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In the debate “Dawkins, high priest of atheism, approves ‘mild pedophlia’” I wrote simply “I find that disturbing. So I guess atheist leaders and religious leaders have more in common than we all thought. Except the religious leaders go all the way with their child rape.” In SaintNow’s reply he asserts “you sound like a molester yourself.” There is nothing that I wrote that either endorses Dawkins’ on mild pedophilia or suggests any evidence that I myself would do such a thing. And then he banned me to allow the smear to go unanswered. That is cheap low class low skill debating, right there. Smear, block, run.
I banned you because you were avoiding the topic of the debate which was the sick thinking of Dawkins as he excuses pedophilia........and the logical progression of that discussion would be that such a man should be dethroned by atheists and not held in esteem yet somehow they ignore how sick the man really is and they still idolize him.
Why don't you post my reply from that debate? Here, I'll do it for you since apparently you are too cowardly to face it yourself.
So you too seem to be saying "mild molestation" by pedophiles against children is not bad, and since there are many priests who did it, it's okay that it was done to Dawkins and it's okay that Dawkins is basically saying all he Catholic priests should be let off the hook because mild molestation is not bad for children and it's okay for pedophiles to molest children as long as it's "mild"?
you sound like a molester yourself.......acting like mild molestation is okay compared to whatever you think some priests might have done. But at least you started by agreeing that what Dawkins said about the issue is disturbing. I'm not making excused for anybody who molests children in any way or to any degree. They should all be in jail or executed.
The point here is Dawkins, the high priest of atheism, is a pervert and gets a pass on it from his supporters....and by giving him that pass, they are all guilty with Dawkins for promoting criminal perversion against children.
Yes I'm smearing you with your own mud as the way you are arguing is to allow for the "mild molestation" Dawkins was subjected to and which he says now that he finds is acceptable and harmless.
Nobody is trying to excuse Catholic priests who tend to be homos and drunks due to their stupid requirement of celibacy for the priesthood and temptations of wine which tends to loose morals.....a requirement I guess has changed in recent years but over decades or centuries became a breeding ground for homosexuals and wino with priests sharing some alcohol with alter boys and loosening up with them. Nobody here is excusing that behavior, it seems like you are excusing Dawkins' endorsement of "mild molestation", DAWKINS EXCUSES MOST OF THE SEXUAL DEVIANCY AND ALL "mild" MOLESTATION DONE BY CATHOLIC PRIESTS.
If you are going to condemn the priests, you need to also condemn the high priest of atheism, Dawkins, or you are obviously the real hypocrite............and if you won't condemn Dawkins' approval of "mild molestation" which excuses most of the behavior of the priests you hate, I really have to wonder if you were one of those altar boys and you are disturbed trying to hide your own perversion.
I banned you because you were avoiding the topic of the debate which was the sick thinking of Dawkins as he excuses pedophilia........and the logical progression of that discussion would be that such a man should be dethroned by atheists and not held in esteem yet somehow they ignore how sick the man really is and they still idolize him.
So answer the smear. I have implied there is good reason to believe you are trying to cover your own perversion. I could be wrong, but I have reason to suspect that I am right by the way you are talking and acting.
Nope. I agreed with you when I said I found it disturbing. And you smeared me when you twisted that into then I must be a pedophile. And then you banned me because you're a coward. And everyone on this site knows that's why you do it.
You are not condemning Dawkins who is actually worse than the priests who at least show some shame and guilt for the things they have done. Dawkins shows no shame and teaches that pedophilia as long is it's "mild molestation" is not harmful.
You should be smeared as long as you are excusing Dawkins while condemning priest while Dawkins actually is making an excuse for those priests. Your seeming inability to see Dawkins is the most contemptable for saying he was molested and it didn't harm him and those who molest children should not be condemned indicates you have been molested and are trying to deny the shame of it......while sidestepping condemnation of Dawkins teaching on pedophilia.
I banned you from that discussion because it was to focus on Dawkins and for some very strange reason you try to shift the focus off of Dawkins........telling me you have stuff in your closet you want to keep in the dark.
Until you loudly condemn the things Dawkins said excusing pedophilia which would excuse the pervert priests you want to shift attention to, I have to conclude there is a serious character flaw caused by something in your closet. I could be wrong, but by your attitude in avoiding renouncing Dawkins teaching on pedophilia, I'm going to think maybe you are a pedophile at heart if not in action.
Denounce Dawkins strongly, specifically, and pointedly, ("I find that disturbing" is far to vague) or I will continue to suspect you at heart are a Dawkins. Again, I could be wrong about you on that point, but when you will not renounce Dawkins teaching on pedophilia being acceptable and harmless, I am going to think you hold those same ideas in your heart even if you don't act out on them and molest children.
Again, I banned you because you were trying to shift the discussion away from Dawkins......and I have to wonder why.......what did the priest do to you when you were a little boy? Did you go through confirmation and baptism, sip communion wine as you learned to be a good altar boy?
I can concur with their statement, everyone on this sight thinks you're a religious nut who stays awake at night wondering when the devil will come to get him, or why he's not currently burning in hell. Maybe 1% of this website has agreed with you at one point or another, but you can't deny how outrageous your claims are, seeing as other, more respectful and devoted Christians constantly call you out for your erratic and extremist behaviour. You sound like you're about a half step from starting your own Christian ISIS by the way you speak.
Yeah, I agree that statements shouldnt be twisted in order to make a statement of truth, or to prove a point.
The crazy thing about truthful statements is the truth defends itself when people are interested in the truth.
When there is no interest in truth, side arguments are the only defense for nontruths. So when someone is unwilling to disect an issue or precept, and offer reasonable arguments to the point made, the point made has veered to nonsense in at least one of the argument approaches.
Then the truth seekers have to be aware, and disect lies to get to the bottom line truths and lies of the matter being discussed.
What if we approached everything deciding to direct for truth?
Well for once you are kinda talking sense. The problem is that people do not want the truth, they love the lies they believe, they want to believe the lies, and God gives them what they want....strong delusion. He gives it to them because it's what they want...and then one day God gets tired of them and ends their time under His mercy and they wake up in Hell with no hope.
Grenache refuses to condemn Dawkins who flatly said he cannot condemn "mild molestation" of children. Why?
The fact that he will not condemn Dawkins' pro-pedophilia statements directly leaves the door wide open for speculation about Grenache's reasons for drinking a lot of wine.
Grenache had all kinds of overblown statements to smear all "religious" people, but nothing specifically condemning Dawkins' approval of "mild molestation".
Why are you always on the wrong side with non-Christians and NOT TELLING THEM THEY NEED TO BE SAVED NOR TELLING THEM WHO CAN SAVE THEM NOR TELLING THEM OF THE HELL THEY NEED TO BE SAVED FROM>.....I said that all with a smile, I'm not yelling at you, I really find you funny for being a patsy for some of the people who have been the nastiest of all toward me on here.
and Grenache is an atheist for crying out loud. I"m trying to get him to see he is a sinner who needs to be saved from Hell and you are patting him on the back saying "there there, I think you are more righteous than saintnow, you don't have to worry about Hell" That's how he's playing you, that's what he is getting out of you, he's using you as a patsy to make himself feel righteous so he thinks he can't end up in Hell and he's lost and condemned and probably will wake up in Hell ...and who cares? holding his hand and stroking his ego wont' do him any good.
You forgot the question mark at the end of your question. Also, your last sentence is at least three if not four sentences run together, and "you're" would be the correct word.
You allege I'm the punk but you're the one who writes like one.
spelling and grammar mistakes do not make a punk, bad attitude does, punk. You've always been a punk to me because you are crying about your brother and taking out your feelings toward him on me. Punk. You might want to go drown your troubles in a glass of wine since you can't handle the truth.
Bad attitude? You have a site full of people who think you're a tool because you ban everyone and then mock away. All I've ever done is stand up to you. You fancy yourself a bully, but you're just a bully in anonymous cyberspace. You're the punk.
There is a correct and simple answer to the question. Try it on yourself, say to yourself "If Hell is real, why am I not burning in it now?". You are supposed to be a Bible believing Christian (even though you like to make up your own versions to suit your own idea), so you should already know there is no "if" about Hell and you should know the correct answer as to why you are not burning there now. I'll give you a clue....it's always new, it's the only thing that is always new in this world, moment by moment it's always new
1hr ago
What is wrong with you? You are being as dense as boulders!
When are you finally going to admit to yourself that you don't actually believe in God? It is clear based on the statements you make, but you seem not too realize it yourself.
Are you going to tell me you have the right to live? Who are you going to sue when your life is over and your "right" is taken away? This is simple reality logic 101. If you had the right to live, you could not be deprived of that right, you would not be dying, your clock would not be counting down to zero, your time would not be running out. Is this too much for you to admit? You're not even living, you are dying.....your clock is counting down to zero as you die. I know it's hard for you to admit you are dying and not living, but it should be obvious you do not have the right to live and time in this world is a privilege.
Are you going to tell me you have the right to live?
Nope. Of course life is a privilege, there is nothing after it. If I was religious I would think I had a right to live since God gave me that right.
Who are you going to sue when your life is over and your "right" is taken away?
No one, I am not religious.
This is simple reality logic 101.
Suing someone when you die is not logical at all.
If you had the right to live, you could not be deprived of that right, you would not be dying, your clock would not be counting down to zero, your time would not be running out.
Right, and you would transition to heaven when your life on Earth ended to start spending your eternal life.
Is this too much for you to admit?
Why would I have a problem admitting the atheist position that we don't actually have the right to live forever?
I know it's hard for you to admit you are dying and not living,
Those 2 things aren't mutually exclusive, so yeah it is hard for me to admit that.
but it should be obvious you do not have the right to live and time in this world is a privilege.
Yes, it is obvious to me because that is the atheist position. The question is, why is that obvious to you?
a privilege is given by somebody, fool. If you say you have the privilege of time, you imply their is a giver of that privilege. I'd rather talk to my dog than try to reason with a fool.
so when do you think you will become nonexistent, and do you even exist now or does it only appear you exist due to the random chemical fizzes causing a hologram which seems to be your consciousness?
"My name if Farman. I'm an atheist which means it is not possible God can be smarter, stronger or better than me. God is dead. I'm Fartman. I'm so smart. Wow, I am the god."
I like it. Its funny. No athiest here thinks they have or right to live in hell or out of hell or that they have any rights relating to hell but you still keep asking them again and again why they think they have such rights. Its very strange. But funny. Keep up the good work pinhead.
Yes because they dont believe in hell. Just like you didnt until you got scared and converted (although you fsil in every aspect of Christianity). Why is it is difficult for you ro understand that it is nothing to do with "rights".
Yes, I keep asking them again and again, trying to get them to think...to ask themselves why they are not burning in Hell now if Hell is real. Atheism is an overdose of a mental sleeping pill.......and if the atheist doesn't wake up and see the danger of falling into the hands of the living God, they will wake up in Hell. I'm trying to wake them up before it's too late....and really, I think it's already too late for some of you atheists, I think you have gone beyond the point of no return so you will never seek God's mercy and never be saved from Hell. It's the ones who read silently and may be open to the truth.....those are the ones I'm really aiming at trying to get them to see the marvelous light of the gospel of Jesus Christ who conquered death so all who repent and believe on Him will be saved if they receive Him as their Savior
I have never thought I had the right to live in out or in the general vicinity of hell nor heaven nor chocolate bunny land. I have never said I had the right to live outside hell. You complete and utter idiot.
The fact that you are not burning in Hell proves God is not giving you (yet) what you deserve.
You realise what youve said right? "The fact that God hasnt sent you to hell (yet) is prove that God hasnt sent you to hell (yet)". You spent so many hours asking everyone that question and THIS is the answer? hahaha.
I have a question for you: "Why are you not eating spaghetti and meatballs right now?"
"The fact that your computer blown up is prove that you havent got what you deserve (yet)!"
Youre good for a laugh. Keep it up pinhead. Please.
