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Debate Info

18
14
okay not okay
Debate Score:32
Arguments:37
Total Votes:32
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 okay (15)
 
 not okay (8)

Debate Creator

brontoraptor(28599) pic



3 points

1) Why do you care? Seriously? Heck, you're always venting about people aborting babies, parents not staying together to raise babies, etc. Here's a baby welcomed with loving arms. Would you rather they threw it in the trash can or left it to be a ward of the state?

2) All you do is repost Lifezette stories, a conservative propaganda site. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LifeZette. Why don't you just start each day with a debate saying "Read LifeZette" and then leave us alone?

Side: okay
1 point

Chances are it isn't going to affect the child. Sure, there might be raised eyebrows. But effectively, most of what will be happening is the kid won't be stereotyped. They'll be free to play with whatever toys they like, dress how they like and so on. Maybe some people will have objections to this, but let's face it, it's quite hard to tell the gender of a child of that age. It's only when the child reaches school age that there might be a problem, as other children tend to become more gender conscious and might bully them.

When the kid learns to speak though, the chances are they'll naturally gravitate towards their birth gender anyway as they'll pick up gender whether they're raised with it or not. For example, through TV, pictures of kids in books and interactions at school.

Let people parent in their own way. I don't really agree, but it's unlikely to have a huge impact on the child. Who knows? Until someone does it, we don't know if it'll be beneficial to be raised without social / gendered expectations. If it turns out to be a bad idea and it scars the kid, I think that's when we should step in and criticise.

Oh, and that article is biased (for example, the author refers to the nonbinary parent involved as "she" and the pronouns as grammatically incorrect which is not strictly accurate). If you want a good and healthy debate it's best to counter with an opposing article, even if you don't agree.

Side: okay
3 points

I can find out the gender real quick. All it would take is a one second peak.

Side: not okay
2 points

That's what i'm talking about but hey the Leftist raise the entertainment value when it comes to gender.

Side: not okay
2 points

Some Canadians can't tell the difference between a penis and a vagina.

Side: okay
outlaw60(15368) Clarified
1 point

That would be a Canadian problem but there is one lingering question where did the male and female population come from in Canada.

Side: okay
outlaw60(15368) Clarified
1 point

"Maybe some people will have objections to this, but let's face it, it's quite hard to tell the gender of a child of that age."

LMMFAO how insane is the above statement !!!!!!!!!!!!!

Get over it one is either born a male or a female ! Are you denying science ?

Side: okay
catninja(249) Clarified
1 point

Firstly, please use the dispute function when you wish to dispute something as it's dishonest to get people to score points for your side.

Secondly, you'll get better responses from people if you're more respectful and less provocative. Textspeak is unnecessary and doesn't endear people to your viewpoint.

Thirdly, it is hard to tell the gender of a child that age, if you don't know the child, and assuming they are dressed. If you see a little boy in a princess outfit with long hair, chances are you would not be able to tell they were a boy, in the same way that a little girl with shorter hair and dungarees could be mistaken for a boy.

As for "one is either born a male and a female", that is mostly true. You are usually born with a biological sex of male or female and your appearance reflects this. There are some exceptions such as intersex (where you are not easily identifiable as one or the other), mosaic chromosomes, and androgen insensitivity syndrome (a kind of biological transgenderism where someone looks and identifies as female, but she has XY chromosomes).

In the case of androgen insensitivity syndrome, it is clear that gender is not always linked to sex. Someone with the condition would be raised as female, look female, be referred to by female pronouns, and may be very shocked to find out she was genetically male.

But I digress slightly. Gender and sex are not exactly the same. They're often used as synonyms, but sometimes they don't match up. See my point above for the biological reason. Socially, sometimes people identify as transgender. Your sex is male, but your gender (which is something society has made up) is female, or vice versa.

And before you tell me this is just a modern, liberal Western notion, transgenderism exists in some Native American cultures (such as Two Spirits) and historically in Europe with the Sworn Virgins.

Side: okay
jeffreyone(1383) Disputed
1 point

So doctors should wait till school age before they prepare a birth certificate indicating male or female for a kid?

You can some times give your daughter a boy's hair cut as you cannot determine yet?

You can teach your boy about menstration.

And to seduce his father if he turns to be a girl.

You swallow too much nonsense.

Who feeds you?

Side: not okay
catninja(249) Disputed
1 point

You swallow too much nonsense.

And you don't seem to have much of a grasp of the argument.

