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Debate Info

90
93
Yes No
Debate Score:183
Arguments:74
Total Votes:288
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Argument Ratio

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 Yes (32)
 
 No (42)

Debate Creator

unknown91(132) pic



Is there really a god and are we supposed to believe in any religion?

the questions of life still continue...

Yes

Side Score: 90
VS.

No

Side Score: 93
4 points

i'm gonna vote on yes, but really... w/e happened to maybe?

not to mention this is a two part question...

i dont' know. the Universe is beyond understanding. and what is God? God is something also beyond understanding. Humans feel that they are brilliant and good enough to understand the Universe or God... that just makes them arrogant. Both atheists and theists have so far proven themselves to be ignorant and arrogant of any form of wisdom.

Side: Yes
1 point

But you yourself are human and subject to the same flaws you point out. Therefore, you are ignorant and have no more right to call them ignorant than I have the right to call you a slave to religion

Side: No
jessald(1915) Disputed
-1 points

"Both atheists and theists have so far proven themselves to be ignorant and arrogant of any form of wisdom."

Theists have proven themselves to be ignorant and arrogant. Atheists simply admit that they don't know.

Side: Atheists vs Theists

I think it's safe to say there really is a God. As to believing in any religion I think it's safe to say if you believe in your own, that would be sufficient. What other people believe as to their religions is fine as long as they too believe it!!! Most of us are "born" into our religions...we didn't choose them. As we get older and begin to think about such things we may not only ditch God, we may do away with religion altogether! But to what end?

We must believe in something and why not God? We must live by a code of some kind and why not the 10 Commandments? I can find nothing wrong with them at all. Whatever you believe in, believe it with all your heart and practice it. It can't make you a worse person for having tried.

We see so much wrong in the world and always blame God for the terrible wrongs that are perpetrated on people. Many people are angered by this and don't understand why these things happen. It is said that God gave us free dominion over ourselves. We continually make a mess of it and wish God to rescue us from the pain life and death brings. It is also said that God never gives us more than we can bear and I, for one, believe that is true. I've seen it in myself and in many others through the years. Where does this inner strength come from? I believe it comes from my faith and belief in God.

Side: Yes I believe there is a God
gaidheal(1) Disputed
3 points

I agree with your last paragraph, especially with your point about inner strength.

However, I have to disagree with you on some things you said in the rest of your argument.

My first point is that it is entirely UNsafe to say there is a God. This is because through this, you are saying that you believe in God. This leaves you open to those who hate Christianity, God, or anything to do with either. Not just because you do, but also because you seem to only be saying that you believe this because there's no risk involved, which brings me to my second point.

The whole point of believing in God, is that it is unsafe to do so. This is related to the cry of (perhaps less learned) atheists, asking for proof of God existing. If we knew, there would be no point in believing, as we would know that he existed. The whole concept of our God is that although we have no concrete proof, we keep on believing.

I say no CONCRETE proof, because God gives us many things that atheists or others might scoff at. Often we overlook things in our lives, because they are there all the time. For example, many people in developed countries earn a decent living, can afford luxuries, and have clean, running water. Many more in third world countries do not have these things. We should therefore be grateful to God for our chance to live like we do. We should also remember that God loves everybody, more than we can imagine, and no matter what we do and say. This, I hope, provides a comforting thought to those who aren't sure about God, or maybe even currently hate him.

Side: Yes I believe there is a God

Hello gaidheal! For me it's OK to leave myself open to those who do not believe as I do. Of course there is a risk involved and it pertains to all you mentioned. I am at risk since it leaves me open to attack from those who cannot fathom or think it's just plain stupid to believe in someone or something you cannot prove or see. I must stand at the ready to field those attacks if I wish to.

I surely do not believe that the whole point of believing in God is unsafe. Saying that if we knew, there would be no point in believing is entirely untrue as I see it. If there were all the proof in the world that He does exist and I didn't happen to believe in His way of doing things I am certainly free to dissent and find something else I may agree with more than I do His presence in my life.

There are those who require CONCRETE proof of the existence of God while I do not need any such thing. I see and feel God in my life and all around me. I also do not require a particular religion to attach myself to. All religion is man made and subjective. I try to live my life through the Commandments as well as the "Alternatives" list by jessald. These are not new to me and reading them again serves only reminds me of the innate goodness in people.

I try very hard not to forget or overlook what has been given me, whether it is something that is beneficial or hurtful, for each has its lessons to be learned. I fully realize that some of us are truly blessed and some are not. I feel blessed by the opportunity to give of myself to others in great need on any given day.

Side: Yes I believe there is a God
jessald(1915) Disputed
1 point

Many people have faith in things other than Christianity. Some have faith every bit as strong as yours. How are we to decide who is right and who is wrong? This is why concrete proof is important.

Side: Evidence is needed
jessald(1915) Disputed
1 point

"We must believe in something and why not God?"

Because there's no evidence. We should only believe in things that are backed by evidence.

