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 What I consider deception & why I ban those who constantly use it to twist the truth. (18)

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FromWithin(8241) pic



What I consider deception & why I ban those who constantly use it to twist the truth.

How many times have we heard Democrats and Progressives tell us that the GOP want to stop funding women's health issues by defunding Planned Prenthood? If you listen to the one sided Liberal media marching in lock step with the Democrat Party, one might actually believe the lies.
It seems to make sense since the GOP is trying to defund tax payer money going to PP. This is the deception I keep speaking to.

The GOP has made it clear that it will take the tax payer dollars used to fund PP, and give it to other women's health organizations that do not deal in the controversial abortion trade.

GREAT COMPROMISE RIGHT? Nahhhh, the Left demonizes the GOP everytime they try to defund any Liberal programs. They twist the GOP wording of cutting the rate of growth of certain programs, or defunding PP, and crucify them by saying they hate the poor , or hate women, or hate old people, etc. etc. etc.

The Left leaves out the parts of the GOP defunding plans where they say they will keep funding the women's health issues that have nothing to do with Abortion.

THIS IS THE CONSTANT DECEPTION FROM THE LEFT, AND LOW END VOTERS WHO CAN'T THINK FOR THEMSELVES SWALLOW IT EVERY TIME.

This same type of deception is used with most divisive issues between the Democrat and Republican Parties.

When the GOP trys to make a compromise with late term abortions, and make a 20 week limit unless extreme cases, what does the Left do every single time? They start screaming about the extreme cases which would be allowed under the GOP bill.

They do what they always do and start spewing the rape, incest, or life of mother abortion excuses to make you think the GOP would deny women these exceptions. Most of the phoney Progressives on ths site tell us how they are against no restriction abortions, but as we all know, they keep electing the politicians who keep it legal!

Would you refuse to vote for a KKK member over the one issue of racism if you agreed with him on his other policies? Yes, you would refuse to vote for him!

But when it comes to no restriction late term abortions of viable babies for any reason up to birth, you all of a sudden do not allow that one issue to effect voting for inhuman Politicians who keep it legal.

THIS IS THE CONSTANT DECEPTION FROM THE PROGRESSIVES AND THE LEFT.

I have better things to do then waste my time debating deceptive people, because no matter what you say, they simply twist the truth to deny their own inhumanity against our most innocent viable children, as well as denying their intolerance towards Conservatives as we saw with Trump's severed head on public College walls, as well as censoring the free speech of Conservative speakers at liberal Public Colleges.

The next time you wonder why I ban you, be honest and admit how many times you try to decieve people by twisting the facts of debate topics.
Add New Argument
2 points

"The Left leaves out the parts of the GOP defunding plans where they say they will keep funding the women's health issues that have nothing to do with Abortion."

The majority of "Federal Funding" for planned parenthood, involves Medicaid and Title X reimbursements to women who use planned parenthood for health screenings, treatment, etc.

At this time, Federal Law PROHIBITS the use of federal funds for Abortion; so the Abortion services performed by Planned Parenthood are currently not federally funded.

Most of the "defunding" legislation proposed thus far, and talked about in public policy involves removing the medicaid and Title X re-reimbursements.

This means, many of the GOP defunding plans are explicitly saying that they will NOT keep funding the Planned Parenthood provided women's health issues that have nothing to do with Abortion.

You may argue that women can go somewhere else, but in reality; there is no other widely available women's health coverage provided in the same way by anyone else.

I don't know what else there is to say here....

"When the GOP trys to make a compromise with late term abortions, and make a 20 week limit unless extreme cases, what does the Left do every single time? They start screaming about the extreme cases which would be allowed under the GOP bill."

Most of the objections to Abortion that I have heard or read in a variety of Media, are examples such as:

Ohio recently: where Abortion was banned for any pregnancy where the heart beat was detectable (this is as early 8 weeks, or about 2 weeks after a missed period).

A variety of laws in Texas: where Abortion clinics are forced to provide hospital level surgical compliant conditions even though the abortions they provide are almost invariably non-surgical. Thus elimination abortion via a back-door under alternative pretense.