So doctors should wait till school age before they prepare a birth certificate indicating male or female for a kid?

No, as I have said, in some countries the parents are no longer obliged to put a gender on the birth certificate. Doctors don't normally do chromosome tests; they put down the gender that the child most resembles. So if you are intersex, they might do surgery to make your genitalia resemble one gender or the other more closely, and put down that gender. If you have androgen insensitivity syndrome, they'd put the baby's gender as female as they're looking at the outward appearance (vagina) not the chromosomes (XY).

You can some times give your daughter a boy's hair cut as you cannot determine yet?

Parents know their kid's biological sex from the get-go. A stranger wouldn't easily be able to tell unless the kid wasn't clothed.

If the daughter expresses a preference for a boy's hair cut, she should be allowed to have one. I had a boy's hair cut as a young child because my hair was too thin for it to look good long.

You can teach your boy about menstration.

You should learn about menstruation whether you're a boy or a girl, then you won't get so many idiots like Ryan Williams (who thought women could turn off their bleeding like a tap, and took to Twitter to "educate" others about it).

Transgender girls and women don't menstruate. Nor do biological women who are born without ovaries. It doesn't mean they shouldn't know the basics.

And to seduce his father if he turns to be a girl.

Wait, let me get this right. You actually think sons who identify as female seduce their fathers?

Do sons who identify as male seduce their mothers?

I'd hope not.

Side: okay

specifically male or female parents tend to put up a gender, since they haven't changed their gender, but transgender parents let the kid decide what gender the kid wants to be of, since they have made a change, not surprising to me at all.

Side: okay
1 point

Logically speaking it is hard to know the gender of a transgender's child.

Side: okay
3 points

Whacked Out Leftist just cannot figure out if they were born male or female. Any sane person will never understand the twisted mind of the Left which gets crazier by the day.

Side: not okay
2 points

Here's the slippery slope of this new age extremist Democrat Party.

How many speeched did Hillary and the Democrat Party give lifting up LGBT agendas.

These extremists are pushing this unnatural abnormal political correctness on America and is the reason Trump won.

We now have Liberals fighting for Pedophile rights to have attractions to our children, but also not be denied jobs around children.

We now constantly hear about gender confusion by dysfunctional people who have the bully pulpit in the Democrat Party.

Side: not okay
1 point

The only criteria which should be used to determine the gender of a newborn baby are the sex organs which are present at birth.

If, as the infant grows it develops interests or pursuits which are opposite to that which it's genitalia would indicate then, and only then should it's sexuality be fixed.

Side: not okay
catninja(249) Disputed
1 point

I'm not particularly disagreeing with you and I think there should be a gender listed on the birth certificate (some countries have recently scrapped this or made it optional).

However, you're conflating gender and sexuality. Gender is the state of being male, female or identifying yourself as neither. Sexuality is who you want to sleep with.

So you can be a lesbian but it doesn't mean you consider yourself to be male.

(If that makes sense).

Side: okay
1 point

Let's educate you in some basic biology. If it has a penis, it's a boy. If it has a vagina, it's a girl. There are 42 million genders, there are 2 genders clearly separated by biological differences. Do you know of any transgender lions? Whales? Monkeys? No, because humans are the only ones smart enough to be so damn dumb.

Side: not okay
catninja(249) Disputed
1 point

There are 42 million genders

I guess this is open to debate, but I'm not going to open that can of worms. But yes, humans identify as they please.

there are 2 genders clearly separated by biological differences

So biological "sex" not gender. You can argue that there are two genders and these relate to the sexes (and to be honest, I won't argue with you), but one is your biology, the other is your state of being.

For the sake of argument I will say there are two sexes, ignoring intersex. In most cases (but not all!) your chromosomes match your genitalia. There are some syndromes and disorders which can cause you to look female but be biologically male.

Do you know of any transgender lions? Whales? Monkeys?

Gender is a human thing. There are, however, animals that pretend to be the other sex.

Male clownfish can change their sex to female.

If the egg of a male chicken embryo is put in a cold place, the chicken hatches as a fully functioning female, but it still has male chromosomes.

So even biological sex is really not as clear-cut as you'd think.

No, because humans are the only ones smart enough to be so damn dumb.

Most animals are more concerned with survival. It's like Maslow's hierarchy of needs. You have intelligence, you have all you need to survive, that's when you start thinking about your identity. I'm not saying transgenderism doesn't occur in the developing world but it's still very much a first world phenomena.

Side: okay