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7
12
Limited freedom of speech Absolute freedom of speech
Debate Score:19
Arguments:25
Total Votes:28
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 Limited freedom of speech (5)
 
 Absolute freedom of speech (10)

Debate Creator

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Should we absolute freedom of speech?

In Denmark we have what we call the racism paragraph. The racism paragraph limits the constitutional right of freedom of speech. You are not allowed to express racist beliefs, you are also not allowed to discriminate when it comes to race, sex, sexuality, nationality, ethnicity or religion. The punishment varies from fines to two years in jail. However, nobody has ever received jail time for this paragraph yet in Denmark.

I bring this up because in my previous debate about the KKK, I noticed some people said ''even though I don't agree with their views, I believe in their right to express their opinion.''

So do you agree? Should people like members of the KKK be allowed to not only have such opinions, but express them freely in the public in order to recruit more people on their team?

The racism paragraph is extremely controversial, and has received a lot of criticism. But should we really have the freedom to express racist and sexist beliefs?  There are still nazi parties in Europe, Denmark included. They are discreet and hidden, but they wouldn't be if it they weren't labeled as criminals.


Limited freedom of speech

Side Score: 7
VS.

Absolute freedom of speech

Side Score: 12
2 points

A man I'm sure you recall once said: "A people who values its privileges above its principles soon loses both." Freedom of speech is a privilege and "principles" should limit its use. (That man is known as "Ike")

The KKK is not known for its principles.

Side: Limited freedom of speech
outlaw60(15368) Disputed
0 points

During the Senate debates on the Ku Klux Klan Act of 1871, it was revealed that members of the Democratic Party formed many terrorist organizations like the Ku Klux Klan to murder and intimidate African Americans voters. The Ku Klux Klan Act was a bill introduced by a Republican Congress to stop Klan Activities. Senate debates revealed that the Klan was the terrorist arm of the Democratic Party.

History reveals that Democrats lynched, burned, mutilated and murdered thousands of blacks and completely destroyed entire towns and communities occupied by middle class Blacks, including Rosewood, Florida, the Greenwood District in Tulsa Oklahoma, and Wilmington, North Carolina to name a few.

Congressional records show it was Democrats that strongly opposed the passage of the 13th, 14th and 15th Amendments. These three Amendments were introduced by Republicans to abolish slavery, give citizenship to all African Americans born in the United States and, give Blacks the right to vote.

Side: Absolute freedom of speech
AlofRI(3294) Clarified
1 point

Yep! That's one reason those "Southern Democrats" were thrown out of the out of OUR party and picked up by YOURS! WE didn't like scumbags. They still hadn't been rejected when the "Party of Lincoln" abolished slavery. If Lincoln were around today I have NO DOUBT he'd switch parties. The KKK was the terrorist arm of the "good ol' boy" Southern Democratic Party ... which we rejected.

Nope, no need to browbeat any more, if the shoe fits, wear it, conservative.

Side: Limited freedom of speech
outlaw60(15368) Disputed
0 points

Do you need to brow beat anymore on who the KKK is there Progressive ?

Side: Absolute freedom of speech
outlaw60(15368) Disputed
-1 points

Most people are either a Democrat by design, or a Democrat by deception. That is either they were well aware the racist history of the Democrat Party and still chose to be Democrat, or they were deceived into thinking that the Democratic Party is a party that sincerely cared about Black people.

History reveals that every piece of racist legislation that was ever passed and every racist terrorist attack that was ever inflicted on African Americans, was initiated by the members of the Democratic Party. From the formation of the Democratic Party in 1792 to the Civil Rights movement of 1960's, Congressional records show the Democrat Party passed no specific laws to help Blacks, every law that they introduced into Congress was designed to hurt blacks in 1894 Repeal Act. The chronicles of history shows that during the past 160 years the Democratic Party legislated Jim Crows laws, Black Codes and a multitude of other laws at the state and federal level to deny African Americans their rights as citizens.History reveals that the Republican Party was formed in 1854 to abolish slavery and challenge other racist legislative acts initiated by the Democratic Party.

You need more of a history lesson there Progressive ?

Side: Absolute freedom of speech
2 points

One: The Freedom of speech.” is not saying whatever you want unless you are adding absolute.

The United States 1st Amendment containing the phrase “Freedom of speech,” having a natural and legal limitation placed on it, by its place as the first change applied by the people, to basic understandings of separation by representation. The challenge involved in any change of basic state, principle, and self-representation is the claim it makes to the formation of a publicly formed new beliefs, by way of unregulated publicly shared understanding.

Making only two things clear. There is an absolute freedom of speech and a basic absolute freedom of separation. The open and unregulated use of one, can very well direct the outcome to the extent of the regulated use of the other.

All freedom of Speech is basically held in public principle as being inalienable to the common defense of the general welfare.

In describing freedom of speech. In this day and age, the freedom to speak one’s mind is never truthfully altered or abolished in any way. It is only action, or focus direction which has been corrected.

Side: Limited freedom of speech

I am of the opinion that restrictions on freedom of speech causes more problems than it prevents.

Some people can abuse absolute freedom of speech to incite hatred and violence, but even so, the basic right to state your heartfelt opinion on any issue including racial, sexual or religious prejudices should not be muzzled by repressive laws.

The ''suppression of expression'' only serves to fester prejudiced views and stifles open discussion which can often dispel many misguided beliefs and unfounded fears.

Laws cannot change 'hearts and minds', only open, civilised and candid discussion can identify the true feelings of a nation's people and when rational debate is entered into by reasonable, well meaning people it's usually the case that a harmonious compromise can be achieved thus leading to a better and more peaceful society in which we all feel comfortable with each other.