There are other laws where abortion providers are required to LIE to prospective individuals about links between abortion and Breast Cancer.

There's HB134; which define the beginning of human life as “when a human ovum is fertilized by a human sperm.”

There's laws in Kentucky that proposed women have an ultrasound described to them if they want an abortion (even at 6-7 weeks).

Even then, many of the 20 week laws; if you actually care to read them, do not include the protections you claim they do:

For example, the Ohio Senate bill 127 (Ohio's 20 week law) does indeed prohibit abortion before 20 weeks; but the allowed exceptions post-20 weeks DO NOT INCLUDE provisions for Rape or incest, or in cases where the child is either non viable, or will be non-viable.

Read the bill; it's available here:

https://www.legislature.ohio.gov/legislation/legislation-summary?id=GA131-SB-127

You can read the IOWA 20 week bill too:

http://iowahouse.org/pdf/SF471.1863.pdf

No provision for Rape. No provision for Incest. No provision for in cases where the child is either non viable, or will be non-viable

That's at least 2 republican bills that do not contain things you claim that they do; and contain limitations that the liberals are claiming.

They both contain provisions for "medical emergency", and nothing else.

"The next time you wonder why I ban you, be honest and admit how many times you try to decieve people by twisting the facts of debate topics."

It's pretty clear in the context of this post; you have said a number of things that are either distorting the truth, or incorrect.

Republicans are pretty much across the board gunning for massive restrictions to abortion across the board; the 20 week provisions are not only a first step on that route, but there are multiple other extreme bills, AND most of the bills that I have seen do not contain the provisions that you claim they do.

You portray the republican party as trying to compromise, as if they are being fair and reasonable: a point that the facts don't seem to establish.

Secondly, you claim that defunding of planned parenthood will not affect

healthcare provision. That is clearly false, and seems to massively misrepresent what defunding include: reduction or removal of medicaid and Title X disbursements to planned parenthood. You also seem to not realize that Planned Parenthood abortion services are already independently and not federally funding as you imply.

All of this makes your final quoted claim particularly ironic.

FromWithin(8241) Disputed
1 point

All the things you said about abortion are individual States determining for themselves what limits to put on Abortions.

I am talking about the GOP federal law that would prohibit the nine NO RESTRICTION abortion states from killing babies for any reason up to birth. The GOP bill would allow extreme case abortions up to birth so the Left's excuses are ludicrous as always.

For the Texas law you mentioned, how many emergency situations, that might pop up, would it take to bother you? If one woman dies from complications and having no hospital level emergency conditions available, that's one too many. I thought you pro abortion folks were so worreid about back alley unsafe conditions when killing the baby.

The Democrat Party always fight the GOP when they want to force abortion clinics to provide emergency medical treatment for botched late term abortions of viable babies born alive. You support the Party of infanticide and inhumanity!

If you actually don't think Planned Parenthood can not get around using funding in any manner they choose, I have a bridge to sell you.

If the Left and people like you are supposedly so worried about women not having access to health organizations, that do not deal in the abortion trade, HOW ABOUT CREATING SOME? DECADES OF POLITICAL FIGHTING SOLVED!

Why is it that elective abortion is so important to you? Women can go down to clinics for abortions when supposedly only 3% of Planned Parenthood business deals with abortions. You have had decades to create womans health organizations seprate from the controversial inhumanity of abortion!

WHY MUST THE LEFT FORCE EVERYTHING DOWN AMERICAN'S THROATS? KEEP THESE ISSUES SEPARATE and quit forcng Americans to support killing babies with State medicaid taxes.

Ramshutu(227) Disputed
2 points

"I am talking about the GOP federal law that would prohibit the nine NO RESTRICTION abortion states from killing babies for any reason up to birth."

Okay, so the only examples of 20 week abortion bans that are present in the USA.

These bans do not have the provisions you claim they do; and do not have the provisions that the left claim they do not.

You seem to be conceding that this is the case.

