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Reward Points:82
Efficiency: Efficiency is a measure of the effectiveness of your arguments. It is the number of up votes divided by the total number of votes you have (percentage of votes that are positive).

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Arguments:34
Debates:10
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10 most recent arguments.
1 point

I'm sorry, WHAT? You are kidding right? First of all, are you in the Navy? Have you been to the bottom of the ocean? If you want a place to be by yourself, make yourself a "man cave" a game room. I have to say that your statement "angered to hear that women are now allowed" actually made me wrinkle up my forehead. First, what rights should men have that women shouldn't? How exactly are men getting trampled over? The only industry that was primarily women only (prostitution houses) has now started hiring men to work as prostitutes, so where are your rights being lowered? And for the record, no one "ALLOWS" me to do anything. I have the same rights as everyone else.

1 point

I am curious, how is being pregnant relevant? In the article, she was not pregnant during her combat service, or sent home because she was pregnant. What exactly do you mean that it is relevant?

3 points

Maybe it was my training, or maybe it was growing up as the little girl surrounded by big boy cousins, but I was never raped while I was in the military. I would honestly fight to the death. By the way, did you know that in the military according to the Uniform Code of Military Justice, the sentence for Rape is actually death? Just to give you a little more information on the subject. Good luck with your research.

1 point

Please provide these so called experimental outcomes. I would like to see them. Since 2003 the United States military has had no problem sending female soldiers out to battle. I was in the Army and deployed 3 times, as I said earlier, so I am waiting for someone to tell me that I am not physically capable to do what I did, which was be in combat for 365 at a time, per deployment. Yes I had a weapon, yes I fired my weapon, yes my military drivers license has around 10 different vehicles I am trained and authorized to drive (and we aren't talking neon's). I am not the minority of females here, I am the majority of those that are in the military. So while you are laying out the facts, please lay out the the entire set, maybe a link to these so called experiments because during the entire time I was in the military, I took part in no such experiments.

Supporting Evidence: women in combat (userpages.aug.com)
2 points

I feel that I must dispute you because I went to public school, and I am not ill informed or illiterate. When you weigh out the cost/benefit to keeping your kids at home, they could (and could is meant literally, not will) learn more of what you want to teach them, but they will also face numerous social problems. The child's social skills will be far behind those that were afforded the opportunity to interact with other children all day during the school season. I wonder MrManhattan, were you home schooled? My second question to you would be what is your IQ?

1 point

I am a little discontented by the arguments so far. While yes, kids in school do get teased, I believe it teaches them about the real world. I think it is wrong to home school a child then let that same child out into the "real world" with no real world training. Children that are home schooled are generally less able to form relationships (whether social, working, or romantic) because they do not know how to deal with people. These children do not have the skills to be able to interact with groups of people. I can only imagine the trust issues that these children have. While my school years weren't the best, like most other adults, I was afforded the opportunity to learn to interact with different people, I was able to learn how to resolve conflict, I was able to learn to debate with someone I did not know. The US public school system does need reform, we do need to teach our children better, but if your position is to promote home schooling because the public school system is inadequate, my response is teach your children what you think they should learn on your own, on the weekends, during the evenings. I was in some ways lucky, I knew how to read and write by the time I was three, and I can attribute that to my mother supplying me with coloring books, crayons, and reading materials that she taught me to use. My bottom line here, no I do not think home schooling should be encouraged, I believe we would do our children more good by paying teachers better salaries, hiring those that are prepared to "teach our children", correct the school lunch program and not feed our children the same meals that prisoners are being fed, and fighting for a complete reform of the public school system.

Supporting Evidence: DC Public School Watch (www.dcpswatch.com)
1 point

Kinda, sorry you were down-voted but that wasn't me. You have the right to your opinion. I am on C.D. only to engage in interesting conversation, not take away points because someone called me a name. If you think I am a "retard" that's fine, but I think I have shown quite well that if I do indeed have any mental disabilities, they do not affect my ability to debate, research, maintain conversations, or reason, therefor they would be slight if any.

My referrals were directed to polygamous relationships in that manner because that is the side of the debate I am on. Of course I want to show that my debate is the strongest, which is why I provided the information I did. It was Maholl's job to prove me otherwise. As I am sure you are well aware, there are going to always be experts on both sides. I simply referenced the ones that supported my argument.

