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Why is creationism ridiculous?
I challange creationists to watch these 36 videos (if you haven't already) without giving up at some point (I'm not asking you to see them all in one go, though), and I challange creationists to try to understand what creationism is really about. I challange creationists to accept what has been confirmed through rigorous tests in a zero tolerance context (where forging of information leads to lawsuits and severe penalties), I challange creationists to open their eyes.
Since creationism is majorly made of people who don't know anything they're talking about, and who too often contradict each other and themselves, what makes you still "believe" in it?
I strongly recomend these videos to everyone, even evolutionists, mainly because they show you how "evil" criationism is being to our society, especially to our young children, by brainwashing people, distorting information in media broadcasts (with forged proof sometimes), raising money from the delusioned people, slowing and sabotaging science advancements and knowledge, etc
Seems like name of videos should be Why is this creationists an idiot. Didnt know one person could acount for an entire grp of people . I never got to vote for an 18 yr old kid to be the mouthpiece for creationism. Only watched 2 videos but really making some scientist wanna be 18 year old with no idea what hes saying look dumb isnt that hard.
I am an agnostic atheist who strongly supports evolution, and spend most of my time on this site debating creationists. I have also seen this series all the way through. All that being said, I find your assessment fair, at least as far as the earlier episodes are concerned. It is true that as the series starts out Thunderf00t picks some of the most ludicrous arguments from some of the bigger idiots in creationism, and that these specific arguments are not necessarily indicative of the whole movement. Although he never quite lets go of VenomFangX, as the series progresses he does single out higher profile creationism proponents (Kent Hovind, Ray Comfort, the Discovery Institute, Sarah Palin, Ben Stein) and moves into more central points of the debate. Towards the end he describes why he feels the way he does, and why he so passionately supports science and attainment of information.
"I never got to vote for an 18 yr old kid to be the mouthpiece for creationism."
Totally fair statement. The point of this series, however, is to highlight that the difference between VenomFangX and the more central members of the movement is a mighty thin line, and at the end of the day, the only real line of delineation between them is the level of eloquence and education that they display (and even that is hardly universal). Thunderf00t's point, I believe, is that the creationism side of the debate is not one of intellectuality but of emotion masquerading as intellect.
I like his series, I find it both entertaining and informative, but I think a much better series on the subject is AronRa's "Foundational Falsehoods of Creationism."
I like his series, I find it both entertaining and informative, but I think a much better series on the subject is AronRa's "Foundational Falsehoods of Creationism."
Also, I agree with you. VenomFartX is pretty much the same as the others, the diference is merely the context in which they speak through. Youtube may not seem too "dangerous" at first, but it can be just as much as the talk show on TV. And that makes these guys a bit of a problem...
And btw, one important aspect of TF's videos is the underlining of what the academic level of science is about. This is one of the most common misconceptions. People tend to believe that they aren't very sure of anything, when in reality they don't approve anything as true if they aren't sure of it. And he also mentions zero tolerance in science. I didn't know about that, but if it's is really true, then it makes me feel even safer in my perspective of science.
Yeah, I have plenty of respect for DonExodus as well. That particular video is a good one to keep on file, as it is likely we will encounter that list sooner or later while debating creationists.
"Youtube may not seem too "dangerous" at first, but it can be just as much as the talk show on TV."
I concur, and the bloggers and vloggers are likely to continue to surge in prominence over the next few generations. But that can be used to the advantage of any side of any issue. Its good that we have our own counterparts putting in effort. And you and I can do these things too.
"one important aspect of TF's videos is the underlining of what the academic level of science is about."
Very true. In my opinion, the scientific misconceptions promoted by creationists are one of two big problems in the debate. The other is their reliance on faith as a methodology for discovering "truth". Both factors make it very difficult to show them what is really going on, and both require constant ground-level work to even have a chance at showing people how potentially dangerous this movement can be if allowed more political clout.
AronRa states the importance of consistency in academic level of science. I haven't yet watched many of his videos but so far I like it. He's ver objective, among other good things.
...the scientific misconceptions promoted by creationists...