I'm am not eating spaghetti and meatballs because I don't care for them enough to make them for myself...
The fact that my computer (has not) blown up proves it was made good enough to not blow up yet. For all I know, there's a time bomb inside though I doubt it. I deserve to be burning in Hell now as a sinner. The fact that I am not burning in Hell now proves that God is merciful. If God's mercy is nothing to you, be sure you will get what you deserve and the One who paid your price in death now reigns in everlasting life and will be your Judge and having refused His mercy He will pour out His wrath in fire upon you. He took your death but neglect His mercy so in death you will be neglected forever in Hell. That's how it works if you won't repent and believe on the Lord Jesus Christ.
Justice or mercy, you get what you deserve if you won't believe God's way for you to be pardoned. Jesus is the way, the truth, and the life. You're going the wrong way against God, and if you wake up in Hell before you can read this post or at any time in the future, you got there by your own choice, stuck in pride loving your sin more than life.
That's good preaching, but probably a waste of time for you.....others may hear while God is calling out to you but you refuse.
You can deny that you deserve not to have your computer blown up until your blue in the face. You are still going straight to the computer blowing up scenario. You need to repent and not be deserving of the computer blowing up.
This is exactly how you debate. Pretty fucking stupid eh pinhead?
It won't work. I adopted his manner for a time during interactions with him. He didn't see an issue with my means, so I couldn't properly illustrate his error to him.
No, it means He is merciful. You are not escaping justice, you are still in condemnation on death row....if you are still here, it's because God is giving you time you do not deserve. He gives you that time because He does not want you in Hell but you keep insisting He is not good and not merciful, you want to believe He is not good and not merciful, and eventually He will give up and let you have the reality you want and that reality is Hell where there is nothing good from God and no mercy, nothing but Justice....it's what you deserve, it's what we all deserve. God will pardon you on His terms if you will come into agreement with Him. If you will only defy Him, you will remain as you are, rejected by Him forever and left in Hell where He will not hear you.
Got it? No, you don't got it. You think you are getting off the hook in death....I would say good luck in that but I know there is no luck involved and you are wrong as long as you are going against God and trampling the blood of His Son under your feet.
the only thing you are pointing out is that you exclude God by your own choice, preferring your own created absurdities of your imagination, created absurdities which are not God..then you talk stupid by saying "the absurd thing I imagine is not God, therefore there is no God outside of my imagination". Why don't you just stand there on your tiptoes and spin like a top and flubber your lips going blblblbblbl. You would be making the same about of sense.
Why don't you ask them? If they could tell you, I do believe they would say "I know I am not nothing and God made me to be somebody." It's our nature, we are born that way. This rubbish about "atheism is the default position at birth" is nonsense.
I can testify that some of my earliest memories were before I could talk, when I was a baby, maybe less than a year old, when I witnessed what I knew was evil, and threw a temper tantrum over it.....and I knew I trusted in God if that evil was to hurt me. I knew I had the authority of God to protest the evil I was witnessing. I could not describe God, I did not know Jesus, knew nothing of sin or Hell.......but I knew God gave me life and I knew it was by His authority that I protested the evil. There was nothing else to believe. Babies know they come from God. As they grow, people may put twisted ideas about God and religion into their heads, atheism is a choice people make after they learn they can and have done wrong.
It is not likely and is not usual - as a matter of fact it is HIGHLY unlikely and EXTREMELY unusual!!
Here is part of the historical event of Steven's Martyrdom
Notice his stoners coats were laid at Saul's feet.
Saul after murdering Christiand, has an unusual transformation and personally experienced an encounter with the Risen Jesus.
Saul goes from killing them to the greatest winner of souls. And by those actions fullfills prophesy!!
And his dramatic conversion THEN pushes the gospel out from his own countrymen - The Jews, to "All Nations" - Gentiles, (other Nations other than Israel) and is well know even from those he was in league with while severely persecuting Christians.
Matt 24
14“This gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in the whole world as a testimony to all the nations, and then the end will come.
Isaiah 11
10 "And in that day there shall be a Root of Jesse, who shall stand as a banner to the people; for the Gentiles shall seek Him, and His resting place shall be glorious."
If all you are doing is insisting God does not exist, why are you trying to build a case for Him being unjust? Why are you trying to prove God is not good? Why are you unable to prove God is not good?
If all you are doing is insisting God does not exist, why are you trying to build a case for Him being unjust?
Because it shows that the followers are God are even more crazed from following such a being.
Why are you unable to prove God is not good?
It s easy to prove God is not good. The only way that Christians say he IS good is by changing the definition of good to mean "anything that God does".
This scripture prophesy also have a cluster of prophesies that would need to be fullfilled for each to be fulfilled.
So prophetic intrusion by God in His Word, takes predictions to prophesy, which is predictions based on possibility, to prophesy - pre-written history, which is complicated.
But it also knits prophesies together in clusters like cells, building history.
Complicating even miracles of prophesy to clusters of prophesies ALL needing to be fullfilled for the next in a cluster.
If you really look at prophesy, and realize it's difference from "predictions"
Then you realize prophesy is like layers, with many prophesies knit together like cells all dependent on each other for each individual fulfillment, I think it's a greater feat than cells mutating and accidentally on purpose resulting in intellegent design!
My argument is God has proven Himself through history, as the Bible was being written.
Can you show me how it's not detailed in prophesy with an accuracy as if history was knit together, as your cells in evolution?
And can you show me any historical documentations of the Bible that is riddled with inaccuracies?
Another Prophesy:
Some 400 years before crucifixion was invented, both Israel's King David and the prophet Zechariah described the Messiah's death in words that perfectly depict that mode of execution. Further, they said that the body would be pierced and that none of the bones would be broken, contrary to customary procedure in cases of crucifixion
(Psalm 22 and 34:20; Zechariah 12:10).
Again, historians and New Testament writers confirm the fulfillment: Jesus of Nazareth died on a Roman cross, and his extraordinarily quick death eliminated the need for the usual breaking of bones. A spear was thrust into his side to verify that he was, indeed, dead.
(Probability of chance fulfillment = 1 in 10 to 13th power.)
I argue about something I think is imaginary because i live in a country where over 70% of the citizens believe in that imaginary thing. Trust me, I wish there were other things we were all talking about a lot more than this nonsense.
well if you think you are talking about nonsense, I think you are not very bright. I don't put energy into talking about things I consider nonsensical.
I feel like you might put some energy in if a vast majority of people you met on the street believed in this 'nonsense' and used it to fuel their lives. Or preached at you constantly about this nonsense.
You mean to tell me that if you lived in a Muslim nation, you wouldn't ever put any energy in to talking or thinking about Islam?
Why should you care? Why not just eat, drink and be merry because tomorrow you die? Why stress yourself over a figment of your imagination? God who is there independent of anybody's imagination can't see you, right? So why spend your life trying to fortify a wall to keep Him out?
I'm not going to talk to you about it if you are ignoring me. Why not just go eat, drink, and be merry since tomorrow you die? Enjoy all you can while you can? Why be unhappy? Is there sin in your life you are trying to excuse, so anybody who believes in God reminds you of your sin and you have to try to get them to shut up so you can forget your sin?
Why should you care? Why not just eat, drink and be merry because tomorrow you die? Why stress yourself over a figment of your imagination? God who is there independent of anybody's imagination can't see you, right? So why spend your life trying to fortify a wall to keep Him out?
Because we feel there are real consequences..? We cant just go a say sorry and feel whatever human consequences there are dont matter because youre going to live in lala land when we die?
Eternal value and riches are Eternal, and so are consequences are eternal. There is no lala land someday for the Christian, we already live in Eternity, we are already aware of Eternal.
《<------------------------>》
When I say people are already on fire, I already understand what is in front of us is already Eternal.
There is a realm you can't see, and that realm is Eternal
Because we're here. We have thoughts, emotions, consciousness, love, life; it's all really cool and there's so much here to explore, feel, think about, learn, sing, hear, smell, taste make, explore, experience and it's all finite. It's all we get, so we we get to treasure it. It's special. It's not some test to avoid pain or win prizes. It gets to be there for its own sake, and that's beautiful. We can experience things that make us happy, or sad, or everything you can imagine and we get to experience that just for the now. It's fucking amazing and the fact that you see it all as a way to avoid eternal pain it fucking sad as hell.
So we're here. We have thoughts, emotions, consciousness, love, life; it's all really cool and there's so much here to explore, feel, think about, learn, sing, hear, smell, taste make, explore, experience and it's all finite. It's all we get, so we we get to treasure it. It's special. It's not some test to avoid pain or win prizes. It gets to be there for its own sake, and that's beautiful. We can experience things that make us happy, or sad, or everything you can imagine and we get to experience that just for the now. It's fucking amazing and the fact that you see it all as a way to avoid eternal pain it fucking sad as hell.
This is an interesting chapter with instructions. Jesus is saying the Law and Prophets won't pass away, He fulfills the law, in Him we are not crushed by the Law. Those outside of Him are judged by the entire Law. Without forgiveness in Jesus, you are crushed by the weight of the Law.
In this verse Jesus was giving Heavenly Kingdom instructions on exactly what He expected from His Church, the Law of Christ and of those within His Kingdom. You see pieces of this chapter reitterated in in the letters. These are specific to interactions of people who share in His grace.
But if you dont believe in God, the Bible clearly states, "the fool says there is no God." So the Bible literally calls you a fool! We don't have to twist anything to make the Bible say it. It's a statement of affirmative fact.
Right, I'm not denying that the Bible calls me a fool. But are you saying that it means that you aren't allowed to call any other Christian a fool? And it's a ok with everyone else?
(Quick side note: The Bible also says : I do not permit a woman to teach or to have authority over a man; she must be silent.
I think that probably includes your behavior on this site. I personally think it's ridiculous and am enjoying our conversations, but I would be curious to hear your thoughts on that verse).
I don't think this passage is about name calling. But I can understand your over simplification of it. It's the attitude of the heart toward one another.
And whether you believe the Bible or not there is a God.
I have given you evidence that is substantial in Prophetic fulfilment, and Historic reliability. And findings that show incredible situations just in the series of events.
Well I guess since the person who IS a fool, is a fool for not believing in God.
And the Bible doesn't CALL you a fool, it declares that you are a fool.
Calling you a fool is an opinion, that's just name calling, and name calling is an opinion.
The Bible declares you a fool. The Bible is telling your whole life story in just one word, "fool"
See, that's why people in the church shouldn't say thou fool to other believers, because by being a believer we are not damned, in contrast the fool is damned.
"Fool" is a declaration of judgement. It's a harsh judgement, reserved only for those who are damned, those who are named fool!
Listen to this audio it helps clear up the Bible on women teaching men and all that women at church.
Basically balance, it was a cultural issue. There wee forceful chatty women among them, that were disruptive. It was instructional for managing church meetings.
Well, it also culturally makes sense why the church would be against homosexuality in those days, for lots of reasons that are no longer relevant in today's society. Does that mean that true Christians should support homosexuality?
I can see why the thought though. It seems the same, one is a cultural disruption. There were women that just wouldn't shut up. Surprised? Of course not, Lol!
But it wasn't sin to be a woman, the lack of self control, disrespect to others, and hindering the teaching of the gospel was sin. We have women prophets like Deborah as an example.
And the pictures of men and women and church structure have purpose. But it's not to silence women.
Where it says women submit to your husbands; there it also in the same scriptures and in the same chapters it also says fot the men to love their wives, as Jesus loved the church, and gave Himself up for her. So as Christ loved the Church and gave Himself for her a husband should live for his wife. - fun ammunition for the ladies, lol!
Who has it tougher?
The woman who should not be a budinski?
Or, the man who needs to lay down his life for his bride?
Re: homosexuality, it's a hot button issue, but it is clear what God says.
1st though, I want to show you something. It's assumed that God made sin, then said "don't touch it" some cruel game thought up in a tyrannical, twisted, diabolical all powerful bully some call God.
But that's not really truth, it's much more twisted than that!
