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Should I go all the way, vegan?
I am an animal rights supporter, and plan on giving up meat and dairy, for spiritual and moral reasons, but I am wondering if i should just say "fuck it" and be a vegan. Plan answer my question, and give reasons, and evidence. I believe animals have the right to their bodies.
Sure. If you're prepared to make the commitment then why not? I agree with you about an animal's right to life, but unfortunately I'm a bit of a hypocrite about it because I do eat meat. I grew up eating it and although I don't like the idea of animals suffering, I'm not passionate enough about it to take action. But if you are then more power to you.
I judge not lest I be judged. I am still a meat eater, but everytime I eat meat, I have a broken heart, and can no longer participate. I believe animals are spirits, that occupy bodies, and have the right, to their bodies, and to live. i have also been abused, so why should I abuse?
I believe animals are spirits, that occupy bodies, and have the right, to their bodies
According to most Christians animals seem to be objects that aren't even sentient. Most Christians would take offence at you thinking animals have souls.
If you want animals to be treated well, then the people producing meat won't listen to you, because you're not their costumer. Why should they listen to somebody not buying the product anyways?
If costumers demand better products, STOP buying stuff the massproduced stuff in tiny cages and start buying the organic local meat, then you've made an actual difference.
If you want animals to be treated well, then the people producing meat won't listen to you, because you're not their costumer. Why should they listen to somebody not buying the product anyways?
In my honest opinion factory farms should be forced by the state to gradually and systematically be phased out and replaced with more sustainable and humane practices.
That would be a good idea, but there are some things that make such a legislation difficult.
First of all when one state, let's say as an example the UK, when they make a legislation demanding certain standards of production, one of two things happen.
1. The international producers that import goods to the UK meet the standards, by changing their ways of production.
2. The international producers simply stop selling their production to the UK.
Most likely, when it comes to a small country standing alone, the latter will happen. So either a country has to gain some allies, like maybe the EU, to put a greater force on international producers of meat - OR the UK just has to suffer economically. Which is usually not a popular decision to make as a politician.
The easiest way would be to change the market from the buttom up - because the producers will change their ways of production if their product doesn't sell. That's why I think veganism and vegetarianism is a terrible idea. Instead of boycutting meat, why not boycut the producers that make the industry such a horrible place for animals?
If more people bought local and more organic products, more producers would change their methods to meet that demand.
Yeah, you bring a sound strategy to the table. Most vegans would say that you reduce the demand for unethical products more effectively by just eliminating all animal products but what they fail to grasp is number 1: they are radical and think all animal products are inherently unethical, which most people do not agree with and probably never will and number 2: Assuming number 1 is true, there will always be a market for animal products and thus a more realistic approach would be to make it as ethical and healthy as possible by educating the consumer. The average consumer would be much more receptive to a message of " let's promote humane practices in the animal agriculture industry" rather than a message of "all animal agriculture is inherently evil and you must eliminate all animal products from society".
The problem is that the more humane and higher quality meat is typically more expensive and much less abundant. That is where the state comes in.
The state subsidizes the factory farms. It is literally artificially propping up the very thing that must be destroyed. So we need a combined approach to be really effective on this, there must be a shift in consumer demand as well as a drastic change in what the government is doing. They need to start systematically promoting more and more of the "good stuff", funding local farms, and creating a program that promotes innovation in the industry so that we can keep production up without the factory farms. This also should be an international effort for the reason you already stated and is one more reason not leaving the EU would be far less stupid than the current government in the UK seems to be.
I do not believe, in killing animals, or forcing them, to lactate, and killing, their babies. That is essentially a dick move, and what really is, happening.
Yes. It happens all around us in nature. Humans aren't the only one's feeding on animals, you know? :)
Shut your fucking mouth you animal murdering whore. Animals eat other animals to survive, humans don't even NEED to eat meat to survive or be healthy. Not being a vegan means you support the unnecessary murdering of sentient beings. Everything you say is an excuse to hurt sentient life. Shut your greasy ass pork guzzling trap-hole you filthy cunt whore bitch. Do you really think a lion is the same as a human? We are literally herbivores plus we have modern systems of food production and moral agency as supposedly more intelligent beings. There is no excuse for not being vegan other than being a stupid, lard guzzling piece of shit.
Animals eat other animals to survive, humans don't even NEED to eat meat to survive or be healthy.
