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31
35
Do Don't
Debate Score:66
Arguments:21
Total Votes:85
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 Don't (16)

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What Capitalists Forget To Mention When They Talk About Marx

Is that he produced the most thorough economic and philosophical analysis the world has ever seen on the subject of why capitalism is unsustainable. He left absolutely no doubt that it cannot survive because it is exploitative, hierarchical and ultimately ends in hegemony (i.e. dictatorship of one form or another). 

Capitalists would much sooner you forget this, which is why all you will ever hear out of their mouths are distortions about how Communism won't ever work, can't ever work, hasn't ever worked, blah blah blah. They are desperate to project the catastrophic failures of their own system onto Marx because that way they don't have to face the reality that their own ideology is doomed. Who even cares if Communism works or not? It's a sinister and deliberate deflection of the point because capitalism doesn't bloody well work either! We all learned that in 2008, but capitalists mention 2008 even less than they mention Marx's critique of capitalism. And when they do mention it, believe me, they still find ways to blame Marx.

Do

Side Score: 31
VS.

Don't

Side Score: 35
3 points

What Capitalists Forget To Mention When They Talk About Marx

That he lived in the country that would become Nazi Germany?

Side: Do
1 point

Know Karl Marx was in favor of over throwing Capitalism but the Holder of the Glass Pipe in it's narcotic stupor some how wants to tie an Anti Capitalist to Capitalism !!!!!!!

Nom the Burrito you are an idiot and proud to prove it through your pure stupidity !!!!

Side: Do
1 point

Know Karl Marx was in favor of over throwing Capitalism

Do you know why he wanted to overthrow capitalism? I'll give you a completely honest answer.

Because he understood it considerably more clearly than you do.

Side: Don't
outlaw60(15500) Disputed
1 point

Ryan the Burrito your loved Marx was a Communist !!!!!!!!!!

During his first few months in Paris, Marx became a communist and set down his views in a series of writings known as the Economic and Philosophical Manuscripts (1844)

Deny it Glass Pipe !!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Side: Do
1 point

We all learned that in 2008, but capitalists mention 2008 even less than they mention Marx's critique of capitalism. And when they do mention it, believe me, they still find ways to blame Marx.

Burrito history tells us this - His real mission in life was to contribute, in one way or another, to the overthrow of capitalist society and of the state institutions which it had brought into being, to contribute to the liberation of the modern proletariat, which he was the first to make conscious of its own position and its needs, conscious of the conditions of its emancipation.

Now Ryan you want to say Marx was a Capitalist ? Was your beloved Marx a Socialist Capitalist ?????????

Side: Do
4 points

What Capitalists Forget To Mention When They Talk About Marx

That he created an ideology that gave Hitler, Stalin, Mao, and Pol Pot some jacked up ideas?

Side: Don't
Fiora(46) Disputed
1 point

That he created an ideology that gave Hitler, Stalin, Mao, and Pol Pot some jacked up ideas?

Hitler was far right, Stalin and Mao used communism as a carrot on a stick to lure the masses into fascism, Pol Pot didn't know what Marxism even is because he was absolutely yonkers.

Side: Do
brontoraptor(28861) Disputed Banned
4 points

Pol Pot was absolutely yonkers.

Name a Communist leader who isn't a tyrant or absolutely yonkers.

Side: Don't
brontoraptor(28861) Disputed Banned
3 points

Stalin and Mao used communism as a carrot on a stick

That's what cult leaders do. Put a fairytale on a stick and lead the sheep to the slaughter.

Side: Don't
brontoraptor(28861) Disputed Banned
2 points

Hermann Rauschning, for example, a Danzig Nazi who knew Hitler before and after his accession to power in 1933, tells how in private Hitler acknowledged his profound debt to the Marxian tradition. "I have learned a great deal from Marxism" he once remarked, "as I do not hesitate to admit". He was proud of a knowledge of Marxist texts acquired in his student days before the First World War and later in a Bavarian prison, in 1924, after the failure of the Munich putsch. The trouble with Weimar Republic politicians, he told Otto Wagener at much the same time, was that "they had never even read Marx", implying that no one who had failed to read so important an author could even begin to understand the modern world; in consequence, he went on, they imagined that the October revolution in 1917 had been "a private Russian affair", whereas in fact it had changed the whole course of human history! His differences with the communists, he explained, were less ideological than tactical. German communists he had known before he took power, he told Rauschning, thought politics meant talking and writing. They were mere pamphleteers, whereas "I have put into practice what these peddlers and pen pushers have timidly begun", adding revealingly that "the whole of National Socialism" was based on Marx.

https://www.independent.co.uk/arts-entertainment/hitler-and-the-socialist-dream-1186455.html

Side: Don't
1 point

Hermann Rauschning, for example, a Danzig Nazi who knew Hitler before and after his accession to power in 1933, tells how in private Hitler acknowledged his profound debt to the Marxian tradition. "I have learned a great deal from Marxism" he once remarked, "as I do not hesitate to admit". He was proud of a knowledge of Marxist texts acquired in his student days before the First World War and later in a Bavarian prison, in 1924, after the failure of the Munich putsch. The trouble with Weimar Republic politicians, he told Otto Wagener at much the same time, was that "they had never even read Marx", implying that no one who had failed to read so important an author could even begin to understand the modern world; in consequence, he went on, they imagined that the October revolution in 1917 had been "a private Russian affair", whereas in fact it had changed the whole course of human history! His differences with the communists, he explained, were less ideological than tactical. German communists he had known before he took power, he told Rauschning, thought politics meant talking and writing. They were mere pamphleteers, whereas "I have put into practice what these peddlers and pen pushers have timidly begun", adding revealingly that "the whole of National Socialism" was based on Marx.

https://www.independent.co.uk/arts-entertainment/hitler-and-the-socialist-dream-1186455.html

Side: Don't

Totally unrelated to the United States of America.