I recently did a study in Genesis and I believe God showed me somethings I hadn't seen before.
Below skim through for an idea of it.
The summary: in Genesis 1, The beginning starts out with a general statement - God made Heaven an Earth,
Then goes on to explain Day 1, the earth is dark, and void, and unformed. Black emptiness without form or structure, without a discernably clear image of anything.
Now, at some point we have Satan's fall from Heaven to the earth like lightening, we know it was before man. What if it happened, around the same time, when the earth appeared on the 1st day. What if Satans fall was connected to the bang, What if the morning Star fell into the darkness as Lucifer's light known as "the morning star" went out? He was one of the greatest, most talented, most beautiful of all angels. What if the earth appearing at creation was in part someway in place from his fall or for his fall?
Satan fell into darkness, so even he didn't create sin, sin is growth from seeds born in the darkness. Satan also grew into what he is from the seeds of darkness.
Satan was in light at one time, he wasn't in light thinking of what dark thing to do. But as soon as pride entered he became full of it since "everything grows" God lets you grow your hearts desires, and it becomes you, consumes you, Till he delivers you over to the mind of the beast. As you think, so you are.
And that which is dark consumes, so then what happened to the Morning Star Satan? ... He fell like lightening into darkness. Why?
Such a quick shooting fall, because darkness can't remain in light!
I will ... I will ... I will ... is against the Light and against His will. And God understands Light - no darkness can remain in Light!
Nothing about darkness can remain or cross the boundary into light and remain dark, it shrinks back, light pushes and repells darkness.
But when there is only a little light, darkness can overtake light and push light back. But the two cant exist AS ONE!
Not because He doesn't love those who choose darkness, but the darkness itself can't remain in light.
So then, how can those who choose darkness remain in light?
So, we see darkness simply exists, Satan fell into it, and then he became just what he, Satan, wanted. And in "judgement" since the god of this world is already judged, God also GAVE HIM, Satan over to his lusts.
And by Satan's own judgement he fell into the darkness that marked him, given the mind that is darkened, full of his darkness that consumed him, and he became the god of the darkness, and the father of its seed!
Just like his heart wanted. He became god (a god.)
The already judged god of this world's darkness producing already judged seeds of darkness, taking root in flesh he is destined to eat and hunger after all the days of his life. So those who eat the fruit eat the fruit that forms in the void, sin born from seeds of darkness.
The rule of God and Judgement is this, whatever you eat takes root, and becomes you, whatever takes root is its fruit, and that defines your tree. Repent and He will prune you, and water you with pure water, and He will forgive you of your bad fruit and replant you in conditions that produce in you the best fruits.
Children of Light learn darkness is their enemy, and in the end they become grown up children of light, just like their father!
Children of Darkness learn to repell light and hate light, because when exposed it is seen for what it is, darkness. It's a bright room, looking down a darkened hall to see an even darker room.
The other side of the double edged sword, is God let's the heart have what it wants. Because the heart doesn't respond to Him the Light, as to their Father. Showing they choose their father, and their deeds are seeds growing in them producing the image of their father in the darkness.
So they stay with their father. And God is destroying darkness and Satan in the end, and all of the seeds and trees born into darkness. It simply can't and won't exist when He brings His Kingdom, which has no night or darkness, and has no seeds born in darkness, including pain sickness and disease.
The darkness gets to stay in darkness as it IS their hearts desire!
He doesn't force anyone out of darkness, who's heart He knows is SET on darkness.
He defines Light this way, He says this is what is "Good" to me.
"and He saw it was Good"
So On Day 2
He separates water from water - Day 2
And He separates water from water and He says "it was so"
Then He names the expanse Heaven.
Now, if you go to Genesis 2 -
water is coming out of Eden - Waters His Garden - Then splits
into 4 RIVERS of water!
This is why when God separates water from water, He says "and it was so" because whatever is "and it was so," means it is left to unfold, according to the world and man in it, with the influence of the god of this world. So then free will cares and cultivates these things that are "and it was so"
Wheras Things God BROUGHT TO THE DARK WORLD is "He saw and it was good."
What the world's fruitfulness of darkness makes it unfolds as it grows. The hosts God puts in, that are hosts of darkness, are chosen based on foreknowledge of choices they would make. And these He then predestined in their places at the appointed time, to be instruments and vessels of dishonor. While everyone else, everything else, sickness, sin, death, pain, war, hate, etc... unfolds seed after its kind "and it was so." !!
Their choices taking root and growing through all time, till the end of our time.
And He in the Word "Son's of God" "producing seeds in daughters in man!"
Now it came about, when men began to multiply on the face of the land, and daughters were born to them, 2 that the sons of God saw that the daughters of men were beautiful; and they took wives for themselves, whomever they chose.On Day 3
He separates Sea and makes them "gather" in one place
He exposes dry ground ready to grow things after their own kind
(Fruit trees weeds grass plants etc) AND He says of some "and it was so" to other things He says "and it was good"Both produce after its own kind. A world full of tares among wheat, unripe fruit and trees destroyed by insects and disease among fruit trees that are bearing good ripe fruit in perfect conditions to grow!
And those trees tend to be on farms or locations together, if a drought or a swarm of locusts comes through they are attacked in groups of trees. If the grape vines and fruit trees arrested in thriving conditions they are also in gatherings.
The conditions you grow in or choose to grow in are self producing - seed after its own kind, or self mutilating by choosing to grow in adverse conditions. And tares Jesus says, enemies sow them in good batches of wheat. Which He will separate in the end.
How does He separate in the end, at the harvest. He sends out the reapers and uproot the tares!
Well lots here. Hopefully you see a little better.
But if your choice is darkness no matter what is true, then either God has to bring you to a surrender, or you are one to be swept away by this time period, as He pours out everthing He is pouring to clearly defined what is marked of the world and
what is MARKED with HIS Seal! (Born again, Not marked in the BEAST'S Image! But MARKED in the "Image of God," and Sealed with the Holy Spirit)
See Revelations and Luke 17 and Matt 24.
Everyone is being marked, its image of your Father - Satan or God! The mark of the beast is Satan's image, the god and father of the darkness of this world, his currupted seed that is at Enmity with The Woman's Seed, as told to Satan when he was cursed all the way back in the beginning at our Adam and Eve account!
And God is destroying darkness and Satan in the end, and all of the seeds and trees born into darkness. It simply can't and won't exist when He brings His Kingdom"
thanks for the kind words but unfortunately your wrong about that part i bolded.
It would be nice if God could destroy Satan and Hell and His demons but He cannot. Not while they are roaming this Earth. As this Earth IS under Satan's domain. that should be obvious to you by know. I have seen and fought too much of His legion to believe otherwise. where God CAN deliver is from Satan is when we come into His Grace. Or in Heaven. Only then are we rescued. And this is only some of us not all.
its obvious from your picture, if thats you, that your Jewish? But i see you have converted to Christianity? What made you do this? You were raised Jewish, correct? DO your read the Torah or the Talmud? I love reading the Talmud and it explains a lot of the Torah and the meanings of those metaphors which are not literal. Rabbis know this. And you also probably know most Jews don't believe in a literal Hell or Satan? but you do. is this why you converted?
Please scientifically explain this record. Or was it just a coincidence that this was a record of the day Jesus died on the cross? The record is not Christian or religious, it is secular.
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Thallus (52AD)
Thallus is perhaps the earliest secular writer to mention Jesus and he is so ancient his writings don’t even exist anymore. But Julius Africanus, writing around 221AD does quote Thallus who previously tried to explain away the darkness occurring at Jesus’ crucifixion:
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“On the whole world there pressed a most fearful darkness; and the rocks were rent by an earthquake, and many places in Judea and other districts were thrown down. This darkness Thallus, in the third book of his History, calls, as appears to me without reason, an eclipse of the sun.” (Julius Africanus, Chronography, 18:1)
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If only more of Thallus’ record could be found, we might find more confirmation of Jesus’ crucifixion. But there are some things we can conclude from this account: Jesus lived, He was crucified, and there was an earthquake and darkness at the point of His crucifixion.
Mark 15
27 They *crucified two robbers with Him, one on His right and one on His left. 28 And the Scripture was fulfilled which says, “And He was numbered with transgressors.”
29 Those passing by were hurling abuse at Him, wagging their heads, and saying, “Ha! You who are going to destroy the temple and rebuild it in three days, 30 save Yourself, and come down from the cross!”
31 In the same way the chief priests also, along with the scribes, were mocking Him among themselves and saying, “He saved others; He cannot save Himself. 32 Let this Christ, the King of Israel, now come down from the cross, so that we may see and believe!” Those who were crucified with Him were also insulting Him.
33 When the sixth hour came, darkness fell over the whole land until the ninth hour. 34 At the ninth hour Jesus cried out with a loud voice, “Eloi, Eloi, lama sabachthani?” which is translated, “My God, My God, why have You forsaken Me?”
35 When some of the bystanders heard it, they began saying, “Behold, He is calling for Elijah.” 36 Someone ran and filled a sponge with sour wine, put it on a reed, and gave Him a drink, saying, “Let us see whether Elijah will come to take Him down.”
37 And Jesus uttered a loud cry, and breathed His last. 38 And the veil of the temple was torn in two from top to bottom. 39 When the centurion, who was standing right in front of Him, saw the way He breathed His last, he said, “Truly this man was the Son of God!”
Just so you know, since obviously you don't know what you are talking about, Matthew 5:22 which you misquote says:
“But I say unto you, That whosoever is angry with his brother without a cause shall be in danger of the judgment: and whosoever shall say to his brother, Raca, shall be in danger of the council: but whosoever shall say, Thou fool, shall be in danger of hell fire.”
The context here is speaking to your brother. You are not my brother, you are a fool. If you call another atheist a fool, you are in the same danger as your fellow atheist who is your brother. Psalm 14:1 says the FOOL hath said in his heart, there is no God. Atheists are fools, and it is proper to say so and proper to tell them so. They are not my brothers, they are fools....................fool.
2 My brethren, have not the faith of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Lord of glory, with respect of persons.
Whatever fake Bible you are quoting from, you're still misapplying it. It is written to Christians regarding fair treatment for poor people.
You're an idiot, James 2 was not for you, it was for Christians. If it was intended for you, it would have say "Oh ye idiots and fools who do not believe in Jesus, treat everybody as you are, like fools and idiots.
2 My brethren, have not the faith of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Lord of glory, with respect of persons.
Whatever fake Bible you are quoting from, you're still misapplying it. It is written to Christians regarding fair treatment for poor people.
You're an idiot, James 2 was not for you, it was for Christians. If it was intended for you, it would have say "Oh ye idiots and fools who do not believe in Jesus, treat everybody as you are, like fools and idiots.
Another movie I'd recommend is "God is Not Dead - 1"
There is a real temperate of the atheist presented in some characters in the movie, and I have to say I personally have seen these personalities grow in epidemic proportions over the last 10 years, it's changing but I don't think it will be pleasant for any in the near future as it grows even more.
God makes a difference because you still have light around you as an influence and as a shock absorber, so to speak.
As you may be able to see as the lights go out, people grow in evil, and society is a lot less happy and kind.
Are you saying that the here and now isn't really important to people who have faith?
Not to people of faith, no. But honestly, if you put an afterlife into the mix... then, yeah. At least relatively. If you're going to be in an afterlife for eternity, then the here and now takes up literally 0% of your life. And the importance you put on it is only in relation to that afterlife.
People often find out what's most valuable when the noise of this world and its things go away.
When your faced with losing a child, spilled milk and cheerios stuck to the floor seem to matter less than yesterday.
When you make it out of a burning building and loose everything you own, but those you love are ok, I think even the atheist whispers "Thank God"
As I see it, when your a Christian and you live according to love and the things that matter most, your well ahead of the game. Because you already know what matters most!
I wanted to share this with you, please take a few minutes for the video, I think it's 16 minutes long.
Well the gospels are eye witness accounts and actual biography.
Most historians confirm this.
The question for the skeptic really lies in the belief of Resurection and other miracles.