It occured to me now that in my country there arent' many creationists. I think most religious people here don't even think very much about this, but I'm convinced that most reasonably educated ones do believe the theory of evolution makes more sense than having it all pop out of nowhere in a weak (I didn't mention atheists and alike, because these tend to be even more educated).
But despite that, there's still the problem of the scientific misconception. And, at least here, pop culture and sensational media are to blame for confusing people into believing that science is not very strict... One great example of that is the public opinion on global warming. Hardly anyone thinks scientists are quite certain about it.
Which is one of the things I really like about him. There are a lot of aggressive, militant atheists out there. I can see why they talk the way they do, but they aren't convincing any Christians with their vitriol. I think this topic requires information and objectivity, and should not be based on drawing lines in the sand. For the most part, AronRa is very good at using the appropriate tactics.
"It occured to me now that in my country there arent' many creationists."
The US almost certainly has the largest population of these people, although the movement is quickly gaining steam in other English-Speaking countries (such as UK and Australia.) The problem isn't necessarily with their beliefs per se, but with the political clout they can muster in large numbers. They may believe what they want, but when they try to promote it through pseudo-science or legislation, it becomes a potential problem. Education is a key tactic against them, but some have chosen to rebel against the education. I fear we fight an uphill battle. But I keep marching up that hill.
although the movement is quickly gaining steam in other English-Speaking countries (such as UK and Australia.)
That was my fear when I've seen how dangerously mainstream they have become in the US. I didn't really know about them until recently. At first I tought they were just some usual christians like any other with just a few new arguments to try to "sell their vacuum-cleeners". But this is far worse than many other bad things I've seen.
But what impresses me most is the media not being selective in this matter... and the government not imposing a limit there.
"But what impresses me most is the media not being selective in this matter... and the government not imposing a limit there."
That depends on the media outlet. All mainstream news sources in America are somewhat biased. They each have different audiences, and they cater to them. Most of the fundamentalists get their news from Fox, so Fox has something to gain by giving them face time. More left-wing oriented news sources try to ignore or criticize them, but usually aim for an objective and non-combative stance.
As far as the government not imposing a limit, well if you are referring to the media, the government is not supposed to get involved in what the media reports except in cases of national security. And the same pretty much goes for everything else. Our constitution guarantees a freedom "of and from religion", meaning that while they aren't supposed to legislate something based purely on religion, they also aren't supposed to censor or limit religious activity as long as the religion doesn't break the law. And honestly, I think this is for the best. What it means though, is it is up to the citizens to deal with these situations, and the creationists are getting increasing support and organization. Also, when legislation is up to the public vote, religious tenants can and do end up getting de facto government approval if the majority votes that way. It all gets very tricky, but they haven't stolen the country yet.
Aren't there any laws against false information, deliberate official information distortion, opinion inducing, and certain other types of severe bias? (I think I'm lacking better words for these...)
The way I see it, I suppose there may be laws for some of the things they've been doing. I forgot most of them by now... Even though they might not be very influent in court...
My country is very big on freedom of speech. For the most part, we are to be able to say whatever we want, even lie in most cases, without fear of prosecution. Combine this with the federal protection of religion, and one would have to be extremely careful about prosecuting religious groups or leaders, especially since religious conservatives are extremely powerful. The exception comes when they get involved in outright fraud or tax evasion, or other such financial crimes. Kent Hovind is in jail for over 40 counts of such crimes, but most of them aren't as corrupt (or stupid) as he is. The truth is, what they're doing is legal, and I honestly think it should be. Persecuting religion or limiting freedom of speech could lead to an authoritarian slippery slope that I don't want to deal with (although some might argue that that is exactly where the country will end up if they keep gaining power, but I think that's far too speculative a notion to warrant violating their rights for).
So far, at least, the Courts have been successful at keeping creationism out of our public schools, but the battle may never be truly over.
Seems like name of videos should be Why is this creationists an idiot.
Nah, it's not just him. It would be a relief if it was only that kid. That's why this guy made so many videos, it's a lot of people, and a lot of misconceptions.
And I think he still didn't reach the end of it yet...