As per federal Law. The 2015 proposed bill again, didn't have all the exceptions I mentioned, though went further than the state laws.

You claim "Left's excuses are ludicrus"; but Planned Parenthood among others explicitly stated it was the lack of provision for emergency abortion in cases of lethal disease and non-viability were the reasons for it's opposition.

You appear to be confusing the complaints of democrats against multiple different bills: to the point I can't find a single democrat saying that the 2015 bill didn't include provisions for rape or incest at a time when it did.

"For the Texas law you mentioned, how many emergency situations, that might pop up, would it take to bother you."

The same number or the same chances of emergency situations that might popup as the result of any generalized non-surgical or basic medical operation that would be conducted at a GP office, for example.

There are innumerable types of medical facilities (GP or Dialysis provision, blood work, labs, etc) where emergency situations are more likely to arise; if saving peoples lives is the aim, why not apply the same standard to all of those. Even worse, the complications due to abortion are generally much lower risk than the complications due to giving birth; so that argument is effectively that a 1/10000 risk of complications is unacceptable, so we pass laws that effectively raise that risk to 1/1000

No, this is just an attempt to legislate abortion providers out of business via a back-door.

"The Democrat Party always fight the GOP when they want to force abortion clinics to provide emergency medical treatment for botched late term abortions of viable babies born alive"

Abortion providers already have the capacity and ability to provide emergency medical treatment.

Democrats oppose even more stringent regulations that mean that the buildings, equipment, facilities, doors, wirings, processes, and much more are the same level as a hospital which is completely unrequired in order for that facility to save lives.

Why require them to have corridors four gurneys wide, like a hospital, when they deal with 6 clients at a time, and the chances of them requiring a gurney at all are effectively 0.

This is simply misrepresentation.

"If you actually don't think Planned Parenthood can not get around using funding in any manner they choose, I have a bridge to sell you."

Please explain how.

The Hyde Amendment prevents the use of federal funds to fund abortion.

Planned Parent hood gets reimbursed for medicaid screenings, preventative medicine, like breast cancer, etc.

When they charge medicaid for a breast cancer screen, are they lying? Did they perform that screen?

When they charge $1000 for a procedure, is the market rate for that procedure about $1000? Or higher.

If both of those are correct, how exactly are they getting around the Hyde Ammendment?

But basically, in the midst of all your vitriolic name calling; you seem to have changed your argument. You claimed that the GOP were not revoking funding for medical screenings etc; and now you have changed that to implying that they are, but it's democrats fault.

I think, in reality, you are confusing a great many things: it is obvious given the facts (if you care to search them) that your claims are untrue at both the State level law (with the GOP behaving much worse than you claim they are, and the democrats not unfairly opposing various laws); and untrue at the Federal level (with the GOP not including key abortion provisions, and the democrats opposing that reason; not the grotesquely unfair examples)

You are also misrepresenting the texas laws concerning the medical facilities; not realizing how it applies unevenly, whilst pretending it is for health.

Even despite that, you still seem to be arguing that it is the democrats forcing everything down your throat and forcing your taxes to pay for abortion.

They do not.

It is illegal for federal funds to be used to support abortion.

catninja(249) Banned
2 points

Deception is a really good buzzword to throw out when you feel like you're losing the argument. The ad hominem of "you're a stupid dirty liar" is such a takedown it's unreal, and automatically lends your own argument so much gravitas.

But banning! That's the best way to tell someone you're right and your points are sound. In fact, you're so right, there's no need for anyone to debate you! Might as well spare them the effort.

FromWithin(8241) Disputed
1 point

I ban deceptive idiots, vulgar idiots, childish idots, any idiot that wastes our time. Banning is the best way to tell someone they are acting like a total idiot and better improve themselves or they will continue being banned.

If you are stupid enough to think we should allow a liar to debate, then you truly are a Liberals.

Liberals believe in the no fault anything goes lunacy and they would allow our world to be controlled by the losers in life.

By the way, I also ban people who constantly whine about being banned.

catninja(249) Disputed Banned
1 point

I ban deceptive idiots, vulgar idiots, childish idots, any idiot that wastes our time.

