CreateDebate is a social debate community built around ideas, discussion and democracy.
If this is your first time checking out a debate, here are some quick tips to help get you started:
Arguments with the highest score are displayed first.
Argument replies (both in favor and in opposition) are displayed below the original argument.
To follow along, you may find it helpful to show and hide the replies displayed below each argument.
To vote for an argument, use these icons:
You have the power to cast exactly one vote (either up or down) for each argument.
Once you vote, the icon will become grayed out and the argument's score will change.
Yes, you can change your vote.
Debate scores, side scores and tag scores are automatically calculated by an algorithm that primarily takes argument scores into account.
All scores are updated in real-time.
To learn more about the CreateDebate scoring system, check out the FAQ.
When you are ready to voice your opinion, use the Add Argument button to create an argument.
If you would like to address an existing argument, use the Support and Dispute link within that argument to create a new reply.
You can share this debate in three different ways:
#1
#2
#3
Paste this URL into an email or IM:
Click here to send this debate via your default email application.
Click here to login and CreateDebate will send an email for you.
Should Jehovah's Witnesses be considered Christians?
I myself am a non-denominational Christian. My parents are Catholic and when a Jehovah's Witness comes walking down my driveway, my mom comes out and she tells them, "We're Catholic!" and they run away. I have asked many times why we are so hostile towards them, and she always says that they are a cult. She has never given an explanation for it, so after recent research i have done on the topic, I have come to the conclusion that they are indeed not a part of Christian faith. They have fundamental differences with Christianity such as Jesus not dying on the cross and how heaven will only accept 144,000 people. it is also very confusing because they make numerous dates about the end of the world despite how in the bible it says"no one shall know the date or time of the end". they also have many other confusing small beliefs.
GO NUTS! i will have a very open mind in this debate.
Every sect of Christianity has fundamental differences. Protestants reject the notion of Papal infallibity, Catholics think the Pope's THE man. Any sect that says they adhere to Christ's teachings is a Christian religion. You cannot say their interpretation is unchristian, because it's THEIR interpretation.
The Westboro Baptist church IS Christian! And they preach a whole heck of a lot worse than Jehovah's do.
An example of Christians, who don't really seem like Christians.
I'm not saying JWs and Christians are the same in the sense that all Christians are JWs. I'm just saying JW are a subset of the more general label of "Christian".
e.g. All elephants are animals but not all animals are elephants.
You misunderstand and misstate my argument. It's simple set theory. Allow me to rephrase:
If all B are A and all C are B, then all C are A.
In other words, if everyone who believes Jesus is the son of God (B) is a Christian (A), and everyone who's a Jehovah's Witnesses (C) believes Jesus is the son of God (B), then all Jehovah's Witnesses (C) are Christians (A).
QED.
We can elaborate over the B->A relationship (e.g. they believe Jesus is the son of God and try to act according to how they believe Jesus thinks they should live their lives...blah blah blah), but I truncated it for clarity.
Their preaching work identifies them as Christian. In the Bible one can clearly see that Christians are those who obey Jesus commands and not those who simply call themselves Christians. See Matt chapter 25 and Matt 28; 19,20
yes, and they disobey God by contantly predicting end dates for the world. that was a command from God. they also have alittle bit of being "false prophets" in them. they say only 144,000 will go to heaven when in john 3:16 it says "Whosoever believes in me shal not perish but have eternal life"
JWs do not predict the end the world, it is GOD himself, from his word, the BIBLE. “the last days” and “the time of the end” have been in use for a long time. (2 Timothy 3:1; Daniel 12:4). And that has a reason. And one another thing, the 'end' does not refer to a total destruction of the world. In fact, he “formed it (earth) . . . to be inhabited.” (Isaiah 45:18) But not by a wicked, dying race of humans. God set a time for the restoration of his rulership by means of the Kingdom spoken of at Daniel 2:44. That’s why. And John 3:16 is so true. Every person who has potential could have eternal life. But there's two ways/categories in having eternal life, one is in paradise on earth, and the second is in heaven (that's 144, ooo, Revelation 7 & 14). Why not all?? That’s because God will not destroy earth, so who else will live in here if we go all in heaven???
Lets exile the Mormons too, then. They believe in Christ right? Christians. It's like refusing to admit that a certain kind of art isn't art. You can deny it, but it's still art.
Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. I'll agree with you, modern art looks like shit and garbage, but I bet the art societies of the world would harshly disagree with you on the subject of their validity as pieces of art.
I agree with the general spirit of your argument. I believe modern art IS art. Just not very good art.
Similarly, all Christian sects are Christians, but some may be "better" than others in the sense that some are more faithful to Christian teachings then others. Of course, since these teachings are typically written in a vague and ambiguous form, they're often open to interpretation.
Really, i don't care at all. i hear people complain about how they can't get blood transfusions or how the children can't celebrate anything... but i don't care. why should i interfere with their lives?
but, that's the world we live in. people always want to step in to others lives. for better or for worse.
Yes they are because Christianity is comprised of those that believe that Jesus Christ is Lord and Savior and that he died and rose again and then ascended into Heaven.
Speaking for a religious stand point, In the early days, those that professed Jesus as Lord started out as a cult in Judaism. To call them a cult is wrong; more like a sect of Christianity.
Just because they are different from other Christian religions doesn't mean that they are completely different and shouldn't be considered Christians. Christianity means follower of Jesus and, to my understanding, that is what Jehovah's Witnesses do; they follow Jesus.
He isn't "lesser" than God. God might have more power than him, but that doesn't mean he is "worse". And btw, i thought u were arguing that JW's say that Jesus is God?
A Christian follows the teachings of Christ as expressed throughout the Bible.
A Christian bases their beliefs about God and Jesus Christ on the BIble, and strives to live up to the examples and principles set by the prophets of old and the first century apostles of Christ.
When a group does that, then they are Christians.
Other organized religions admittedly follow formed church doctrine not based on the Bible. This is why hardly anybody (at least when I was younger they did not), brings a Bible to church.
In Protestant church services, few scriptures are cited in the short ten or fifteen-minute "sermons," and the time in worship services is taken up with announcements, music, repetitious prayers and sayings, and anything but in depth Bible teaching.
Some churches even discourage Bible reading, saying that it will 'confuse' people. Of course it does, BECAUSE most 'church doctrine' DOES NOT FIT THE BIBLE'S TEACHING, hence, the question should be, are THESE ones really "Christians"?
as a resultof this debate i have come to the realization that they are christians. anybody who believes that jesus died for our sins and that he is our one and only savior is christian. they have some differences which other people might and do believe in, but they are still christians. they get some parts of the bible wrong and .... I lITERALLY JUST HAD THIS EPIPHANY! what if they are false prophets? they will surely go to hell if they are! the Bible says that... they have the main thing down, but if they are leading people away from the truth, then they are false prophets! I recant my statement above my epiphany. this just got a whole lot more confusing...
p.s. how weird to have an epiphany while writing in a debate! awesome. maybe it was God giving me a little reminder from the Bible.
No, I agree completely with your statement. The Devil did believe in Jesus and so did his demons. Certainly you have read the Bible, and thank you for reminding me about that. I believe that for people on the earth have a different rules for that. unless they are a bunch of demons, which i am not counting out and is seems plausible ( by a very long stretch and leap of the mind). i will definetly ponder this some more. too bad we are enemies. you have such good points, but i try not to override my past actions as they are a reminder of who i am and how i change.
Ok... That's semantic nitpicking, but fair point. Just append to his argument "and they attempt to live by the teachings of Jesus" that there you go. JWs certainly claim to be doing this, and are therefore Christians.
Semantics (that time) is irrelevant in regards to my post.
Just because JWs can con you into thinking that they are Christians is no argument that I too should be conned by them.
Christianity, as defined by the scriptures, doesn't assert that an attempt to follow the words of Christ is Christian. Either they are or they are not Christian. There is no authorization for pseudo-Christianity.
JWs can claim whatsoever they want to claim.
They claim they are the witnesses of God; funny, the bible declares otherwise.
Note: JWs only persuade they who are ignorant of the words of the Bible.
DJ...They do not believe that Jesus died on the cross. What do they believe...that he got run over by my lil yellow cab? Sorry, that was quite flippant but I truly do not understand how they can be considered Christians in light of that. Christianity was born in all its glory when he died that day.
Would you care to engage in an adult type discussion about Christianity? I'll be polite!
