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26
24
Congress President BUSH & OBAMA
Debate Score:50
Arguments:38
Total Votes:53
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 Congress (20)
 
 President BUSH & OBAMA (18)

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National Debt tops $13 trillion and soaring...Who is to blame?

Congress

Side Score: 26
VS.

President BUSH & OBAMA

Side Score: 24
3 points

Since there is no correct answer to this in the listed tags, I'm just sticking it over here.

People love to pretend the government is "those people over there" doing whatever they want while the true desires of "the people" are not being met.

And this is nonsense.

Oh yeah, "the people" don't want deficits and debt. That's true enough. And that's what they're getting... so, outrage... the government isn't doing what we want them to do!!!! Right?

But if congress tries to cut the deficit and debt by cutting social security? Rioting in the streets.

If they try to cut medicare? See above.

If they try to raise taxes? See above. (The Tea Party geniuses are protesting taxes after getting a tax CUT for crying out loud)

If they try to cut defense spending? Oh My God! You want to endanger the country and let the terrorists win!!!!!!

Why is there a 13 trillion dollar debt? Because the voting public are children who want everything provided for them but don't want to pay for it.

Side: The Voting Public
2 points

Do you really think that there will be riots in the streets if social security and medicare was cut?

Were there riots when the government announced that there will not be increasing payments with the rate of inflation? Where were those old people protesting?

Cut Spending in military. The U.S. accounts for 48% of the world's defense spending. Are terrorists really getting the better of us even if it was cut by 20%. They never did and never will. Are you telling me that 6 terrorists outsmarted a near trillion dollar operation?

Why are you really going to blame this on the voting public.

The voting public votes responsible individuals who supposed to make tough decisions. That is part of being a public official.

Because the voting public are children who want everything provided for them but don't want to pay for it.

I pretty much said that before.

Side: President BUSH & OBAMA
2 points

lol also the more we focus on pumping money into the war on terrorism and 3erd world country nations to confront it, we only enlarge the amount of opposition against us, we are fighting a group of religious madmen who have no country or government, we need to stop treating them as conventional legitimate nations and armies.

Side: government
gcomeau(536) Disputed
2 points

It's an expression, oh perceptive one.

What it means if you want to be literal is that the senior population of the nation are the most active voting block in the country and will bury whatever politicians they end up deciding is responsible for pushing it.

And no, I don't think the terrorists are going to get us if we cut defense spending. What I think is that's what people are going to be ranting on every news network in the country if you try and significantly cut defense spending.

And yes, amazingly enough in a democratic nation where the government is run by elected officials, I hold the voting public responsible for the long term conduct of the government of the nation. WILD idea, I know. If one single elected offical gets elected then reverses all their positions and goes against the desires of the people that elected them.. fine, that's on the official. The debt? That's not a result of that.

Side: The Voting Public
1 point

Holy crap, at least 50% of that made sense, and it is a political debate no less. Congrats, I was starting to doubt you still had it in you.

Upvote for your comments on terrorism. It's like Bruce Lee buying full body armor and an AK to fight off a gang of fetuses. We need to concentrate on boarders and the propaganda war. There will always be crazy religious nutjobs and taking them seriously (no matter how destructive a few can be) only gives them more power.

However, old people should have some kind of safety net, not like they can go out and get a job.

Side: President BUSH & OBAMA
1 point

I agree that this is the way members of congress see things. But I have a feeling that perception is not entirely accurate. I think there's an opportunity for somebody to run on an austerity platform. Cut a bit from all the expensive programs and increase taxes a bit -- a centrist compromise. I think the debt bothers a lot of people and they would get behind an agenda like that. I think the success of Scott Brown shows this. I think people can understand, "we can't afford it." I don't know, maybe I'm just dreaming.

Side: The Voting Public

A President's budget is ultimately a large book with numerous pages of paper with numbers and figures without the approval of Congress, thus, making it law.

