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Are sovereign citizens a threat to the rule of law?
These self declared ''sovereign citizens'' are becoming a law onto themselves and challenging the enforcement of the laws as passed by our duly elected representatives.
Some Sovereign Citizens claim that they can become immune to most or all laws of the United States. Mexifornia comes to mind. Run by the Moonbeam Radical Progressives.
Yes, these anarchists are insidiously merging into all aspects of society under the cloak of an anti-fascism movement when they're really trying to establish a national network of left wing revolutionary radicals dedicated to the dismantling of the political, social and economic principles upon which our nation is founded.
The approach of the duly appointed law enforcement agencies and indeed the judiciary appears to be embarrassingly disjointed and in need of clear uniform clarification.
"These self declared ''sovereign citizens'' are becoming a law onto themselves and challenging the enforcement of the laws as passed by our duly elected representatives."
Washington,D.C. is the most perfect example to the heading of your post
Agreed, President Trump is making enormous headway in resolving many of the international issues facing the nation.
However, the emergence of this group of anti-American revolutionaries represents one of the most serious domestic issues and the growing menace needs to be addressed forthwith with Trump's characteristic vigour and decisiveness.
Round them up and ship them off with a one way ticket to one of their favoured utopian paradises that’s more in keeping with their idea of an ideal society
Yes, their infestation can only thrive within an ordered and fair society.
If they tried to ply their civil disobedience and cockeyed credo in Russia, China, any Muslim state, not to mention the African and most South American countries they would be kneecapped between the ears.
This unfolding danger is being accelerated by the apparent lack of a cohesive and uniform policy towards these dangerous screwballs.
The problem is nut jobs like these are defended by idiots and actually tolerated by lily livered politicians who should be the ones demanding they’re rounded up and kicked into touch
Yes indeed and what a great team we have after doing South Africa, Australia , Argentina and the All Blacks last year we then destroyed the best of the rest , roll on the World Cup Antrim 👌☺️
When did FOX "NEWS" order you nothing-heads to start believing that the sovereign citizen movement was in any way connected to liberalism? It's not and it never has been.
It was from it's very inception a clusterfked up group made up of extreme Reich Wing idiots just like you - and it still is.
You and your fellow mentally bent nut jobs are so interesting to watch. To see how you can make crap up and then convince yourselves it's real is truly amazing. It's so fascinating to observe your diseased minds continually deteriorate.
I can't tell you how much I'm looking forward to the big meltdown, when the inevitable happens and reality finally rears it's ugly head. I don't see how the mental wards are going to be able to cope with the new patient load. Good thing the government's planned ahead and built those phony FEMA shelters to herd all of the mentally shattered zombies into.
I just hope they built enough of them.
The Mueller investigation is about to wrap up, the fun's about to start.
Your post graphically illustrates that your head is full of mad dog's shit, as for a start, the so called Sovereign Citizens claim they are anti fascist/Nazism.
Due to their ongoing criminal activities which include;
MURDER AND PHYSICAL ASSAULT
THE THREATENING OF JUDGES
USING FAKE CURRENCY, PASSPORTS,LICENSE PLATES AND DRIVER'S LICENSES
VARIOUS ''WHITE COLLAR SCAMS, SUCH AS THE ONE IN SACRAMENTO WHERE TWO ''SOVEREIGN CITIZENS'' WERE CONVICTED OF RUNNING A FRAUDULENT INSURANCE SCHEME, these domestic terrorists are very much in the sights of the F.B.I.
Even though I am Irish and have lived in Ireland all my life I am clearly more knowledgeable about the internal affairs of the United States and conversant with this group's criminal activities than you are.
You should be ashamed to call yourself an American citizen.
Your ignorance about your own country is disgraceful.
Here's what the VERY left wing Southern Poverty Law Center says about sovereign citizens.
"The ideas of the "sovereign citizens" movement originate in the ideology of the Posse Comitatus, an anti-Semitic group that raged through the Midwest in the late 1970s and 1980s. Sovereign citizens claim that they are not subject to most taxes, are not citizens of the United States (but instead are "non-resident aliens"), cannot be tried for crimes in which there is no complaining victim (zoning and professional licensing violations, for instance), and are only subject to "common law courts," a sort of people's tribunal with no lawyers. Most refuse to obtain Social Security cards, register their vehicles, carry driver's licenses or use zip codes; many refer to UCC-107, a part of the Uniform Commercial Code, to justify their bizarre claims; and some use weird forms of punctuation between their middle and last names in all kinds of documents. Sovereign citizens also often distinguish between so-called "14th Amendment citizens," who are subject to federal and state governments, and themselves, who are also known as "organic citizens" — an ideology that causes adherents to claim that black people, who only became legal citizens when the 14th Amendment was passed after the Civil War, have far fewer rights than whites. Some of the more famous adherents of sovereign citizens ideology include Oklahoma City bombing conspirator Terry Nichols and members of the Montana Freemen."
