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What defines humanity?
Ive been watching a lot of documentaries on human evolution, and I find it interesting learning about the different primate species - more specifically I find the discussion of when our species became ''not monkey'' interesting. Like, was it when we started using tools, was it when we started communicating, was it when we started doing art?
In your opinion, what kind of human qualities make us different from not just monkeys, but all of the other animals on this earth?
The human opposable thumb is longer, compared to finger length, than any other primate thumb. This long thumb and its ability to easily touch the other fingers allow humans to firmly grasp and manipulate objects of many different shapes.
So if we found another priamte species that had human-like hands, with long opposable thumbs, that would be enough for you to categorize that species as homo?
not a particularly specific one you are able to measure.
Your question was what defines humanity, not how do I measure what defines humanity. Besides, if you were interested in measurements you'd have measured the human thumb before challenging its uniqueness.
Yes it is. What is an abstract problem? When you need to interpret terms, then your definition is abstract and not specific.
our question was what defines humanity, not how do I measure what defines humanity. Besides, if you were interested in measurements you'd have measured the human thumb before challenging its uniqueness.
Alright then, what I was interested in was a definition that is unique to the primate species "homo", and it had to be something where you can by studying a given creature define whether or not they are of the species homo :)
No it isn't. Abstract definition is an oxymoron. If something has a specific definition it is no longer abstract.
What is an abstract problem?
It means you can think about how to fit a square peg into a round hole even if you have never seen a square peg or a round hole.
When you need to interpret terms, then your definition is abstract and not specific.
If I define something, it can't be abstract because I have just defined it.
Alright then, what I was interested in was a definition that is unique to the primate species "homo"
Opposable thumbs are unique to primates, and humans are the most biologically advanced primates. If you ask me what defines a plane and I answer wings, telling me that birds also have wings is a bit pointless.
If something has a specific definition it is no longer abstract.
That would also mean, that if a definition is abstract, it is not a definition - which was kind of my point.
It means you can think about how to fit a square peg into a round hole even if you have never seen a square peg or a round hole.
See, this would be a definition ;)
If you ask me what defines a plane and I answer wings, telling me that birds also have wings is a bit pointless.
I don't find it pointless at all, I find it extremely interesting :) If birds have wings too, then defining a plane as somthing that has wings demands that you go back to the drawing board and create a new hypothesis, since you've discovered the old one's flaws. Isn't that how we "create" knowledge? If birds have wings, and birds aren't planes, then you need a new definition for plane.
But that is what this debate is though? I was asking how humans are different from monkeys or other primates.
If Ill ask how is a bird different from a plane, it's not relevant to say; well planes have longer wings.
Because then you can just find a bird with even longer wings, and it would still be a bird and not a plane.
So the question of the debate is what human quality is the DEFINING quality that makes us human? So that when we study a fossil from a primate, we can determine if and why that fossil stems from a creature that either is or isn't of the homo species.
Like... when in the terms of evolutions history did we go from being monkey to being human? What quality did we evolve that determined we weren't monkeys any more?
But that is what this debate is though? I was asking how humans are different from monkeys or other primates.
You asked what defines humanity, not what makes humans specifically different from monkeys. They are two different questions. Besides which, not all monkeys and primates have opposable thumbs. Only a handful do, and not surprisingly they are our closest relatives.
So the question of the debate is what human quality is the DEFINING quality that makes us human?
Why do you even suppose there is any single quality which makes us human? What is the defining quality that makes something feline? Is it claws? Nope, because other animals have those. Is it fur? Nope, because other animals have those. Is it sharp teeth? Nope, because other animals have those.
Like... when in the terms of evolutions history did we go from being monkey to being human?
We weren't ever monkeys.
What quality did we evolve that determined we weren't monkeys any more?
No quality. We are primates. We were never monkeys because they are a different group of primates. We are part of the ape family. There was probably a common ancestor and different types of ape evolved from that one species.
I am clearly participating because I am challenging your statements.
Yes, you are participating, but you are not participating in the debate I was fishing for :) you are very focused on statements that aren't important to the topic. Like for example, when I said monkey, you challenge the fact that I used the wrong terminology. And then we spent a great deal debating what exactly I said or asked, or what this debate is about, and then we debated what a definition and what ''abstract'' is. And now we're debating whether or not you are participating in the debate ;)
Yes, you are participating, but you are not participating in the debate I was fishing for
Lol. I came in here and answered your question so I'm not sure what more I can do.
you are very focused on statements that aren't important to the topic. Like for example, when I said monkey, you challenge the fact that I used the wrong terminology.
That isn't simply the wrong terminology: it's the wrong SPECIES. Lol. Given that your debate is -- by your very own admission -- about what differentiates us from monkeys, I would say it is both very important and very relevant that you understand humans are part of the ape family.
Lol. I came in here and answered your question so I'm not sure what more I can do.
This isn't a question with an answer? This is a debate :) Scientists are not in agreement about this, so why should we? If I wanted an answer to a question I would've asked google.
That isn't simply the wrong terminology -- It's the wrong SPECIES.
I am danish, in danish both the word ''monkey'' and ''ape'' translates to ''abe''. So that is the explanation to my confusion of the terminology. I do understand the difference.
And then we spent a great deal debating what exactly I said or asked, or what this debate is about
But I had to clarify what you asked because you appeared to want to change the question. I answered what defines humanity, but then you decided you wanted one unique quality which differentiates us from monkeys.
Yeah, it's fine that you clarified. But you never answered my reply in a different thread. I asked if we found a new primate species, with human like hands, would that feature be enough for you to categorize it as homo?
You never answered that one, you've just been nitpicking :) Which tells me you're not really interested in the topic, WHICH IS FINE, LETS JUST STOP HERE. Have a great day, my friend <3
Yeah, it's fine that you clarified. But you never answered my reply in a different thread.
Are you sure? Maybe I just didn't see your reply. And why would you reply in a "different thread"? Why not in the same thread?
I asked if we found a new primate species, with human like hands, would that feature be enough for you to categorize it as homo?
But that can be clarified by reading my initial answer, without any further input from me. Opposable thumbs was only half of my answer. The human thumb coupled with the ability to visualise abstract problems is the reason we were able to invent tools and weapons to help us survive.
It was after you shared a link to an article. It was written .. I think yesterday probably.
Well, after reading your question today I can genuinely say I didn't see it the first time. I only ever look at the waterfall and my private messages. I never check for new arguments through my profile.