First question: As an adult, have you questioned the validity of what is commonly referred to as Christianity in comparison of the words of the scriptures? I'm not referring to the denominations and their root causes. I'm asking about your judgment of Christendom.
who is down vote boy? have we finally caught the "notorious downvoter?" do we need to chew him out? lemme at him, lemme at him!!! cmon put 'em up put'em up!
as i have stated in the prelude to this debate, i disagree with the jehovah's witnesses. i also have many questions about them, such as this one: why do you have over 2 million members if only 144,000 will go to heaven? i think they have many wrong things in their doctrine.
I think the most salient question is why do they have over 200 million members? I know a couple who are Witnesses and are adamant about their faith. They go on and on about it as if they were converting you right then and there. They say that this is the only religion they understand and that suits them to a T. Who am I to judge them? I cannot and do not. Another motto..."Whatever it is you believe in believe it to the bottom of your heart and soul...something good must come of this kind of belief."
I'm like you DJ. I simply don't get it (JW) at all. I have questions about my own religion, I'm a Lutheran, that I discuss with my good friend and Pastor, Roger. He doesn't have all the answers either. I think no one does.
i think i have. if you really want to know more about your questions, why don't you talk to one of them??and yes i am a JW and if you want, i am willing to answer all your questions base on the bible and as long as i can.....
I believe that Jesus died for our sins...but not on a cross figure...cuz when we study its history very well, the "cross", in Greek word means 'stau-ros'. Stauros signified a stake, an upright pole, or piece of paling, on which anything might be hang ..even amongst the romans the crux(from which cross was derived) appears to have been originally an upright hole. So it's not a cross as you know. And even if Jesus was really hanged on a "cross", why would some worship that image that Jesus was hanged??for example, do you wanna see your 'bestfriend' hanged and then praise him??it's absurd, right?!and also about 144,000. Revelation 7:4 says: "I heard the number of those who were sealed, a hundred and forty-four thousand.." the 144,000 were the 'little flock' that 'God has approved of giving them(144,000) the kingdom'(Luke 12:32). Yes, these were the chosen one that will be the companion of Jesus to govern God's kingdom. Viewing the number as literal agrees with Jesus' statement at Matthew 22:14 regarding the Kingdom of the heavens: "There are many invited, but FEW chosen". So how about those who didn't chose? They are called the 'great crowd' which will inherit God's kingdom that will go down on earth.(Psalm 37:9, Matthew 6:10)
uncountable as in MORE THAN 144,000 people. a non-definite number. maybe billions or trillions, you cannot count them. God clearly counted 144,000 people in that verse. besides that, it says they are from the tribes of Judah, so do you have to be Jewish to get to heaven?
the uncountable refer to the 'great crowd'....those who will inherit the 'new earth'....Judah back then were qualified to be kings....the bible wrote 'from Judah' not because Jews were the only going to reign in heaven but Jews has the qualifications that God wanted...and it is always applicable to us if we have the guts....
yes, but does the way that Christ died really have anything to do with the reason? as long as he died for our sins, i dont think it matters what he died like. I do not know for sure, but, if you have a different opinion, pleas share.
Yes, but isn't it a matter of what THEY believe that would make them Christians?
"They have fundamental differences with Christianity such as Jesus not dying on the cross and how heaven will only accept 144,000 people. it is also very confusing because they make numerous dates about the end of the world despite how in the bible it says"no one shall know the date or time of the end". they also have many other confusing small beliefs."
Somewhat off-topic, but I never really understood the whole "died for our sins" dogma. How is that a sacrifice? And I mean that in a serious, non-flippant, non-trolling manner.
If I were an immortal, omniscient son-of-God-who-is-also-God, and if I died then I'd simply come back to life a few days later, then dying would be a sacrifice the way a millionaire giving a penny to homeless man is a sacrifice.
The only way it would truly have been a sacrifice is if Jesus were NOT the son of God, and his death was permanent and irrevocable. "Giving" something you'll simply get back is no sacrifice.
before jesus, we had to make sacrafices of animals to pay for our sins. they had to die for our sins. then God sent Jesus to come down and after preaching and doing all that, was killed by us. when he died, he was the final sacrafice. we do not need to sacrafice anymore animals because jesus sacraficed himself.
if jesus did not, then there would be no way to be forgiven of our sins and we would all go to hell.
You just said "we had to make sacrifices of animals to pay for our sins". Last time I checked, we still have animals, so I deduce from your statement that "if jesus did not" then we'd simply keep sacrificing animals. Besides, God created the whole "sin and go to hell" rule, so how is finding a loophole in his own rules sacrificing anything? Sounds more like a bug fix.
