My point is that there is no logical way to validate any information in the bible, because it has been re-written and edited an infinite amount of times over thousands of years. People can modify it to suite their needs (in the olden days would've been things such as military expeditions and other things done "in the name of god". All this, on top of other scientifically proven faults in it.
Well, that explains why you call 'game of telephone' what I call 'obsolete administrative tool'.
Compared to other religions, like Hinduism, that I can safely assume were created due to superstitions and later configured for administrative purposes, it has no value.
The Bible, though, is contradictory with reality either way. Now that it can't really be edited, its followers are trying hard to stay centuries-outdated on the theories that invalidate it.
Which part of it? I can explain either of the 3, but probably by tomorrow. I've something a bit more ambitious in mind than typing it all here each time it is needed, but it is night here and I'm rather tired. I'd still attempt a quick explanation.
It is qualitative and quantifiable evidence of the veracity of the Bible when the Bible says the soul that sins shall surely die.
You are a sinner and you are dying. How much quantifying and qualifying evidence do you want? You want to be in Hell where you can forever try to measure the heat and the amount of unending time? Will that be enough for you? It won't be enough, you can't get enough, you're asking for it and forever it will be given to you as you want it, a reality void of any "evidence" that God loves you. The only way you can get enough evidence is to believe the truth. God loves you. That's the truth.
I'm sorry but I think you need to take a course of evidence evaluation because you have no understanding of those terms (Qualitative & Quantitative). Please continue to make yourself look foolish though, it's quite funny.
The quality of your life is corruption which can be scientifically proven in the weakness of your body as well as the exposure of your immoralities. The quantity of your life is measured in time while you are dying, after which it is unending dying if you do not have eternal life.
Why can't you figure that out for yourself? Are you to high up on your horse names "Pomp"? Typical evolutionist, reach a conclusion to prevent yourself from using your brain to try to understand things which at first mystify you.
I'm sorry I described your life and dying as qualitative and quantitative. I didn't know your brain would short circuit so you could not understand what was being said.
You call it "nihilism" is if coining a word makes it intelligent. I call it "stupidity" because it's dumb. The Bible says you are a fool. Whatever you want to believe, however you want to pretend you are intelligent, go for it and spend your whole life trying to prove you have the right to exist as a sinner outside of Hell.
If you think a 2000 year old game of telephone insists I'm a fool, then it's clearly your inability to differ from logical sources of information and illogical hand me down, constantly reviewed, and rewritten sources of information which would qualify as "stupidity".
Also using "Hell" as a deterrent for someone who thinks differently than you is a pointless argument because I don't believe it exists, and nor is there is proof it exists. So you're using your own irrational fears to validate your irrational opinions. Have fun in your safe space that is your local church though, I'm sure they enable your previously flawed opinions on life and existence to ensure you sleep tight at night.
You're talking stupid. You should look in a mirror and see how stupid you look when you talk stupid.
Seriously. Take your post here and recite it in front of a mirror as you watch your face....and see how stupid and/or evil you look while talking this way. Maybe it will help you to wake up and see you need to be saved from Hell.
How do you know there's an afterlife? After death, no one has returned. Even Christ's account are dubious, and is there an afterlife for the common people? No, I think there isn't. When you die, you die. Thats all there is to it. Unfortunately people couldn't swallow this hard truth and thus religion and afterlife come in.
There is either eternal dying or eternal living, there is no ambiguous "afterlife". One thing you know for sure, you are stuck in death and can't get yourself out of it and if God does not save you you will be lost....you are lost now, dying, and on your way to Hell. How you think you know more than God is proof of self-deception.
The other argument is mine. This was submitted twice due to an error, so ignore the contents of this one.
There is just oblivion.
Anyone who wishes to prove otherwise is free to try proving how their version of heaven is true rather than some beer factory or Hades' Underworld without contradicting their own proof. And that's not my final argument, even then. (Doesn't really apply to the agnostics)
You don't really have something divine inside you that is commanding your body. That's simply absurd. There is no longer much need to rely on false explanations from religious propaganda. As there is nothing divine inside you, there isn't anywhere you can go after death, since you will lose all your being and identity then.
The only thing you said right here is that there is "nothing divine in you". This is true, you are a sinner, separated from God by your sin which makes you an enemy of his, devilish and not divine. You got that right....and the way you are going, you won't get proof of Heaven but you will get proof of Hell.
