Should woman be allowed in combat positions in the U.S. Military
Side Score: 106
Side Score: 56
I think no matter what gender you are you should be able to fight for your country. you should be able to risk your life for what you believe in. Many woman already die in the war now from combat yet we are not offically allowed to be in combat. this should change NOW!
Maybe it was my training, or maybe it was growing up as the little girl surrounded by big boy cousins, but I was never raped while I was in the military. I would honestly fight to the death. By the way, did you know that in the military according to the Uniform Code of Military Justice, the sentence for Rape is actually death? Just to give you a little more information on the subject. Good luck with your research.
... No is winning?
So much for equality right?
It's my personal opinion that in this country if you're not fighting for everyone's rights, you're fighting for nothing.(This includes the gays, the blacks, the jews, the azns, the satanists, etc.) We're a country of mutts right? We came here because we wanted freedom.
Jesus people, are we really going to start segregation again? Really? You want to take a step back? I'm honestly sick of twofaced people who say something's inhumane or wrong and then turn around and fucking advocate something like this on this site. Hell, in general.
Of course. Women have come a long way. Can women not be patriotic and have a feeling to fight the enemy? Women have every right to fight for our country.
It is not in a woman's nature to pick up a weapon and start fighting. however, she has the right. And if she wants to exercise that right, well dammit let her!
Effectiveness is not the issue here. If it were, the ability to meet certain physical requirements (strength, accuracy, weight etc...) would be the only thing to be considered. I think it's more of a matter of Combatants that don't want to shoot a woman. It's a moral issue.
i think the only reason its not in a woman's nature to pick up a weapon is because of tradition. in most cultures, women are passive. They are taught to be stay at home mothers and have children. They are taught to be gentle and caring. children learn from what they see. and what they grow up with. Women should have as many rights as men. to me we are all the same. Men and women have just been taught to act different ways.
Lets take half of the men in the U.S. that are in the military and half of the women in the U.S. that are in the military and put them all in a fight match, couple by couple. Which team would win? Men. Because men are more effective in a fight. That is just how it is. We are just doing what is best for your country. It has nothing to do with being sexist.
Definitely, why not? It's not like women are weaker or more frail then men - that's stereotypical and and discrimination against the other gender. In fact, in a lot of countries female life expectancy is higher than the male, so I see nothing wrong with females being allowed in combat positions. As long as they have the skills and they want to become part of the U.S. military, there's nothing wrong with it. There are male nurses, so why not?
Note that I support a woman's right to do what she wants irregardless of gender, however...
Yes. We are equals to men
Not physically. Women are different when it comes to body frame and muscle mass. This is where the debate stems from, women are not equal to men in purely physical tasks. Note that I say women as a group, there can be exceptions but the bulk of the group has more hardship in these endeavours.
and everyone else!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
There are more than two genders?
Instead of war woman should run most government throughout the world proving to man that there is intelligent ways of solving or differences without spilling each others blood. No war is worth fighting when the results is always the same where they advance is technology/weaponry to destroy human life. The movie saw is a perfect example of that.
War is like recycling the same garbage over and over with no end in site. We are not as intelligent as we think, we are just imitations of intelligence the same way parrots mimic the idea of intelligence. The only patriot is a human patriot that value peace, love and happiness for the entire human and animal race. However, our history shows that we are professionals with degrees and Phd's in destruction with no end in site.
No. There is such thing as a justified war. It's part of nature to fight for territory.. but being human we should make more dignified choices i.e. a war that should be worth fighting for. These days most wars should never have been... doesn't mean war should never be.
I still stand by my point that NO WAR is justified. Nature don't fight wars humans and animals do, territory will always be their whether we like it or not.
A democracy which makes or even effectively prepares for modern, scientific war must necessarily cease to be democratic. No country can be really well prepared for modern war unless it is governed by a tyrant, at the head of a highly trained and perfectly obedient bureaucracy.
I agree that a woman's place is to nurture and to build civilization. It's in her nature to be equal with Mother Nature. Just think of it, in one minute Mother Nature can reap havoc on the entire planet. So in sense, the description of Earth as a Mother is entirely correct, she is the ultimate warrior!
You want to see a real battle fought in ancient times then read the Mahabharata War or the 18 chapters of the Bhagavad Gita.
Women did not fight except if they disguised themselves to seek revenge for some injustice committed by some man on the enemy side; thus her opportunity to avenge herself presented itself.
