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Debate Info

27
20
Nothing wrong with it Offensive and shouldnt be used
Debate Score:47
Arguments:32
Total Votes:48
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 Nothing wrong with it (17)
 
 Offensive and shouldnt be used (15)

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The Nazi Symbol (Swastika)

What is your opinion on people that use the Swastika in their DP's (display pictures) on sites like facebook, createdebate, twitter, ect.? Do you think people shouldn't be using these symbols, or that there is nothing wrong with it and people need to stop crying like fucking babies?

Nothing wrong with it

Side Score: 27
VS.

Offensive and shouldnt be used

Side Score: 20

People need to stop whining about stupid shit like this. There is nothing wrong with the symbol itself, in fact it actually looks pretty bad ass. The only problem people seem to have is that the Swastika was originally used by the Nazi party (and they are wrong in saying that as well, anyway, seeing as it was originally used for Buddhism).

There isn't any initial problem with the symbol itself, just the idiots that get offended by something that shouldn't offend. If people stop getting offended by stupid shit like this then the symbol will lose all 'offending' power; pretty much the same as a swear word losing all power if we cease to give it any.

Side: Nothing wrong with it
1 point

I agree with most of what you said. Or at least what I think the main theme of your comment was; how the sign was originally used in Buddhism and the only reason it offends is because people allow it to offend them. I am a big supporter in the idea that it’s their own damn fault if people get offended, and that goes for just about anything.

About the first part of your comment, I have a few questions. What is it about the sign that makes it look "bad ass" in your opinion? Considering the sign is a perverted version of the solar symbol in other ancient Asian cultures (the middle part of the original sign consisted of a '+' sign instead of an 'X'), wouldn't that be a sufficient enough to say that there is "something wrong" with the sign, not ethically but fundamentally? If a painter were to paint a mural in a church showing the cross as an X instead of a +, aside from it being fucking hilarious, would you consider there to be "something wrong" with that regardless of any offense taken by the Christians in that church?

What I am trying to find out is aside from people being at fault for being offended by something so frivolous as displaying a symbol, is it any more 'right' to brandish the sign while fully aware of its offensive disposition?

Also, is it the symbol itself or what it stands for which causes people to take offense, and that the person who is brandishing it is possibly making a public statement to say that they support what the symbol stands for?

Side: Nothing wrong with it

Oh yeah, and I'm pretty sure my display picture has pissed off a lot of people, and if it has; I'm glad ;)

Side: Nothing wrong with it
TruthAnalyst(48) Disputed
1 point

The point of society is for groups of humans to work together for the common good. Your kind of ideology doesn't support society, yet I would wager that you wouldn't be willing to go live off on your own.

Without everyone working together, each individual would still be responsible for getting their own food, building their own shelter, and providing all their other needs.

Maybe you shouldn't dismiss cooperative society so quickly.

Side: Offensive and shouldnt be used
TruthAnalyst(48) Disputed
1 point

The problem with your argument is that history is important. As a society, we generally try to avoid making the mistakes that have ruined other societies in history. It's called learning from someone else's mistake.

The Holocaust is something that should never be repeated in any form. When we demean the Holocaust, and the symbols supporting it, we begin to erase those lessons.

Side: Offensive and shouldnt be used
1 point

When we demean the Holocaust, and the symbols supporting it, we begin to erase those lessons.

So you are saying we should try and forget about it? Learning about the holocaust is great, and as horrible as it sounds it is probably for the better that it happened. Why do I say this? Well if it hadn't happened then it would have happened eventually (Almost EVERYONE hated Jews, Blacks and homosexuals at the time), and it happening taught us a valuable lesson. It's horrible to look at it like that; but it is quite true, whether you think so or not. We need things like this to happen in order to grow and develop and mature as a species.

Side: Nothing wrong with it
Side: Nothing wrong with it
2 points

You shouldn't be worried by a mere symbol, only by whether or not a particular individual is racist or not. If the mere symbol has an automatic negative connotation, it's your own fault.

Side: Nothing wrong with it
2 points

Well, this one is an interesting one that I would like to chime in on.

1. I have seen this symbol used in other ways in other cultures. In fact, I believe it has significant meaning in the east Indian culture.

2. I have been asked repeatedly to remove or ban people who use certain images. I don't and won't do that until and unless someone's image is truly offensive (pornographic, obscene, etc.). Now, I dom't have a problem with the pyg's avatar, nor hellno2012, in both cases for the same reason. Some may find if offensive, but people should be allowed to express their opinion and views and, public figures are subject to a different set of rules than non-public figures.

So, while I find the swastika offensive if used in terms of Nazi Germany, I do not find it offensive as a symbol.

Supporting Evidence: About.com supporting evidence (history1900s.about.com)
Side: Nothing wrong with it
TruthAnalyst(48) Disputed
1 point

The Nazi swastika is a very specific symbol. According to my knowledge no other culture has ever used it. The boldness, 90-degree angles, and overall tilt(along with the direction of the legs), is unique to the Nazi symbol. As such, it is a symbol of the Nazi ideals.