I disagree, I absolutely think humans need animal meat to be healthy. There are even some people with diseases like Glycogen Storage Disease, diabetes, IBS and many more that definitely suffer from an all-carbohydrate diet only.
Furthermore there is not enough land on earth to grow enough food for the 7.2 billion people that live here. There are 25,000 people that die of starvation a day. A DAY. And over 3 million children die of starvation a year. I can't imagine what those numbers would be, if such a major food source as animal meat is, would be taken away.
I know you love your cat and all that, that's great. Personally I value the health and lives of human beings.
I disagree, I absolutely think humans need animal meat to be healthy.
You are objectively wrong. It is established science that humans can be healthy on a vegan diet thus you are either vegan or you support the unnecessary murder of sentient beings. The only people who have an excuse are those who need it to survive which only applies to a rare few who have certain disorders such as the inability to process certain plant forms of vitamins OR those who are literally living in the wilderness or some third world country and have nothing else to eat. Those are the ONLY excuses, so if those don't apply to you, you are a literal murderer.
Glycogen Storage Disease, diabetes, IBS
All of those are actually caused by animal products. Do some research, and not from fringe keto blogs that tell you what you want to hear.
all-carbohydrate diet
There is no such thing, unless of course you get your information from fringe keto blogs and are implying that we should be in ketosis.
Furthermore there is not enough land on earth to grow enough food for the 7.2 billion people that live here.
We are currently using up land to grow crops to feed to the 9 billion cows that we eat, you insanely stupid murdering fuckbag. There are more cows than there are people because of animal agriculture, and that's only one species that we happen to exploit and selectively breed for exploitation. If we converted all that farmland to grow crops for HUMANS we would have more than what we have now.
I know you love your cat and all that, that's great. Personally I value the health and lives of human beings.
Humans are animals. You just want to be self important and pretend that humans matter more because you are one of them. In objective reality, the value you place on humans is meaningless. Nature does not share your values and there is no logically consistent way to justify them that can be reconciled with objective reality. It is a scientific fact that humans are not more important just because they are human.
You are objectively wrong. It is established science that humans can be healthy on a vegan diet
Actually, no - Im not objectively wrong. You are assuming that our definitions of "healthy" are the same. The word "healthy" is a subjective term, and therefore there are a lot of ways to be healthy. Furthermore I'd like to see your sources on that statement.
The only people who have an excuse are those who need it to survive which only applies to a rare few
Those are not that rare and few. Diabetes is one of the most common diagnosis in the world. Plus - When you say that it is okay for some people to consume meat for health reasons, then you are keeping the meat industry alive. Which brings me back to my original argument: If you want to improve the industry, they won't listen to you if you are a vegetarian - why would they? You are not their costumer. Instead demand better product, buy local and organic. That's how you change the world.
All of those are actually caused by animal products.
LOL?? Glycogen storage disease is a genetic disease - do some research yourself.
We are currently using up land to grow crops to feed to the 9 billion cows that we eat, you insanely stupid murdering fuckbag.
Exactly? So if we all turned vegetarian, all the herbivore species would die because there is not enough food for them.
You just want to be self important and pretend that humans matter more because you are one of them.
That is very true. I don't deny this. I do consider humans to be a superior species, and I will treat it as such.
Actually, no - Im not objectively wrong. You are assuming that our definitions of "healthy" are the same. The word "healthy" is a subjective term, and therefore there are a lot of ways to be healthy. Furthermore I'd like to see your sources on that statement.
I would probably side with you on this because humans are biologically designed to be omnivores. They can survive either on meat alone or vegetables alone, but that does not necessarily mean they are going to be as healthy as if they consumed both.
Exactly. Furthermore as a species we are very diverse. The eastern-asian diet is very high in carbohydrates, and genetics say that their bodies can process all those carbohydrates better than people in other places. For instance the people of Greenland, whose main source for food is meat, often very fat and even fermented meat. Their digestive systems are also different, because we don't just evolve as a species - we also evolve according to the conditions we live under. Therefore a healthy diet in east-asia is very different from a healthy diet in Greenland.
Also by mentioning Greenland that poses another difficulty in the world turning vegetarian - where would they grow their food? Should they import it all? Financially speaking that's not sustainable - probably not sustainable either considering all the oil it would take to feed 55,000 people every day with imported goods. Greenland is a large country, you can't travel by car - what happens when the imported goods arrive in Nuuk? Do they helicopter everything to the rest of the people?