From that description, they are anything but left wing.
Ignoring the differing claims of their political affiliation ( which probably varies from individual to individual) they are dangerous criminals whose crimes range from civil disobedience to murder.
Their disruptive activities and law breaking are adding to the burden of the law enforcement agencies.
I have read an independent report on their warped rationale and have formed my own opinion of these anti-government extremists who believe that even though they reside in America they are separate, or sovereign from the United States.
They don't pay taxes nor indeed recognise ANY LAW.
Whether they're left wing or right wing is irrelevant as it is their criminality which is the only issue to be addressed.
I will repeat myself by saying;- they can commit their crimes within the framework of a politically stable and socially fair society which exists in the United States.
Let them try to exercise their madcap philosophy in Russia, China, North Korea, any on the Muslim or African states and see what happens>
Other than identifying them as lefty’s, I don’t disagree with your assessment at all. In fact, Trump should ROOT them out instead of worrying about children on the border.
Most of those children are plants that don't even belong to the family they come across with.
It took you 10 years to go through the process to get citizenship? It took me five minutes to hop the border and go find an American Communist. The end.
1)By that standard 6 billion people could walk into the country. The system would collapse. That's kind of why we have laws and a legal system for migration. But ya know, us horrible Americans who already take in 1,100,000 legal migrants every year. We're the bad guys here.
2)Using children to scam another country's people is evil beyond measure.
3)Using children and illegals to flood our country with people who will support your future Communist regime is even more vile than that.
We know all about rabidly antisemitic groups don't we Con? Your party keeps importing them by the millions. Oh well, they'll just make us feel more multicultural. I know I feel all mushy inside when I think of Britain's terrorism being 86% Islamic, while Muslims are just 4.4% of their population. Oh well. Put on my fake smile and bobble head...They killed my daughter and grandchild. Oh well. I'm a Lib. Oh well. That's life. Oh well...oh well....oh well....my child was privileged. They deserved to die because of 1800's slavery or some other self hating excuse. Terrorists are just misunderstood. Could a minority somewhere chop off my balls to make me feel more Libby than I already feel? I'm just not feeling Libby enough today...
Sure they are. You need 60 votes. Republicans don't have 60 votes. Your party is in charge of everything from academia to the media to Mueller's entire team, to even the movies. Nice lameduck attempt though.
If MILLIONS are coming in, they're doing it under the nose of Trumps crack border patrol.. DUDE again!!!
Uh huh. Democrats in the judiciary oppose everything Trump does. You know fully well it isn't Republicans creating lawless sanctuary cities and bribing people to jump the border.
I love how if Trump does anything about anything you jump right to he's Hitler, but if he does little or nothing, you go right to he's weak. No wonder you guys are getting stomped in the polls. You guys deserve to get your ass kicked. You can't even tell us what the hell you even believe in, nor do you support anything other than lawlessness, trashing the Constitution, disrespecting the flag, and disrespecting vets and cops. You guys are who the founding fathers warned us about. Your party are openly Communists now. Are you a traitor and a disgrace?
From that description, they are anything but left wing.
This is one of those topics that is incompatible with the left-right dichotomy. There are Sovereign Citizens (SCs) from all over the political spectrum. SCs are not left wing nuts or right wing nuts; they are just wing nuts.
Dissatisfaction with the government is something common to most Americans. Dissatisfaction with anybody being in charge (but them) is standard for nutjobs on both the far right and far left. Both the American Nazi Party and Antifa both have a deep resentment of government control, and disdain for any laws that would limit them.
The attractiveness of the SC movement to people all over the political spectrum would seem to be the result of the fact that rules, fees, fines, and limitations chafe against everyone.
The racism the SPLC mentions is not an indication of right wingishness for all Sovereign Citizens (SCs). There are racists all over the political spectrum, SC or not.
Nor is antipathy to Blacks an integral part of the SC movement. If you go on YouTube, you will find video of SCs of all races, Blacks included.
This is one of those topics that is incompatible with the left-right dichotomy. There are Sovereign Citizens (SCs) from all over the political spectrum.
Hello m:
You're right.. However, I'M not the one who's confused.. I suggest the post wouldn't have even been written IF the writer KNEW that sovereign citizens were NOT libs..