If someone uses a swastika in the form it is used in other cultures, it shouldn't be considered offensive. But, by no means should we weaken the meaning of one of the most hateful symbols ever created. History is extremely important to humanity's future.

Side: Offensive and shouldnt be used

I hate Nazi's. But the internet is supposed to be a free place for personal expression. So while you may not like it they still have the right to use it. Just how I have a right to display the Soviet flag to say "Hay I'm a Communist!" They have a right to display the Swastika to say "Hay I'm a National Socialist!"

Side: Nothing wrong with it

I'm pro-communism; so I love you

An arrogant and irrelevant statement yes, but whatever, I still love you ;)

Side: Nothing wrong with it
hawaface(6) Disputed
1 point

The swastika says SO MUCH MORE than just "hey, I'm a national socialist!". If someone were to constantly VERBALIZE their support for what the Nazi symbol stands for, that would be a problem, but using an IMAGE to show the same sort of support is OK? What sort of logic is that?

Side: Offensive and shouldnt be used
1 point

Well, I remember a topic like this was brought up a while ago, but instead of indirectly protecting me, it was inderectly attacking me.

There's nothing wrong with the symbol. What you do while parading the symbol is a different story (and I don't think I'm doing anything wrong, either way).

Side: Nothing wrong with it

but instead of indirectly protecting me...

Good work on picking that up ;)

I kinda got sick of seeing people 'diss' you because of your picture.

Side: Nothing wrong with it

Luckily nobody has dissed me and my picture. LvMI------------

Side: Nothing wrong with it
1 point

It's okay by me and personally, I find my own avatar a lot more offensive.

Side: Nothing wrong with it
2 points

Honestly it shouldn't be offensive, but to some people it instigates a sensitive subject. I'm not saying it shouldn't be used, but there's no question that has offended people.

Side: Offensive and shouldnt be used
2 points

Perosnally i think there is nothing wrong with it. I actually think it is cool but to respect others i would not really bring it up infront of someone who could get offended in any way. For jews it is ofcourse/maybe/mostly still offensive. With all due respect to them i dont mind it

Side: Offensive and shouldnt be used
2 points

From the title of this debate, I'll assume that we're talking about the swastika that was used in Hitler's regime and how it is used to reference the Nazi's and their values today. It should not be used for any purpose except to educate. The fact of the matter is, it is not the symbol itself that is offensive, but the deeply offensive and painful roots of it's recent history. Regardless of it's origins, the swastika has come to represent a very dark part of our worlds history. When someone who has been affected by the holocaust sees a swastika, the first thing that comes to their mind is probably not peace or the Buddhist religion. It is extremely offensive to use a symbol that is associated with the hateful elimination of millions of human beings.

Side: Offensive and shouldnt be used
1 point

Personally, it doesn't offend me. But there's something morally disturbing imho with somebody who gets their rocks off by showing it off when it is known widely for its offensive disposition.

Side: Offensive and shouldnt be used
1 point

The Nazi symbol is a sign of evil because of what the Nazis did to the Jews.

Side: Offensive and shouldnt be used
Liber(1728) Disputed
1 point

Why persecute a symbol as a sign of evil simply because it was used by people who, in your opinion, did something evil?

Side: Nothing wrong with it
hawaface(6) Disputed
2 points

Because like someone said in this debate, a symbol becomes what society makes it! Until a major movement happens to change our perception of the Nazi symbol, it will stand for something very ugly. Another thing: If it's his "opinion", and not FACT, that the Nazi's did something evil, then I guess the idea that slavery is wrong is an OPINION, and that people of all ethnicities should be given an equal chance is OPINION.

Side: Offensive and shouldnt be used
1 point

The Nazi Symbol (Swastika) shouldn't be used because it offends a lot of people.

Side: Offensive and shouldnt be used
Liber(1728) Disputed
3 points

My middle finger offends a lot of people. Clearly I ought to cut it off.

Side: Nothing wrong with it
1 point

Care to elaborate? Why does it offend people? The point of this site is to debate.

Side: Nothing wrong with it

There are a few reasons why the Nazi symbol should not be used. I am not referring to Swastika's in general, simply the Nazi interpretation of the symbol.

1 - It is extremely insensitive to people whose families were directly affected by the Holocaust. There is nothing funny about what these people went through.

2 - Nor should such an important(not good, just important) historical event be disrespected. It is similar to OWS protesters comparing themselves to the Americans who starved, lost extremities, and died at Valley Forge. When we don't take the lessons of history seriously, we open the door to repeating past mistakes.

There are immature people everywhere, but their immaturity doesn't make the usage correct. Nobody should make light of events like the Holocaust or Hiroshima. As a society, we should stand together to support the importance and lessons learned from such events.

Side: Offensive and shouldnt be used