You just know that people like that guy .. Vegpolice are born and raised in a big city and have NO sense of reality outside that bigcity bubble.
In that case cancer and heart disease are healthy, so I recommend a bacon, egg and red meat diet. You see how that works? If you think what is healthy and what is not is subjective, then take a cyanide pill, because in my opinion it's healthy.
Heart disease is the leading cause of death. Is that because of carbs too?
When you say that it is okay for some people to consume meat for health reasons, then you are keeping the meat industry alive.
Everything you say is stupid. It would still be drastically reducing it and eventually we could find a way using science to make the right vitamins and such without exploitation.
they won't listen to you if you are a vegetarian - why would they? You are not their costumer.
Exactly you retarded fuck, I want to take away their consumer base all together and thus stop them from murdering animals, not encourage them to murder animals more nicely.
LOL?? Glycogen storage disease is a genetic disease
It sure would appear that way. It's actually caused by RNA from animal protein.
Exactly? So if we all turned vegetarian, all the herbivore species would die because there is not enough food for them.
You are stupid. Realistically, we would gradually stop breeding them as the meat industry was gradually reduced by more and more people gradually becoming less retarded and evil through education. The world will not go vegan all at once. But soon we shall rule the world, in maybe 100-200 years, and it will be illegal to unnecessarily murder sentient beings. A one world vegan government is inevitable because veganism is objectively correct and so is the new world order (which is actually a good thing, not an evil conspiracy).
I do consider humans to be a superior species
Tell me why you think that, I literally will bet you 7000 dollars I can prove it is logically inconsistent.
You know what, following your statement with a youtube link just isn't that convincing. Sorry.
Heart disease is the leading cause of death. Is that because of carbs too?
In many cases, yes. A diet too rich in carbs causes obesity, obesity causes all kinds of health issues, including heart disease.
Exactly you retarded fuck, I want to take away their consumer base all together and thus stop them from murdering animals,
That's not what you said before? You said some should be able to eat it, that have deficiencies of some sort. Now you're contradicting yourself.
Tell me why you think that, I literally will bet you 7000 dollars I can prove it is logically inconsistent.
Because we dominate this planet.
It sure would appear that way. It's actually caused by RNA from animal protein.
Alright, this statement proved to me that you aren't too smart. And you can't really talk to dumb people, because they neither listen or understand. So goodbye pretty, have a nice day <3 Keep your 7000 dollars and adopt yourself a baby panda, honey.
You actually lost a debate to my half-assed alt account. I am not really a vegan but I technically won this even though I was knowingly wrong about certain things. You see, I am actually Burritolunch lol.
Lol, what a lame and pathetic excuse for losing a debate
You technically lost by completely ignoring the evidence in the video as well as repeatedly misinterpreting the arguments I made. For example you claimed I contradicted myself when the obvious implication was that the human race will not go vegan all at once and even though my ultimate goal is complete veganism there are reasons (which can eventually be overcome) why someone might need to eat meat. Even though I was intentionally arguing for the incorrect position I won from a pure competitive debating standpoint because you completely ignored evidence which is just the same as admitting you can't debunk it in a formal debate, plus you failed to even understand what you were arguing against and thus made non-arguments repeatedly. As for the RNA thing I completely pulled it out of my ass.
Shut your fucking mouth you animal murdering whore. Animals eat other animals to survive, humans don't even NEED to eat meat to survive or be healthy.
You were saying the exact opposite when you were posting on your Syrnge account you sophist tool monkey. You change your mind like the wind changes direction.
You were saying the exact opposite when you were posting on your Syrnge
I do not own a Syrnge, nor do I even know what that is. I can only logically conclude that you are severely delusional and need immediate psychiatric intervention.
That's not propaganda or fake news. That is absolute truth. Just like women's breasts hurt when they haven't breastfed in a while, a cow is in pain as well when it's full of milk. It's basically a breastpump :)
Like i said, save your propaganda. That story, is not true. Cows, do not lactate, when they do not want to. End of story, get it? All you ever do, is act defiantly, to troll.
You have the right, to your opinion, but you don't have the right, to your own facts. Milk was designed for mother animals, to give their babies short term, and that's it. I will literally never change my mind, and I will never support the meat or dairy industries.