War is never good no matter what era it occurs in. But Ancient warfare had more honor and pride than contemporary warfare. You had to be a martial artist skilled in horse riding, elephant control, and different strategic formations for battle.
In addition, men made their own weapons: bow and arrow, shields, swords, lances, chucks, discus, etc. They knew what type of armor they were using. In modern times someone else makes the weapons and you know what can result.
Seriously? C'mon now. I'm female, but I'm smart and assertive and competent and I'm perfectly capable of fighting- and I would probably be better at violence than at rearing child. Also, what does honor or who makes what matter? Especially given how wrong your facts are- most weapons were made by specialists, as soon as people had a large enough volume of people have specialists- i.e., way before large-scale warfare.
Also, WREAK. Mother Nature could WREAK havoc.
I'm a spouse of a infantry wounded warrior. I no longer have a "husband" persay, but I do still have our two back to back (irish twin) girls... Try and picture the roles reversed in this kinds of situation.... yeah, easier said then done :?
I would love to "throw" any women who "thinks" they are just as equal as a male when it comes to serving in a combat arms mos, out in a field for 7 straight days.
As a female, we go through certain "monthly/physical" changes that a male will Never experience. So next time a "women" wants to be a bada$$ feminist and claim she's just as "qualified" to be a grunt, etc...
please don't forget your tampons and clean "panties"... ;)
sorry to offend any women, but being one myself, I would assume more women would also think about "hygiene" before "proving a point" ... :/
Wow. So since you were a spouse, you understand what it takes to be in the field for 7 days? Let me, if I may just for you, clear it up a little bit with some facts. I am a recently retired soldier who served in the US Army. I was deployed to combat zones 3 times. I was "in a field" (btw, the correct way to say it is in THE field) for more than 7 days at a time. You learn to adapt, and you learn how to perform personal hygiene as best you can. I, as a woman, was not in a combat MOS, but you can trust me, I was in a combat zone so I was in the same convoys, roadside attacks, mortar attacks, etc. as my male counterparts. I am certified in field sanitation so I know how to make dirty water clean, I know where to put the dining facilities in relation to the toilet facilities, I know how to burn human feces as to not contaminate the area of operations. As far as tampons and clean panties, honey, you do what you gotta do in a war. You improvise how you must when you must. You learn to adapt. I attained the level of expert in both grenade and rifle qualification, I am a combat lifesaver, and an expert in the field of logistics (which is a support MOS, that has been thrust onto the front lines of Iraq and Afghanistan) so you do not offend me, your lack of understanding frightens me. It is people like you holding up little U.S. flags in the airports welcoming home our troops claiming to be supportive. Bottom line, I was in combat three times, so I should have the choice to be in a combat MOS.
And some woman remind me of the types that try to run in heels from the bogeymen.
.."I would love to "throw" any women who "thinks"
- I dont think you could even throw yourself dear lady.
"As a female, we go through certain "monthly/physical" changes that a male will Never experience."--
"So next time a "women" wants to be a bada$$ feminist and claim she's just as "qualified" to be a grunt, etc..." --
- You sound like the classic "TrophyWife" :)
I can see you and i are going to get along ;~
On a more serious note :
Your a spouse of a wounded infantry warrior. How very brave of you . It must be very hard for you at times. You sound like you need a break .Sympathies.......
EDIT: 2.52PMNEXT DAY.........whoopsy..... I just did a bit of research. It seems , you say you dont want sympathy.....ok !
BUT I CAN RELATE. No ive never been in the army but i have Post Traumatic Syndrome ,ETC . etc , etc ,etc and not to go on, a herniated disc is no fun either.
No , i have never been in the army , SO WHAT .Neither has my daughter who spent 11 months fighting for her life!
I wont reveal too much of what i know , but , InfantryWife...............Your not the only one .
Do they force people to serve in the US army ? ?
No , you wont get anymore sympathy from me.
Even though your husband may deserve his purple heart , your plight or whatever it is , is not deserving of a medal.
Maybe you secretly desire to go awol.
Those brave women who chose to assist the men in fighting wars do not join the bandwagon to try to prove that they are equal to men.
Obviously your time as an infantry wife has been beyond lonely.
Apparrently despite your husbands CHOICE to be in the army ,you have no female friends ,who were also in the army along with your husband ?
I wonder why he never imformed you of how a lot of those women , who chose to bravely serve in war , are stronger than some of the toughest men he has ever met.
These woman dont join to prove some stupid point that they are equal to man......What a naive and ungrateful bitch you are!