"We must live by a code of some kind and why not the 10 Commandments?"

Because better moral codes exist: Ten Commandment Alternatives

"Where does this inner strength come from? I believe it comes from my faith and belief in God."

So then, as an Atheist, where does my inner strength come from? It comes from beliefs grounded in rationality.

Side: No
4 points

Hi Jessald! To say we should only believe in things that are backed by evidence is to believe that nothing else can exist other than what you see.

Your comment pertaining to the 10 Commandments as far as there being better moral codes that exist is a bit unfair. The "Ten Commandment Alternatives" are wonderful but to say they are better is very cheeky. Can we not live by combining all that we see listed there including the 10 Commandments? Of course we can if we wish to.

If you are an Atheist, your inner strength may come from your beliefs grounded in rationality but that is not to say they cannot come from another source. You are entitled to your beliefs, as we all are. Please allow me to do the same.

Side: Yes
unknown91(132) Disputed
3 points

"Jessald" its pretty sad taht you have to use wikipedia as your evidence.. most unreliable site

Side: We cannot know
1 point

He is imaginary. At most he is a distant, uncaring being. Why not not believe in God? Many people do not, and yet they are still good people. Morals and the ability to know right and wrong I think are a natural part of human nature. As for me, I believe that if God exists, he is an asswhole who should step off his high throne and get his hands dirty. But oh wait, he is too good and loving to do that. [email protected]#$k God man.

Side: No
1 point

To the first part of the Q: Yes there is a deity but who/what that might be is entirely subjective.

To the second part of the Q: Yes, humans have an innate requirement to believe in the mystical, spiritual, and supernatural. At the same time, we are cynical, curious, and desiring of answers we CAN understand. It is this which keeps the former in balance... sometimes.

Side: Innate but subjective
1 point

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Side: yes
aveskde(1935) Disputed
1 point

There is no god, so Islam is merely the path to self-delusion.

Side: No
2 points

There's no god. Sorry.

Side: No
unknown91(132) Disputed
5 points

But what actually proof is there to say that there is no god?? there is no proof to say there is a god but the bibles etc, but my question to you is, what proof do you have that there is not god??

Side: Both
7 points

There is no proof that there isn't a god. There is also no proof that there isn't a walrus orbiting Saturn. Or Mars. Or Venus. Or Jupiter. Or that it's not an Elephant seal. Or a car. Or a fish. Or a book. Or a radio antenna. Or a flagon of ale.

Side: Yes
xaeon(1093) Disputed
3 points

Simply that there is absolutely no proof of him anywhere. The burden of proof is always on the person asserting something. Everything that religion has said about the world has been shown to be false through the scientific method.

God made man? Nope, it was evolution.

God made the universe and the earth? Nope, sorry, big bang.

The idea of god is so silly in this day and age. Sure, I could understand it when we needed some kind of intelligent being in order to answer questions that we didn't understand, like how the sun would rise and fall in the sky, why crops would grow at certain times of year, etc. But we're past that now.

I know everyone and their mother will moan about a straw man argument, but the fact of the matter is that I could make up any old crap about why we are here, without any proof, and then ask people to disprove it. That's not how the world works though. The religious need to start showing some proof, otherwise they can keep their religious beliefs to themselves; out of government policy, out of scientific innovation, out of people's person lives, etc.

Show me a single shred of proof for god?

But, for me, actual proof comes in the following form. Religion is completely based around the idea and concept that humans are special. The whole of the universe and the earth, according to the popular religions at least, is here for our benefit. The only problem is that the idea of evolution came along and totally bitchslapped religion's stance that we are somehow special. I believe it's something that religion has never fully recovered from. Sure, people can say that god started evolution, etc, etc, but the damage has been done. The divinity that religion once had has all but gone.

Side: No
1 point

Because the God that the Bible and any holy book describes is self contradictory. The notions of God being all powerful, all knowing, and all loving and forgiving only make sense to a simpleton. In reality, all of these traits can be used to show that if there is a divine being, it cannot be God, because he simply contradicts himself.

Side: No
Bradf0rd(1428) Disputed
1 point

There is no way anyone can know weather or not there is a god. I think that the popular idea of god is bullshit, but that's just me. You cannot say though, without proof and you have none.

Side: Yes
1 point

If there are gods, which ones are we supposed to believe in? There is no proof of any god, there is no proof of tooth fairies. So no, no god. And I can't see the point in believing in religion if there are no gods.

Side: No god
1 point

All right boys and girls, one more time, here's how it is:

Belief is God is irrational.

Why? Because there's no proof that he exists. It has been rightly said that believing in God is like believing in magic, like believing in fairies, unicorns, you name it. You can't disprove the existence of any of these things. The only difference between belief in God and belief in fairies is that the idea of God is very deeply entrenched in our society today. However, the fact that a lot of people believe in something does not mean that it's true.