But as a Biography, that isn't disputable by any reasonable argument.
And there also has been forensic analysis done that would make the 4 gospels written collaborating the detailed stories impossible.
If you take 2 executives, brainy people of modern day, and they set out a conspiracy, (without luxury of government coverups - as in Hillary) But just executives frauding people, and caught and under investigation, a series of questions would detail inconsistencies that are indications of lies in testimony.
So just 2 people in short term with details of 1 thread of events would likely unravel.
And that's not the case with the 4 gospels, a forensic would confirm it, many have. 1 in particular has, and he started as a passionate atheist, and after months of review determined these were true eyewitness accounts.
Here is a quick clips from an atheist turned Christian through investigation.
My thought is let's prove beyond a reasonable doubt that faith has a logic and a reasoning that comes from reasonable conclusions when weighing evidence.
Then we can discuss if God is good or a tyrant.
Let's investigate, if He likely exists, then we can discuss if you like Him or not.
You can't prove the sky is blue to a person who won't believe it. It is not our job to prove God is there, or the gospel is true, we can present truth and if people will see it for themselves, they will see it.
There is a strong brainwashing in America via public schools teaching evolution and atheism for decades along with all kinds of occult and magic and everything else pushed through television, ungodly music, ungodly books......most of the people here are brainwashed into total rejection of truth and if you think you are going to win an argument or make a point with them, you will be disappointed.
I"m doing a work here presenting God's Word and His gospel truth as it will be in heaven and I want my treasure there. I'm giving my time to the gospel and the Word of God, and get pretty much nothing but hatred for it and I take that as an honor that the Lord counts me worthy to suffer shame for His name's sake. Every time I think somebody is starting to listen to the truth and I get my hopes up for them to trust in the Lord and be saved, I'm always disappointed. When I simply be obedient to God and speak the truth and expect nothing, the Lord brightens the path and I carry my cross knowing what's ahead in glory.
You can't prove the sky is blue to a person who won't believe it. It is not our job to prove God is there, or the gospel is true, we can present truth and if people will see it for themselves, they will see it.
This is a different time, and we need to bind the lies of the strongman, before they can even hear truth.
The flood of deceptions is poured, you won't reach anyone without exposing first the darkness and the lies.
And you have to listen to what has them bound.
Example
People are atheists for many reasons.
Finding out their why is important. And if you listen the Spirit will direct you on tearing it down. So Truth seeds can get in, and hopefully, eventually they will be a fruit trees with good fruit, even if we never see it.
Spirit is at work, but in this age we have to expose lies and darkness, in a way they can discern it or see it.
We have to draw pictures to get them to see, tomorrow may be a different picture built on the last.
We lay a foundation, then we build. But sometimes you have to tear something down, before you lay a new foundation.
In this age where people are so lied to and misinformed, we have to unbind them like Lazereth. We have to unravel so much first. Here is what we are up against, it's not just a moral flashlight these days, it's programming. Like when people are in cults.
Satan has taken every study and every truth and perverted it.
So your first obstacle is to establish truth and credibility of the Word, otherwise your throwing seeds at a closed door.
Archaeology has literally delt a blow against the Bible credibility, it probably didn't start out on purpose, but it turned into an opportunity for atheists. And part of it was the fault of Jewish faith and culture leaders and the Christian leaders.
Biblical evidence has been found but too late, because now an atheist field of skeptics is in control of people's minds on the matter, and they are delighted, and no one is interested in 1 admitting blunders, which is new to this era, integrity of a field and delight in findings was paramount in previous professionals,
Then they built that on top of Evolution, so then after discrediting the History, they discredit everything, through to Jesus, and the New Testament.
This generation of professionals delight more in cutting the head of of religion and are more than happy to let the sleeping dog of religion lie by not confirming archaeological finds, and by not establishing corrections that give the Bible credibility.
They don't want that, especially if God can be proven in the evidence. So our job is unique today. We have that to overcome before they can hear anything.
And not all will hear, most probably won't.
But our challenge is laying ground work, smashing foundations, then hopefully building a foundation of truth.
1 Corinthians 3
6 I planted, Apollos watered, but God was causing the growth.
7 So then neither the one who plants nor the one who waters is anything, but God who causes the growth.
8 Now he who plants and he who waters are one; but each will receive his own reward according to his own labor.
9 For we are God’s fellow workers; you are God’s field, God’s building.
10 According to the grace of God which was given to me, like a wise master builder I laid a foundation, and another is building on it. But each man must be careful how he builds on it.
11 For no man can lay a foundation other than the one which is laid, which is Jesus Christ.
12 Now if any man builds on the foundation with gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, straw, 13 each man’s work will become evident; for the day will show it because it is to be revealed with fire, and the fire itself will test the quality of each man’s work.
14 If any man’s work which he has built on it remains, he will receive a reward. 15 If any man’s work is burned up, he will suffer loss; but he himself will be saved, yet so as through fire.
It's about looking at evidence and answering it, tell me why it isn't evidence.
We talk about God's character all the time, and you guys say how awefully God is if He exists, and we say how He is Great.
I actually don't feel like having that stupid argument.
Let's get to the foundation! Then we will crash the Bible or admit it's evidence, or stay like we are and appreciate the argument for good if it's worth a lick!
Let's establish if God exists, then we can discuss whether you like Him or not
So in order for God to be God, He would have to kill you now for being a mocker, and if He does not do that, then He is not God and does not exist?
You never thought maybe God does not want to kill you and leave you in Hell, so He's giving you time that maybe you will come to terms with Him to secure pardon and be forgiven?
Your imaginary friends do not compare to God, you are trying to change God into something that can be imagined, something no bigger than your brain, like Big Bird and it's Big Bird Brain. You are creating a straw man which is not God, and arguing against your created absurdity. Isn't that kind of a waste of time, creating Big Bird and then arguing that Big Bird is not real? Why in the world waste time arguing about something that is not real...except that you feel like you are succeeding in keeping God from ruling over you.
Then, knowing you, you will say "god is a created absurdity"......to which I would say "the god you create is an absurdity, God is the One who gave you the ability to create absurdities and He thinks your pursuit of absurdity is a joke." God will let you have the absurdity you want, and that absurdity is fully realized in Hell where your entire existence will seem nothing but absurd in eternal torment. Sorry friend, that's the way it is. I'm simply stating facts. You are making an absurd argument against God by creating a straw man version of something less than God which is absurd....then you LOL at your own absurdity.......and you wonder why the Bible in Psalm 14 calls atheists fools before it describes their corrupt moral character?
You should listen to God because He is trying to stop you from going to Hell. Your imaginary friends will not be in Heaven as they exalt themselves against the knowledge of God, but you can have them in your imagination in Hell...but in Hell, I don't think you'll want them as thinking of them would only add to your torments.
God is talking to you, trying to get you to believe on His Son and be saved from Hell, but you won't listen I guess so it looks like you will wake up in Hell, and be ignored by God as you ignored Him. Tootles, Atfag. Sorry to be the bringer of bad news, but it looks like you are going to wake up in Hell soon.
Funny. You dont seem sad. If i knew most of the world is going to burn forever i would be on my kneew crying most of the time. Me thinks you know that its not really real.
Oh, so you don't want to be a Christian because you would feel too sorry for non-Christians, and it's easier for you to be one of them and go down to Hell with them than for you to be a Christian and be burdened with their plight.
Understandable. Have a nice trip with your com padres in death.
Nope. My point is you dont really believe in hell because you are not mourning that people are gping to burn forever. You make flipant little comments like "oh sorry punk youre going to hell". Either you dont really believe in hell or you are an evil uncaring person. Which is it?
You think it's flippant when I tall you that you are on your way to Hell because you don't believe it. You're flippin out, and flopping down into Hell....and you want me to cry for you when you hate me? sorry.
Yes you are being flippant. You are surely not such a monster that you take such pleasure from otherw being tortured in hell. It would be like me watching those ISIS videos and saying "theyre going to be burning like a sausage soon enough" - if you actually believe someone is going to suffer so immensely then you dont make stupid ass comments like you do. But you do. Which means you are either a monster or you dont fully believe. Which one is it? Monster or fake christian?
Your imaginary friends can't keep you out of Hell........I don't know why God is keeping you out of Hell as you seem bound and determined to get there. God is trying to keep you out of Hell. If I were you, I would listen to God but you prefer your imaginary friends.
Why don't you just answer the question? The answer to the question is mentioned in the Bible multiple times more than references to Hell. You claim to be a Christian so you should know the answer and be happy to repeat that answer as it is so jubilantly stated uncounted (at least by me, I'm sure somebody has counted how many times in the Bible the answer to my simple question is mentioned).
I pose the question for these lost people, "if Hell is real, why am I not burning in it now?" to try to get them to think. Atheism is abandonment of thinking, hiding behind a mental block wall blocking out God. They do this because they know they are guilty but are trying to avoid admitting it. If they can't admit they are guilty before God, they will not be saved from Hell. My question is valid for everybody, we all should be able to answer the question but few can. Can you?
you were posting too much graffiti and not addressing the question which was designed for discussion and attacking me personally rather than discuss the question. I was more than fair to give you more than one chance in your disruptive manners excluding me from the discussion I hoped to create and pulling me into your little personal issues.
the kid makes some very valid and interesting points.
And I noticed that none of the believers in the group could answer him. Just as none of the Christians here can answer him. I loved it when he said..."You don't listen to my imaginary friend, so why should I listen yo yours?"
I turned it off, it sounded grotesque and I didn't give it even a few seconds.
I don't know that I'd be easy to shake down without a response. But the video sounded like legion, a crop of demons, I wasn't interested in giving legion an audience!
I'll be glad to give you as much time as you need.
You won't watch a video for 5 seconds.
I think God is a tool used to convince people not to be bad toward each other. It morphed into convincing people to not be bad toward anyone who believes the same thing as you, which leads to horrible problems. Islam is the result of the problems that exist when you decide to hate people who don't believe the same thing as you on a much more strict level of agreement.
No I do not believe in evolution in the way it is imagined, But there is a period of time, before time was created that days may have been millions of years.
God is Light, so this amount of time is not long to Him.
So Day 3 into Day 4 there was growth plants, cells, bugs, bacteria etc.. the 1st FULL Day was Day 5!
I see that the first 4 days may have been over millions of years.
But day 5 and 6 were 24 hour days.
My basis for such a statements:
Science has found Plant life that existed growing without photosynthesis. And that shows Day 3 before Day 4.
Which would be a strange order to come up with in the mind of someone who lived in that time period.
Since the seasons and sun were closely tied to their survival in planting and harvesting
Day 3 God allowed earth to grow plants with seed in them and fruit with seed in them. Producing after their own kind.
God created time on day 4, and that is when sun shown through.
Everything jumped into being, although I do believe there were many things growing including cells and amoeba and viruses and bacteria, and even as advanced as bugs etc
Day 5 says He made fish and birds
Day 6 says He made animals and man
And He did so from the ground which already was growing all these things.
So when God picked up a handful of dirt to form everything, He picked up dirt that was rich in those things you know as Evolution!
You think he has the same person behind him as SaintNow? One person can make up a lot of characters but none of them can be more intelligent than you actually are... its telling.
Your imaginary friends do not compare to God, you are trying to change God into something that can be imagined, something no bigger than your brain, like Big Bird and it's Big Bird Brain. You are creating a straw man which is not God, and arguing against your created absurdity. Isn't that kind of a waste of time, creating Big Bird and then arguing that Big Bird is not real? Why in the world waste time arguing about something that is not real...except that you feel like you are succeeding in keeping God from ruling over you.
Then, knowing you, you will say "god is a created absurdity"......to which I would say "the god you create is an absurdity, God is the One who gave you the ability to create absurdities and He thinks your pursuit of absurdity is a joke." God will let you have the absurdity you want, and that absurdity is fully realized in Hell where your entire existence will seem nothing but absurd in eternal torment. Sorry friend, that's the way it is. I'm simply stating facts. You are making an absurd argument against God by creating a straw man version of something less than God which is absurd....then you LOL at your own absurdity.......and you wonder why the Bible in Psalm 14 calls atheists fools before it describes their corrupt moral character?