I personally prefer the whole science and education route instead, but hey, whatever floats your boat.
God would not have kept accepting animals as payment. mankind needed a final sacrafice to end all sacrafices.
God said to adam and eve "don't eat the fruit of the knowledge of good and evil" but they did anyways and so here we are with din because of our disobedience towards God.
Jesus was the chosen one, the so-called 'Christ'. His followers are called 'CHRISTians'. Logically, every human who follows Christ, including obeying his will and commandments with full devotion, he must call a Christian. But most of the people, who claim that they are Christian, do not really know Jesus! Some says that Jesus himself is the GOD! They also praises him more and not to his Father, Jehovah. And we know that Jesus do not want to glorify him but instead to his Father. So why some still assume that he is GOD? Do they follow the Christ's command that we must only praise and glorify his heavenly Father, Jehovah God? Should they call their selves a 'True Christian'?
couldn't they be false prophets though? alot of their rules seem a little out of whack. why do they not think Christ was crucified? are they following Christ, or just a few of his rules? Jesus is God. prove me wrong. and why do they only accept 144,000 when they have over 2,000,000 members. if you can ecplain these questions to me, then we can get farther in this debate.
how could they be??they're not even a prophet..they just made the bible as their sole basis of their beliefs. i think u'r blaming the bible itself, because of it's commandments...speaking of crucifiction, the "cross", in Greek word means 'stau-ros'. Stauros signified a stake, an upright pole, or piece of paling, on which anything might be hang ..even amongst the romans the crux(from which cross was derived) appears to have been originally an upright hole. So it's not a cross as you know. And even if Jesus was really hanged on a "cross", why would some worship that image that Jesus was hanged??for example, do you wanna see your 'bestfriend' hanged and then praise him??it's absurd, right?!and above all, Jesus is not the Almighty God. Why would Jesus prayed to God all over again if he, himself already GOD..?Why he repeatedly says ...'My father...my Father'? Do you and your father are one??of course not!!it's symbolical that Jesus and his Father are one. Just like in marriage that commonly announced the couple as one.
[ The Crucifixion ] As they led him away, they seized Simon from Cyrene, who was on his way in from the country, and put the cross on him and made him carry it behind Jesus
Matthew 16:24
Then Jesus said to his disciples, "If anyone would come after me, he must deny himself and take up his cross and follow me."
they both mention the cross, but of couse, you think it means something else, right? why would Jesus be crucified on a steak? how do you crucify someone on a steak? historical evidence shows that at the time, the Romans were using the "cross". why would the soldiers have to break the thieves legs if they were on a steak? you see, crucifixion results in death from suffocation. breaking their legsspeeds up this process, as it is much harder after that to keep yourself up to breathe. if they were on a steak , how would they die? where would their hands be?
Secondly, Jesus prayed to God because he was in HUMAN form. if he wanted to, he could have flown up to heaven right there, or anywhere in the Bible, but somebody had to die for our sins. he came to the earth in his human form because humans would relate better to him. if he came it a Godly form, then what would be the point of faith? we would justhave to follow God, with to free will.
In other Bible translation, the 'cross' were translated to a 'torture stake'...crucify doesn't always meant as to hang on a 'cross'....base on the dictionary (Encarta),,,
(1) CRITICIZE SOMEBODY HARSHLY: to criticize somebody unsparingly... (2)
TREAT SOMEBODY CRUELLY: to defeat, torment, or victimize somebody in a thorough or cruel way...in these ways...it is applicable to be 'crucified' on a 'steak'....
well assuming that your thought is right.. if Jesus died as human and he was also God,, then who made Jesus alive as a spirit???how can he control/manage himself if he was dead (Ecclesiastes 9:5)....and who would sent him on earth????why the bible says God sent him to be a ransom????and God Himself could not come to earth because of his power....remember what happened when God's hand appeared when He gave the ten commandments to Moses???earthquakes.....horrible...and that fact is written on the bible....
then why God choses Jesus then to be the 'ransom'???? as we take the story in the bible,,Adam was a 'son of God' (Luke 3:38)and God also have communication with Adam back then before he did not sin...but when he sinned,,Adam now lose the 'everlasting life on a paradise earth' - perfect life...not only his but his sons too,,,us people....(Romans 5:12)
so the ransom should be a human that has the exact value of life...perfect (Deuteronomy 19:21)...and no people then are qualified as ransom, so God sacrificed his 'beloved son' to be the exact ransom for our sins to return the 'everlasting life' lose by Adam....
your definition is useless. it was talking about saying " wow, that guy just got totally chewed out by his teacher" or, with crucified, "wow, that guy just got totally crucified by his teacher." i believe it was the normal Roman crucifixion which the history books point to and which they performed at the time. History backs me up.