You're lying. I don't believe for a minute that you believe a word of what you posted. Whenever caught red handed you lying REICH wing nuts always try to claim equivalency when there is none, it's your standard fall-back position and it's almost always a lie.
The Sovereign Citizens movement started with extreme radicalized RIGHT WING nuts and it is still almost EXCLUSIVELY comprised of RIGHT WING NUTS.
What exactly is he lying about. There are SC’s of all colors, and people across the spectrum are dissatisfied with the government. If the SC movement is to be considered a form of anarchist movement, then it makes sense to say it spans the spectrum. We have had anti-government extremists from both sides. SC appears no different.
The Sovereign Citizens movement started with extreme radicalized RIGHT WING nuts
I did not say it wasn't started by right wing nuts.
...try to claim equivalency when there is none...
Nobody claimed equivalency between the right and the left.
Saying SC asshats who don't want to follow rules come from all across the political spectrum no more suggests an equivalency between right and left than saying there are people on both the right and left who do not want brush their teeth after every meal, or floss their teeth.
There are beliefs, preferences, and attitudes that appeal to some people on the far right to the same degree as to some on the far left and to some in between.
Again, there are people all over the political spectrum who have embraced the SC stupidity in a feeble attempt to avoid being subject to fees, fines, and accountability for breaking the law.
"I don't want to, and you can't make me" is not a political philosophy, nor is it an attitude exclusive to any particular political philosophy, but it shows up in connection to many socio-political philosophies, including Nazism and white nationalism (to avoid various anti-discrimination laws, etc.) and anarchism (to avoid all laws.) You, Nom, have repeatedly stated that anarchists are LEFT wing, and the SC movement is obviously embraced by various anarchists.
For Fox sake shithead, blow your left wing drivel out of your arse hole, if there's no one shafting you right now.
Anti-American communist filth like you try to spread your fake news and scurrilous accusations in the hope that there are people sufficiently stupid to believe your spurious propaganda.
Saboteurs such as you have long since been identified climbing out of their Wooden Horse to organise civil unrest and promote bloody insurrection.
You've been exposed, time to book your flight to Moscow.
The Russian revolution started with a few small groups of radical extremists and they grew into one of the most gruesome nightmares the world has ever seen.
This small collection of latter day hippies should be pooh poohed and treated with the contempt they deserve.
Nah. They add too much to our lives. Sovereign Citizen Traffic Stop videos are a riot. You can pull them up on YouTube.
They start off a little funny because you can tell these people seriously believe that their jargon, talking points, and earnest self-righteousness are going to convince the cop to let them go.
Then the SCs get repetitive and pedantic. Don't give up watching, though.
The payoff is the surprised looks on their faces when they are pulled from their cars, handcuffed, and hauled away for resisting arrest.
I think you should delve a little deeper into the activities of these anti American anarchists.
They have been found guilty of many criminal offences including;- murder, and physical assault,
threatening judges,
the use of fake currency,passports, license plates and driver's licenses,
many white collar scams such as the fraudulent mortgage and insurance schemes as we witnessed in Sacramento.
Their crimes cover various scams ranging from using phony diplomatic credentials in Kansas City to Las Vegas where they were arrested and convicted for the laundering of terrorist's money, tax evasion and weapons charges.
They feel they do not have to answer to any government and refuse to recognise, never mind abiding by by the laws of the land.
It is naive complacency which enables such criminal groups to gain in numbers and increase the threat they pose.
There is nothing funny or amusing about the criminal activities of these subservises and it would be a grave mistake to perceive them as a harmless source of You Tube entertainment.
WISE UP AND TAKE MORE SERIOUSLY THE GROWING THREAT WHICH IS DEVELOPING AROUND YOU.
There is nothing funny or amusing about the criminal activities of these subservises and it would be a grave mistake to perceive them as a harmless source of You Tube entertainment.
WISE UP AND TAKE MORE SERIOUSLY THE GROWING THREAT WHICH IS DEVELOPING AROUND YOU.
I think you are a more complex thinker than to seriously propose that humor is incompatible with sad, painful, and dangerous realities.
Classical tragedy is founded on the connection between pain and irony, for example. Slapstick comedy is likewise founded on the humor inherent in pain.
The fact that some (or many) of these folks are dangerous does nothing to support the proposition that it is not funny to watch them struggle with the reality that violence is at the root of law, and that sophistry, self-righteousness, and repeated insistence are no match for a taser and a big cop with handcuffs.
Aristotle wrote, " A tragedy is the moment when the hero comes face-to-face with his true identity." There is tragic humor in watching these folks come face with their true identities as citizens who are actually subject to the law, whether they want it or not.