Side: Absolute freedom of speech

I am of the opinion that restrictions on freedom of speech causes more problems than it prevents

The ''suppression of expression'' only serves to fester prejudiced views and stifles open discussion which can often dispel many misguided beliefs and unfounded fears.

Do you have anything to back up these claims?

Side: Limited freedom of speech
Winklepicker(1021) Clarified
3 points

Well, even though I don't feel inclined to ''backup''! my genuinely held opinion I will do so.

I live in Northern Ireland and experienced 30 plus years of bloody and deadly sectarian violence when the distrust and ignorance of the two traditions as well as the religious beliefs of the two polarized communities evolved into hatred then escalated into murder and eventually into what was really a full blown ans bloody civil war the full horrors of which were only averted by the professionalism, outstanding bravery and even handedness of the army and the dedicated police officers of the Royal Ulster Constabulary.

One of the major contributing factors to the continuing conflict,( albeit on a significantly reduced scale) is the insistence of the Roman Catholic Church that no education integration between catholic and protestants pupils should be allowed.

This in itself means that the two traditions never merge and discover that, to their surprise they have a lot in common, such as maybe they support the same football team etc.

When laws were passed forbidding the full, unrestrained ''freedom of speech'' dialogue between the opposing politicians broke down and the ensuing political void was filled by the paramilitaries.

The people of Northern Ireland were then forced to endure three decades of hell on earth, partly funded by American I.R.A, sympathizers , ( Noraid).

If the warring tribes had been able, and indeed encouraged to OPENLY, ''jaw jaw'' instead of ''war war'' then I'm certain that the deaths and eye-watering destruction of property and countless jobs could have been averted.

If the ignorance induced bitterness of both sides could have been expressed in a full, no holes barred series of ''heated debates'' ( there's an understatement) I'm certain that most, if not all the bloodshed could have been avoided.

When free speech is suppressed emotions and suspicions build up, just like a pressure cooker, and eventually the whole artificially created peaceful veneer explodes into bloody violence.

Side: Limited freedom of speech
1 point

I think that was my comment in the other debate so let me clarify.

There are indeed restrictions on free speech which I agree with - such as libel and slander laws, abetting criminal behavior by giving out private information for identity theft, etc. I also believe people should be held accountable for whatever they say, such as if they falsely yell "fire!" in a crowded theatre and cause people to get trampled and hurt because of it.

However, I indeed do object to the practice in some foreign countries of making certain words or symbols or types of speech banned. I think that's hypocritical. In fact, were Nazis or some similar group able to take power and ban political dissent along the exact same lines of reasoning we'd all cry foul and say they were squashing free speech. You can't have it both ways. If people want to say ugly things let them say ugly things. It's up to the rest of us to counter them and hold them accountable for saying it.

Note, so although I voted in the Absolute freedom of speech column that heading doesn't accurately reflect what this side of the debate stands for. One can support free speech without denying libel, slander, ramifications, etc.

Side: Absolute freedom of speech

Yes, you were one of those who had such claims, and I just want to say that I didn't mean it in a negative way. I just thought it was a good debate topic.

I indeed do object to the practice in some foreign countries of making certain words or symbols or types of speech banned.

Can you give examples of this? I mean I know the swastika is banned in some parts of europe, but I'm more interested in the words to which you are referring.

Side: Limited freedom of speech
Grenache(6053) Clarified
1 point

I'll admit I wrote with a specificity which is often lacking in the hate speech laws of nations. But apparently it is true that you can't call ethnic groups "maggots" or "freeloaders" in Germany without it being legally hate speech.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hate_speech

Side: Limited freedom of speech
1 point

"In Denmark we have what we call the racism paragraph. The racism paragraph limits the constitutional right of freedom of speech."

I shall quote the 1st Amendment of the Bill of Rights !

Amendment I. Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the government for a redress of grievances.

Do you read any where in there limiting the right to free speech ?

Limiting the right to free speech shows you are not a Socialist but a Communist but not much difference between the two.

Side: Absolute freedom of speech
1 point

The most significant problem I have with the suppression of free speech is that historically it has been used to greatest effect to support identity based discrimination. Once it is accepted that we can curtail speech for the greater good, it becomes a legitimate exercise of state authority to do so and the concept of the greater good is entirely dependent upon who holds power. It is is not popularly accepted that censorship is a permissible exercise of state authority, and especially is a strong sentiment of principle can be developed, then it will be more difficult for censorship to be abused.

I am also not persuaded that penalizing individuals for expressing their views actually prevents them from organizing and disseminating their views. This is particularly the case where penalties are fairly minor and the views are coming from an organization which can merely budget the cost of their speech into their finances. The relative anonymity afforded by internet forums, particularly on non-domestic hosts, or through traditional means of information distribution such as fliers, posters, or graffiti makes restrictions fairly ineffectual. Moreover, legally penalizing expression adds fuel to the persecution complexes often at work behind bigotry and can give greater credence to a group than they otherwise would have.

I also think that censorship is inherently antithetical to democracy. However repugnant the view may be, it is inconsistent with representative forms of government that it should be oppressed through the power and authority of the state. Nor should we consider the speech the ultimate concern. This strikes me as slapping a band-aid on a gunshot and enables thinking that out of hearing means it's not a problem. But what gives prejudice its momentum is not the mere ideas, but the conditions which exist that make those ideas appeal to certain people. Typically, those conditions include de facto segregation due to social inequality, socioeconomic differential, educational differential, etc. If we are serious about countering bigotry then we tackle it at its roots, not by muzzling it after its grown.

Side: Absolute freedom of speech
0 points

While I'm as liberal as they come, and I do believe nobody SHOULD be a hateful, discriminatory bigoted d!ck, I think everybody should have the RIGHT to be one. Otherwise you open "pandora's box" as far as what is or isn't acceptable and who gets to decide that and on what authority?

Side: Absolute freedom of speech