"if Jesus died as human and he was also God,, then who made Jesus alive as a spirit???"
He is GOD! he can make himself a spirit. Jesus ressurected and your verse in ecclesiates was talking about normal humans, not Jesus. jesus did not die and just decompose, he resurected and ascended to Heaven three days later.
and God did not send him to be a ransom, he sent him to be a sacrafice.
"Adam was a 'son of God' (Luke 3:38)"
there is no Luke 3:38, so HA! ahhahahahahahahahahahhaahhahahahhahahahahahahahhaahhahahahahahahahahh! that deserves a downvote, but i will not do it, because i am forgiving.
not only his but his sons too,,,us people....(Romans 5:12)
Jesus was not a son of humans, he was the Son of God. the title of that selection is called "Death through Adam, Life throught Christ", self explanatory. and Jesus never sinned.
so the ransom should be a human that has the exact value of life...perfect (Deuteronomy 19:21)...
Deutoronomy 19:21 is about equal unishment, eye for eye, tooth for tooth, life for life. i don't know where you are getting this "Ransom" thing from. you have been mislead my friend.
Well it is not me talking that, it was the dictionary...and Crucifixion was used to relate to cross so stabled ...well taking that 'cross' thing for granted. Why ‘Christianity’ does worship the image that Jesus was hanged??? Does Jesus tell them to do so..??? I do not think so…Isaiah 42:8 stated: “I am Jehovah. That is my name; and to no one else shall I give my own glory, neither my praise to graven images.” Apparently they disobey Him…And also dismayed Jesus..
Well Jesus was human back then…if we take up the history…Adam have sinned…He lost everlasting life…human lost everlasting life…human lost God’s consent…but because of God’s love to the world, He sent his son to be the ransom for our sins…Logically, why would God himself, offer himself as a ransom for our sins ??? If the purpose of that sacrifice was to have God’s forgiveness, and if God also wants people in the world have everlasting life, then He just can forgive them that easy, since he’s powerful…
And why don’t you accept that Jehovah, our GOD is different persona from Jesus…Why does the bible repeatedly talking about GOD and JESUS… If God and Jesus are one, and the Bible is God’s word, then God should’ve let his human (consented) writers to have him two identities…
Oh it is so true…’truth will set you free’…..I have truths about God, but for some, God is still a mystery…
Luke 3:38
“[son] of E´nosh,
[son] of Seth,
[son] of Adam,
[son] of God.”
You should read the whole chapter… I give you hint, it’s a genealogy…LOL
"so the ransom should be a human that has the exact value of life...perfect (Deuteronomy 19:21)...
Deutoronomy 19:21 is about equal unishment, eye for eye, tooth for tooth, life for life. i don't know where you are getting this "Ransom" thing from. you have been mislead my friend."
Oh dear, may I remind you that reading the bible requires deep insight…no offense…cuz bible is so meaningful…some are literal and some are symbolical…
Deut. 19:11
…”soul will be for soul”…
Adam loses a perfect human life….Jesus soul is a spirit while Adam has a human body…then they’re not compatible…But no one else could sustain a perfect human life anymore, so God sent Jesus as ‘human’ to be compatible… Jesus is ‘son of God’…Adam ‘was son of God’… that’s equal, my friend…LOL
get off your high horse and stop acting like an ass. do not insult me.
Why ‘Christianity’ does worship the image that Jesus was hanged???
we do not, we just remember how he died. the important part is that he did die, so i am just asking why jehovah's witnesses put so much emphasis on the part that he died on a stake. and i am also asking why you think that, because the common way for people to get crucified back then was to be put on a cross and suffocate.
"Jesus is ‘son of God’…Adam ‘was son of God’… that’s equal, my friend…LOL"
"but because of God’s love to the world, He sent his son to be the ransom for our sins"
he was not ransom!!!!!! God did not pay us with his sons blood!!