Sad , as all this shows me (AFTER FURTHER RESEARCH I DID ON YOU)is that you are a naive trophy-wife , who is resentful for her choices. Maybe you need to grunt up a bit!.........................PS sorry , i prefer not to be a bitch...but sometimes..well...
As a military wife, i am shocked at how little you know. I spent up to 8 days in the field as a 14 year old cadet, and yes a couple of times i was on my period. It may not make things easy, but you get around it. It seems you are the one who did not think about hygine, simply assuming a woman on her period is unhygienic.
It is not about being a feminist. At school they taught us about the various trades, which we conducted exercises in. Before i was aware that women could not be infantry, that was what i wanted to be, because that was what i most enjoyed. Nothing feminist there. Just a woman wanting to do the career she wanted. Now, i am half way through RN selection to fly jets.
Just because you are too pathetic to leave your mirror for more than a day, dosent mean the rest of us are.
It's women like you I just don't get... I don't see how some families can brainwash their kids into becoming like you. You give women--and feminism--a bad name. Guess what? They have tampons in Iraq Gasp! They sell tampons in places other than the US and Europe? Double Gasp! Who'da thunk it?
Women are physically and mentally weaker than men.
However todays combat has significantly changed and war isn't as it used to be. You can let machines and tools make up for your lapses.
So my conclusion is... not yet.. not until their weaknesses are completely able to be made up for.
Wow, that was probably one of the most ignorant statements ever made. Physically weaker, most of the time, yes we are. Mentally weaker, well your statement justifies my point.
Your ignorance has weakened your argument. Go exercise that brain of yours!!! You can do it.
I don't agree with women in combat, nor do I agree with men in combat. I believe war solves nothing. It only serves to strengthen our enemies negative view of us and their resolve to destroy us. It is a vicious cycle and will not be broken until humans perfect the art of diplomacy.
First of all regarding mental weakness, picking out one single man does not account for the male gender in it's entirety and making fun of someone does not count as an argument. Also you seem to have no understanding about the mentality of the enemies modern American forces are fighting. They are brought up (or brainwashed) to believe a certain thing and they will stop at nothing to accomplish that end. They cannot be reasoned with. For the sake of other Innocent in the country they are rampaging through, they must be destroyed. As long as there are people who sill not listen to reason, wars will have to be fought until they are subdued. Pacifists will not bring peace. They will only stand on the fence and refuse to do anything.
Sigh... a hippy.
You don't understand war which is why you don't believe in it. I have no problem with talking and personally believe violence should be the last option. But when the last option occurs and war happens... then you go for it 100%. You wouldn't understand, you think everything's done by talking. Probably in your protected little bubble.
BullSHIT. You're a bigot, love, and I would quit before I got too far ahead if I were you. Physically smaller, yes, but women usually have better endurance and work more effectively in groups- which is a huge strength. Also, women are just intelligent as men. Yes, there are some stupid women, just like there are stupid men (hey, look at how awful your grammar is!). By any measure, I'm more intelligent than most men- by class rank, SAT score, IQ test, you name it. Have a nice day, Boy Who Will Never Get Laid.
soo maybe men are a little stronger than woman but who decides who is more mentally fit. woman can be just as strong as men mentally and we can come very close physically. Woman make many crucial decisions today that decide our countries future and we almost had a female president so i dont know how you can say woman arent mentally the same. so woman are certanly weaker than others but those are the ones who arent made for the army and can't handle situations like that. Men also have trouble handling situations that are mentally tough. look at the rate of post tramatic stress syndrome from returning soldiers. we are very similar
I knew this would happen. When it comes to the mind people always say men and women are equal. I'm not going to go into that debate.. but when it comes to combat or fighting.. then I will say that it's the same mentally and physically..men are superior. Women do not even come close. You can say what you want about women making crucial decisions... and you didn't almost have a female president.. and we did have a female prime minister - not good at all. PTS is due to the pussyfying of men in general.. and I would also say the term is used a bit too often. However I'm not an expert.. but all this psychology bullshit these days is literally bullshit. Men and women are not similar.. each have their roles in society. That's getting f*cked up now and women want to take on men's roles... society is going down the drain. Not to disrepute women or anything.. they have the most important job in the world of raising children etc... but they don't seem to think that's enough..
First of all, this SHOULD be taken seriously. Women have been oppressed throughout history and are still oppressed today! Women are raped, abused, treated like trash in many parts of the world. There are women in some parts of the world that aren't even allowed to drive. They need to wait for their sons and husbands to come home and drive them to their friends' house or the local grocery store. Step outside your little bubble and realize that this is an extremely serious issue that NEEDS to be talked about.