I don't even need to watch the video, and I won't watch it as I know it's garbage and I don't want the stink of it in my head........I can see already what it is, creating a thing less than God which is an absurdity and then saying the absurdity is not God and therefore God cannot be God.......it's a nonsensical pursuit of absurdity, the labor of fools.
Don't you care that most of these people are on their way to Hell? The Bible really has nothing else for people who are on their way to Hell. Hell is all the Bible has for people who love their sin more than life and will not repent and believe on the Lord Jesus Christ to be saved from Hell.
The Bible really has nothing else for people who are on their way to Hell.
You know nothing about Christianity if you think that is the case. The whole point of it is to help people "on their way to hell". Once again, a huge fail at being a Christian. Well done.
Hell is all the Bible has for people who love their sin more than life and will not repent and believe on the Lord Jesus Christ to be saved from Hell.*
You are an unrepentant sinner. Why do you fool yourself so?
Jesus dined with sinners, and was harsh to religious leaders.
Because they knew God's Word, and misrepresented it!
Jesus will judge the blood on the hands of religious leaders who misrepresent Him and His Word.
People should see Jesus as He is, then decide what is their stand. If truth is measurable and weighed, and if truth is loved when they finally do see it or hear it.
But no one will see Jesus by looking at Hell.
I don't know of any examples of people who chose to follow Jesus because of a threat of Hell.
When Hell words came out, Jesus was talking to people that were solidly enroute to Hell, and it was a pronouncement of a fact not a discussion of persuasion.
Saintnow means well. And I give him the benefit of doubt.
Idols can be doctrines and denominations.
God's calling His people to bring in a final completion.
And "Come out of Her!" is the message for the last days.
Churches are being Spiritually put out. The lights are being turned off. They didn't buy enough oil, and it's time to wake up and they can't find oil any where!
Unless they repent and put their feet on the Narrow Road, and also the feet of their congregations, Jesus will throw them into the sea.
Figure it out for yourself. I know the answer, you can figure it out......unless you are dumb as a monkey and devious like a devil.....which you obviously are.
Was that supposed to be an argument? The fact you are not in jail now provws thst Obama is not giving you what you deserve. The fact the local school hasnt called the police yet is prove thst you arent getting what you deserve. The fact lala is dumdum proves that you arent getyinf what you deserve.
Nonsense sentences are fun! I see why you like them pinhead.
It's just a fact. If you don't believe it, that's not my problem. You are the one making an argument against the fact, and your argument is nothing but bitterness and futile......and your problem, not mine. Keep on making your stupid arguments against God's mercy and see what it gets you.
ike I said to the other idiots, you sure seem to take pleasure in pointing out all the pervert priest who should be in jail if not executed for there criminal sexual behavior, and you seem to be saying that since some priests did it, it's okay for Dawkins to say "mild molestation" like what happened to him as a child should not be criminalized?
Yes i take pleasure from pointing out the evil Christians. so... Then you say i agree with the priests and thats why i think thwt child sexual abuse should be legalised. Whats weather like in lala land? Maybe take some time away from sticking the crucifix up your arse and engage brain?
Sure you do, because you think that if you can prove others to be more evil than yourself, that means you have a better chance of not burning in Hell forever. The problem is that the same evil in the hearts of what you think are the worst evildoer is the same evil in your heart, and God sees it all the same, evil, turned against Him in violation of His holy law. We all deserve to burn in Hell. You cannot excuse yourself by saying others are worse than you. You need pardon from God for your evil or you will never be able to get out of the debt you owe God for being evil in the time He gave you......you will always be evil and you won't get out of Hell by pointing your finger at others.
Catholocism has long been a known Wolf in sheep's clothing. Catholocism has been more political institutionand full of heresy and curruption. Not an example of Christian faith as given through followers of Jesus
Well I sure would be climbing a tree trying to get away from your "teaching". He's probably up a tree now and you can't reach him to teach him and you have to be teaching somebody so here you are tying to teach everybody.
Sometimes you can't teach them, most of them will not be taught..... all you can do is preach at them, give them some good old fashioned Hell fire and brimstone preaching against sin.
It's honestly funny when he bans. Like a kid putting their fingers in their ears so they don't have to hear logic.
But what REALLY makes me laugh is when he turns into the broken record. The moment he does is typically when he can't figure out a way to debate anymore on the facts presented.
Do you think Mint Tea is saved? I have seen nothing but words and actions of a lost person there.....do you care if she is saved or not? Are you a Calvinist?
Earth calling.....most of the people here are on their way to Hell, not saved, and I have seen nothing from Mint Tea to indicate she is not one of that crowd. If you want to treat her like she is saved, go ahead.
I understand truth seeking, and truth accountability, many of my arguments are directed to that.
But I also know there are Christians, real ones, there is elect that disagree on things that are minor and should never be a cause of divisions in the ONE Body of Christ.
There is ONLY ONE BODY AND that body is the ONE BRIDE OF CHRIST.
So some divisions are just divisive in the body, and that is going to be one of the judgements.
When Revelations says "come out of her!"
He is calling His One Body to Be ONE and leave the divisions and those that divide behind, and Be His Bride ready and waithing, with love as the one mindedness, showing we abide in Him! The New Jerusalem - no need for the sun or moon because He is the Light of this City - not made by human hands or built in rocks and mortar! But with Him as the Chief Corner Stone and us as stones with our (NEW) names written on the Stones.
Mint Tea is not a real Christian, and I cannot recall her ever claiming to be a Christian even if only her own version of one....here is one of her statements which a real Christian could never say:
Mint_tea(198) 2 points
Interesting. My line of thought could also be an acknowledgment that there are other Gods. After all
Exodus 34:14
For thou shalt worship no other god: for the LORD, whose name is Jealous, is a jealous God:
Seems to me there is indication there are other Gods out there.
just never mind. I thought you had better discernment than what you show in trying to let yourself believe Mint Tea is a Christian simply because you enjoy the way she criticizes me.
why don't you ask her to explain? You have embraced her as if she is a sister in Christ simply because you liked the way she criticized me. Why don't you ask her what she meant in those posts? You think she is your sister in Christ, let sisterly love continue.........ask her.
Here's another one from Mint Tea showing she is not a Christian: Mint_tea(198) 1 point
I should clarify though, I am neither for or against any religion in particular, I think they are all fascinating. I do however roll my eyes pretty hard when people confuse regular religious practice with extremism.---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
When you team up with her in attacking me, you are in bed with the devil.
Jesus teamed up with sinners and attacked pharasees often, did He misstep?
So she may be seeking, at this point even as a lost person she views your post as off base and nor Biblical.
Sheep hear His Voice and another they simply will not follow.
If Mint_tea is a sheep, is it the shepherds voice in you that she is rejecting? Or hasn't she heard the shepherds voice yet?
It's important that we listen to the Spirit, so the Words we speak are the Shepherds. Because Sheep will come WHEN they Hear The Shepherds Voice.
So Mint'tea if anything shows signs she may be a sheep waiting for the shepherds call, which you have failed to provide.
Witnessing is a call for the Shepherd to round up His sheep that are lost. It's to call all those who love the truth to come to Him.
In order for them to hear the truth, we have to unwind them and bid the strongman that holds them captive in darkness.
And that's through prayer and wisdom, the truth will set them free, but it needs to be truth against the strongman lies that hold them back.
You have to first discern the strongman, then precede with truth, and if they love truth after a while of work they will see and come. If they are not His Sheep, and you have done everthing to bind the strongman and give them truth, then smack your sandals and go to the next city, it Sodom and Gomorrah would fare better than those who "heard truth" and rejected it.
But it's like letters to Timothy says, a skilled workers using the Word to win them. The Spirit will draw them that are His, we just blow the trumpet!
Mint Tea clearly shows she thinks she is good so God owes here a "do not go to Hell" pass......and she doesn't even believe it's God who owes her that pass, she believes any or all "Gods" owe her that pass. And you call me dense? Just because that witchy girl criticizes me, you think she is a Christian? Are you sure YOU are a Christian? how can you be that dense? That witch is casting a spell on you
My prespective on reaching people is different than your.
I come from the point of approach that tries to determine what a person's bottom line objection is.
Not all are the same, it could be they are angry at God, or they don't want to look stupid so they approach everything with proving themselves through intellect, it could be their lifestyle is felt to be condemned so it's a truth of convenience, some are influenced and never investigated on their own and accepted what they heard, others drifting by may not know what questions to ask, or never thought much about it.
Some feel the tolerance factor, and hold to a belief that doesn't allow roots in truth taking pieces they feel make sense.
The bottom line is until you know what is in their "foundation of truth" and their why(s), then a discussion about truth is just throwing pebbles at a closed door!
Jesus did not side with sinners to attack saints. You are siding with a heathen to attack me. You let that devil climb on your back and push your buttons to make accusations against me...that's what the devil does, he's the accuser of the brethren and that witchy girl has some devils on her and you let her ride you like her own personal mule.
I have challenged your points of theology, and I have corrected your presentation which is visibly a Root of bitterness, I have spoken to you as a brother not as lost, I have requested that you sit before God and listen to whatever He shows you, assuming you are His, and expecting God to deal with you as His child.
But you pull out what you assume are tares and declare judgement on their salvation based on opinions of men, not on the Word of the Lord.
There are going to be different views in the body of Christ, but nothing to divide over. Example you have a kjv view, it's a view no matter what weight you put on it. It's not a Word from the Lord, yet you cut the heads off of brethern for the sake of your man made view!
John 14:17
that is the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it does not see Him or know Him, but you know Him because He abides with you and will be in you.John 13:20
Truly, truly, I say to you, he who receives whomever I send receives Me; and he who receives Me receives Him who sent Me.”
1 Samuel 26:11
The Lord forbid that I should stretch out my hand against the Lord’s anointed; but now please take the spear that is at his head and the jug of water, and let us go.”
1 Samuel 24:6
So he said to his men, “Far be it from me because of the Lord that I should do this thing to my lord, the Lord’s anointed, to stretch out my hand against him, since he is the Lord’s anointed.”
You see? You talk to Mint Tea like she is s sister yet by all indications she is an unregenerate sinner dead in her sins and on her way to Hell. You put me, a brother, down while you stroke her ego when she is in sin and she is wrong in her constant and never changing attacks on me which are hateful. She hates the truth.
So....you have nothing then. I'll wait a little longer if you want to go ahead and show me the evidence of that so I can provide clarification or explanation.
Mint-tea, Below Saintnow says you admit to worshipping other gods.
Is Saintnow twisting your statements? See his accusation below.
Thanks KNHav
Saintnow(3347) Clarified 1 point
Mint Tea is not a real Christian, and I cannot recall her ever claiming to be a Christian even if only her own version of one....here is one of her statements which a real Christian could never say:
Mint_tea(198) 2 points
Interesting. My line of thought could also be an acknowledgment that there are other Gods. After all
Exodus 34:14
For thou shalt worship no other god: for the LORD, whose name is Jealous, is a jealous God:
Seems to me there is indication there are other Gods out there.
My statement stands as a question about theological interest in the wording set forth in the bible, also, he is not saying that I admit to worshiping others Gods if that is the example you are giving me.
To make things clear, I do not believe that I fall in the line of a single religious thought process. I believe everyone is entitled to their opinion on the matter but I will call someone out who is hell bent on judging others while trying to maintain they are a good Christian. The main rules (10 commandments, 7 deadly sins) should not be broken or acted out because of excessive ego that blinds one to ones faults, if that makes any sense. If you have a question you would like to ask me and it is one I can answer I will be most happy to.
There is one way according to Jesus, and it's difficult to wrap our heads around especially in our culture of tolerance and political correctness, and the anti Christian movement that has become prominent in the modern day.
So the question is who is Jesus to you?
Then we can discuss who is Jesus according to what He said and other sources to way validity on who He is or was.