A. Did that with my research.

B. Did that with my research.

C. Did that with my research.

D. Did that with my research.

Now it is your turn to do research, and provide a valid argument. One that, in order to make you seem as if you actually know what you are talking about, contains facts rather than insignificant words thrown together to form occasional sentence fragments.

3 points

You are a man, you know it's never that simple. The cost/benefit analysis numbers just don't work out in favor of it, lol.

3 points

You are absolutely correct, I have done my research and here are my facts. Webster’s International Dictionary has definitions of a cult that include "a small or narrow circle of persons united by devotion or allegiance to some program, tendency, or figure (as one of limited popular appeal); a system of beliefs and rituals connected with worship; or a religion regarded as unorthodox or spurious." It must first be understood that the basic structure of polygamy is authoritarian and secretive. The men who practice it believe they have the authority to govern and control their wives and children in the family relationship. The resemblances between survivors of polygamy and survivors of domestic violence and religious cults simply cannot be ignored.

Clearly, the negative psychological impact on the mothers and their children in such a society is extensive. When an individual is denied personal desires, emotional expression, self-will and identity, certain psychological consequences can be expected. These consequences fall along a continuum from moderate to extreme, depending on the resilience and emotional resources of the individual, and the nature of the abuses she has suffered. When a woman, in particular, is not allowed to assert her desires, needs and rights as an individual, she suffers from symptoms of anxiety, depression and low self-esteem. Anxiety often results from a loss of control over her life; depression from feeling powerless to make a difference; and low self-esteem from lack of appreciation of herself as an individual and insufficient personal experience that affirms her sense of worth. "Learned helplessness," is a real phenomena in which one learns that one’s actions have little impact on the outcome, and that there is nothing one can do to escape undesirable conditions. When an individual is suffering from learned helplessness, it is only a matter of time before she gives up. A sense of purpose is lost and without this driving force, everything seems to be a chore, or dark drudgery.

As indicated previously, secrecy is the lifeblood of the polygamous family. Secrecy is not a healthy condition in which a child can grow. Secrets can harbor a compromise of integrity, an "us against them" orientation, a superiority attitude, an end justifies the means modus operandi, justification of wrongful behavior, and a failure to receive feedback from others as to the appropriateness or correctness of what one is doing. Secrecy can become a way of life for a child, one that is strongly influenced by the philosophy "we do not talk about what is going on in our home." How society works can also be distorted in the mind of the child influenced by polygamous beliefs. For example, if children are watchdogs to tell the parent or leader inappropriate words or actions (according to the belief system of the polygamous cult) of siblings or other adults, a suspicious and even paranoid mind set can develop. This paranoia involves looking upon others as the enemy or as one to protect oneself from, including those who could be supportive and helpful in one’s life. It is common for members of the polygamous family to be watched, monitored and controlled. Contact with friends outside "the family" can also be discouraged with the resultant increased isolation and alienation.

Research and clinical experience has demonstrated that victims of domestic violence are similar to survivors of polygamist relationships and have predictable characteristics or patterns of behavior (Utah State Sponsored Domestic Violence Training & Women’s Rural Advocacy Programs). Following are some of those characteristics which also constitute the "Battered Woman Syndrome":

1. Blames herself for her batterer’s behavior and often makes excuses for him.

2. Learned hopefulness-always believes he’ll stop the abuse and the relationship will get better.

3. Minimizes or blocks out the most dangerous parts of the assaults.

4. Believes that she controls his assaults by her behavior and thus constantly tracks his moods in her head; feels lost and in danger if she has no contact with him.

5. Post Traumatic Stress Symptoms are common when she is separated from her batterer.

6. Is economically dependent on her batterer regardless of income level due to lack of access to the family income.

7. Is isolated from friends and family.

8. Has been systematically "boxed in" psychologically by the power and control tactics used by the abuser. (Emotional abuse).

9. Is misunderstood by outside observers and expects people to blame and judge her. The result is that she is hypersensitive to subtle blaming statements.