"Jesus is ‘son of God’…Adam ‘was son of God’… that’s equal, my friend…LOL"
Jesus was the only BEGOTTEN SON OF GOD. Adam was created by God. hahhahahahahah ROFL.
i'm not insulting you...i just adjusting base on your attitude..
"we do not, we just remember how he died. the important part is that he did die, so i am just asking why Jehovah's witnesses put so much emphasis on the part that he died on a stake. and i am also asking why you think that, because the common way for people to get crucified back then was to be put on a cross and suffocate."
i saw lots of lots of images of patron saints inside churches...apparently they are 'praying' to them...they assume that their talking to God....which God doesn't want...and they also have statues of different saints...
"he was not ransom!!!!!! God did not pay us with his sons blood!!"
then who does????do you object the bible???i'm afraid you're not!!!
"Jesus was the only BEGOTTEN SON OF GOD. Adam was created by God. hahhahahahahah ROFL."
Do you say that Jesus was not created by God...???you have said Jesus was the only begotten son of God..'son of God'....Jesus was the first that created by God...that's why he called 'firstborn' son of God. (Colossians 1:15; Revelation 3:14)
they were equal because Jesus was became human...Adam was human...equal...that's the point....!
"saw lots of lots of images of patron saints inside churches...apparently they are 'praying' to them...they assume that their talking to God....which God doesn't want...and they also have statues of different saints..."
that is catholics. i do not agree with them praying to certain saints for certain things either.
"then who does????do you object the bible???i'm afraid you're not!!!"
nobody. nobody pays us for the sins we have comitted. we have to pay for them. i disagree with your word use of "Ransom". it implies that we took jesus and held him against his will. you are basically saying that we blackmailed God, which did not happen.
"nobody. nobody pays us for the sins we have comitted. we have to pay for them. i disagree with your word use of "Ransom". it implies that we took jesus and held him against his will. you are basically saying that we blackmailed God, which did not happen."
"Just as the Son of man came, not to be ministered to, but to minister and to give his soul a ransom in exchange for many(our sins).” - Matthew 20:28
but it doesn't mean that when the time that Jesus was died, we already have paid for our sins, or in other words that we became perfect. it means that we are all given a chance to get an everlasting life from God, to be perfect again, which He wants at first....
it's conditional though..
"Yes, i do. he was with God in the beginning."
How absurd..!
Colossians 1:15 -"He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of all creation;" -=- he was God's first creation, clearly...
"Colossians 1:16 'For by him all things were created: things in heaven and earth, visible and invisible" Or did he create God?'"
Proverbs 8:30 - "then I came to be beside him as a master worker, and I came to be the one he was specially fond of day by day, I being glad before him all the time,"
and also about 144,000. Revelation 7:4 says: "I heard the number of those who were sealed, a hundred and forty-four thousand.." the 144,000 were the 'little flock' that 'God has approved of giving them(144,000) the kingdom'(Luke 12:32). Yes, these were the chosen one that will be the companion of Jesus to govern God's kingdom. Viewing the number as literal agrees with Jesus' statement at Matthew 22:14 regarding the Kingdom of the heavens: "There are many invited, but FEW chosen". So how about those who didn't chose? They are called the 'great crowd' which will inherit God's kingdom that will go down on earth.(Psalm 37:9, Matthew 6:10)
okay, i have read it. that is the number of people who were going to get a seal on their forehead as servants of God. additionally, you have to be from the tribes of Judah. it says in John 3:16. "I am the Way, the Truth ,and the Light. WHOSOEVER believes in me shall not perish but have everlasting life."
hahahha, then in Revelations 7:9, it says "after this I looked and there before me was a great multitude that no one could count, from every nation, tribe, people, and language, standing before the throne and in front of the Lamb. They were wearing white robes and were holding palm branches in their hands."
John 3:16 is applicable to all mankind who satisfy God's commandments. but in two ways...the 'little flock' will have everlasting life in heaven that have a limit number(144,000)....if you study well the Rev. 7:9, apostle John says 'after'...so it is another thing.....and it talks about the 'great crowd' who will then inherit the 'new earth' (Daniel 2:44),,,which will be a paradise and those people will have everlasting life too, just what Adam and Eve lost....
"John 3:16 is applicable to all mankind who satisfy God's commandments."