This may be the most important time ever to have a foundation of truth. Truth isn't whatever we want truth to be.
The question is, if Truth can be shown and established what then do you do with that?
I'm open for a discussion and I will try not to offend you.
I'd be glad to discuss truth and listen to your points and give insight when I can. If there is a truth, now is the time to know it.
To me, he is the embodiment of what Christians should strive for. He washed the feet of sinners, gave care to the poor, he welcomed all with open hearts and sorrow for their sins. He didn't judge those who didn't follow him or cast the stray aside, he simply taught and lived his teachings.
In terms of the Truth. Well. That's an interesting notion that there is one and only one version of the truth. But I've found that what is pure truth to me, isn't pure truth to others. For example. To me, it is true that God exists, my experiences have shown me this to be true. To others, my experiences aren't true to them, therefore they hold to what they believe to be true. We have to hold onto what is true to us. I am a firm believer that it ultimately doesn't matter what you believe, God- no God, what matters is how you act.
You mention truth is according to the beholder as long as they act well. That in the natural sense is correct.
I believe there is one truth in mapping out a life destined for Eternity with God. But here on earth their truths are fine if they are civilized and respect others. But in the real sense, saying "there are many truths" is a deception. It can even be a false kindness. Tolerance is kind, but not telling them the truth is not kind. Truth offends, but is telling the truth an act of intolerance?
If the question is what is truth, real truth, then there is only one truth. And tolerance has evolved into an intolerance for conversation, and the display of truth is offensive.
The question is, if Jesus is who He said He is, then Satan also probably is active also. Look around, if there were a devil is he winning souls easily, has he managed to close ears and keep truth from people?
As Christians we share truth because we do what He does.
Its an act of love to share truth especially with opposition.
It's not always easy, or comfortable, or even preferable to share truth, it often feels like telling a coworker they need to use deodorant.
Jesus left instructions and mapping, and no suggestions, He left commands.
Basically this is the Christian life as per Jesus in a metaphor.
He says follow me along these mountain ledges, and dont look down, or around, just look at me.
Every footstep I make in the ground place your feet on them as you follow me, if you slip I'll catch you, you just concern you self with following my footstep, I am the Lord of the Journey, I am the Good Shepherd of My sheep.
Matthew 7:13-14
13 “Enter through the narrow gate; for the gate is wide and the way is broad that leads to destruction, and there are many who enter through it. 14 For the gate is small and the way is narrow that leads to life, and there are few who find it.
Yes, many truths are deceptions, perhaps that is why we have no right to judge others. We only tend to see our truths and as such measure others to it accordingly -however wrongly. When we die, we will be judged. The only one who knows and can see the absolute truth is God.
It is an act of love, I suppose, to share truth with opposition if it is done without judgement and with open arms.
Christians need to lead by example, that's the best way to teach or help someone. When someone condemns people to hell, shunning them or mocking their belief simply because it doesn't match your own...how does that teach people anything good about God? It sets a very poor example. What we know to be our truth shouldn't blind us to our own faults either.
Christians need to lead by example, that's the best way to teach or help someone. When someone condemns people to hell, shunning them or mocking their belief simply because it doesn't match your own...how does that teach people anything good about God? It sets a very poor example. What we know to be our truth shouldn't blind us to our own faults either.
I agree Christians need to lead by example. Jesus said to do that, we are supposed to show Him by our example.
He told the truth, and we should also.
But not in judgement. Not in a way that condemns, but invites.
With respect, my relationship with God is deeply personal. Just as I will not go into detail with Saint, I will not go into detail with anyone else. I grew up with a multi-belief family and I currently still have a multi-belief family. Perhaps that's why it's easier to respect the beliefs of others even if I don't agree with them.
I respect others beliefs. But there still is only one truth and one way to God. And now is the time to figure that out.
Search truth. Jesus is very clear that deception in the last days would be so severe, that if time were not cut short even the elect could be decieved.
Are you one who doesn't think the gospels are credible?
I think the gospels are stories, not an actual biography. As with any story there are areas that people have to go through to pull fact from fiction and if you can do that then it can lead to credibility. Now I'm a bit different from most religious persons, I guess, in that I know the bible was written by man and as such I believe that it has invaluable information regarding the history of the world- as the writers have seen it- through their stories. The combination of biblical story and archaeology is a fascinating mix, both when we can find ancient cities written about in the bible and when we can explain through scientific method the biblical events that occurred. I don't believe that science and faith have to be mutually exclusive. What are your thoughts on it?
Well the gospels are eye witness accounts and actual biography.
Most historians confirm this.
The question for the skeptic really lies in the belief of Resurection and other miracles.
But as a Biography, that isn't disputable by any reasonable argument.
And there also has been forensic analysis done that would make the 4 gospels written collaborating the detailed stories impossible.
If you take 2 executives, brainy people of modern day, and they set out a conspiracy, (without luxury of government coverups - as in Hillary) But just executives frauding people, and caught and under investigation, a series of questions would detail inconsistencies that are indications of lies in testimony.
So just 2 people in short term with details of 1 thread of events would likely unravel.
And that's not the case with the 4 gospels, a forensic would confirm it, many have. 1 in particular has, and he started as a passionate atheist, and after months of review determined these were true eyewitness accounts.
Here is a quick clips from an atheist turned Christian through investigation.
Interesting. There is still debate on whether they are true biography but I'm reading an interesting article that separated biography into two distinct areas, Ancient biography and modern biography. Here is a link if you are interested.
I'll have to watch your link when I get home, when I'm at work it's very difficult to so please don't think I'm ignoring you when I don't comment on it right away.
I read the article. The eyewitness accounts of the Gospels do actually highlight accounts of details prior to the public person of Jesus.
There are accounts from Conception to the Wedding where Jesus turned water to wine.
And modern biographies do not always have details of childhood, so this is an empty argument from this author. And any details from childhood would be a springboard for latter biographical details, example Shania Twain - there are a few childhood details. Same with the gospels, actually more details of childhood in Gospels then this modern day biography!
Especially since much of Jesus'go into detailed prophesy fulfilment, from Conception to Birth, to running from Herod and being hidden in Egypt to moving to Nazareth.
Even the days of Messiah are calculated in pre written history, known as Prophesy.
Evidence when viewed goes beyond reasonable doubt!
Here is some evidence that supports an affirmative verdict regarding many Biblical facts, including the Resurection:
1 - The Prophetic Words, and the Biblical Directions of Prophesy, and the Plan, the ultimate bottom line action and goals of Biblical content and Prophesy.
2 - Because Biblical History is credible it is a source in support of evidence.
3 - Because Biblical Prophesy is credible in its fulfillments it is an even greater source in support of evidence, especially since prophesy is layered, with many separate prophesies having to also come true for one to come true! - Even greater than knitting cells together in evolution!
4 - Because eye witness testimony, even outside of the Bible, other documents, Greek and Roman secular offer details confirming the dynamics of Christianity and Persecutions and Martyrdom.
5 - The accounts are not contradictions, (as though any were lying) the various times and places of writings actually are a confirmation of reliability, people who lie have fuzzy memories in a week, even with practice and easy communications of our day, lies unravel because even the untrained eye can pick out lies, but that's not the case with the four gospels, they confirm accidentally each other's facts, that show true eyewitness independent works, with different perspectives of the same exact event, as you know since you "read the book" the private investigated discusses this.
6 - The degree of insistence on the testimonies of Christians, and it's growth beyond their group, location, and generation. In comparison Muslims were militant from the start, attracting like violent individuals. It would not have the same magnet effect as peaceful Christians fed to lions. One would excell in dominance, like cell selection, the other would be eliminated as passive cells are dominated.
7 - The Prophetic Words spoken of concerning the rejection by its "mother religion" and the Prophetic Words stating as Messiah would be rejected, All Nations would hear an exclusive religion, rejected by its originator and accepted world wide!
8 - 300 prophesies fulfilled in just the one person Jesus
9 - Martyrdom, the ferverency and dedication, they most all went courageously against horrible opposition, and most ultimately died for it. And not in a group drinking poison like Jim Jones, Christians often died or were imprisoned alone and often died gruesome deaths
10 - Paul a Jew of Jews, happily killing Christians saw what must have been a hologram! Jesus the Risen Lord knocked him off a horse and blinded him, then sent him to talk to his disciples.
Picture this; Saul/Paul had just led a crowd in Stephen's stoning, Saul was unmoved by it, it was something he was gladly a part of. All the Christians knew of Saul, and he scared of them, they feared for their lives.
Jesus knocks Saul off of a horse, and disarms him by making him temporarily blind. Probably so the Christians wouldn't fear him when he pulled up on his horse. Jesus made him disabled in killing them, so he couldn't harm them.
Jesus sends Saul to get disciples that just saw him murder their friend and brother, Stephen! Now he is there to be saved, healed and filled with the Spirit.
Paul goes on to lead the way like a work horse bringing the message of Jesus the Risen Christ to the Gentiles. Saul Jew of Jews - takes on a new name, born again, and brought the gospel out to the Gentiles.
So these are 10 pieces of evidence I have and consider as evidence "beyond a reasonable doubt"
The gospels have a high degree of authenticity compared to other artifacts and ancient writings.
The historical reliability of the Gospels refers to the reliability and historic character of the four New Testament gospels as historical documents. Although some claim that all four canonical gospels meet the five criteria for historical reliability,others say that little in the gospels is considered to be historically reliable.
Almost all scholars of antiquity agree that Jesus existed, but scholars differ on the historicity of specific episodes described in the Biblical accounts of Jesus, and the only two events subject to "almost universal assent" are that Jesus was baptized by John the Baptist and was crucified by the order of the Roman Prefect Pontius Pilate. Elements whose historical authenticity is disputed include the two accounts of the Nativity of Jesus, the miraculous events including the resurrection, and certain details about the crucifixion.
The text of the Gospels is much more documented in accuracy.
The Bible people were documenting more than any group of people. The Jews had specific people that's all they did.
And to confirm accuracy they would have checkers.
Making sure every letter was in the same place on the page.
But other widely accepted historical documents can be 1000 years from the originator, without a question, but the Bible, they don't want that proven. It's pretty ridiculous.
Like this famous scientist as example -
Today we do not know where Archimedes’ tomb is – it has been lost, probably for ever.
Much of his work has also been lost for ever, but what we know of it leaves us in awe of his achievements from so long ago.
This book is also the unique source for Archimedes' treatise On Floating Bodies in the original Greek.
The Archimedes Palimpsest, as this book is called, has true claims to greatness: it is the earliest surviving Archimedes manuscript by about 400 years; it is the most important source for the diagrams that Archimedes drew in the sand in Syracuse, in the third century B.C.
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It is by far the most important evidence we have for the greatness of Archimedes. And Archimedes was a very great man.
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Paleography, or the study of ancient texts, can allow us to approximately date when manuscripts were written.
(^Except Biblical, because miracles exist, they dismiss it ^)
The Archimedes manuscript was probably written in the second half of the tenth century.
It was almost certainly written at Constantinople, for the simple reason that there is no other place that we know of where ancient mathematics was systematically studied and copied.
Constantinople was the one place with a continued tradition of copying and preserving ancient texts from antiquity through the Middle Ages.
The gospels have a high degree of authenticity compared to other artifacts and ancient writings.
The historical reliability of the Gospels refers to the reliability and historic character of the four New Testament gospels as historical documents. Although some claim that all four canonical gospels meet the five criteria for historical reliability,others say that little in the gospels is considered to be historically reliable.
Almost all scholars of antiquity agree that Jesus existed, but scholars differ on the historicity of specific episodes described in the Biblical accounts of Jesus, and the only two events subject to "almost universal assent" are that Jesus was baptized by John the Baptist and was crucified by the order of the Roman Prefect Pontius Pilate. Elements whose historical authenticity is disputed include the two accounts of the Nativity of Jesus, the miraculous events including the resurrection, and certain details about the crucifixion.
I don't know what was first, the chicken or the egg.