10. She is more likely to be seriously injured or murdered when she is separated from the batterer.

11. Frequently comes from a childhood with domestic violence history.

12. Doesn’t trust the "system." It has probably treated her badly in the past.

13. Has been put in constant double binds resulting in a hesitancy to make decisions, insecurity and low self-esteem.

14. Is most likely to get hit for the first time when pregnant or on her wedding day.

15. Is frequently sexually abused by her batterer.

16. Shows guilt, ambivalence, and/or fear over living conditions.

17. Feels isolated and untrusting of others, despite involvement in the community.

18. Has a poor self-concept (this may not have been true before the relationship).

19. Feels angry, embarrassed, and ashamed.

20. Is fearful of being insane.

21. Has learned to feel helpless and feels powerless.

22. Has unexplained injuries that may go untreated.

My References Include

Dellinger, R. (1985). Cults and kids: A study of coercion. Nebraska: Boys Town.

Garvin, C. (2003). The patriarch, polygamy and power. Sacramento News & Review, Chico Community Publishing, Inc.

Greek, A. & Greek, A. (1985). Mind abuse by cults and others. Portland, Ore.: Positive Action Center.

Harper, C.L. & LeBeau, B.F., (1993). The social adaptation of marginal religious movements in America. Sociology of Religion, Vol. 54.

Langone, M.D. & Eisenberg, G.. Children and cults: A study. Printed 1/17/05 from http://www.factnet.org/Scientology/chldclt2.htm?FACTNet.

Llewellyn, J.R. (2004). Polygamy Under Attack: From Tom Green to Brian David Mitchell. Agreka Books, LLC.

Makcert, M. (2000). The sixth of seven wives: Escape from modern day polygamy. Xpolygamist.com, Salt Lake City, UT.

Mauss, A.L. & Barlow, P.L. (1991). Church, sect, and scripture. Sociological Analysis, Vol 52.

Mazur, E.M. (2002). Minority religions and limitations on religious freedom. Social Education, 66, 3, 149+.

Nock, D.A. (1987). Cult, sect, and church in Canada: A re-examination of Stark and Bainbridge. Canadian Review of Sociology and Anthropology, Vol 24.

Ofshe, R. & Singer, M. (1986). Attacks on peripheral versus central elements of self and the impact of thought reforming techniques. The Cultic Studies Journal, Vol. 3, No. 1.

Penalver, E. (1997). The concept of religion. Yale Law Journal, Vol 107.

Singer, M. (1979). Coming out of the cults. Psychology Today, January.

Stark, R. (1995). Reconstructing the rise of Christianity: the role of women. Sociology of Religion, Vol. 56.

Thies, C.F. (2000). The Success of American communes. Southern Economic Journal, 67, 1, 186.

Utah Attorney General (2005). The Primer: Helping victims of domestic violence and child abuse in polygamous communities.

Van Der Vyver, J.D. (1996). Religious fundamentalism and human rights. Journal of International Affairs, 50, 1, 21+.

2 points

You are correct, I come from, and currently reside in the U.S. Although I appreciate the quote provided, I don't believe plural marriage is barbaric, savage or wild, I believe it is degrading to the women who are in those relationships. I sincerely believe everyone has the right to whatever life they choose, and that one of plural marriage is not for me, however, I believe there are serious psychological issues that the women in these marriages have that are not being addressed but yet being passed on to the children in a vicious cycle that only a small percentage make it out of such as a depersonalization where the individual loses all sense of identity. Let me clarify "Wifely Duties" for you. In no way do I mean the stereotypical pre-women's right's wifely duties. I mean, being faithful, supportive, honest, giving, helpful, honorable, etc. I stated "may cook dinner" which I happen to have a passion for, and "may read to the children" which I again have a passion for. I have a career just like my husband does. I have a degree just like my husband does. I bring home the bacon just like my husband does, so I don't want you to misinterpret my definition of wifely duties. I don't understand how my need to fulfill my wifely duties have anything in common with the men I view as being selfish for wanting to live out this type of fantasy. Your tone does not bother me, your lack of proper argument does. I am trying to understand your dispute here. If I say I am against it, then you are expected to give me reasons why I should change my opinion, which I have yet to see. You asked "Why?" when I stated "If a man loves you, he will want to be faithful to you, and you alone". I think the better question is why wouldn't he?

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Winning Position: Plural Marriage
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Winning Position: He went too far
Winning Position: Yes, they need discipline
Winning Position: I am for the President's speech
Winning Position: Customer Service sucks

About Me


"I just like to engage in interesting conversation. I am a people watcher, so being part of the debate allows me to see other people's views."

Biographical Information
Gender: Lady
Marital Status: In a Relationship
Political Party: Other
Country: United States

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