It is Congress that must take responsibility for this mess; however, like usual, they pass the buck onto the President and blame him because they just say, "Hey, it is his budget."

Side: congress
1 point

off topic question, but are u a libertarian? if so we need to create a debate about how government is only hindering humanity and the useless of it too. :)

Side: unrelated question

Yes, I am libertarian, and that would be a interesting debate.

Side: congress

Seeing as how America has been in debt much longer than the last two presidents, I doubt that it is wholly their fault.

Side: congress
1 point

Yeah, it doesn't much sense to pose such a potentially open ended question and then narrow it to only two sides.

Side: congress
2 points

So, who else is making and passing laws for the budget that I am unaware?-------

Side: President BUSH & OBAMA
1 point

What was the national debt before Obama?

It hasn't made nearly a significant increase to put the blame on a man who is only 1 year into his first term. I wouldn't even blame it wholly on Bush, I'll tell you who to blame.

Blame it on Alexander Hamilton, the man based our national bank off of debt and stated that he would do his best to keep this country in debt.

Side: congress
1 point

omg we have hit gold. you must tell me when did you realize that perhaps during the creation of our government we screwed up? i mean what is the problem with people. its like if you see a fire on a pile of dry wood, people think. "hmmm what way can i reduce the fire on the dry wood with out moving the dry wood that society has told me so long to protect and cherish?" the logical answer is not to stop the fire on the dry wood but to remove the dry wood, aka government.

Side: government
DaWolfman(3322) Disputed
1 point

Sarcasm seems to be a virtue in your post.

However your analogy is a weak one.

If you see a fire on dry wood, you don't remove the dry wood you'll burn yourself. If you did remove the dry wood there would be no fire, other than the fire already on the dry wood.

If the dry wood represents government then what does the fire represent? Issues within the government? If you remove government all you have is utter chaos.

Side: President BUSH & OBAMA
1 point

What's the opposite of progress?

Oh, right... CONgress =/

Side: congress
2 points

If poly means many and tics are blood sucking creatures, what does politics mean?

Side: congress
1 point

well techinally congress has more power then the president and evrything has to go threw congress so i am on the congress side

Side: congress
2 points

Who says congress or the presidents have anything to do with it? I think the real culprit is clear.

Side: The homosexual agenda
2 points

I know, those gays and their above average income, they've been steeling jobs from the real america since the dawn of mammals. Did you know gay male geese kidnap baby geese and raise them? Freakin' gay swans.

(I'm continuing what is I hope sarcasm. If not, you're gay.)

Side: President BUSH & OBAMA
1 point

Well, they knew about this situation, and at a time when they could rectify it. Well, they chose to do nothing. Kinda their fault

Side: President BUSH & OBAMA
1 point

after posting two unrelated topics i got interested in the topic ( who would of figured). who is to blame is government, taxation is legalized theft, their unconstitutional policies on industry contradict our lazzi fair capitalism, and we support oppressive regimes in our goal of global peace.

we are not, and i repeat not the global police, i mean every time i hear a news report about some terrorist attack or communist conspiracy i cant help but think of the Cops them song "bad boy".

we need to practice isolation and cut the amount of money obama and past presidents have spent on rebuilding the world so we have stock markets to trade with. the world is tired of our bungling leaders and want a break.

and if my argument was not clear enough the deficit we have is due to our increased failure of the world economy, China's masterful use of decreasing the American dollar, and the weakening of our influence in high resource areas. we cant sustain our empire any more.

Side: government
1 point

The buck stops at the President. However with the exception of Clinton every president since (and including) Reagan has at least doubled the national debt, so these two should not be by themselves. Bush though takes the cake, he increased it faster and by a higher percentage than any President in history. Obama isn't a magician and can't just make it go away in two years, I'll reserve my judgement in this particular regard for after his first term.

Side: President BUSH & OBAMA
1 point

Obama, Bush did his best while Obama goes on 50000000000000000 vacations

Side: President BUSH & OBAMA