Now, one thing a lot of people say is, "There's no way that the universe, in all of it's complexity, could exist without a creator." Well, it has been rightly said that the stuff beyond our universe is beyond our understanding. We can all agree on this, right? Yet if you say God created the universe, you are making a claim to understand this stuff that is inherently beyond our understanding. The very idea of "a creator" is a concept based on the rules and logic that exist within our own universe. By saying God created the universe you are attempting to force concepts from our own universe to apply to stuff we can know nothing about. This is a fundamentally flawed idea!

Couldn't the universe have been created by a non-intelligent force? Couldn't the universe have simply always existed? Why are you choosing the possibility that the universe was created by an intelligent designer over other possibilities that are just as likely?

Now, let's assume for a moment that the universe was intelligently designed by God. We now have a much bigger problem: How in the world can we understand anything about God? Why accept Christianity over Islam? The Bible says Christians are right and other religions are wrong. The Koran says the same thing about Islam. Who are you to say which is right? Thousands of religions have existed over the course of history, many of which differ wildly. Because all religions are equally unfounded, it makes no sense to accept one over the others.

Side: No god
mumin(215) Disputed
4 points

There are a few religions that have ever gained widespread acceptance, especially among the intellectuals of its age and passed down to the present day.

Islam doesn't say that other religions are wrong.

Muslims believe that there have been 124,000 prophets and messengers sent down to mankind throughout the ages. All these prophets preached the oneness of God.

A messenger is someone chosen by God to call people to the worship of one God and was given a new book or source of revelation, ie, Moses was given the Torah [Jesus was given the Bible] and Muhammad was given the Qur'an.

- http://www.bbc.co.uk/dna/h2g2/A2875395

However, the only scripture widely available to this generation in its original, unaltered form is the Koran.

Even the Koran has been taken apart by various forces since history, but it is the miracle that the original word still exists. The scripture was expressed by Muhammad through divine inspiration (enlightenment) and this was composed in everything from its narrative and poetry to its script and sounds. However, its meanings are beyond the understanding of ordinary people and very few have responsible, delegated authority to pass on this information - that is designed to guide humans towards this state of enlightenment, or heaven.

I believe a path to enlightenment does exist, and it is the only way to understand anything beyond our human cognition.

Side: There is a path to enlightenment
jessald(1915) Disputed
0 points

Ok, good point about Islam on other religions.

However, there are still important areas in which Islam and Christianity disagree, the divinity of Jesus for example. We need stronger evidence than old documents allegedly inspired by God in order to decide which is correct. Unless you can definitively show that Islam is right and all other religions are distortions, then it makes so sense to accept Islam over say, Christianity. If you think you can do this, I suggest challenging a staunch Christian apologist to a debate. I'll bring the popcorn. ;)

Side: Islam vs Christianity
0 points

In my opinoin no becuase why does he let us kill each other and why doesn't he try to help Earth if we ae destroying it?

Side: No god
unknown91(132) Disputed
5 points

my vote actually goes both ways here...

God gave us free will to do as we please, if we destroy the earth then it is purely our own fault and no one elses. it is not gods fault people are killing each other and destroying the earth and what not, its called sin. maybe if adam and eve didnt bite the apple in first place then we wouldnt be killing etc..

then again, if the whole adam and eve thing were true then that would mean that we are all incest am i right?? think about this one... there are alot of things to be questioned in religion that can not be answered, so it has to make you think, what actually happens....

Side: Both
centurion(13) Disputed
1 point

If there is a god, please explain why he allows little children to get cancer, and allows tornadoes, and hurricanes and earthquakes. Don't even TRY answering with the Adam and Eve b.s., because it is patently ridiculous, to begin with, and more importantly, even if Adam and Eve were TRUE, that would mean that god holds grudges, and punishes people today for something done by OTHER PEOPLE.

Side: No
1 point

But if God is all powerful, can he not have made freewill that does not lead to evil? Can he be all forgiving if he punishes people for the Adam and Eve crap or if he sends people to hell? Can he be all knowing if we have freewill? Is he all powerful if he can make a rock that he cannot lift, yet he can still lift the rock? The answer is no. God at most is a divine energy that led to the creation of the universe. There is no thinking, loving, compassionate being up there in the clouds.

Side: No
0 points

God isn't real, he is just a fake made up by bible writers.

Side: No

I agree. What better way to gain power than to tell a bunch of insecure, ignorant human beings that if they do not follow you, some divine being will punish them forever? God was made to explain things before science could explain things. God is outdated and useless. Just a tool that has outlived its purpose

Side: No
-1 points

I don't believe that there is A god. If there is a higher power out there, I'm more comfortable believing that there is more than one power in control of things...sort of a system of checks and balances. My main problem with organized religion is the "I'm right and you're wrong so you you're going to hell" mentality.

I'm of a respect-everyone-and-everything mindframe and things will turn out ok. If you have to defend yourself, by all means do so, but there's nothing wrong with just kicking back and observing the show.

Side: No god

I agree. The problem is that organized religion is too controlling.

Side: No