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Debate Info

5
8
Yes No
Debate Score:13
Arguments:19
Total Votes:14
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 Yes (5)
 
 No (8)

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Is criticism of Isreali state policy, and/or US support of it, mistaken for anti-semitism?

Yes

Side Score: 5
VS.

No

Side Score: 8
1 point

You people are talking a mountain of shit.

AIPAC specifically targets people and calls them anti semetic for any attacks on Israel. There are 1000s of reflexive defenders of zionism, who will attack dog anyone who says anything even remotely construed as criticism of Israel or support for her enemies, as jew hating anti semitism.

AIPAC and their super friends are probably more hardline then the Israeli government itself, if thats even possible.

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As a side note a lot of people who hate Israel happen to be anti semitic. Doesnt really change the fact that they are two different things.

Most people who are anti semitic truly hate jews and will start going on about jews at the earliest opportunity.

Most people who are just hating on Israel itself, are drawing parallels between Israeli policy and other despotic and tyrannical regimes, and thats their context for hating israel.

Two different things.

Lastly America jews often have never even been to israel or the holocaust, and these two things are like the external badges of being jewish. Therefore, its a reflexive and stupid mentality, that links the two things in all things.

Side: Yes
Stickers(1037) Clarified
1 point

To avoid complicating things, you're asserting that:

1) AIPAC is bad.

2) Israeli policy is worse.

3) A lot of people who hate Israel are anti semitic.

Nothing in your comment refutes, or even addresses the topic of the debate, which is:

whether or not criticism of Isreali state policy, and/or US support of it, mistaken for anti-semitism

Also, it appears to me that you posted your argument on the wrong side.

Side: Yes
johnny5(135) Disputed
1 point

1 AIPAC is an old boys network and basically a terrorist organisation/cult and is dangerous, and in conflict with american national interest and the concepts of truth and freedom in mainstream american media and government. Is the black power movement good? It has merits. If the black muslims had a massive lobby and controlling hand in american media and government and were using it to masterbate up a stiffy for war against non muslim blacks in africa and self defeating, self defecating policies, and propaganda and lies in americas media.. would that be a bad thing. Probably.

2 Israeli policy is fucked up.

3 A lot of people who hate israel hate jews.

And its not mistaken for anti semitism, it is understood as criticism for israel and attacked as anti semitism anyways.

The correct assertion im making is that they know its not anti semitism and straw man it as anti semitism anyways. And by "they", i mean media corporate and political zionists and also garden variety israel / zionism supporters.

Side: No
mosc(72) Disputed
1 point

1) The AIPAC lobby bad? Then all lobbies merit the same description.

2) Israel exists as a Independent nation who's national self interests and strategic policies of State operate completely or almost completely independent for the Great American Ally.

3) Anti Semitic applies to Jewish minorities living in none Jewish countries. Racists its most definitely not limited to Jews living in foreign countries.

Israel opposes the 2 State Solution. Israel condemns the 2 State Solution as an imperialist attempt made by Great Powers Russia, EU, the US before Trump, and the UN, to divide the tiny Jewish state into 2 hostile States.

Israel rejects this divide and conquer imperialism which the coward Chamberlain unilaterally imposed upon the Czech State in 1938 and which FDR and Stalin unilaterally imposed upon both Korea and Vietnam in 1945. Throughout the European War, the US denounced French imperialism. Yet Truman's government transported the French in American boats back to Vietnam to restore French colonial rule!

The French routinely condemns Israel for use of disproportionate force against stateless Arab terrorism. Yet so conveniently ignores Frances torture and murder of some 5 million Algerians and 1 million Vietnamese in the last century alone.

Side: No

I think it is not right to call people racist just for criticizing Israel. Criticizing a government is not racist.

Side: Yes
1 point

If your civil about your views then I don't think it's anti-Semitism. But when I see someone say, "Hitler was a good man. He was riding the Earth of parasites" or something like that really makes me sick and shows me that person is sick in the head.

That really strikes a nerve in me. What if I said the Jews didn't kill enough Arabs in their war in 1948?

Side: No
1 point

I'd have to say "no", unless someone brings up zionism .

Side: No
Troy8(2431) Clarified
2 points

What do you mean? Could you give an example?

Side: Yes
Stickers(1037) Clarified
1 point

Man, we haven't debated in ages.

From my personal experience, whenever someone brings up "zionism", people tend to associate the name with conspiracies against jews, as if zionism is some sort of secret conspiracy that the jews are engaged in.

I'm not even sure why. Perhaps it's because we hear very little of zionism on televised news, but know just enough about it to know that it pertains to jewish people. Of course, we could also just be hearing very little of zionism in televised news because of negative associations that it carries.

Side: Yes
mosc(72) Clarified
1 point

Zionism = Jewish nationalism. Arab nationalism since 1948 its clearly anti-semitic. Based upon the fact that anti-semitism a term coined in the late 19th century referred strictly and only to Jews in its original intent and usage.

Side: Yes
0 points

zionism is a fair target. it exists. it has a culture. it has representatives.

zionism and judaism are two different things and zionism is balls deep in the cluster fuck that is modern israel.

Side: No
Stickers(1037) Clarified
1 point

Did I say that it wasn't a fair target ?

Side: Yes
1 point

It is 100% antisemitism. You either support Israel or you're a filthy, fucking Nazi piece of shit.

Side: No
1 point

Yep. Martin Luther King said that those who hate Zionists hate Jews. Zionism being an expression of Jewish nationalism and patriotism.

Side: No