As I said in my previous post, the moment they realize this reality is the best bit.
They have been found guilty of many criminal offences including;- murder, and physical assault, threatening judges, the use of fake currency, passports, license plates and driver's licenses, many white collar scams such as the fraudulent mortgage and insurance schemes as we witnessed in Sacramento.
Their crimes cover various scams ranging from using phony diplomatic credentials in Kansas City to Las Vegas where they were arrested and convicted for the laundering of terrorist's money, tax evasion and weapons charges.
Lots of folks commit these very same crimes, and having a pseudo philosophy to explain it is irrelevant to the crimes. The Sovereign Citizen talking points and sophistry make no difference as to whether these people commit crimes. However, the pseudo philosophy and attempt to split legal hairs based on manufactured distinctions and terminology is enormously entertaining.
They feel they do not have to answer to any government and refuse to recognise, never mind abiding by by the laws of the land.
That is true of all criminals.
I think you should delve a little deeper into the activities of these anti American anarchists.
In case you have never been to the US, there are some aspects of the American character that are kind of pertinent.
Americans LOVE the law, but we also enjoy breaking it.
(This is not at all uniquely American. Russians, Australians, and Irishmen I have known are like this, and I assume many other cultures are, as well.)
That is why we have such a high percentage of incarcerated citizens. It is not because of an oppressive government, but because we all seriously doubt that the government is really in charge of us. This can create conflicts that involve cops and judges.
When it is time to make an individual decision, Americans look over our shoulders, and decide whether the law "really matters" right now, since nobody is watching.
The only difference with the Sovereign Citizens is they misunderstand the power dynamic, and think that they can use stubbornness and doublespeak to wriggle out of the consequences of getting caught.
They mostly just say “Am I being detained?” when they’re being detained and “I do not consent” when they are being arrested. Yeah there’s some more extreme examples, but not enough to get excited about.
Read the F.B.I's criminal dossier on these subservises and you may recognise the danger they pose and the cost of bringing them to justice for their crimes.
If I were you, I'd make a distinction between good LEGAL things to say to a cop, and things that'll piss 'em off..
I hoped the humor would be obvious, as well as the distinction.
Legal or not, it is poor judgment to piss off cops and judges.
There was a very good reason that when I was eight years old, I sassed my mother under my breath, and when she asked me what I said, I ALWAYS mumbled, "Nothing, Mom."
There are three questions to ask yourself before you say anything to a cop:
Yes well, if you called the cop because your neighbor is trying to kick in your door or assault you, then he is there to help you. And if that’s the case, you can chuckle at your neighbor when the cop says “yes you are being detained” or laugh when your neighbor cries from inside the squad car that he really really doesn’t consent. Then as you contemplate the excellent words of your neighbor, you can wonder whether the cops were there to help.
So you don’t understand that both mine and the sovereign citizens comments were in response to being CONFRONTED by a cop. Actually, I think you do understand, but you’d rather deflect.
My post was mostly in response to this. Cops are usually there to help someone or keep the roads safe. If it’s you they are confronting, it’s for someone’s benefit. They are there to help, though maybe not to help you.
Let's pretend he's an ISIS militant. Hey look. Con just helped him enter the country to bomb an infidel preschool. Oh, those poor kids. Think of the kids. Oh the kids...Oh well. Con feels good about it so no biggie. He won't have to scrape up the bodies.
Most illegals aren't children. Many of the "children" aren't children. You should watch interviews of border patrol personel. The people you are "helping" think you a fool, and will gladly job you as a sucker.
Typically, they have no skills or English speaking ability, so they go find the gang that their other brothers joined or created and wind up acting not much better than ISIS. Would you like a list of the things MS-13 has done to people, or are you good?
"You feel that the devil is helping you’: MS-13’s satanic history"
In September, an undercover informant led police into the woods of Maryland’s Wheaton Regional Park, along trails with pastoral names like Deer Hollow and Oak Ridge, to a patch of shovel-turned earth.
Inside the shallow grave, a shredded, bloodstained sweatshirt hinted at a horrific crime.
“The victim had been stabbed over one-hundred times, decapitated, dismembered, and his heart had been excised from his chest and thrown into the grave,” Montgomery County detectives wrote in court papers made public last month.
The grisly details drew widespread attention.
“Satanic murder,” declared a headline in the paper.
Oh well. I'm a lib. (insert Canned response about children for emotional affect) Oh well. They're chopping off heads. Oh well. Oh well. I feel extremely Libby today...
Tell me Con. Why is that the only children Libs don't care about is.....ours?