All the Capitalism Karl Marx never addressed. Capitalism by basic principle is independence. Nothing more and it is the human Nature which initiates economic failures by use of philosophy. Marx was educated as civil counsel unbound to a United State Constitutional principle and become stateless due to publications he had written.

Two important facts Marx did not address United State by Constitution and Marx became stateless. Was this a coincidence, doubtful. Also all Capitalism would remember of Marx is he was by principle a capitalist as his belief was that Capital holdings could be owned. His grievance was over only who takes ownership as an understanding to power.

Socialism is the enemy of independence. Marx wanted the independence without the burdens of question.

Side: Don't
2 points

Capitalism by basic principle is independence.

Well no, I don't agree. True independence is anarchy. You are not independent because both government and the private sector work to control and/or predict your movements and behaviours.

Nothing more and it is the human Nature which initiates economic failures by use of philosophy

This is a sub-debate because there is absolutely no material evidence of anything which could accurately be described as "human nature". Several high profile philosophers have outright denied its existence altogether.

Side: Do
Talkative(51) Banned
1 point

Karl Marx is a joke. He was a bum who lived off his friend. From what I've heard he impregnated a maid and then threw her out on the streets to fend herself. He had no idea how the world worked and never had a real job. He had never visited any factories yet wrote about them. He's actually exactly what most millenial socialists are. Doesn't produce, leeches off others, has no real world experience yet loves to criticise the failure of society while not doing anything to better himself or others.

Capitalism is by far the greatest economic system designed in human history and in every single form of measurement. BY FAR.

Side: Don't
1 point

Karl Marx is a joke. He was a bum who lived off his friend.

Right. A bum who wrote dozens of books, articles and journal entries, worked as a journalist for over decade without making a living wage (hence your distortion that he was a "bum" simply because he was poor), acquired a doctorate in philosophy, taught himself economics, and who -- with no relationship whatsoever to your attack against him -- single-handedly produced the most thorough and in-depth criticism of capitalism the world has ever seen.

Marx was probably one of the most hard working academics who ever lived, so you can just get out of my debate to be honest. I'm not in the mood for character attacks rooted in distortions and lies. That's the sort of thing fascists are best known for.

Side: Do
1 point

Ryan the Burrito known as Nom what is up LMMFAO !!!!

What really should be stated is Ryan the Burrito or Nom the Marxist ????

Nom is confused and no one should expect any less from a Marxist !

The worker becomes all the poorer the more wealth he produces, the more his production increases in power and range. The worker becomes an ever cheaper commodity the more commodities he creates. With the increasing value of the world of things proceeds in direct proportion to the devaluation of the world of men. Labour produces not only commodities; it produces itself and the worker as a commodity -- and does so in the proportion in which it produces commodities generally.

Well spoken by a Socialist ! Are you in agreement there Socialist ?????????

Side: Don't
1 point

Burrito Ryan who loves Marx !!!!!!!!!

The philosopher, social scientist, historian and revolutionary, Karl Marx, is without a doubt the most influential socialist thinker to emerge in the 19th century. Although he was largely ignored by scholars in his own lifetime, his social, economic and political ideas gained rapid acceptance in the socialist movement after his death in 1883. Until quite recently almost half the population of the world lived under regimes that claim to be Marxist. This very success, however, has meant that the original ideas of Marx have often been modified and his meanings adapted to a great variety of political circumstances. In addition, the fact that Marx delayed publication of many of his writings meant that is been only recently that scholars had the opportunity to appreciate Marx's intellectual stature.

Nom the Burrito you agree Marxist regimes are a suckess LMMFAO !!!!!!!!!

Side: Don't
1 point

Don't forget Ryan that Marx was a Communist much as you are Burrito !!!!!!!!!!

Arriving in Paris at the end of 1843, Marx rapidly made contact with organized groups of émigré German workers and with various sects of French socialists. He also edited the short-lived Deutsch-Französische Jahrbücher which was intended to bridge French socialism and the German radical Hegelians. During his first few months in Paris, Marx became a communist and set down his views in a series of writings known as the Economic and Philosophical Manuscripts (1844), which remained unpublished until the 1930s. In the Manuscripts, Marx outlined a humanist conception of communism, influenced by the philosophy of Ludwig Feuerbach and based on a contrast between the alienated nature of labor under capitalism and a communist society in which human beings freely developed their nature in cooperative production. It was also in Paris that Marx developed his lifelong partnership with Friedrich Engels (1820-1895).

Side: Don't
1 point

Forget Ryan Shannon that you are a Socialist/ Communist !!!!!!!!!!!

For Marx was before all else a revolutionist. His real mission in life was to contribute, in one way or another, to the overthrow of capitalist society and of the state institutions which it had brought into being, to contribute to the liberation of the modern proletariat, which he was the first to make conscious of its own position and its needs, conscious of the conditions of its emancipation. Fighting was his element. And he fought with a passion, a tenacity and a success such as few could rival. His work on the first Rheinische Zeitung (1842), the Paris Vorwarts (1844), the Deutsche Brusseler Zeitung (1847), the Neue Rheinische Zeitung (1848-49), the New York Tribune (1852-61), and, in addition to these, a host of militant pamphlets, work in organisations in Paris, Brussels and London, and finally, crowning all, the formation of the great International Working Men's Association -- this was indeed an achievement of which its founder might well have been proud even if he had done nothing else.

Burrito did you fail to mention after hitting the Glass Pipe that Marx wanted the overthrow of capitalist society ?

I have never seen such Historical Stupidity as you exhibit !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Side: Don't