That's for you two to decide.
I don't know minttea's theology or truth, I do know you've attacked me in a similar way and labeled me a heretic, and I know some of your points are not accurate or not Word spoken by God, like kjv points, so I'm operating with 1/2 a deck admittingly.
So it's up to you both to smash foundations of lies and establish real truth in your foundations.
some of your doctrines are heretical but I do believe you are saved though sometimes it does cross my mind that you are not with some of the goofy things you say...but I do believe you are saved. Mint Tea is not saved. You need to be more concerned about the fact that she is on her way to Hell then you are concerned about nitpicky arguments with me, and having her on your team to point out what you feel are my personality or character defects.
I believe I have been trained by some life experiences and spiritual experiences to be used by God. To possibly do my small part in reaching people, and sowing seeds so others can reach people, and even a little guidance to people God wants to use sharing methods and offering any skills put into me by God to be effective in any of these ways.
I stand on the fact that the Spirits job is primary, and mine is minute. My job is to care, love, challenge, and bind the strongman to reach the inner man with rays of truth that speak to them. And I realize that after the strongman is bound, the decission of truth rests with them and the Spirit.
That being said, the ones who eventually respond to light are His, and I can't pick that out and judge that because the work of God is a process and I may only be a sower. 1 sows, 1 waters, God causes growth, then we harvest. In some I may harvest in others I sow.
So my job is to open the door call in to them while shining a flash light, and hopefully reach the inner person behind their closed doors.
My job is to figure out how to open that door. Without opening it, we are not effective. God can use a donkey, but He usually doesn't use a donkey. So crude use of the Word can be effective but like Paul says you can be a noisy gong or be an instrument of Love. Love is telling the truth, but in a way that isnt a noisy gong. In a way they can understand.
Hell exists, but conversion is rarely achieved by fear.
I don't recall anyone following Jesus from fear of Hell.
They all followed because the Spirit bore witness to the Word, and to Jesus. The fear of God isn't cowering to Salvation. You are called by kindness. It's kindness of God that leads to repentance. It's the Hope in us we give an answer to.
Jesus challenged the lost with whatever held them from God.
The Woman at the Well
Mary Magdeline and her stoners
Zachias
Rich Ruler
All the miracles
All His callings of disciples
Nicodemus
He spoke to their greatest objection
Guilt, sin, idols. He addressed whatever kept them bound, and He set them free them with His Word. He freed them first, then He filled them with His Word.
Your training has to be tempered by the word of God or you will go off on tangents contrary to Biblical doctrine.
You have said several things in the last few posts which are so far off from Biblical teaching regarding our sinful state, I'm amazed you find no pause for your reasoning. Your loving and caring is tarnished by your misunderstanding, neglect, and misapplication of Biblical doctrine. I know you mean well, but you go off in your feelings and forget what the Bible says about people and situations. The most important thing to be loving is to be truthful and the truth is powerful and painful to those who resist it. It is good for those who accept it, even if it does hurt at first...faithful are the wounds of a friend.
I am careful to be able to back every phrase I compose with scripture. I can do this, but it's tedious.
Your list of people Jesus spoke with conversationally is a one-sided list which ignores the many times Jesus bluntly and forcefully told people they were Hell bound and He did not entertain their responses. Why are you leaving this fact out of your list? Is it Jesus you are trying to emulate, or is it some new-age version of Jesus you are inventing, one which you think is kinder and gentler than that real Jesus who was a man's man with no fear of standing up in the face of the people who were determined to kill Him and tell them they are hypocrites, thieves, liars, of their father the devil, whitewashed tombs full of dead men's bones...........
The Jesus you are trying to invent as nothing but a gentle conversationalist who never bothered people with Hell is not the same Jesus who walked into the temple with a cat of nine tails and violently overturned the tables and chased them all out of His Father's house. It is not the same Jesus who looked on a bunch of His opponents with anger when they watched to see if He would heal a man on the Sabbath so they could accuse him of breaking the law. You're trying to change Jesus into an effeminate thing like yourself.
Saintnow : You have said several things in the last few posts which are so far off from Biblical teaching regarding our sinful state, I'm amazed you find no pause for your reasoning.
Your loving and caring is tarnished by your misunderstanding, neglect, and misapplication of Biblical doctrine. I know you mean well, but you go off in your feelings and forget what the Bible says about people and situations. The most important thing to be loving is to be truthful and the truth is powerful and painful to those who resist it. It is good for those who accept it, even if it does hurt at first...faithful are the wounds of a friend.
I am careful to be able to back every phrase I compose with scripture. I can do this, but it's tedious.
This sentence of yours "The fear of God isn't cowering to Salvation." doesn't make sense.....I don't know what you are trying to say here, and you seem to be idolizing salvation by changing it to a proper noun by capitalizing the first letter in the word.
This is crazy. Salvation through Jesus IS the gospel!
Galatians 2:14 NAS
14 But when I saw that they were not straightforward about the truth of the gospel, I said to Cephas in the presence of all, "If you, being a Jew, live like the Gentiles and not like the Jews, how is it that you compel the Gentiles to live like Jews?
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Romans 1:16 NAS
16 For I am not ashamed of the gospel, for it is the power of God for salvation to everyone who believes, to the Jew first and also to the Greek.
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Revelation 12:10 NAS
10 Then I heard a loud voice in heaven, saying, "Now the salvation, and the power, and the kingdom of our God and the authority of His Christ have come, for the accuser of our brethren has been thrown down, he who accuses them before our God day and night.
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Ephesians 1:13 NAS
13 In Him, you also, after listening to the message of truth, the gospel of your salvation -having also believed, you were sealed in Him with the Holy Spirit of promise,
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Philippians 1:27 NAS
27 Only conduct yourselves in a manner worthy of the gospel of Christ, so that whether I come and see you or remain absent, I will hear of you that you are standing firm in one spirit, with one mind striving together for the faith of the gospel;
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Colossians 1:23 NAS
23 if indeed you continue in the faith firmly established and steadfast, and not moved away from the hope of the gospel that you have heard, which was proclaimed in all creation under heaven, and of which I, Paul, was made a minister.
I have never denied the Resurection or its power, nor have I denied the cross or its power.
I never condoned immorality
I have a hard message, pick up your Cross follow closely die to self and Be Born of the Spirit renewed daily, be perfect as your Father in Heaven is perfect.
Your idea of heretic isn't scriptural. Your idea of heretic is defined over minor issues of doctrine that divide the Body of Christ.
Then you also twist things about women and kjv. And other things, the days being 24 hrs, is minor also.
You had a whole argument early on with me, that Jesus couldn't be tempted, ignoring scripture in Hebrews and in Gospels of Jesus in the wilderness.
So I don't know, I think you are figuring thing out, but I'm not always sure of that.
You've asked me several times how I "felt" about you, I think I kinda feel sad for you now. Like, genuinely I hope your account was hacked or something and you aren't really this broken.
I really don't care how you "feel" about me, I care what God thinks about me and how He feels about me. I don't recall ever asking you how you feel about me because I really don't care. You have always acted like you hate me and that's your problem, not mine. Sorry.
Except I don't hate you. You may see people who disagree with you as hating you, but that's on you.
Oh I'm sorry you've asked "how do you like me now" to me multiple times. So the answer is still the same, both in what I've said before and what I said earlier. I don't like you, I don't dislike you, but I do feel kinda sad for you. Good thing you don't care.
Can you tell me why I should care about what you think about me? You are not exactly a shining example of how Christians should act. To be fair, I'm not either but at least I'll own up to it whereas you are too blinded by your pride and hubris.
You didn't answer the question or give me any reason to believe you are born again. If you die today, are you sure your sins are forgiven and you are on your way to Heaven? If yes, how are you sure? If you cannot answer with full assurance that your sins are forgiven and you are on your way to Heaven, you have a heart/spiritual issue that needs to be fixed by God.
You know what happens when Christians act like Jesus Christ? The same thing that happened to Jesus and exactly what he told his disciples to expect: they get persecuted; tortured and killed if the law of the land allows it. You always come across to me as a persecutor, always attacking me and exonerating yourself.
All these buffoons who say they appreciate the moral and social teachings of Jesus but then they hate hearing any words against sin......they, and you seem to be one of them, crucified Jesus Christ and would throw me to the lions if they could.
So answer the question: If you die today, are you one hundred percent sure that your sins are forgiven and you are on your way to Heaven? If you cannot say "yes" and explain how you are sure, something is wrong and you need to get it right.
The answer to your question is between God and myself, not between you and I.
Did you miss the part where I openly admit I am not a shining example of Christianity as well? You really need to learn the difference between attacking and debating. I've never fallen so low as to call you names that I can remember so look in the mirror when you try to accuse people of something.
Now if you want to have an actual debate on something and it doesn't fall into the category of you just want to ban anyone who disagrees, or doesn't become a name calling - mud throwing playground or get personal, and it's interesting....I'm usually willing to. I think you have an interesting mind and I enjoy debates that aren't steeped in nonsense.
If you cannot say with certainty that your sins are forgiven and you are on your way to Heaven, something is wrong and the first thing seems to be that you are NOT a child of God and NOT qualified to comment on what a Christian is.
Do you believe Jesus is God who created all things and who died for your sins?
Do you believe He is risen from the dead bodily?
Do you believe that as a sinner you deserve to die and burn in Hell?
If you answer yes to all three of these questions, you MAY be saved. IF you ARE saved or not, I'm still trying to find out. I don't think you are saved or you would be happy to say that you are and you would want everybody else to be saved.
Pervert..........why don't you go sit on Dawkins' lap, I"m sure he will be happy to give you a "mild molestation" like that which he was subjected to as a child.
I guess I was right, you are not a Christian, not a child of God, not born of His Spirit and washed in the blood of the Lamb.....and you see no meaning in me saying so because you are lost.
Actually it's not meaningful because it's your broken record routine. There is no value in simply copy/pasting something that has little sway or standing in a debate. I'm sure you'll get over being wrong, you're a pro at it by now.
Actually you have always sounded like a broken record to me.....whining in despite of the gospel by which people can be saved from Hell. You are one of those people who can be saved, but will you be saved? I doubt it by the way you act.
I already know you cannot answer the question, asking yourself "If Hell is real, why am I not burning in it now?".
I know your response will be unrelated nonsense dodging the challenge of answering the question for yourself.
I know you'll just try to smear my character and insult me when all I'm doing is telling the truth, pointing out the fact that you give no sign of being anything other than the sinner you were born as and not a child of God, not a Christian, and on your way to Hell needing to be saved but acting like you are too good to be saved.
I've already answered your question. My relationship with God is between Him and myself, not between you and I. It is not and will never be your place to judge or condemn me in His name.
I don't have to or need to smear your character, it speaks for itself when you write such hateful remarks on a person. I don't hate you, as you seem so keen to say, as again I've said before, I feel nothing for you. You are words on a page and whether or not I agree or disagree with you the fact is, we neither of us will see eye to eye on many things. But disagreeing with someone doesn't equate to bad feelings of any kind.
I've also already said that I think you could be an interesting debater if you could lose the name calling and the hateful rhetoric you tend to fall back on. You have the potential to be genuinely interesting with your thoughts and ideas and I would love to pick your brain on your opinions, however (while I'm no master debater myself) when you go off on your personal attacks, I tend to lose interest.
Well, this seems more evidence to me that you have no real relationship with God as the only way to see the kingdom of Heaven is to be born again, and I have yet to meet anybody who has encountered the risen Savior in reality and received Him by faith who was reluctant to say they know Him. I think what's between you and God is your sin which is keeping you separated from Him while you talk like you have him in your back pocket to use at your convenience.
You're always trying to put me down, the same as you are now by throwing "I"m apathetic toward you" at me like you think you are so stinking good.
