CreateDebate


Debate Info

6
4
yes, 4 more years no, god bless 'merca
Debate Score:10
Arguments:8
Total Votes:11
More Stats

Argument Ratio

side graph
 
 yes, 4 more years (5)
 
 no, god bless 'merca (3)

Debate Creator

obama12(5) pic



Obama health care plan

yes, 4 more years

Side Score: 6
VS.

no, god bless 'merca

Side Score: 4
1 point

Yes no one should die because corporates are getting all the money

Side: yes, 4 more years
1 point

Countries with similar health plans live longer, healthier lives according to all statistics, and pay less money for this far superior service.

Meanwhile here in the U.S. we pay on average nearly double what any other country pays for health care per person, and we, the richest nation on earth by more than double, has something like the 24th ranked health care in the world. It's retarded and the only argument against changing the system is bs fear mongering about death panels or whatever bs the right is spewing nowadays.

Side: yes, 4 more years

The majority of American voters elected Obama for 4 more years so they do like ObamaCare.

Side: yes, 4 more years

http://www.ncpa.org/pub/ba649

Though health care in America has problems (like every other health care system in the world) it is the best or at least one of the best. The only other health care systems that comes close (Singapore's for instance) do so because they make the citizens pay for the majority of the costs (out of pocket), there fore the health choices of each individual is there own responsibility, and as long as they work they will be paying for there own health care and the healthier they are the less they will inevitably have to pay, unlike what Obama wants to do (which doesn't pencil out). the link above has a lot of facts comparing our system to others (mostly Canada's and Europe's) but another thing a person should consider while reading it is that the US currently provides this superior service to more people than all of Europe, Canada and Singapore combined.

Side: no, god bless 'merca

Excellent link. Obama health care plan will only bankrupt business health plans, and many will not be covered, which is what this plan is geared towards because then the government will say, hey, look private business can't provide health care insurance, so we must, but they don't see why they are the problem not the solution.

Side: no, god bless 'merca
iamdavidh(4856) Disputed
1 point

Your article is about how great it is to be rich in america and to have access to all the great medical technologies the rich can afford.

Here are the facts for the other 90% of the U.S. population.

http://www.kff.org/insurance/snapshot/oecd042111.cfm

http://www.infoplease.com/ipa/A0934556.html

Per capita we pay far more than any other country. That's per capita, so the commonly used excuse, the one you use, that "we have more people" is not a factor. So we pay way more both individually and as a percent of our GDP, and yet...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_Health_Organization_ranking_of_health_systems

http://www.reuters.com/article/2010/06/23/us-usa-healthcare-last-idUSTRE65M0SU20100623

So we pay by far the most for one of the worst healtcare systems in the world.

And the countries with the best healthcare, who also pay far less per capita and far less as a percent of their GDP, all have one thing in common, either a single payer system or plan similar to the one passed by Obama.

Side: yes, 4 more years
1 point

Did you read this, I think you should consider it at least, this one is from the wikipedia link you posted.

"Criticism

The WHO rankings have been subject to much criticism concerning their methodology, scientificity, and usefulness. Dr Richard G. Fessler called the rankings "misleading" and said that tens of thousands of foreigners travel to the United States every year for care. In addition, he claims that the United States leads the world in survival rates for 13 of the 16 most common types of cancer. He also noted that the financial fairness measure was automatically designed to "make countries that rely on free market incentives look inferior".[3] Dr Philip Musgrove wrote that the rankings are meaningless because they oversimplify: "numbers confer a spurious precision".[4]

Journalist John Stossel notes that the use of life expectancy figures is misleading and the life expectancy in the United States is held down by homicides, accidents, poor diet, and lack of exercise. When controlled for these facts, Stossel claims that American life expectancy is actually one of the highest in the world.[5] A publication by the right-wing Pacific Research Institute in 2006 claims to have found that Americans outlive people in every other Western country, when controlled for homicides and car accidents.[6] Stossel also criticizes the ranking for favoring socialized healthcare, noting that "a country with high-quality care overall but 'unequal distribution' would rank below a country with lower quality care but equal distribution."[5]

Glen Whitman claims that "it looks an awful lot like someone cherry-picked the results to make the U.S.'s relative performance look worse than it is." He also notes that the rankings favor countries where individuals or families spend little of their income directly on health care.[7] In an article in The American Spectator, Whitman notes how the rankings favor government intervention, which has nothing to do with quality of care. The rankings assume literacy rate is indicative of healthcare, but ignore many factors, such as tobacco use, nutrition, and luck. Regarding the distribution factors, Whitman says "neither measures healthcare performance" since a "healthcare system [can be] characterized by both extensive inequality and good care for everyone." If healthcare improves for one group, but remains the same for the rest of the population, that would mean an increase in inequality, despite there being an improvement in quality.[8] Dr Fessler echoed these sentiments"

Even if the US does spend more money per capita on health care than any other country, setting up the system to be controlled by the government is very dangerous. Consider European country's right now. Most of them have a government run health care system of one kind or another, what do you think is going to happen to that system (and inevitably the citizens) when those country's go bankrupt like Greece. The government wont be able to pay to employ any nurse or doctors, let alone buy supplies and equipment. There is a possibility that doctor's and nurses will volunteer there expertise and services ( then the expenditures per capita really will be low. LOL) but the quality of care will be third world level. I know we can figure out some way to make health care in the US more affordable without socializing it. Maybe we could stop suing doctors or get rid of the nurses union.

When i was 20 my appendix ruptured, after surgery I owed 19,000.00. At the time I made 10,000.00 a year and i had no insurance, but I was able to set up a payment plan of twenty five dollars a month. I pay more when I can but there is no interest and even though I may be paying it fro the rest of my life I would rather be paying that money directly to the hospital then to the bureaucracy of the government.

Side: no, god bless 'merca