You realize that your view of women being less intelligent than men is wrong... and instead of admitting your wrong, you laugh and act as if this isn't a big issue and it's simply a small group of women overreacting.
The reason why have been looked down upon in history is because of the view of ignorant, stupid little men like YOU. You fail to acknowledge the intelligence of women because of your idiotic and shameless ignorance (I used the word shameless because you fail to realize that you are wrong). You blame their words for experiencing PMS, when in actuality, you have just insulted an entire gender, an entire sex. THAT is enough justification for women (AND MEN) to dispute your stupid claims speak up for for themselves. You idiot.
The U.S. military has performed experiments on this exact topic many times and found that the majority or them don't have the mental and/or physical stamina to perform adequately in combat situations. I am not trying to offend any feminists who may be reading this right now (though I probably am) I'm just laying out the facts that the military has already come up with.
Please provide these so called experimental outcomes. I would like to see them. Since 2003 the United States military has had no problem sending female soldiers out to battle. I was in the Army and deployed 3 times, as I said earlier, so I am waiting for someone to tell me that I am not physically capable to do what I did, which was be in combat for 365 at a time, per deployment. Yes I had a weapon, yes I fired my weapon, yes my military drivers license has around 10 different vehicles I am trained and authorized to drive (and we aren't talking neon's). I am not the minority of females here, I am the majority of those that are in the military. So while you are laying out the facts, please lay out the the entire set, maybe a link to these so called experiments because during the entire time I was in the military, I took part in no such experiments.
women in combat (userpages.aug.com)
ohhhhh, I am automatically going to side with you now because people like you obviously know everything. Grow up. Maybe you should give some evidence for starters instead of stating some childish statement like that.
Here is my evidence why.
watch the video it has evidence.
All of this talk about physical stamina, rape, pregnancy etc is not why I am voting no. You have to ask yourself...what is a soldier ? A soldier pulls a trigger, carries things, runs etc - but to what point - what is the Army / Marines really trying to create - tier end point - the answer is ... A hyper aggressive testosterone driven trained Killer. If for some reason a soldier can't put his hands on a rifle, he has to be able to - without hesitation use his bare hands or whatever implement is available, like a trench digging shovel, pick it up, charge the enemy and bash someones brains into pulp with it, and do it again and again to avoid being killed, then get up the next day with a clear conscience and be able to go kill again and again...this is what the marines and army are trying to create - trained killers that have been stripped of their individuality, trained to follow orders, - go over the top into oncoming death, snarl, charge ahead at top speed and shoot the enemy in the face, watching their heads blow up like watermelons that have been smashed with a sledge hammer. Then high five their fellow soldiers, and go kill some more that day, and the next and the next. The army/marines is going to want yo to be able to get up every day and go kill people - period- they want you to love it, embrace it, paint your face with the blood of your enemy. And when the mission is over, they want you psychologically stable. Killing the enemy with maximum brutality and efficiency is what it's all about. Women are just not like this, women are not the material with which trained killers are made. Look at society in general - there aren't to many women murders in jail, historically women kill with poison because of the low risk of physical confrontation - not face to face with a hammer. I just don't see my mother / sister / wife (maybe) / daughter being able to kill with a snarl on their face and repeatedly -I think maybe some women could - once - but then they would be a mental wreck. In the Killin business of combat infantry - it's kill quickly and repeatedly - or be killed - the team with the highest body count wins in war. Women just aren't hormonally attuned to be professionally trained killers. I think with the right training most men have the inner killer instinct / capacity to be molded into killing machines - women just don't.
Of course , we can say that women should fight for what they believe in. But what we REALLY should think about is that they die for the country, they kind of take men responsibilities ( i'm not a dude) . But i think it's kind of hard to lose a member of his family because he/she went to fight for the country. And besides , do you people really think that combating is somewhere a good choice of dealing with the "enemy" (you're going to think that i'm crazy or some "peace in the world" person) but seriously my mum lost her grand-mother because she was helping the US army and she's still chocked about it ( who cares, well a lot of people actually) I also think that it's beautiful the help the country we're leaving in but in my opinion it's hard for a woman to die because of the army , but it's a personal choice and we can't argue on it
Are you implying that it is worse for a woman to lose her life in service than it is for a man? If so, it follows that you consider men more expendable than women, both to their families and their country. I think there are a lot of people who would have a problem with that.