Exactly. Jesus died for ALL of our sins, not just 144,000 of us. are you saying that 144,000 of us get to go before the rest of us? or only that 144,000 of us get to go to heaven? are you saying that the 144,000 get to go to a special Heaven or something? please enlighten me on this subject
144,000 are chosen by GOD himself.... so they are special one...but these people qualified in God's requirement...and we all know that God has a very high standard so they have something special with them....i can remember in the bible that one qualification for being a member for 'little flock' is being single/never been into sexual activities....these 'little flock' will be Jesus' companion to govern God's Kingdom...in other though, they will be kings...to identify those chosen,,,,every memorial of Jesus (annually, Nisan 14) , they participate to the emblem...
Christians and Jehovah's Witnesses have very large differences... both differ greatly on afterlife... Trinity is rejected by witnesses while accepted by christians... witnessess believe jesus was crucified on a stake rather than a cross...witnesses will not recieve blood transfusions and are not very involved in politics... unlike christians
you're right...that's what Christianity in this world do...but Jesus always listen to his Father, our God Jehovah...he also uses the bible (God's word) in his ministry...and definitely obeyed bible's commandments....JWs' beliefs, like what i've said, were from the bible, like what Jesus do.....every belief are coped from the bible....and that should a 'real' Christian do, to adhere God's and Jesus' commandments....
i have.................................................................................................................................................................................................................
The following SUMMARIES OF OVER 1400 JEHOVAH'S WITNESSES CRIMINAL and CIVIL COURT CASES will provide the BEST and MOST ACCURATE info about Jehovah's Witnesses, their beliefs, and how they ACTUALLY practice such day to day.
The following website summarizes 900 court cases and lawsuits affecting children of Jehovah's Witness Parents, including 400 cases where the JW Parents refused to consent to life-saving blood transfusions for their dying children, as well as nearly 400 CRIMINAL cases -- most involving MURDERS:
DIVORCE, BLOOD TRANSFUSIONS, AND OTHER LEGAL ISSUES AFFECTING CHILDREN OF JEHOVAH'S WITNESSES
The following website summarizes over 500 lawsuits filed by Jehovah's Witnesses against their Employers, incidents involving problem JW Employees, and other secret JW "history" court cases:
EMPLOYMENT ISSUES UNIQUE TO JEHOVAH'S WITNESS EMPLOYEES
Christianity is not as clear-cut as many of you think it is. Many people who call themselves Christians really aren't Christians in the least bit. Honestly, I do not think that Jehovah's witnesses are Christians. They seem to add to the Scriptures, which God tells us specifically no to do.
Ye shall not add unto the word which I command you, neither shall ye diminish from it, that ye may keep the commandments of the LORD your God which I command you. -Deuteronomy 4:2
I say this because the Bible says nothing about only 144,000 people going to heaven.
I say this because the Bible says nothing about only 144,000 people going to heaven...
NZ
Yes, it does. Revelation 7:14, and 14:1-4. These who go to heaven are figurative "Jews" (God's 'chosen' people), and limited in number, since it was never God's intention that ANY human live in heaven. We were created on earth, from the elements of the soil.
Those who go to heaven are said to be a "little flock" as opposed to a "great crowd" worshiping God, and are said to have been "bought from the earth", in that they once lived on earth.
I can explain further if you wish, or you could call your local Kingdom Hall and get a full explanation from your own Bible, with no obligation to do anything further.
"Ye shall not add unto the word which I command you, neither shall ye diminish from it,"
The Bible didn't exist as a compiled book until approximately 1000 years after Deuteronomy was written. So, anything written after Deuteronomy is an addition. That includes the entire New Testament and most of the Old Testament. If you can't add or diminish from Deuteronomy, then you have to go back to killing disobedient children (21:18-21), killing women who have sex before marriage (22:20-21), hanging people for sinning (21:22), killing anyone who tries to get you to worship other gods (Deut 12:32), not eating pork (14:8), and a very long list of things Christians no longer do. Please read all of Deuteronomy to see just how depraved it is. It's very similar to ISIS.
“These are the statutes and the judgments which you shall carefully observe in the land which the Lord, the God of your fathers, has given you to possess as long as you live on the earth." Deut 12:1
Jehovah witness is more like a branch of judaism which believes in christ. Any yet not thoroughly....they disbelieve some of his sayings like muslims and judaism that jesus has said. Yet they say they are Christians. I think they are the closest anti~christs to christianity not Islam.