I am not judging you or condemning you, that is not my place. I'm simply stating facts and going by your own words in light of what the Bible says. You are trying to hide from the light with your "it's between me and God" cop-out, so I can only conclude you have not received Jesus as your Savior and He does not live in you as you never speak His word, just your own self-defensive feelings. Why don't you just admit that you are not sure your sins are forgiven and you are going to heaven, and if you are sure you are forgiven and going to heaven why in the world would you not want to spell out how you know such a wonderful thing so others can see how they can know the same for themselves? That's all I"m trying to do here, trying to get people to see that they can have full assurance today of being saved from Hell....and you just sit there and whine "don't judge me, man".
You honestly sound like you are whining that you aren't invited to a party that is between two people, when I say that my relationship with God is between Him and myself. I don't know if you mean to come across that way but it really does sound like it. It's not putting you down when I say that you mean nothing to me to justify hatred or any strong emotion, in truth I should mean nothing to you as well, other than words on a paper (screen). Now if I'm not reading enough into this and I mean MORE to you than that, then my apologies. I didn't realize you think of me so much. ;D
I guess I was right, you are not a Christian, not a child of God, not born of His Spirit and washed in the blood of the Lamb.....and you see no meaning in me saying so because you are lost.
The problem is, he really can't. He has issue that I've pointed out his hypocrisy countless times and that I've stated that his representation of how Christians should act leaves many with a bad taste in their mouths towards religion and the religious.
As he is attacking me he whines that I'm "attacking him" while he subsequently makes personal jabs and resorts to name calling. I've asked him multiple times to show me evidence of what he accuses me of so I can make clarification or defend and each time he resorts to his typical copy/paste tactic that has zero to do with the topic at hand. Multiple people on here have asked him to provide evidence or invited him to an actual debate and everyone is either banned or mocked.
When a person disagrees with him he automatically thinks they are the enemy or can't be saved or are going to burn, that's his vetting process.
Can you show the reasons for the people of faith you have declared as false people of faith.
Maybe you can detail that on each of us, so we can understand your vetting process.
1 Corinthians 4
5 Therefore do not go on passing judgment before the time, but wait until the Lord comes who will both bring to light the things hidden in the darkness and disclose the motives of men’s hearts; and then each man’s praise will come to him from God.
6 Now these things, brethren, I have figuratively applied to myself and Apollos for your sakes, so that in us you may learn not to exceed what is written, so that no one of you will become arrogant in behalf of one against the other. 7 For who regards you as superior? What do you have that you did not receive? And if you did receive it, why do you boast as if you had not received it?
8 You are already filled, you have already become rich, you have become kings without us; and indeed, I wish that you had become kings so that we also might reign with you. 9 For, I think, God has exhibited us apostles last of all, as men condemned to death; because we have become a spectacle to the world, both to angels and to men. 10 We are fools for Christ’s sake, but you are prudent in Christ; we are weak, but you are strong; you are distinguished, but we are without honor. 11 To this present hour we are both hungry and thirsty, and are poorly clothed, and are roughly treated, and are homeless; 12 and we toil, working with our own hands; when we are reviled, we bless; when we are persecuted, we endure; 13 when we are slandered, we try to conciliate; we have become as the scum of the world, the dregs of all things, even until now.
14 I do not write these things to shame you, but to admonish you as my beloved children. 15 For if you were to have countless tutors in Christ, yet you would not have many fathers, for in Christ Jesus I became your father through the gospel. 16 Therefore I exhort you, be imitators of me. 17 For this reason I have sent to you Timothy, who is my beloved and faithful child in the Lord, and he will remind you of my ways which are in Christ, just as I teach everywhere in every church. 18 Now some have become arrogant, as though I were not coming to you. 19 But I will come to you soon, if the Lord wills, and I shall find out, not the words of those who are arrogant but their power. 20 For the kingdom of God does not consist in words but in power. 21 What do you desire? Shall I come to you with a rod, or with love and a spirit of gentleness?
24 Jesus presented another parable to them, saying, “The kingdom of heaven may be compared to a man who sowed good seed in his field. 25 But while his men were sleeping, his enemy came and sowed tares among the wheat, and went away. 26 But when the wheat sprouted and bore grain, then the tares became evident also. 27 The slaves of the landowner came and said to him, ‘Sir, did you not sow good seed in your field? How then does it have tares?’ 28 And he said to them, ‘An enemy has done this!’ The slaves said to him, ‘Do you want us, then, to go and gather them up?’ 29 But he said, ‘No; for while you are gathering up the tares, you may uproot the wheat with them. 30 Allow both to grow together until the harvest; and in the time of the harvest I will say to the reapers, “First gather up the tares and bind them in bundles to burn them up; but gather the wheat into my barn.”’”
Whatever they are, they are not aliens, they are liars and lies originate in Hell.
8 days ago
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SatintLater(264) Disputed Banned 1 point
so...you'd really think that God only made one sentient creature. what about Angels? are they from the physical heaven or a metaphysical heaven? and why does it follow that there are ONLY humans on ONLY one planet. God made the heavens. the bible doesn't mention those places beyond. so where does it say that humans were the only ones kicked from eden?
8 days ago
Funniest thing is it wasn't even Saint's debate and I legit have no clue why I was bannified. Saint never replied. he got banned too?!?
yet again, I ask you to explain the relevance of this statement. because it seems highly irrelevant. I'm really one to talk. but I was just trolling before. this here seems to be very real that you think this somehow discredits my point. it doesn't. what evidence suggests that humans are alone in the universe?
MY POST: I don't know what response you expect from this. He makes these videos for people who already hold those beliefs, he isn't arguing with atheists. Alright, I'll just grab the most outrageous quote from there.
"Atheists should be banned from holding public office."
He believes that atheist have no morals, other than they're own person "evil" agenda and can't be trusted to be any kind of leader. Well sir, this is direct violation of the constitution.
SAINTNOW: I'm not even reading your garbage before I ban you, foul mouth punk. You think you are so stinking cool, I think I'll give you the boot and try not to let the door hit ya where the good Lord split ya.
I reported him for his abusive response, though I doubt anything will come of it. His response included slander, sexual harassment, and terroristic threats to my cheeks. He says that he's "not even reading" my post, but you know he did. The reason he said he didn't read it is because he knew I was right and there was no way he could come back with an appropriate counter point. Ironic that he shows a video of man saying that "atheists have no morals therefor shouldn't be allowed to have any position of leadership." yet he can't even fairly run a web debate.
Ohhhh a new one I got banned on. Honestly I laughed pretty hard that it was his immediate response. He wrote:
"evolution is the religion of death, you love death when you trust in evolution and death is all you will get out of it, forever dying in the lake of fire, frying like an eternal sausage.........stuck in the death you are in now, with no hope of ending it through evolution."
"Even if you can loosely argue that Evolution is a religion....it isn't but putting that aside, if it's anything it supports life finding a way to survive in an ever changing environment. It's beating the odds set against you by adapting, growing and learning different techniques through time, trial and error. To me that's beautiful, the persistence of life.... not something morbid like a religion of death."
No attacks, no name calling but sure enough he bans me then goes on a 4 post rant knowing I can't respond. Too funny! Pretty soon he's going to be a very lonely debater when he bans everyone for daring to disagree.
Saintnow- Sorry, your "surgery" analogy is not Biblical. You don't need surgery, death is required for new life to arise.
John 12:24
“Verily, verily, I say unto you, Except a corn of wheat fall into the ground and die, it abideth alone: but if it die, it bringeth forth much fruit.”
Repentance which results in salvation through faith in the blood of Christ puts a sinner in a place recognizing the condemnation of death he is in for sin. When Christ comes in to a person who believes on Him and receives Him by faith, He gives that person a new heart. It's not a "surgery".
I don't want a doctrinal debate with you here. If you are going to comment in my debates, keep your saying in line with scripture. This: "The death and Resurrection is surgery, sterilizing, and cutting away sin and fallen flesh, and darkness away from our hearts and spirits." is non-scriptural gobbeldy gook from your own feelings trying to express your own feelings in faith but twisting Bible doctrine out of your pride of thinking you have special insight, typical of Calvinists and those who believe in any form or theistic evolution.
8mins ago
Actually it is. Flesh is cut away through the cross. What is the difference between a surgical analogy and one of a potter and clay. Isnt the Spirit doing a work of renewal. Isnt that work because of His death on the cross? Isnt that the gate?
Isnt the cross a circumscision of heart and of removing flesh from spirit?
Colossians 2:9
9 For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.
10 And ye are complete in him, which is the head of all principality and power:
11 In whom also ye are circumcised with the circumcision made without hands, in putting off the body of the sins of the flesh by the circumcision of Christ:
12 Buried with him in baptism, wherein also ye are risen with him through the faith of the operation of God, who hath raised him from the dead.
13 And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses;
14 Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;
15 And having spoiled principalities and powers, he made a shew of them openly, triumphing over them in it.
Colossians 1
13 For He rescued us from the domain of darkness, and transferred us to the kingdom of His beloved Son,
14 in whom we have redemption, the forgiveness of sins.
15 He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of all creation.
16 For by Him all things were created, both in the heavens and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities—all things have been created through Him and for Him.
17 He is before all things, and in Him all things hold together.
18 He is also head of the body, the church; and He is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead, so that He Himself will come to have first place in everything.
19 For it was the Father’s good pleasure for all the fullness to dwell in Him,
20 and through Him to reconcile all things to Himself, having made peace through the blood of His cross; through Him, I say, whether things on earth or things in heaven.
21 And although you were formerly alienated and hostile in mind, engaged in evil deeds,
22 yet He has now reconciled you in His fleshly body through death, in order to present you before Him holy and blameless and beyond reproach—
Saintnow- Sorry, your "surgery" analogy is not Biblical. You don't need surgery, death is required for new life to arise.
John 12:24
“Verily, verily, I say unto you, Except a corn of wheat fall into the ground and die, it abideth alone: but if it die, it bringeth forth much fruit.”
Repentance which results in salvation through faith in the blood of Christ puts a sinner in a place recognizing the condemnation of death he is in for sin. When Christ comes in to a person who believes on Him and receives Him by faith, He gives that person a new heart. It's not a "surgery".
I don't want a doctrinal debate with you here. If you are going to comment in my debates, keep your saying in line with scripture. This: "The death and Resurrection is surgery, sterilizing, and cutting away sin and fallen flesh, and darkness away from our hearts and spirits." is non-scriptural gobbeldy gook from your own feelings trying to express your own feelings in faith but twisting Bible doctrine out of your pride of thinking you have special insight, typical of Calvinists and those who believe in any form or theistic evolution.
8mins ago
Actually it is. Flesh is cut away through the cross. What is the difference between a surgical analogy and one of a potter and clay. Isnt the Spirit doing a work of renewal. Isnt that work because of His death on the cross? Isnt that the gate?
Isnt the cross a circumscision of heart and of removing flesh from spirit?
Colossians 2:9
9 For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.
10 And ye are complete in him, which is the head of all principality and power:
11 In whom also ye are circumcised with the circumcision made without hands, in putting off the body of the sins of the flesh by the circumcision of Christ:
12 Buried with him in baptism, wherein also ye are risen with him through the faith of the operation of God, who hath raised him from the dead.
13 And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses;
14 Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;
15 And having spoiled principalities and powers, he made a shew of them openly, triumphing over them in it.
Colossians 1
13 For He rescued us from the domain of darkness, and transferred us to the kingdom of His beloved Son,
14 in whom we have redemption, the forgiveness of sins.
15 He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of all creation.
16 For by Him all things were created, both in the heavens and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities—all things have been created through Him and for Him.
17 He is before all things, and in Him all things hold together.
18 He is also head of the body, the church; and He is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead, so that He Himself will come to have first place in everything.
19 For it was the Father’s good pleasure for all the fullness to dwell in Him,
20 and through Him to reconcile all things to Himself, having made peace through the blood of His cross; through Him, I say, whether things on earth or things in heaven.
21 And although you were formerly alienated and hostile in mind, engaged in evil deeds,
22 yet He has now reconciled you in His fleshly body through death, in order to present you before Him holy and blameless and beyond reproach—
It seems to me you are combative to other believers. Are you lofty or judgemental?