What about emotional crybabies who type in ALL CAPS, call people names and use seven exclamation marks to get their point across?

Banning is the best way to tell someone they are acting like a total idiot and better improve themselves or they will continue being banned.

By "improve themselves" you mean becoming conservative, i.e. agreeing with you. If they agree with your worldview they can be as idiotic as they like and they don't get banned.

Liberals believe in the no fault anything goes lunacy and they would allow our world to be controlled by the losers in life.

You know who I would ban if I didn't believe in people's right to exercise their idiotic opinions? The people who waste my time with fallacious arguments and ad hominems.

By the way, I also ban people who constantly whine about being banned.

Is that meant to be a threat?

The real reason why you ban people is because you spend most of your time insulting and belittling those who disagree with you. You're xenophobic, will never admit anyone who doesn't share your worldview might actually have a point, you appeal to emotion rather than logic, and you insult the person rather than the argument.

You think the USA is the only country in the world, you think that every issue you bring up applies only to your own country and you seem to think everyone outside the US is some kind of barbarian.

You skim-read counter-arguments, answer the debate you want to answer, and knowingly and deceptively take the debate on tangents purely because you think you'll get an advantage over the debate and not because you're actually interested in debating it.

I've seen people engage you in debates simply for the sake of trolling, which I'm not surprised by. You're so easy to rile up. But most people who disagree with you are polite and courteous. You rarely return the courtesy; a few choice insults and maybe a link to a right-wing source if you can be bothered to do so.

And then you ban them because you don't want dissenting opinions on your debates earning points for the side you don't support.

Most of us moderates (i.e. those who are not extremists) consider being banned by you a badge of honour. You're threatening to ban me? I've just delivered a truth bomb. Now prove the point I'm making, and ban me.

The usual response from Progressives after spending hours trying to deny the undeniable, they will say..... uhhhh, duhhhh, ok but the Right is just as bad.

ROFLOL, complete lie and complete denial because they seldom give examples or proof of their claims.

Ramshutu(227) Disputed
2 points

I have not ignored a single core argument you have made; simply told you to not try and bait-and-switch into a new argument. Indeed, I believe I have offered a consistent defense to all your contentions above; and the only person who refuses to defend their position by constantly changing the subject , is you.

Please also note; I have provided links, quoted states, explained the law, gave examples on many of the points that have been contested.

I don't believe there has been a single location in this thread where I have claimed the right is just as bad; only contesting your own claims about what the right is and is not doing.

Pretty much everything you just said in this asinine response is factually untrue; like most of what you appear to say.

I suspect you ban people because you cannot deal with people holding a contrary opinion and repeatedly contradiction you as you appear not to have the intellectual tools to be able to justify your own position.

catninja(249) Banned
1 point

Here are some examples of FromWithin being rude to other debaters in the past week.

You are a liar once more.

Bigots like you

You are proving to be as mind numbingly stupid

You are a typical bigoted joke.

Everytime you speak, all we hear is a fool with no answers

The fool spews garbage once more.

Your bumper sticker shoud say "intolerant fool"

What a shock, another deceptive liar

When you move to America and live under our laws

But bigots like you

I'm not wasting my time debating someone from another nation

You should make a bumper sticker you mindless Liberal fool.

You are a total fool

TOTAL FOOL.

You are complete judgmental hypocritical fools!

You are becoming a waste of time.

The fool mispelled again. (ironic that "mispelled" is misspelled)

This is why I will always ban fool liars like you. WHAT A TOTAL MORON!

YOU WASTE OR TIME AS DO MOST DECEPTIVE LIBERALS.

You are the typical fool liar Liberal.

YOU DECEPTIVE FOOL!

makes you a deceptive fool.

Have I lately called you a deceptive fool? (newsflash: he probably has)

The only person being grotesquely deceptive around here is you.

That's when I switched the channel just like I'm going to do with you.

You are a broken record!

Total waste of time dedating you.

GET A BRAIN PLEASEEEEEE!